I don't believe there is a conspiracy against Biden. I don't believe it's "The Elites against The Base"

[Tom Rinaldo]

There are always factions in politics. There are always rivalries, "camps", special interests and hyper personal ambitions at work behind the facade of unity that every political party would prefer to project as their image. But the Democratic Party, as an institution from top to bottom, was solidly behind President Biden, until the Presidential debate.

There could have been one or more serious primary challengers to Biden this year, but there weren't. That should not be taken as a given. Ted Kennedy challenged President Jimmy Carter for the Democratic nomination in 1980, and Ronald Reagan challenged President Gerald Ford for the Republican nomination in 1976. Both of those contests went down to the wire, with uncertainty over the outcome up until the conventions. Yes Joe Biden won 14 million primary votes this year, and mine was one of them. I had no reason to have second thoughts over backing Biden for another term, and he had no serious opposition inside the Democratic Party.

Sure, i could have voted for a low profile back bench congressman with no national following instead, or for an inspirational author who failed to move the needle when she tried to run in 2020, but why? I believed that the man who I saw campaign against Donald Trump in 2020 could and would defeat Trump again after this presidential campaign. That was the consensus inside the Democratic Party, and despite all of the fore mentioned rivalries and factions no doubt present among Democrats, above all else Democrats wanted to win November's election. That was my mind set when i voted for Joe Biden. And the same was true no doubt for Nancy Pelosi and all of the other Democratic Party leaders who have subsequently advanced if not outright endorsed the idea of replacing Joe Biden as our nominee.

What changed? I think the honest answer is, Joe Biden. Yes President Biden remains a man of superior values, insights, instincts, and judgement. To use the baseball metaphor raised earlier today, as a pitcher he hasn't lost the strike zone, but his fast ball isn't the same as it was in 2020. Biden's team scheduled an early election debate this year for a straightforward tactical reason, to shake up the election race. Biden's team significantly outspent the Trump effort in the battleground states up until July, but Biden couldn't open up a lead over Trump. Meanwhile Democratic candidates for Senate were outperforming Biden in those same States. The reasoning was that an early debate would spark voters into making a direct comparison between Trump and Biden, focusing their attention on Trump's deficiencies. Instead it shifted the focus to Biden's deficiency. We needed one outcome but we got the opposite.

I could say that Pelosi, Schumer, Jeffries, Schiff, Raskin, and Obama and the like are all out of touch national elitists, but I don't really believe that. They are Joe Biden's partners in the Democratic Party, and they, like Biden himself, know how much of a disaster is will be if Trump gets elected and Republicans control both Houses of Congress. Joe Biden, along with Vice President Harris, has an excellent record in office. The public should appreciate that. Trump should be ten points behind in the race at this point. No one can, nor wants to, take Biden's record in office away from him. Whoever tops our ticket, Biden, Harris, or anyone else, will run on that record. For Democrats to win in 2024 we have to do better than we have at both selling that record and expressing opposition to the record of MAGA Republicans. That simply is a fact.

Some think Joe Biden is fully capable of still doing that. Others think not. But the clear majority of America's voters have been adamant now for over a year that they believe both Donald Trump and Joe Biden are too old to be elected President again. Unfortunately more feel that way about Biden than Trump. Those too are facts and they don't work to our advantage.

Over the last 15 years Nancy Pelosi has become my political North Star. She has her finger on more pulses than i can even imagine. Simply put i not only believe that she wants what is best for both our Party and our Country, I believe she more so than virtually anyone, know best how to navigate us toward that goal. Yes, there is politics afoot. Yes egos are involved. Yes, no one can say with absolute certainty what course of action at this critical juncture will most likely lead to victory. I trust President Biden, but he is not the only Democrat I trust. If he goes on to be nominated for a second term, he has my full support. If Vice President Harris instead becomes our nominee, she too will have my full support. But no one can say that Democrats have turned their backs on our base voters if we should run an African American woman for President.

[BootinUp]

1. What does it matter what pelosi thinks

You can’t seriously think a change, this can be pulled off this late. And Biden still isn’t convinced according to my read.

[SamuelTheThird]

26. lol sure, Pelosi is an idiot

I mean, it's not like she has been the most important Dem in Congress for a very long time

[BootinUp]

35. I shouldn't type in haste or frustration about this, that was wrong of me.

I will put this exactly how I mean it.

I do respect Speaker Emeritus Pelosi, very highly. Best Speaker of the House I have ever seen. Tough tough job. She has been amazing standing up for our side for many years.

So, we are in a situation where reportedly, *according to rumors*, she thinks we should change the nominee at the top of the ticket less than 4 months from the election, and then, just WIN.

This has never been done.

As many have pointed out, there is no plan yet. The convention is what a couple 4 weeks out, and not everyone agrees with the half baked plan. Especially Joe. Joe has repeatedly said NO. So, this is some kind of bad joke. I hope that explains my take on things better than before. And no slight to any of our reps except they really should stick to their jobs as they are making things far far worse in my view. If only they were acting as strong advocates for our nominee.

[radius777]

69. +1. Pelosi is a political genius,

one of the great leaders of a generation. She knows what the result will be if he doesn't step aside, what the data clearly shows. And what the consequences will be for so many.

Biden originally said he was going to be a bridge to the future. There should've been an open primary where the best nominee would've emerged. I think that would've been VP Harris, but it also could've been someone else.

[thucythucy]

103. "There should have been an open primary..."

How exactly was the primary "closed."

Did the party pass a law or regulation prohibiting challengers? If so, I don't seem to recall it.

Biden ran essentially unopposed because no major Democrat, whatever their reasons, chose to oppose him.

They might regret that now, and perhaps it would have made a difference, but that's how it happened. Blaming "a closed" primary just shifts the blame, if blame there is, from those others who refused to enter the fray.

[radius777]

104. Sitting presidents are rarely if ever challenged

by any real candidate. And in the rare cases they have been it hasn't gone well, with the party usually pushing back. In effect, once Biden decided to run, it removed any real choice for the primary voter.

[thucythucy]

112. So the only way this could have been an "open primary"

under your definition is if President Biden had decided not to run at all?

Which is what LBJ did in 1968, with disastrous results.

Whatever the history might be, if there were Democrats who had such serious doubts about President Biden, they should have made their case openly and put it to the voters to choose.

Having decided to sit this one out--possibly hoping for a shot at 2028--and given that he is our candidate--they should now make their concerns privately to the President and his campaign, and leave it at that. Sending off all these rockets in public is one sure way to throw this election, a classic instance of a self-fulfilling prophecy.

"Biden can't win, so I'm going to do all I can to cast doubt on his ability to win or even govern."

Like I said, self-fulfilling prophecy. Let's hope it doesn't turn out that way.

[travelingthrulife]

108. "the data clearly shows"

No, no it doesn't, and that is the problem.

[Dem4life1234]

115. The bridge to 2028

[edisdead]

80. Pelosi is not infallible.

She is human. She can make mistakes. You know like all old people apparently.

[radius777]

105. Biden is not on her level as a political mind, few are.

Recall that Biden ran for president in 1988 and 2008 and was not a good candidate. He had a late career renaissance because Obama chose him as VP. That is where Biden came into his own and became the Uncle Joe we all know and love. But in terms of politics, both Pelosi and Obama (who reportedly are asking Biden to pass the torch) are the ones who have great political sense - and he should listen to them.

[Skya Rhen]

114. Thank goodness Biden isn't listening to anybody except we the people

He has so much courage and fortitude to be able to stand up for us, against all of the different factions pressuring him to cave.
He is more than we deserve.

[Skittles]

86. oh is Pelosi going under the bus too now?

[Irish_Dem]

2. I agree Tom, good post.

[liberalgunwilltravel]

53. Appreciate the thoughtfulness

I attempted a similar post this morning. The responses were mostly positive. However, although I expected to be criticized, I was surprised that the main criticism was that I was an infrequent poster, and therefore a “disrupter.” My understanding of this forum is that almost everyone here wants the best for America. And Joe has been the best president in my lifetime. But fair or not circumstances have conspired against Joe and the correct pathway forward is in question. I certainly don’t have the answers, but I trust the likes of Speaker Emerita Pelosi and Representative Raskin to give good advice and Joe to make the best decision for all Americans. We have to not only beat Trump and his MAGAts, they must be crushed. However, that can be done, I’m in.

[Irish_Dem]

64. It is a very stressful time right now.

Emotions are running high.
And an influx of disruptors.

As long as you post in good faith and follow the rules you will be OK.
And it is not personal.
It is just rough and tumble politics.

[liberalgunwilltravel]

71. Thanks

It is difficult times. Our republic is at stake and everyone is rightfully on edge. How a clown like Trump got to a position to threaten our survival is just mind boggling.

[Irish_Dem]

95. We face losing a great deal.

We face a ruthless and dangerous sociopath with psychopath minders being installed back
into the WH.

They will burn down everything to get what they want.
Unlimited power and wealth.

Yes our survival is at stake.

[grammiepammie]

106. Joe Biden stepping down

It is sad to me that a man that has done so much to bring our country back from the brink only to be asked to step down but I am also aware after watching him, that he has slowed down. If he stays in and the democrats lose the house, senate and presidency, he will not be remembered as a great president, but as someone that should have stepped down and lost everything for his party. This is not how I want history to remember him. I am angry about the wealthy donors threatening to hold funding for all candidates if Biden does not step down. He deserves better. I am angry with the media for their actions after the debate and never never calling out Trump and all the lies spewing from his mouth. They just let him talk with no fact checking. They are an embarrassment.

[Walleye]

3. I respect these people, but none of them have run and won a national campaign

[Irish_Dem]

6. They still hold tremendous political power.

And there is a serious back room brawl going on right now.

Like it or not.

[SamuelTheThird]

27. If trump hadn't screwed up covid so badly

he would have probably won. Think about it.

[Walleye]

28. If Trump hadn't been such a racist and a menace, Biden probably wouldn't have run in the first place

[SamuelTheThird]

30. That's true

And we owe Biden for that. But gratitude and appreciation can't be more important than keeping trump out of the WH. To think so seems insane to me

[Walleye]

46. The other side will just be saying that we forced Biden to drop out because we're afraid of Trump, which of course we ar

But we’re afraid of his dictator inclinations.

[Bettie]

59. Look at history and see how replacing an incumbent president works out

for the party doing it.

Spoiler alert: It is not good.

[Cha]

45. Excellent Point, Walleye. 💙🌊🇺🇸🕊️🌈🕯️

[Walleye]

49. I'm pretty sure Biden would've stepped aside if Trump hadn't tried to run again

[Cha]

61. Who knows.. from what I've seen

Of President Biden he wouldn’t be so intent on running if he didn’t think he could Beat the Russian Puppet Again

[Walleye]

62. Exactly. He doesn't want to step aside just to have us lose.

[Celerity]

57. Using your own logic there, James Carville and David Alexrod are correct in calling for Biden to drop out.

They ran 4 winning POTUS campaigns between them.

Your own self-expressed criteria for judgment has been met.

Can I assume you agree with them, and that you are #Bidenout?

[Walleye]

58. Sorry, I meant winning a campaign as a candidate, they've never run for anything

[Celerity]

65. Well, IF Obama suggests he drop out, and IF Bill Clinton says no, I guess we have a quandary at that hypothetical point,

using your revised ('clarified' perhaps is a better descriptive) criteria.

Jimmy Carter, who turns 100 years old in 73 days, is unfortunately, in no shape to be an active tie-breaker.

[Walleye]

68. I've seen a definitive statement from Clinton. Obama has yet to speak publicly about it.

[AZSkiffyGeek]

78. Wasn't the Clinton statement "Keep donating to Biden/Harris"?

I might be misremembering. That's not really a definitive statement - it's rallying the troops, but it is not saying that Biden is staying in the race.
Likewise the campaign statement that they weren't working on any plan where Biden wasn't the candidate. Of course they aren't working on a plan if he's not the candidate.

[radius777]

73. +1. Most of the best political minds, whether

centrist or left, all know what is going to happen if Biden stays in. They of course also know the risks of replacing an incumbent president, but clearly see it as the 'less bad choice', based upon what they see with their own eyes and what the data shows.

[edisdead]

81. yeah.... They knew in2016 too

[radius777]

87. 2016 is not analagous to this situation. /nt

[Walleye]

99. I believe that the best political minds collectively are the voters

[travelingthrulife]

109. what data are you saying shows this clearly?

You keep saying this as though it's a thing.

[Emile]

98. Exactly

[BannonsLiver]

4. Well said, Tom.

A very reasonable POV.

[Mme. Defarge]

5. Some speculate that billionaire donors

are calling the shots with high ranking Democrats and threatening to withhold donations unless Biden withdraws. But how does that explain Obama who is not running for anything?

[Self Esteem]

8. Because Obama is pragmatic.

He might see that Joe is being kneecapped and because he's being kneecapped by elite donors, he can't win. His telling Biden to seriously reconsider the viability of his campaign might be a direct reflection of the knives that have obviously come out against him. Basically just telling him to stand down because he's so wounded now by these voices that he can't win.

[Irish_Dem]

18. I think money is a part of it, but not all.

Pelosi is not worried about re-election funds either.
And not in an official leadership position.
Down ballot is not her responsibility any more.

[2naSalit]

70. Perhaps it's...

Something other than donations, maybe there are specific threats that are dangerous. Which makes me wonder what documents and info is out there that MF45 sold.

Just random thoughts.

[Ping Tung]

7. I'll be voting against Trump.

Last edited Thu Jul 18, 2024, 08:35 PM - Edit history (1)

Whether it's Biden, Harris, Whiitmer, Newsome, Hank the barber, or a ham sandwich.

[Skittles]

88. THANK YOU

I'd vote for ANY DEM running against Donald Fucking Trump because I'll be VOTING AGAINST FASCISM.

[Self Esteem]

9. There's ample enough evidence to suggest you're wrong.

The donor class has clearly drawn the line in the sand: get Biden out or we will cut off funding to your congressional campaigns.

Pelosi and Schumer, above everything, care more about winning at the congressional level than they do the presidential. If the options were to win the House and the Senate, but lose the presidency, or win the presidency but fail to win the House and Senate, I have no doubt Pelosi and Schumer would choose the former every single time. And I can't necessarily fault them because they're legislators - not executives.

With that said, we have enough evidence about the pinch from the donors.

Here's just one example:



My guess is that they are terrified of losing the donor class more than they are terrified of Trump winning.

It's not about winning at this point. If it was, they'd at least present a viable pathway forward and a candidate to replace Biden. But none of that exists. Their concern is to drive Biden out and then pivot to get that money back from the donor class.

[Walleye]

31. Fair weather friends

[Cha]

56. Jeeze! TY for Candidly Tiff

I follow her brilliant tweets.

Then there’s Schiff.. Disappointed in All he had to say about PJB!

[AdamGG]

63. But why do the donor class want a different candidate?

I don't think that they're pro Trump. They feel that they've seen the writing on the wall for a bad outcome with Joe Biden fulfilling the narrative in many voters' eyes that he has cognitively declined and their motive is to switch to a candidate who they feel has a better chance of winning.

They could be wrong, but their motive is for Democrats to win the election and for Trump not get back into office. They didn't get to the positions that they're in by being idiots.

[Self Esteem]

66. I don't know.

Maybe they never liked Joe Biden. Joe has been the first president since maybe FDR who has really gone after the ruling class. Maybe they 'tolerated' him but then saw this as an opening to change things?

[Phoenix61]

72. They don't want a pro-union, pro regulated crypto president.nt

[edisdead]

83. Regulations and trump tax cuts.

It IS that simple.

[edisdead]

82. If we bow to the oligarchs now.....

It will be hell to get out from under their thumb.

[Dorian Gray]

92. Come on!

President Biden has done a good job as president. But, also, have you not watched his interviews since the debate? His messaging is getting mangled. He isn't unifying the party. He's not the same man he was even four years ago at this point.

It's sad. It feels terrible. But it's reality.

Donors are seeing it, and they don't want to sink their money into a sinking ship.

It's not rocket science.

I want to support Biden, and I will vote for him. But there are many who feel like they can't do so because they don't think he'll be able to do the job for the next four years. Voting for him is voting for Kamala. Which, again, I'm all set to do, but a LOT of people don't know her well, either.

There is a segment of the population who doesn't like Trump, but they're not engaged by the Democratic Party. We are looking at a MASS stay at home and not vote election.

[travelingthrulife]

110. Media manipulation is powerful

It is disappointing how easily Americans fall for it

[Dorian Gray]

111. I think this is delusional thinking

and will hurt the party.

He's done four or five interviews since the debate, and he has struggled to remember things and does NOT present the same way he did four years ago.

That's a fact.

We've had crisis after crisis in the last two weeks.

This is unsustainable and BAD for the party and for defeating Trump.

[jaxexpat]

10. I think its a good bet that Democratic voters will vote for the candidate who gets the convention's approval.

I wonder though, how many will take their ladies, their picnic baskets and carriages out to Bull Run to see the drubbing this time.

[Blue Full Moon]

11. Put your money where your mouth is.

Taxing the rich and cutting taxes on middle class and poor.

[waterwatcher123]

12. There is no way to successfully change a presidential candidate with a little over three months to the election.

There are about three three 3.5 months until the November election. So, explain to me how any of these democratic insiders are going to find a new candidate, get them on the ballot in all 50 states, create a marketing campaign, fund raise, hire and train staff, build a get-out the vote campaign and build bridges with the fourteen million Americans who already voted in the primary? It is political suicide to do this at this stage of the process. They had their chance in the primary and chose not to exercise that option.

I have noticed that it is not the progressive Democrats or the Black Caucus who are clamoring for Biden to step down. So, what is it that scares these white, generally wealthy democrats about Joseph R. Biden? I think it is more about greed and money than anything else. As much as they pretend to care about social issues, these wealthy Democrats have a lot in common with wealthy Republicans. They do not want an economic populist for president who supports estate tax reform, unions and who keeps talking about getting the rich to pay their fair share.

[unc70]

13. Bill and Hillary are supporting Biden

I take that as a strong sign to stay with Biden.

[Fiendish Thingy]

16. Well, according to anonymous sources, they are

Let’s keep things apples to apples, shall we?

[Irish_Dem]

19. Do you have a link to recent support.

Beyond the support the day after the debate.

I would be happy to see them backing Biden this week.

[Fiendish Thingy]

14. Thank you, thank you, thank you!

For a reasoned, honest, heartfelt essay on how you see things.

[LAS14]

15. Thank you!!!! nt

[SocialDemocrat61]

17. Nancy Pelosi is not infallible

No one is. She can be dead wrong.

[Irish_Dem]

21. If it were just one person that would be Ok.

But so many of them.

All of them dead wrong.

How did we vote for so many people who are dead wrong about such a critical issue?

[SocialDemocrat61]

23. There was a time

when most believed the earth was flat. They were all dead wrong. Just because many people agree on something, it doesn't make them right.

[Irish_Dem]

24. We don't know if they are right or wrong because they won't tell us what is going on.

And right or wrong, they still have a great deal of power and influence.

These are people we have respected for many years, trusted them and admired them.

We need more information to make a judgement.

[edisdead]

84. That they have power and influence...

That they have power and influence does not TRUMP our voice!

JFC this strikes at the very birth of our nation. wtf are we doing????

well the king and his nobles have a lot of power and influence. Who are WE to question them?

[Irish_Dem]

94. IDK what Pelosi et al are doing.

I just know they are in a brutal brawl with a sitting president from their own party.

I suppose they figure this is a representative democracy, not a direct one.
This means our elected officials represent us and make decisions.

[Blue Full Moon]

51. Actually no one thought the world was flat.

[edisdead]

85. Actually some still do.

[Blue Full Moon]

90. That came later

[Blue Full Moon]

91. Flat Earth is a myth, a modern misconception

The belief that educated people during the Middle Ages thought the Earth was flat. 5th century Greece is the earliest written proof that the Earth was a sphere. In 240 BC Eratosthene calculated the circumference. Early Middle Ages, 600 to 1000 AD educated people from Europe and the Middle East knew the Earth was round. And was nonexistant from Late Middle Age onwards. There never was a period of flat Earth darkness. No educated people in history of Western Civilization from 3rd century BC onward believed the Earth to be flat. Flat Earth came about between 1870 and 1920 over struggles with biological evolution.
Exception to this myth is the Great A'tuin, a world turtle with 4 immense elephants
Berilia, Tubul, Great T'Phon and Jerakeen stand on it's shell and discworld rests on their shoulders. My favorite author Terry Pratchett's Discworld series.

[SocialDemocrat61]

100. Interesting, thank you

Have a nice day!

[Walleye]

33. We won't really know who is right or wrong about this until after the election.

[Irish_Dem]

38. Exactly. This is the only metric which counts.

Especially this election cycle.

I don't know if the Dem leadership is right or wrong.
I only know what they seem dead set on doing.

There is one hell of a political brawl happening behind the scenes.

[TheKentuckian]

79. Not even then.

It is well within the realm of possibility that either path could have worked or we were getting a fail no matter what.

The only thing we can count on is that winning cures everything so as long as whatever happens works out that will at least suffice despite the crowing of the proponents of whatever happened.

Well...I guess it can be relied on fairly heavily that if we lose the other side of the coin will pretend certainty that everything would be great if they got their way too but that you almost can never tell.

I'm a little jealousy of the feeling of anything resembling certainty here.

[Walleye]

93. But at least Biden remaining on the ticket is supported by democratic voters

We knew that because of the primary if somebody has a better idea than the 14 million voters, they better be right

[Mr.WeRP]

37. Most from California.... Hmmm.

[Irish_Dem]

39. What do you think that means?

[Mr.WeRP]

48. I'm more curious as to what YOU think that means...

[Irish_Dem]

52. I have no idea what you meant, or I wouldn't need to ask.

What do you think is the California connection?

Seems like a straightforward question.
I ask people questions, I like to know their thoughts about a topic they are raising.

Usually most people can explain their comments.
They don't need to turn it around and start shouting about it.

[Mr.WeRP]

74. Why do you want Biden to resign?

That is the real question. Are you deep in the $$?

[marmar]

25. A very reasoned and measured post.

And I agree with you. I think Biden has done an amazing job as president, but I'm also well aware of the perceptions out there of people who don't pay as much attention to these things as we do.

[Freddie]

29. I totally agree with you

I’m a huge fan of the President but I think another candidate would have a better chance of winning. This year that is ALL that matters.

[Walleye]

34. "Another candidate"? Like a generic candidate?

[Freddie]

40. Vice President Harris

If Biden steps down. My choice for VP would be PA Gov Josh Shapiro.

[Walleye]

42. Sounds like a great ticket. I don't think it would have a better chance than Biden though.

Have we forgotten what they did to Hillary? They’ll do the same shit to Kamala.

[Sympthsical]

32. I think the explanation is extremely simple

People (not you, OP) are spinning far-flung conspiracies off into the aether, but the simplest explanation sounds like the truest one to me.

But.

I honestly don't think I can say it here. But it accounts for the donors and the leaderships' behavior very easily. And, best of all, there's nothing super villainous about it. Just a risk calculation.

Just think of the simplest possible explanation.

It's that.

[Mr.WeRP]

36. If this is the take of DU, then the Dems are fucked, plain and simple.

[bullimiami]

43. I think it's mostly Republican and Russian trolls and a handful of comments.

Twisted and amplified and hoovered up by the FUCKED media addicted to drama.

[ZonkerHarris]

44. You are wrong Tom. The big donor class is calling the shots against Biden. Don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining

There's been a lot of reporting on it.

[hamsterjill]

47. May I disagree?

“ But the clear majority of America's voters have been adamant now for over a year that they believe both Donald Trump and Joe Biden are too old to be elected President again.”

Hmm…I simply not sure this is an accurate statement. Ask a Trumper if they think Trump is too old. Betcha they will say he isn’t and start telling you about his virility, etc.

And then ask an older Biden supporter if they (themselves) are too old to do the things they are most skilled at doing. The answer might surprise you, and the older generation is the one that gets to the polls.

[SCantiGOP]

50. To the OP:

Thanks for your reasoned and thoughtful post. I think it is helpful considering the strained environment this forum is in right now.

[hume]

54. De Toqueville said,

Americans are naive to think there is no aristocracy.

[relayerbob]

55. Your examples show the fallacy in replacing Biden

" Ted Kennedy challenged President Jimmy Carter for the Democratic nomination in 1980, and Ronald Reagan challenged President Gerald Ford for the Republican nomination in 1976. "

BOTH destroyed the incumbent's chance for re-election.

Add the challenges of Ralph Nader v. Al Gore, the results with H. Ross Perot and Clinton/Sanders.

Dumb.

Stay the course.

[Bleacher Creature]

60. Great post.

Seeing the number of people liking it and agreeing with you makes me feel a lot better. I'm seeing some crazy conspiracy theories on this board and it's been quite frustrating.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

116. I agree. There is a lot of emotions out there and

people not really thinking logically. I think a lot of people taking this very personally are looking at this as an attack on them. Maybe they are older males. I’m older but female and can relate to both Joe and Kamala. I feel bad for Joe - it makes me sad when I see that picture of him walking with his baseball cap on looking sad. Im also thinking that some of this is an attack on Kamala, a female. It reminds me of how there was so much hatred of Hillary here in 2016. It’s a sad situation all around.

[Deek1935]

67. This is a SICK political HIGHJACKING and nothing else. Fuck them!

[dchill]

75. You're right. It's not a conspiracy.

It's an attempted takeover.

[MaryMagdaline]

76. Well said.

[Tweedy]

77. Just stupid

It isn’t a conspiracy. It is just stupid, unnecessary and maybe damaging.

[betsuni]

89. The oligarch, wealthy donor and billionaire "class" evil conspiracy conspiracy plot is silly.

Most Democrats' donations are probably usually under $100 (as were Hillary Clinton's in 2016, of course), there are legal limits on campaign contributions, PAC money doesn't go into candidate's pockets. I guess we're supposed to lose faith in government because both sides everyone's corrupt, big envelopes of cash are handed over in parking lots at midnight. Silly.

[Generic Brad]

96. We have no reason to question anyone's integrity in this matter

Personally, I don’t like that it is happening. But at no time have I thought anyone was compromised or trying to undermine this election. Leadership is having a disagreement which has spilled into public view.

[Emile]

97. It's a hostile takeover by rich donors who lost their influence in the GOP because MAGAT's

took it over. They can't buy Biden, so now they are trying to push him out. They want an open convention because they don't like Kamala either. Hopefully Joe stands firm and the party unites. I am truly disgusted with the leadership in the party. They need to apologize and back Joe Biden before all is lost.

[PennRalphie]

101. Why any of this talk?

Democratic primary voters already chose President Biden. I really don’t want anyone claiming they know better than we voters.

Why is there any of this talk? Because of the debate? Soon forgotten. President Biden needs to focus on the economy he’s created. Record number of people employed. Americans traveling at record numbers, spending money wherever they can. He’s helping those who need help. That’s what the people here in this swing state will react to.

President Biden is our choice. Period.

[Raven123]

102. Very thoughtful and sober post

I think the bugaboo for me is that a lot of the movement has been based on polling, and given the shaky track record of polling, I just don’t know what to make of it. I am having a harf time convincing myself that people would vote for TFG because Joe is too old, so in my mind the issue is whether voters show up. Would those potential “no shows” really let TfG win?

i think that’s what my mother used to call cutting off your nose to spite your face or something similar. I just don’t get it.

[JohnnyRingo]

107. Well stated

Some need a splash of cold water to the face so they can step back and take an objective look.

[Elessar Zappa]

113. Many people see conspiracies everywhere.

The mindset is more widespread among the political right but the left is not exempt. I don’t think it’s a good idea to replace Biden and I think all these leaks are hurting our chances. That said, I’m not attributing malice to the motivations of those in our party who believe otherwise. Whatever happens, I’ll vote blue no matter who in November. Because the alternative is unthinkable.