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PCIntern

(25,582 posts)
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 08:49 AM Feb 2023

I have a running joke in my practice

Wherein I state unequivocally to a somewhat condescending young individual (which happens all too frequently) that all of us older folk owe a debt of gratitude to this young generation for inventing alcohol, illicit drugs, popular music, and sex.

I read the same concerning the “advent” of populist racism and hate. Here is a tiny portion from Wikipedia concerning Governor George Wallace of Alabama:




Since this was decades before the Internet, I don’t think many younger people realize how incredibly popular this segregationist, avowed racist, and incredibly charismatic politician was in America. If you do nothing else today, in terms of political reading, just go to wiki and read his Entry. Most people either have no recollection or never knew that when he was not allowed to be elected for another term, his wife ran and was elected and was the titular head of the government where, as the First Gentleman, long before Doug Emhoff, he ran the state. Later, he won many presidential primaries and ran in 68 and 72 with frighteningly substantial success.

As an aside, I was sitting in my dorm room in college and a guy walked past and said “Hey, did you hear George Wallace was shot?“ My response was, “Ooh…is he dead yet ?“ Wallace was vilified by every thinking person in the country, but make no mistake, he had incredible popularity at all levels, and in the strangest places.

And as another aside, many years later, I met a man who’d been sent to do business with him for the Office of Educational Opportunity, who said that behind the scenes, Wallace was incredibly receptive as effective proponent for everyone in the state, including the black population. The guy told me that the hypocrisy was overwhelming, and that it was the greatest professional shock of his life.

Anyway, my point is that this has been percolating for decades and exploded with the election of President Obama. We are a nation in turmoil.

31 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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I have a running joke in my practice (Original Post) PCIntern Feb 2023 OP
Your response to the news that Wallace had been shot EYESORE 9001 Feb 2023 #1
"vilified by every thinking person" reminds me of the Adlai Stevenson story Maeve Feb 2023 #2
Post removed Post removed Feb 2023 #3
1-post troll needed to either (A) up their skills or (B) build a persona first hatrack Feb 2023 #4
That was quite a post.. PCIntern Feb 2023 #5
In July of '69 I went to the Laurel Pop Festival in Maryland. (Check out the lineup!) panader0 Feb 2023 #6
Wallace apologized, later in life. Asa Earl Carter is as interesting. He authored, 3Hotdogs Feb 2023 #7
Repugs today are saying the same thing...just phrasing it a bit differently. Ferrets are Cool Feb 2023 #8
I have long believed that Obama's election touched off a new race war. Lonestarblue Feb 2023 #9
I have Rebl2 Feb 2023 #13
I agree that white supremacists were livid when Obama won. patphil Feb 2023 #15
A friend of ours spent several years overseas. shrike3 Feb 2023 #23
I thought so too. They just couldn't stand that a black president was smart, and did such a good job demigoddess Feb 2023 #25
As a boomer, I'd like our generation to take credit for alcohol, illicit drugs, popular music, usonian Feb 2023 #10
Extremists in power are sometimes shrewd enough to know when their time has come and gone. DFW Feb 2023 #11
As a Boomer also, it needs to be reminded 3825-87867 Feb 2023 #12
Oh, those young people Sympthsical Feb 2023 #14
Well then you're an exception... PCIntern Feb 2023 #18
It's a simple thing Sympthsical Feb 2023 #19
Not shitting on young people: PCIntern Feb 2023 #20
You're being told how what you're saying is being perceived Blue_Adept Feb 2023 #21
I would agree, yes. shrike3 Feb 2023 #22
You certainly did shit on young people. Mariana Feb 2023 #24
Strange that Wallace sarisataka Feb 2023 #16
Why? tritsofme Feb 2023 #28
George Wallace had his Ku Klux Klan to help promote him. 70sEraVet Feb 2023 #17
My 6th grade class had a mock presidential election in 1968 Martin Eden Feb 2023 #26
I can believe it... PCIntern Feb 2023 #27
Especially after what happened in April 1968 Martin Eden Feb 2023 #29
Memories DET Feb 2023 #30
Highly Recommended: PBS American Experience: "George Wallace-Settin' the Woods on Fire" Stallion Feb 2023 #31

EYESORE 9001

(25,973 posts)
1. Your response to the news that Wallace had been shot
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 09:01 AM
Feb 2023

was eerily reminiscent of my reply when a coworker told me that Reagan had been shot. I watched the blood drain from his face and then return with enough force to make him blush. Mine was a spontaneous, from-the-heart response - cold-blooded though it may be. I can’t apologize for something that I don’t feel one bit bad about.

Maeve

(42,288 posts)
2. "vilified by every thinking person" reminds me of the Adlai Stevenson story
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 09:01 AM
Feb 2023
When Illinois Gov. Adlai Stevenson was running for president in the 1950s, a supporter purportedly said to him: "Every thinking person in America will be voting for you." Stevenson replied, "I'm afraid that won't do — I need a majority."

I remember our neighbors were Wallace supporters, but otherwise seemed to be good people--but then, we were white, too, in a rural (white) area with virtually no people of color ....(none in the school system at all)

And hey, I thought we Boomers invented alcohol, illicit drugs, popular music, and sex!

Response to PCIntern (Original post)

hatrack

(59,592 posts)
4. 1-post troll needed to either (A) up their skills or (B) build a persona first
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 09:24 AM
Feb 2023

But yeah, to your point, people forget that while Strom Thurmond won four states in 1948, twenty years later, Wallace won five.

panader0

(25,816 posts)
6. In July of '69 I went to the Laurel Pop Festival in Maryland. (Check out the lineup!)
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 09:36 AM
Feb 2023
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laurel_Pop_Festival

Almost three years later, George Wallace was shot in Laurel, Maryland in the parking lot of a supermarket.
https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/governor-george-wallace-shot

To this day, I can't think of one without the other.

3Hotdogs

(12,406 posts)
7. Wallace apologized, later in life. Asa Earl Carter is as interesting. He authored,
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 09:47 AM
Feb 2023

"The Rebel Outlaw, Josey Wales" and "The Education of Little Tree."

Little Tree (fiction) was the story of an orphaned Cherokee boy and the life lessons his grandmother taught him. It is sympathetic to Native Americans and was a juxtaposition to his racist views. It was found in school libraries throughout the U.S.

It was published under the pen name, Foster Carter so people had no idea that the author was racist Asa Earl Carter.

Ferrets are Cool

(21,110 posts)
8. Repugs today are saying the same thing...just phrasing it a bit differently.
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 10:28 AM
Feb 2023

Yes, I lived through the Wallace years as a resident of AL. His popularity was scary. And there are STILL colleges named after Lurleen B. Wallace in AL.

America has always been a nation in turmoil....it's just more reported now.

Lonestarblue

(10,063 posts)
9. I have long believed that Obama's election touched off a new race war.
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 10:42 AM
Feb 2023

Republicans were absolutely livid that a black man sat in the Oval Office, a position reserved solely for white men. I confess that I was not an Obama supporter when he challenged Hillary, and I still believe that had Hillary won the nomination and chosen Obama as VP, we might have avoided some of the nastiness we are seeing today. I think Hillary would have won in 2008, and Obama would have gained some valuable experience as VP, which would have made him an even greater president. Monday morning quarterbacking!

Rebl2

(13,551 posts)
13. I have
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 11:41 AM
Feb 2023

thought that too for some time now. I voted for President Obama twice and then Hillary when she was the presidential nominee.

patphil

(6,207 posts)
15. I agree that white supremacists were livid when Obama won.
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 11:56 AM
Feb 2023

Even more so when he was reelected.
Although we now stand on the edge of the abyss, as the forces of love and darkness struggle for the soul of America, I feel Obama's Presidency was the best thing that could have happened.
The evil was always there just below the surface, and it was inevitable that some day we would have to confront it and make that heaven or hell decision for the future of, not just our country, but all of humanity.
You can see how far-right, facist movements have taken over governments all over the world. Humanity suffer from a lack of love, and it seems to get worse each day.

One of the most important reasons for the existence of Humanity is to learn the lessons of love. Without love we just exist, as a song once said.
But actually, without love we run the very strong risk of not surviving as a species.

shrike3

(3,783 posts)
23. A friend of ours spent several years overseas.
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 12:42 PM
Feb 2023

He says, "I came back to a different country." He believes what you believe, that a black man was just too much for a certain portion of our electorate to take.

I'm afraid I do not believe Hillary would have won in 2008. Hillary hate just ran too deep, even then. I supported Obama over Hillary because I believed a black man was more likely to win than she. Sad, I know.

demigoddess

(6,644 posts)
25. I thought so too. They just couldn't stand that a black president was smart, and did such a good job
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 06:45 PM
Feb 2023

and got reelected. They thought Obama would take their guns away from them, and every president in the future would be black.

usonian

(9,867 posts)
10. As a boomer, I'd like our generation to take credit for alcohol, illicit drugs, popular music,
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 10:50 AM
Feb 2023

and sex. but they actually have been around for some time.

As for Wallace, I remember that time, but Wallace later repented his racism.
Modern racists will probably take their hate with them to the grave.

And just what if Saint Peter is not as they imagine, but


DFW

(54,436 posts)
11. Extremists in power are sometimes shrewd enough to know when their time has come and gone.
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 11:29 AM
Feb 2023

I'm talking about people like McConnell, not MTG or other newbies too inexperienced to know the real lay of the land.

Even the old pal of Hitler and Mussolini, Spain's Fascist dictator Francisco Franco, told his successor, King Juan Carlos, before he died: "you will be able to do things I never would have been able to do." Franco had been a savagely brutal dictator, hiding behind his ideology and his religion to rationalize a thirty-plus year riegn that started out as a brutal and lethal (to dissenters) reign of terror. When the Second World War started to go the "wrong" way, Franco declared "neutrality," in order not to suffer the same fate as Hitler and Mussolini. His street smarts allowed him to not only survive, but become a member of NATO. By the time I lived there, although he was still in power, Spain had become a bored, listless fascism, almost bursting at the seams to join the rest of Europe, which it did right after Franco was gone.

Alabama, of course, does not have a France on its border, and Mississippi and Tennessee aren't exactly role models a neighboring state would find advantageous to emulate. But one fine day, even Alabama will dare to recognize that even their state will one day have to give in to the aspirations of the most creative people who live there, or else lose them. So far, they seem to have been content to lose them, but I can't imagine this will be eternal.

3825-87867

(855 posts)
12. As a Boomer also, it needs to be reminded
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 11:30 AM
Feb 2023

that the many from Brokaw's "Greatest Generation" wanted to ban (not from themselves!) alcohol, drugs, pop music and sex and control minorities and people who didn't agree with their beliefs.

So, yeah, stupidity and racism isn't just a stigma of a current or recent generation (not sure about the future ones).

Sadly, we do have the power to begin to erase or minimize racism (not too sure about stupidity), but too many are too apathetic - "Hey, it doesn't affect me. Why should I be concerned?"

This isn't just a fork in the road, it's an American Pothole before the fork with rather bumpy travel around it.

Current time seems to be a significant turning point in the future history of this nation.

Sympthsical

(9,111 posts)
14. Oh, those young people
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 11:50 AM
Feb 2023

Who don't know *checks* what is regularly taught in American History at the high school level.

Whatever would we do if people didn't relentlessly condescend to us so? Thank you! Tears of gratitude.

Source: Am Millennial who learned about Wallace in high school.

PCIntern

(25,582 posts)
18. Well then you're an exception...
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 12:08 PM
Feb 2023

The vast number of Americans have no knowledge of this chapter either because they never Learned about it, were not paying attention, or in denial.

And as far as condescension goes, you cannot imagine what I have had to deal with from SOME members of your generation with respect to that which I “might” know about, including but not limited to, music, art, film, professional athletics, fashion, style, literature, and philosophy. One acquaintance was very surprised that I knew what the cocktail Manhattan was, since they had only just been created recently.

Sympthsical

(9,111 posts)
19. It's a simple thing
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 12:11 PM
Feb 2023

Just talk about Wallace.

The preamble with shitting on younger people is unnecessary.

It feels like I'm having this conversation every three days. Are there guidelines posted somewhere I don't know about? A points system? Like, "Unnecessarily work in why Gen Z sucks, +10 points"

I'm all for it. Just feeling a little excluded if there was a pamphlet no one mentioned.

PCIntern

(25,582 posts)
20. Not shitting on young people:
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 12:15 PM
Feb 2023

Shitting on the parents, the schools, and the media. It’s not your fault. Not entirely by a long shot. The past is not being treated as Prologue.

Blue_Adept

(6,402 posts)
21. You're being told how what you're saying is being perceived
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 12:24 PM
Feb 2023

That's all. Reading your OP as a gen-x person, it just made me roll my eyes as another piece of someone doing the same routine, same as it always was.

shrike3

(3,783 posts)
22. I would agree, yes.
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 12:39 PM
Feb 2023

Around the time of the BLM protests, young people I know sincerely thought African-Americans were upset about being enslaved so many years ago. "Get over it," they said. They knew nothing of Jim Crow, segregation, the lynching era, Rosewood, Tulsa, black GIs getting frozen out of the GI bill, etc. They sincerely thought it was all about AAs not being about to "get over" slavery. And I'm not blaming them. They've been failed by the educational system, their elders, etc.

Mariana

(14,860 posts)
24. You certainly did shit on young people.
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 12:59 PM
Feb 2023

There isn't a single word in your post about parents, schools, or the media.

sarisataka

(18,770 posts)
16. Strange that Wallace
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 12:00 PM
Feb 2023

Is the example you chose for political racism.

His racist position is unquestionable, but I would think a different choice would be highlighted on Democratic Underground.

70sEraVet

(3,512 posts)
17. George Wallace had his Ku Klux Klan to help promote him.
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 12:03 PM
Feb 2023

Today's racist politicians (too many to name, but DeSantis comes to mind foremost) have Fox News.

Martin Eden

(12,875 posts)
26. My 6th grade class had a mock presidential election in 1968
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 09:00 PM
Feb 2023

I grew up on the southwest edge of Chicago near Midway Airport in a white working class neighborhood.

Out of 26 students, I was one of two who voted for Humphrey.

Six voted for Nixon.

18 voted for Wallace.

Martin Eden

(12,875 posts)
29. Especially after what happened in April 1968
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 09:12 PM
Feb 2023

MLK's assassination was a very sad day for family. When I went to school the next day there was an air of celebration among my classmates, the prevailing sentiment being We finally got him!

DET

(1,324 posts)
30. Memories
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 09:24 PM
Feb 2023

I used to have to travel to Dothan Alabama for a company project a long time ago. We’d pick up a car at the airport and drive into Dothan. The first thing you’d see leaving the airport were signs for George C. Wallace Community College. It was disturbing then, and it’s even more disturbing now.

Stallion

(6,476 posts)
31. Highly Recommended: PBS American Experience: "George Wallace-Settin' the Woods on Fire"
Mon Feb 27, 2023, 10:08 PM
Feb 2023

outstanding documentary of the Rise, Fall and Resurrection of George Wallace. Trump literally stole Wallace's playbook. One of the greatest political documentaries in history-albeit about a man I detested

You can find it free on Youtube



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