'There are going to be countries of old people starving to death'

[Nevilledog]

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/article/2024/may/25/american-pronatalists-malcolm-and-simone-collins

The Collinses didn’t tell me Simone was eight months pregnant when we were making plans for me to spend a Saturday with them at home in Valley Forge, Pennsylvania, but I guess it shouldn’t have come as a surprise. They are the poster children of the pronatalist movement, on a mission to save humanity by having as many babies as possible.

Malcolm, 37, answers the door of their 18th-century farmhouse with four-year-old Octavian George, who is thrilled to have a visitor, bringing toy after toy to show me like an overexcited golden retriever. His little brother, two-year-old Torsten Savage, is on his iPad somewhere upstairs. Simone, 36, in an apron that strains across her belly, has her daughter, 16-month-old Titan Invictus, strapped to her back. The imminent arrival of their fourth child, a girl they plan to name Industry Americus Collins, turns out to be only the first in a string of surprises – and one really shocking thing – that I will encounter during my day with the pronatalists.

We begin talking in Malcolm’s office, which is also the kids’ bedroom, with a desk and a stack of bunk beds three storeys high from floor to ceiling. “Children use the room at night, I use it during the day,” Malcolm shrugs. “Why have two separate rooms?” Simone and Malcolm work together – in separate rooms – as what Simone describes as “CEOs and non-profit entrepreneurs”: they acquire businesses with investor money that they improve and eventually sell “or turn into a cash cow”, as she puts it, ploughing their earnings into their charitable foundation, which encourages people to reproduce. They plan on having a minimum of seven children.

This is not Quiverfull, the fundamentalist Christian belief that large families are a blessing from God. The Collinses are atheists; they believe in science and data, studies and research. Their pronatalism is born from the hyper-rational effective altruism movement – most recently made notorious by Sam Bankman-Fried – which uses utilitarian principles and cool-headed logic to determine what is best for life on Earth. This is a numbers game, focused on producing the maximum number of heirs – not to inherit assets, but genes, outlook and worldview. And it’s being advocated by some the most successful names in tech.

*snip*


These people are just weird.

[FirstLight]

1. Intriguing...

there's all kinds I suppose. I'll let you know if anything hits me after I read it

[leftieNanner]

2. "What's best for life on earth..."?

Well, considering the fact that we can't adequately feed and support the population we currently have, I think having a minimum of 7 children ain't it

[0rganism]

3. Immigrants can do what babies do ... for less

A sane, healthy baby requires care, investment, mentorship, and significant effort from its parents and the surrounding community to develop into a sane, healthy, contributing member of society. An immigrant might arrive ready to go with a complete skillset, only needing training in the local language and customs.

If we wanted to mitigate difficulties of an elder-dominated society, we'd be encouraging legal documented immigration and making it easier, not treating it like some shameful offense intended to pollute pure bloodlines.