Ordered a generator from Lowes this morning.

[Kaleva]

Should arrive at the beginning of next month.

For quite awhile I've thought about getting one. One large enough to run out LP gas furnace and be dual fuel. Meaning it can be powered by gasoline or LP gas.

During the blizzard this past weekend while my wife and I were hunkered in our home riding the storm out, I mentioned it to her and she said to order one. With the increase in our pensions and social security starting next month, we could afford one that was about some here between $500 and $700 or so. The one I ordered, with a couple of accessories and tax, came to $647. I selected the option of no interest if paid in full within 6 months.

I watched a couple of videos on YouTube on how to make it easy to switch the furnace over to being powered by a generator and isolated from the home electrical service. An easy job and I found the materials I need to do it in the basement. I also saw how I can install adaptors in the gas line after the low pressures regulator mounted on the side of the house. Something I'll do later next year during the summer. In the meantime, I can use the 3 20 lb. LP tanks I have to supply gas as the generator comes with a hose that can be used to hook directly to such tanks .

With the 3 20 lb tanks and the 1 5 gallon gas can I have, I should be able to last about 4 days without outside power. Once I have the appropriate fittings installed in the gas line from the 509 gallon LP gas tank, I could go a few weeks without outside power, depending on how many gallons of gas there is in the tank

The main purpose of the generator will be to keep the furnace running and the freezer and fridge in the basement cold. I can also use it to keep our phones charged and the wifi modem on.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

1. Where do you live?

[Kaleva]

2. Upper Michigan. North of Wisconsin.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

5. Thank you.

[GP6971]

3. What make is it and what size?

I got mine from Lowes in 2010 and it's finally on it's last legs. It's a Troy-Bilt 10,500/7000 and with all the energy efficient appliances, LEDs etc. these days, I've found I can replace it with a much smaller one to run the essentials.

TIA

[Kaleva]

6. Westinghouse model WGEN3600DFCV

Westinghouse Dual Fuel, 30A RV Ready, Peak 4650-Watt Rated 3600-Watt Gasoline/Propane Portable Generator

It should have the capacity to run the furnace, chest freezer and at least one of the refrigerators.

[GP6971]

8. Thanks!! n/t

[Lucinda]

4. We need to do the same...

We are next to GSMNP (smokies nat park) and most of the heavily wooded areas around us haven't switched to buried lines yet, so we are always at the mercy of windy/rainy days...

❤️ ✿❧🌿❧✿ ❤️

[Kaleva]

7. It may not be often I need it but when I do, I'll be glad I have it

[Kaleva]

9. Told my wife that if power is out for several days, our house will be full

I said the men can sleep on the couch, chairs and on the floor downstairs while the women and young grandchildren can sleep in the bedrooms upstairs .

[LetMyPeopleVote]

22. I have promised a friend who is on an oxygen concentrator that she can come to my house

My next-door neighbor is a diabetic and I promised to store her drugs for her

[Disaffected]

10. I've been looking at a gen as well,

to run the stuff you mention. One issue (I think) I've run into concerns whether or not the generator neutral conductor is connected to the generator ground at the generator itself (termed "open neutral" if not, "bonded neutral" if it is). Some portable generators are wired open and some are bonded. It is an issue because with an open neutral generator connected directly to an appliance (such as a furnace) leaves the ground wire unconnected to ground at any point unless the furnace itself is grounded by means other than that provided by the house wiring ground. IOWs, the ground may be floating and therefore a short circuit to ground, either in the appliance or the generator itself, will not trip the generator breaker and, could present a shock hazard.

The remedy is to connect the generator to it's own ground rod (as I understand it) so any current shorted to ground will have a place to flow to.

Disclaimer: I'm not an electrician and this is my understanding of the situation only. There are some YouTube videos on the matter and, it might be an idea to ask the seller of the generator, or a licensed electrician, if it is something to be concerned about.

BTW, there are also tri-fuel portable generators available (such as the Firman) which will also run on natural gas - never have to worry about running low on fuel.

[Luciferous]

11. I told my husband earlier today that a

generator should be our next big purchase. I want one that runs on natural gas.

[usonian]

12. Please don't get all your info from YouTube.

I, for one, can't remember a damn thing from videos or phone conversations unless (DUH) I write them down.

So, here are some "print" articles you can peruse, print, and best of all, compare to see that they agree on basic safety concerns.

Safety Rules for Using a Portable Generator
https://www.thespruce.com/portable-generator-dos-and-donts-1152600

Safety Rules/Tips for Using a Portable Generator
https://www.generator-review.com/safety-rules-for-portable-generator/

Use a generator safely
https://safeelectricity.org/public-education/tips/generator-safety/

PDF from OSHA
https://www.osha.gov/sites/default/files/publications/OSHA3286.pdf

Main thing is to never feed electricity back into the home wiring and grid.
Do not plug a generator into the wall to avoid back feed. Use heavy-duty extension cords to connect appliances to the outlets on the generator.

Be safe!!
I live in the woods and have a big Generac running off my propane tank. It has an automatic transfer switch.

[TheBlackAdder]

29. Also, a sine wave signal one is key for electronics. Many people ignore this to their detriment.

.

Good stuff in that post.


A lot of generators are listed with maximum output and not the sustained output.


When there was that power outage in the Northeast several years ago, people were stealing them right from homes while they were running. Less than a minute there were gone. You need to hide a Tile Tracker in them. Sooner or later it will get pinged.

You also need to secure the unit away from the house. It definitely can not run in an attached garage, even if the door is partially opened or you are using exhaust tubing. I tried to place one close to the house and that even tripped the CO sensors.

.

[PCIntern]

31. You're not kidding about the carbon monoxide...

A fair number of years ago we had a five day power outage because I lived at that time near where the power lines could be decimated by falling trees, and we had this enormous wind storm, which did so. I went out and bought 40 gallons of gasoline, had a small, portable generator and put it on the porch, outside my family room, nowhere near the windows, or the house, I would say about 10 feet away in open air. Within half an hour, my two carbon monoxide detectors went off, almost simultaneously. I ran outside and turned it off and moved it way away from the house.

Interestingly, right before the detectors went off, I was feeling in fact, kind of woozy, but attributed it to not having enough sleep the night before . Everybody needs to be careful, and really careful because you think you’re OK, you think you did the right thing, but occasionally weird stuff happens with you absolutely would not expect.

[Kaleva]

34. I looked at the manual online for the one I ordered

One thing it mentioned was to make sure the exhaust was pointed away from the home.

As I'll be using mine primarily for the furnace, freezer and the fridge in the basement. The freezer should only have to be powered once a day to keep internal temp well below 32 degrees so only the fridge and furnace would be plugged in full time and that's during cold weather. In warm weather, the furnace wouldn't be needed.

As for charging electronics like smart phones , it's recommended by some to use a surge protector for extra protection.

[Kaleva]

32. I'll be unplugging the appliances from the house outlets

and plugging them into heavy duty extensions cords , rated for 20 amps, that are run to the generator. There will be no way to backfeed electricity into the house circuits .

The generator owner's manual has an extensive section covering the safe use of the generator .

[Blueplanet]

43. Saved Links

Usonian,
Thanks for the links. I bookmarked them.

This precaution is a little scary. Did not realize that someone would try it,
"Main thing is to never feed electricity back into the home wiring and grid.
Do not plug a generator into the wall to avoid back feed. Use heavy-duty extension cords to connect appliances to the outlets on
the generator."

[Turbineguy]

13. Make sure you have some type of interlock on the switches.

[Kaleva]

28. The appliances will be directly hooked up to the generator.

Last edited Tue Dec 27, 2022, 08:55 AM - Edit history (1)

When needed.

[Turbineguy]

35. That would be safest.

Unplug from the wall, plug into the generator. They have automatic bus-tie breakers, but they are expensive and unless you have power interruptions several times per day, not worth the effort saved.

[Locrian]

42. just remember...

You Can't Plug in a 2 with a 6

[Zeitghost]

14. I need to get one

They will be illegal here soon.

[Captain Zero]

15. what leads you to say they will be illegal?

just wondering...

[Zeitghost]

23. The law that passed making them illegal beginning in 2024

CA AB1346

[tiredtoo]

16. Where is here and why will they be illegal? EOM

[Zeitghost]

25. California

AB1346

[LetMyPeopleVote]

21. How will these devices become illegal?

I have a built-in generator and my son is building a new home that will have a built-in generator

[Zeitghost]

24. They will soon be illegal here in CA

n/t

[LetMyPeopleVote]

26. Why?

The California grid has had a large number of issues

[Zeitghost]

27. Yes

And a number of earthquakes and other natural disasters. I don't think it's a wise decision.

All small ICE engines are getting banned, at least for sale. Possession and use will remain legal, for now. But I expect prices on the secondary market will sky rocket once the ban on new sales is in place.

A generator and a decent chain saw are both on my 2023 shopping list.

[MrsCoffee]

30. Kind of. The bill limits the sale of GAS powered generators only not the use of them. And it's 2028.

2024 is for gas powered lawn equipment. They are also going to ban the sale of gas powered vehicles by 2035.

Climate change isn’t going to fix itself. Just sayin.

[Zeitghost]

36. It looks like I have a bit of extra time on the generator

That is somewhat good news. But the new chainsaw will need to be next year. Battery/electric powered ones are nice for yard work, but not much good for bigger work around the ranch and my Stihl 044 is getting a little long in the tooth.


You're correct, climate change won't fix itself but banning the sale of generators which are a lifeline in natural disasters and extreme weather won't move the needle either and will only cause problems.

[tiredtoo]

17. Have one ordered was supposed to be here December 24th.

Need it for oxygen concentrator and would like to have heat etc. Will be getting electrician to set it up for me.

[phylny]

18. We got a big one (Generac) earlier this year.

Huge propane tank. It wasn’t cheap but we were done with power outages. We’re lost so much food during the last outage that lasted 47 hours.

[jmowreader]

19. Please tell me...

...one of those accessories is a transfer switch.

A transfer switch sits in your home's electrical service. What it does is to cut off the power from the utility to the circuits you are running off the generator. The reason you must have this is if the power comes back on while the generator is running and you don't have a transfer switch, it will feed line current into the generator, blow it up, set it on fire and potentially burn down your house.

[Kaleva]

33. In my setup, I won't need a transfer switch

The appliances will be unplugged from the house outlets and plugged into heavy duty extensions cords that are themselves plugged into the generator. There's no danger of backfeeding when doing it that way.

[jmowreader]

44. How are you going to get the cords into the house?

In your location it’s going to get cold QUICK! if you open the door to run them through.

[Kaleva]

47. Basement stairway window

An accessory I ordered is a 25 foot cable. One end plugs into the 30 amp outlet on the generator and the other end has 4 20 amps sockets. I'll feed the cable into the basement via the window on the basement stairs and close the window as much as possible and stuff rags to fill in the gap. From that cable, I'll have heavy duty extensions cords to the appliances I want to power which are all located in the basement.

[Kaleva]

48. Here is a link showing the cable

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Champion-Power-Equipment-Champion-25-Foot-30-Amp-125-250-Volt-Fan-Style-Flat-Generator-Extension-Cord-L14-30P-to-four-5-20R/5001608519

[LetMyPeopleVote]

20. After the Feb 2021 freeze I contacted my light company and started the process

It took over a year but I have a built in generator that will power the entire house during a power outage. This generator is hooked into power system and the natural gas line and comes on after power is off for more than a minute. I use a CPAP and my refrigerator is full of diabetes and COPD drugs. The generator has cut on a couple of times for short outages (one-half hour to an hour). My oldest is building a new home and he is getting a generator for his new house.

[hunter]

37. It might be fun to have generator, but I don't need one.

It never gets cold enough or hot enough where my wife and I live for power outages to be a survival issue, or even a major inconvenience. It also matters that we're in the same power block as the local hospital/trauma center. Our power stayed on even during the "rolling blackouts" of the Enron scandal. In other sorts of outages our power has been quickly restored.

Our natural gas wall heater doesn't require electricity and I know how to live without a refrigerator. My wife sees refrigerators as a necessity, I don't. The appliances I'm most attached to are the washing machine and dryer. When I was a kid our family lived an entire year without a refrigerator.

My wife and I have a couple of solar panels that are probably enough to keep our cell phones and ebooks running in an extended outage.

I suppose I'd like to have a hybrid car I could plug my house into. That's a Prius option in Japan, I've heard, but it wasn't offered in the U.S.A..

Politically what we all need to do is fight for reliable electric supplies, which are one of the hallmarks of true first world nations. Worldwide, places where generator ownership is common are usually not the kind of places you'd want to live.

[Raftergirl]

38. We bought a whole house generator (Generac)

at the beginning of 2021. It took until October 2021 for it to arrive and be installed due to pandemic supply shortages. It is hooked up to natural gas. It was $11k. we’ve remodeled our whole house from top to bottom and inside/outside and this is the best investment we’ve made. I live in a town where there are big trees everywhere and one is always falling down and taking out power lines somewhere.

Having it, I no longer worry about losing power, freezing pipes, ruined food and just the general disruption losing power anytime causes and wondering how long we will be without power.

[Kaleva]

39. It'd make riding out a power outage stress free

[Raftergirl]

41. Yes. It is a huge stress reliever!

[NowsTheTime]

40. They need to change law to make them with less CO emmissions...

https://www.texastribune.org/2022/02/25/generators-carbon-monoxide-safety-rules/

U.S. plans new safety rules to crack down on carbon monoxide poisoning from portable generators

The U.S. agency responsible for protecting consumers announced this week that it intends to recommend new mandatory rules to make portable generators safer, saying manufacturers have not voluntarily done enough to prevent carbon monoxide poisoning deaths caused by their products.

The announcement, part of a 104-page staff report by the Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC), is a key step toward regulating gas-powered generators, which can emit as much carbon monoxide as 450 cars and which kill an average of 80 people in the U.S. each year.


The commission’s move comes more than two decades after U.S. regulators identified the deadly risks posed by portable generators and two months after an NBC News, ProPublica and Texas Tribune investigation found that federal efforts to make portable generators safer have been stymied by a statutory process that empowers manufacturers to regulate themselves, resulting in limited safety upgrades and continued deaths.

Portable generators, which are often used to power life-saving medical equipment, air conditioners, furnaces and refrigerators after major storms, emit enough carbon monoxide to kill within minutes when operated in enclosed spaces or too close to exterior openings. Carbon monoxide deaths caused by generators occur after nearly every major power outage, including 10 fatalities in Texas tied to generators during last year’s winter storm and power grid failure.

Generator manufacturers say that their products are not dangerous when users follow the safety guidelines in instruction manuals, which include keeping the machines outside, away from doors and windows. But safety advocates say those instructions aren’t always easy to follow, because the machines can’t be operated in rain or snow. And a review of user manuals by the news organizations found that they can provide conflicting messages. Some manuals suggest keeping generators a shorter distance from windows or doors than the 20-foot minimum recommended by the CPSC, while others provide more general guidance such as keeping the machines “far away” from homes.

The new push for mandatory rules has been years in the making. In 2016, after concluding that generator manufacturers could save lives by making machines that emit less carbon monoxide, the CPSC announced plans to make the modification mandatory.

But before the CPSC could impose the rule, industry-friendly federal law required the agency to first allow generator manufacturers to come up with their own safety upgrades and to study whether those voluntary measures were enough to protect consumers.

Industry representatives instead proposed a cheaper safety upgrade: switches that would automatically turn the devices off when carbon monoxide builds up to an unsafe level. They said the shut-off switches would prevent 99% of deaths, but safety advocates argued that that claim was exaggerated. (partial of article)

[Kaleva]

46. I'll be mainly using LP gas which produces much less CO

But you are correct in that people need to use extreme causation when using a generator.

[mainer]

45. We have a Generac, runs on propane

It's set to automatically switch on when the power goes out. Our propane tank is big enough to keep the house powered for 2 weeks.
It has given us great peace of mind here in wintry Maine, and our close friends and relatives nearby know that if they lose power, they can always come sleep at our house.

[EX500rider]

49. For those on a tight budget:

I wanted one in Fla for hurricanes, to run 1 small window A/C (440w) my fridge (under 50w) and laptop/wifi/TV

I went with 2,000w for $350 on Amazon, it's a 4-stroke motor and fairly quiet.

I keep 5 gas cans filled and my boat on the trailer has another 17g and will run it outside with cords into the house.

https://www.amazon.com/iPower-SUA2000iV-2000-Watt-Portable-Generator/dp/B07M8P1RFW/ref=dp_prsubs_1?pd_rd_w=gp79O&content-id=amzn1.sym.ec3cee7c-6bd8-496a-8166-4fdb6d51cad1&pf_rd_p=ec3cee7c-6bd8-496a-8166-4fdb6d51cad1&pf_rd_r=TVB60HCS5H29K3GXQW9A&pd_rd_wg=pyl2C&pd_rd_r=e9aa0c19-165e-499a-9fd4-e58abaedeeb7&pd_rd_i=B07M8P1RFW&th=1