Toronto's Curbside Patios Made 49 Times More Money Than the Parking They Replaced

[Yavin4]

A recent study on curbside dining in Toronto found that there are loads of financial possibilities waiting in empty parking spaces.

During the pandemic, Toronto, like many cities, began allowing some on-street parking spaces to be used as patios by local businesses. As reported by The Globe and Mail, residents spent a total of $181 million at curbside patios within 13 weeks of summer in 2021. If those spaces had remained dedicated to parking, only $3.7 million would have been reaped during the same time period. In other words, curbside patios produced 49 times more revenue than what would have been earned from parking fees.

https://www.strongtowns.org/journal/2022/11/22/torontos-curbside-patios-made-49-times-more-money-than-the-parking-they-replaced

[Trenzalore]

1. I don't think this statistic stays the same when the restaurant is open for indoor seating

[Yavin4]

4. I think that the restaurant was opened at the time. n/t

[Alexander Of Assyria]

2. What, a place to buy food has more revenue than a parking spot? Who knew this??

[certainot]

17. that's not the purpose! this is another way radical leftists make it harder to own and drive cars,

part of the global warming hoax to destroy capitalism

[Farmer-Rick]

3. They paved paradise and put up a parking lot

Do we really need more parking? How about a little walking?

[LisaM]

20. I like the outdoor seating areas, but

People who are elderly or disabled are being left out of some of these models. They need to be able to get places and not everybody can walk.

[Farmer-Rick]

25. That's true and they should allow access for drop offs

But a small parking area for handicapped folks is not so bad.

[BlueWaveNeverEnd]

27. good point.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

28. Electric shuttle trains from parking structures to car-free downtown spots.

[Wingus Dingus]

5. Curbside patios in Toronto would only be pleasant for 3-4 months.

Parking there is much more valuable, IMO.

[Yavin4]

6. They can be heated in the winter.

Seen that here in NYC.

[NoRethugFriends]

7. Why would they need heated parking?

[Yavin4]

8. The Curbside patios n/t

[NoRethugFriends]

10. Geez. It was a joke! (nt)

[plimsoll]

13. UAF* had outlets in parking spaces so you could power your engine block heater.

So you could power your engine block heater.

*University of Alaska Fairbanks.

[Effete Snob]

9. Obviously parking is not more valuable

During the 13 weeks in question - 1/4 of a year - the patios made 181 million as opposed to 3.7 million parking revenue.

The parking revenue is unlikely to dramatically vary but 4x the parking is $14.8 million - not even 1/10 of the restaurant revenue.

It’s not really a matter of opinion. During the other 39 weeks, parking is not going to be 12 times more valuable than it is during the summer.

On street parking is the most ridiculous use of valuable urban real estate.

[Wingus Dingus]

11. Well, until you need to park there.

[Effete Snob]

24. Indeed

The underpricing of real estate taken up by parking spaces is why I live in a van and just feed the meter.

[Yavin4]

29. You could take public transportation or walk or bike

Or park in a lot outside of the city.

[Major Nikon]

12. The statistic in question was apples and oranges to begin with

You can't just look at the revenue generated from parking fees and compare that to the revenue generated from using that space some other way. The first unanswered question is how much revenue is going to be generated as a secondary result of bringing in people to the area who might not have otherwise came. Then you have the second unanswered question of how much revenue spent in those repurposed parking spots would have been spent at those same business anyway.

[Wingus Dingus]

14. Yes. And what about all those businesses that aren't cafes/restaurants/bars, don't

utilize "patios", that now have reduced street parking nearby--they may lose revenue from people who don't want to walk from potentially blocks away. I have some experience trying to park in Toronto. It's a real hassle. Every activity has to be planned around parking.

[Major Nikon]

18. It's one of those things that makes for good clickbait, but doesn't really prove anything

If you dig a little deeper you soon learn the source of the information is "Researchers for an association of local business". In other words the businesses that are operating the patios paid for the study which produced exactly the clickbait misleading information they paid for and they had no problem getting pseudo news outlets to publish it.

[DENVERPOPS]

23. Thx for confirming what is typically the case.

"Experts", consultants, ETC most often give the people who are paying them exactly whatever the firm/group that hired them wants to hear....

Anyone who reads this article, who has an IQ above 80, is immediately skeptical and does a LOL. This article is a joke and not worth reading.

These articles about "implied" legitimate studies are not only spread by pseudo or Quasi news organizations, they are the mainstay of even the purported "legitimate" news Media..........With the substantial percentage of all U.S. Media owned and opearated by Rich Republicans, a lot of the news is tainted, and censored in favor of a Politician, corporation or entire industry. A lot of it is very subtle or even subliminal.

I could go on and on about some of the techniques they News Media uses to indirectly warp the beliefs of the reader or viewer. Hell, they don't even have to try to hide it on Fox, they just put it out there. Fox and Limbaugh are FAMOUS for their psychological techniques for "CONDITIONING" their viewers/listeners minds to accept whatever they hear, with absolutely no question as to it's truth.

[Yavin4]

30. There are other analyses that support the general thesis of the article

There are a series of videos from a US non profit organization called, Strong Towns.

Here's a sampling of the videos.

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&list=PLJp5q-R0lZ0_FCUbeVWK6OGLN69ehUTVa&index=2

&list=PLJp5q-R0lZ0_FCUbeVWK6OGLN69ehUTVa&index=3

&list=PLJp5q-R0lZ0_FCUbeVWK6OGLN69ehUTVa&index=4

[Lonestarblue]

15. Europeans have known this for decades. Most major cities have created large open spacea

for pedestrians and outdoor cafes and shops. Public transportation makes them accessible. I wish US city planners would plan more around the needs of pedestrians and less around cars. Far too much of our infrastructure is for cars, not pedestrians.

[twodogsbarking]

16. 'mericans tend to be a tad overweight. Hmmm.

[appalachiablue]

19. +1 Much older cities, no vast auto. culture like the newer USA. Different strokes

[RockRaven]

21. Earned by WHO? This is an apples and oranges comparison, since parking revenue goes to

the municipality (usually) and the figure being touted is restaurant sales. In locales with sales tax, this could be translated into the tax revenue generated for the local government, but the figure would be much smaller. Also, some of those customers would have eaten at the restaurant anyway, so the relevant figure to consider is any increase in sales at restaurants which added patio dining.

Fucking numbers, how do they work?

[ProfessorGAC]

22. One More Question

Is the $3.7 million the revenue that would have been generated during the pandemic, when due to several factors, less parking was needed?
Or is the $3.7 million the historical value for normal parking demand?

[KY_EnviroGuy]

26. So where do their customers park?

I can see some valid conclusions from this concept:

1. Cities with efficient mass transit shouldn't waste much downtown land for street-side car parking.
2. Parking garages are more efficient and safer than street-side parking.
3. Customers eating/drinking curbside would be at risk of injury from idiot drivers, therefore requiring safety barriers. Not to mention noise and pollution exposure next to a busy street!

IMO, strip malls with parking lots tend to be the current American favorite for shopping/dining, etc., with few willing to feed parking meters or even bother to drive into the downtown areas.

I get it that we need to trend toward mass transit and bike lanes for many valid reasons, but America is far away from accepting that as fact as a majority.

As a whole, we're too busy being unhealthy, dumb and lazy and our billionaire enablers love it.

KY