Why Democrats Must Break With Obama on Social Security Cuts

[Melinda]

There are a lot of complicated ways in which to describe the schemes being floated by President Obama and congressional Republicans to abandon the traditional Consumer Price Index in favor of the so-called “chained-CPI” scheme. But there is nothing complicated about the reality that changing the calculations on which cost-of-living increases for Social Security recipients are based has the potential to dramatically reduce the buying power of Americans who rely on this successful and stable federal program.

So the word for what is being proposed is “cut” – as in: President Obama and congressional Republicans are proposing to cut Social Security.

“This is a cut affecting every single beneficiary — widows, orphans, people with disabilities and many others. It is a cut which hurts the most those who are most vulnerable: the oldest of the old, those disabled at the youngest ages, and the poorest of the poor. Perhaps fittingly, this will be done during the holiday season, when the American people are distracted,” says Nancy Altman, the founding co-director of the advocacy group Social Security Works. “They will cut Social Security not openly but by stealth — through a cruel cut known colloquially as the chained CPI.”

This is what Democrats – and most Republicans – said during the recently finished campaign that they would never do.

If Obama cuts the deal, he will in the words of CREDO political director Becky Bond being engaging in a “massive betrayal” of his own campaign commitments, and of the voters who reelected him barely a month ago.

Full article at The Nation

__________________________________________________________________________________________________

So I understand that basing the COLA adjustments on the chained CPI instead of on the traditional CPI would cut the typical 65-year-old's benefit by $130 per year, resulting in approximately $100 Billion saved over the next 10 years.

Eliminate a seniors ability to buy food or medicine so we can make sure and build more bombs, more drones, more machinery of death!!

Again, how much is it we spend annually on wars? Is it just me, or does this country continue to have its priorities screwed up under a Democratic Presidency? We are no longer the party of FDR.

[jsr]

1. “Massive betrayal” would be an understatement

[plethoro]

16. Betrayal changes everything...

Betrayal changes everything.
How you live and how you die.....

[still_one]

2. and as time comes on that amount gets worse, and hurts people even more. The Democrats used to be

the party the you would trust to protect social security and medicare

and yes, Democrats should break with the President or anyone on social security or medicare cuts

[Melinda]

4. Absolutely right. The annual $130 is just the start.. from the Washington Post:

Making such a change also means paying out less in Social Security benefits over time — something liberal Democrats can’t stomach. Imagine, for example, a person born in 1935 who retired to full benefits at age 65 in 2000. People in that position had an average initial monthly benefit of $1,435, or $17,220 a year, according to the Social Security Administration. Under the cost-of-living-adjustment formula and 2012 inflation, that benefit would be up to $1,986 a month in 2013, or $23,832 a year. But if payouts were adjusted using chained CPI, the sum would be around $1,880 a month, or $22,560 a year — a cut of more than 5 percent and more as the years go by.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/2chambers/wp/2012/12/17/what-is-chained-cpi/

[One of the 99]

3. $130 per year?

That's a massive betrayal? Anyone who thinks or says that is not serious and has no credibility.

[Melinda]

5. It always helps to read the entire article posted before replying...

Just sayin'... welcome to DU

From the same article:

Congressional Progressive Caucus co-chair Keith Ellison, the Minnesota Democrat who was one of Obama’s earliest and most enthusiastic backers in 2008, did the math: “The current average earned benefit for a 65 year old on Social Security is $17,134. Using chained CPI will result in a $6,000 loss for retirees in the first fifteen years of retirement and adds up to a $16,000 loss over twenty-five years. This change would be devastating to beneficiaries, especially widowed women, more than a third of whom rely on the program for 90% of their income and use every single dollar of the Social Security checks they've earned. This would require the most vulnerable Americans to dig further into their savings to fill the hole left by unnecessary and irresponsible cuts to Social Security.”

[One of the 99]

9. I did

And $6000 over 15 years is only $33 per month. Far from a massive betrayal.

[bighart]

12. Do you live on $17,000 k a year?

An extra $33 a month may mean the difference between having the electric or gas service or having it shut off.

[One of the 99]

14. Except

that by protecting the medicare retirement age and the other savings that seniors will see in healthcare costs due to the Affordable Care Act, that $33 will be easily offset. It's called looking at the big picture.

[duffyduff]

38. Obviously you don't have to nickle and dime everything

$33 may seem like nothing to you, but if you're poor, it might as well be 33 THOUSAND.

[underthematrix]

101. I'm on social security and receive less than

10,000 a year - for TWO people - me and my husband. It is our only income and the CPI will not affect low income seniors like me.

[Melinda]

15. Your math is wrong. The amount of decrease is chained to the CPI

However, adopting a chained consumer price index to calculate Social Security COLAs is not a small benefit change – it will compound benefit reductions dramatically over time, resulting in an annual benefit that is roughly $1,000 (2012 dollars) lower by the time a beneficiary reaches age 85. As a result, according to AARP Public Policy Institute’s new report Proposed Changes to Social Security’s Cost-of-Living Adjustment: What Would They Mean for Beneficiaries?, “the CCPI will produce the largest benefit cuts during the time when older Americans need more resources to pay for increasing out-of-pocket medical costs, are most dependent on Social Security benefits, and are at the greatest risk of poverty.”

http://www.aarp.org/about-aarp/press-center/info-11-2012/AARP-Opposes-Social-Security-Benefit-Cut-as-Part-of-Lame-Duck-Deficit-Discussions.html

Here's another explanation:

http://www.dailyfinance.com/2012/12/18/chained-cpi-how-washington-is-likely-to-slice-social-security-b/

I'll follow up with more later... work calls, gotta go!

[One of the 99]

59. According to the post I was commenting on

That was the number. Go take a look: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2029144

[Melinda]

66. It's called extrapolation. Have a look:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022033684

[One of the 99]

69. Accoding to that chart

It's only $50 per month. Versus those who will lose their food stamps, unemployment insurance and other benefits in a few weeks. The chained CPI can always be reversed when the Dems regain control of the House. But there are people that have a real risk now. That should be the priority.

[rhett o rick]

76. Cut one single dollar is a massive betrayal. Stay away from Social Security. Cut defense spending,

cut tax give-aways for the rich, cut corporate welfare, but stay away from Social Security.

[RKP5637]

79. They won't really cut defense spending a lot or others on the take with lots of $$$$$ because they

kick ass. So, they go after the vulnerable in a society, because often they do not fight back. If cuts are significant, it will be the demise of the democratic party. If they thought they lost the south in the 60's, that will seem like the good years. If the course stays the same the democrats will lose in 2014 and the presidency in 2016. Many will just say F it, A=B, the differential has been lost.

[One of the 99]

84. Crazy talk.

That 'my way or the highway' thinking will get nothing accomplished. It is totally counter-productive.

[rhett o rick]

85. I find it interesting that when the Republicans say "my way or the highway" it's ok.

It's way past time for us to say no to the fuckin terrorists. It's our way or the fuckin highway.

Stop compromising with the bastards.

[One of the 99]

86. So you solution is to be more like Republicans

Nice.

[rhett o rick]

87. If that's the way you want to play, go play elsewhere. nm

[One of the 99]

88. I'm just repeating

what you said.

[rhett o rick]

89. With a slight twist. It's called intellectual dishonesty. It's up to you.

If you want to have a discussion w/o twisting my words fine, otherwise, go somewhere else to play those games.

[One of the 99]

90. So now you're denying you said

I find it interesting that when the Republicans say "my way or the highway" it's ok.

It's way past time for us to say no to the fuckin terrorists. It's our way or the fuckin highway.

Which says you want Dems to do exactly what you accuse Republicans of doing. Those are your words, not mine.

[rhett o rick]

91. If you have a point to make about the discussion, please make it.

You seem to be hung up on trying to put words in my mouth then beating me up for them.

"So now you're denying you said"? and "So your solution is to be more like Republicans". That technique is called insinuation via question and considered intellectually dishonest. Often used by Faux Noise. "Is Obama a Muslim?" "Do Democrats eat babies?"

It is clear you want to play games and not discuss the issue. Please go away and annoy someone else.

[One of the 99]

92. But that's what you said.

I quoted what you said. Why are you now denying it?

[rhett o rick]

93. One more time. It appears you dont understand intellectual dishonesty.

When you say, "Why are you now denying it? " you are making the implication that I did deny it. If I, in fact did deny it, then provide the quote. And even if I did say it, it's beside the point of the discussion. You have deviated from the discussion to try to beat me up for what you think I said. Looking back, it doesnt look like you made any proposals yourself.

I do not wish to continue this exercise in futility. I am asking you nicely to move on.

[plethoro]

18. $130.00 a year? Do you really think everyone here is freaked out

about $130.00 per year? I suggest you read further about what the collective and cumulative effects of adjustments through a chained cpi are. $130.00 per year? Mother-of-God. Do that teach math in school anymore.

[One of the 99]

60. That was the number quoted in the post above

Take a look: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2029109

What I really find most concerning is that people here are more concerned with a slight decrease in SS benefits 20 years from now but don't care that millions will lose Food Stamps, Unemployment Insurance and other benefits in a few weeks if the government goes off the fiscal cliff.

[NoMoreWarNow]

28. the problem is that our priorities are MASSIVELY screwed up

we spend an obscene amount on the military and wars, but can't cut that and need to cut already meager payments to seniors? Sick.

[One of the 99]

61. I agree

The military budget needs to be cut. But the current reality is that the GOP still controls the House and can filibuster in the Senate. Unfortunately, the President and the Democrats have to deal with them and compromise in the short term. What we need to do is make sure that the Dems retake the House in 2 or 4 years, then maybe some of this can be reversed.

[JHB]

48. What will it be next time? Another raise in the age? Another "tweak" to the COLA?

This isn't over, because the billionaire ideologues who only care about deficits when Democrats are in charge won't miss a beat, because they believe Social Security and Medicare are "big government" "socialist" programs that the government should not be involved in.

[One of the 99]

62. Well if we don't want that to happen

We need to work to ensure that the Dems retake the House in 2014.

[plethoro]

64. With the chained CPI going into effect, that won't happen......nft

dddddd

[One of the 99]

70. Only if

The left acts like a spoiled child and takes their ball an goes home. We shouldn't make that mistake again. We are now living with the result of that thinking in 2010.

[plethoro]

71. No, we are living in approximate hell because we elected a President with no experience

Last edited Wed Dec 19, 2012, 10:18 PM - Edit history (1)

in negotiation techniques. I'm going to take roughly 280 thousand balls and go home. I cannot vote for someone who is cutting what my wife and I earned over 50 years. Until this is settled, we are cutting back on expenses and will have to stop charitable donations.

[One of the 99]

73. Yes that will help. nt

[WiffenPoof]

67. It Is Not The Amount...

...it is the principle.

Paige

[One of the 99]

68. How about this for an amount.

If the fiscal cliff happens, millions will lose their food stamps, their unemployment insurance and other benefits. Not in 20 years but in a few weeks.

I rather stand up for people instead of some ideological or political principle.

[customerserviceguy]

78. One way or the other

the Repukes have got us where they want us. Older and disabled folks with COLAs fighting unemployed and working poor folks with nothing. They sure know how to play divide and conquer.

[One of the 99]

83. That's just ridiculous.

If they "got us where they want us"; why have they rejected the package.

[customerserviceguy]

96. They don't have to accept the package

just to have fun watching us fight. In fact, the harder they resist, the more they figure the President is going to sweeten the deal.

Sorry if I seem cynical, I just remember the lousy deal he cut two years ago with the lame duck Congress, and he didn't even have a Repuke House to wrangle with.

[One of the 99]

98. That's not logical,

And two years ago they had to deal with GOP filibusters in the Senate.

[customerserviceguy]

102. What's changed about that?

I sure hope the President has sharpened his skills, but then, I don't think he's going to get any kind of a deal. I really see the Repukes driving the whole thing into the wall, thinking their constituents will do way better than our side. Sure, rich people want to make megabucks off the poor every day of the week, but they're way more prepared to take an income pause than we are.

[One of the 99]

103. Nothing really

Which is why we need to realize that we are not going to get 100% of what we want and that compromise is needed.

[forestpath]

6. K&R

[Doctor_J]

7. He will go down in history as the president who cut SS

and the slaughter in the mid-terms will be directly on his shoulders.

I have a sneaking suspicion that once this deal is cut he might change his party affiliation. He will no longer have anything in common with Sanders, Wellstone, Grayson, and LBJ. He will officially be a Reagan/Bush Republican.

[lark]

17. Its only when he's in campaign mode that he's even somewhat liberal

The rest of the time he's the old time moderate Repug, same values, always hurts the poor and working class in favor of the 1% but socially liberal. Who contributed to his PAC after all?

I was hoping this time he'd get it and realize he needed to stay true to his help the workers promise, but the ink hasn't even flowed and he's already giving the Repugs a great Christmas gift. They will be able to run on this forever - Democrats cut your retirement, vote for us. Why is Obama negotiating with himself? Let the Repugs propose cuts, then say "NO". Why is he cutting when he should be expanding SSI by removing the cap? Why hasn't that been raised, because he wants to be seen as a centrist and a conciliator and cares more about looking good to Repugs and Independents than he does to the people tht actually voted for him. Stupid. So glad I didn't contribute one signle dime this time around.

[NoMoreWarNow]

29. so true-- he talks a good game when it's time for election

but then comes the sell-out. Of course, most politicians do it. But let's not pretend something he isn't.

[NorthCarolina]

19. I think this has been on the drawing boards since

his inception as a candidate back in 08. Conservatives have always known it would take a Democrat to pull off such a great swindle, so the powers that be created a Democrat in their own image. There is a no doubt a script for this entire plan someplace. The media will act as if there are sufficient folks on board with this, calling it 'no big deal' or something to that effect, and once again the people will be screwed for the benefit of the top 2%; the ones that actually decide who we get to vote for.

[kenny blankenship]

31. I'm convinced Obama is really Pete Peterson in shoe polish.

It's like a Superman - Clark Kent thing, except in this case the alter with the super powers goes around shredding the Constitution, shielding torturers and the biggest crooks in history, slashing the safety net, and destroying the American Way instead of protecting it. Now I know what you're about to object - and yes it's true: multiple people have seen Obama and Peterson together at the same place at the same time. So the alter-identity hypothesis would appear to be ruled out. However, I maintain that this was a magician's trick pulled off with carefully placed mirrors. It's the only explanation that makes sense.

[duffyduff]

41. I think more and more people are seeing through the whole thing here

The powers that be own both parties, with one playing the bad cop and one the good cop. However, it is always the "good cop" who ends up screwing people over.

The Democratic Party as personified by Obama is NOT the Democratic Party of even ten years ago.

[EmeraldCityGrl]

63. They know after their 2nd term they will be treated like Gods

by the media and Social Elite. Just this morning I turned on MSNBC
and for the second time all the Bush Women were on there for some
puff piece. Turned it off as soon as I saw they were on.

[HiPointDem]

75. ??? Clinton: welfare reform, nafta, telecom bill, selloff of broadcast spectrum.

[duffyduff]

81. All true, but face it, he didn't try to dismantle public ed, Social Security, and Medicare

He wasn't that stupid.

[HiPointDem]

82. dismantling the public trust is a step-by-step process. offshoring jobs, downsizing welfare, & the

financial services modernization act set the stage for the low-jobs, financialized economy & financial crises that are being used currently to justify more cuts.

[HiPointDem]

74. unfortunately, that's the pattern. just like clinton cut welfare & pushed through nafta. the

democratic base doesn't want to kick if a democrat does it.

in that sense, it's almost better to have a republican because there's push-back on some issues when it's not 'our guy'.

unfortunately, not on foreign policy.

[duffyduff]

39. +1

Not to mention his education "reforms" that have been devastating to public ed.

[Oilwellian]

94. He already likens himself to a Reagan Republican

He did this interview last week. Imagine if he said this right BEFORE the election. He's such a fucking snake.

[99Forever]

8. Quite frankly...

.. these CUTS will destroy The Democratic Party. Deservedly so.

[closeupready]

10. Yes, correct on all points.

[plethoro]

21. Yes. At the exact time the Republican Party was nearing its end..........nft

ddddddd

[AnotherMcIntosh]

53. That's why Obama et al have been keeping the Republican Party standing like a palooka.

[NoMoreWarNow]

30. I really doubt it

most people will sweep it under the rug and forget it... but the Dems will keep losing more true thinking and caring people, more than they've already lost and lost.

[99Forever]

34. I don't care what you doubt.

2010 will look like a walk in the park and a huge win for Democrats, compared to what 2014 will be. Rightfully so.

[kentuck]

11. Yes, they should tell him that he is on his own on this one.

He seems to have difficulty distinguishing his friends from his foes?

[MissDeeds]

13. It's beginning to look like

our foes are his friends. Some of us wondered how he would govern in a second term if he didn't have to worry about reelection. It appears our concerns were well founded.

[lark]

20. IT ACTUALLY has always looked like that

except when he's in campaign mode. He's the stealth president, stealing our money to give to the rich, just like the other side only not so crazy and upfront about the thievery. The really frustrating part is SSI has no part in the deficit, is solvent for 37 years doing nothing. Why is he caving on this? Does he have any principles at all, or is it all about trying to be being popular with the other side? Tht is pure craziness, they will always hate him, no matter that he's giving them everything they want. Next we will hear about cuts to Medicare, and can Medicaid be far behind? Sad that our president is just another pol, saying one thing to get elected then abandonning his principles before he's even signed in.

[plethoro]

23. Baloney. The middle class is dissolving because of giving up things. nft

sssssss

[RomneyLies]

24. The Middle class already sacrificed. In fact, we're the ONLY ones who sacrificed ANYTHING in this me

Time for the people who got us into this mess to actually sacrifice for once.

[Liberal In Texas]

25. Look buddy, I paid into the system and expect to get what was promised.

SS is NOT an issue with the deficit. The deficit came from repug borrowing for 2 wars, corporate welfare and the gift to the wealthy Bush2* gave them in tax cuts from the surplus Clinton left.

Now the bill is coming due and it's time to change the policies that got us here. Try living up to your screen name and think critically and stop buying into the propaganda.

[RomneyLies]

26. +1,000,000,000,000 n/t

[JEB]

27. If you want to cut fat

try the bloated, corrupt, lardass Defense (war) Dept. Leave Grandma and the disabled Vets alone. Anybody who supports cuts to SS benefits will never receive my vote.

[littlemissmartypants]

32. Start with the government funded golf courses.

http://www.militarygolfcourseguide.com/

+ 30 States and + 10 countries have them according to this site.

[e-mail]

[JEB]

36. Turn them into homes and farms

for homeless Vets. Turn your golf clubs into plow shares. Seems the military could use a bit of austerity.

[NoMoreWarNow]

33. exactly- though the Rethugs will always trot out someone who is unbearably crazy compared to our guy

[JEB]

40. Off the fiscal cliff.

It is the best deal we can get.

[arjazz]

35. Obama deserves every criticism and denunciation in this monstrosity

HANDS OFF SOCIAL SECURITY + MEDICARE!

[CrispyQ]

37. What kind of cuts are our senators & representatives

proposing to take in their own retirement packages?

[JEB]

43. These rich fucks

certainly deserve their share of austerity. Give them a park bench for a retirement package.

[Doctor_J]

45. Maybe no raise on their $175,000 taxpayers salaries this year

[alfredo]

42. He wanted the response we are giving him.

[JEB]

44. We gave him that response

in the election.

[alfredo]

49. That's why he brought it up, to drive home the fact we won't accept cuts to SS and Medicare/Medicaid

[littlemissmartypants]

46. WE THE PEOPLE PETITIONS ...

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/not-cut-social-security-andor-medicare-simply-keep-taxes-low-wealthiest-americans/wN1GL0PC

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/make-no-cuts-social-security/xqsFsqLP

[CrispyQ]

47. Don't forget to write to your senators & rep.

It only take a few minutes to compose a couple of paragraphs & copy it into the email form of both senators & rep.

It doesn't have to be eloquent, it just has to be heard!

DO IT, EVERYONE!

[Sheepshank]

50. An opinion piece?

one opinion posted and the bigger picture ignored. i guess it fullfills the "sky is falling, we are betrayed" agenda. But I'm calling this OP like it is ...bullshit. Not in good form luv. In fact it's down right misleading and dishonest.

Try this link for a little additional information so that you can start building a bigger picture with some actual facts and not just opinion pieces.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251264891

ETA. I'm not advocating we all sit on our hands and not make our preferances known in a productive manner. Certainly contact the local, state, reps, and the WH. It's important they understand what we, the public want and need. But to state that it's time to separate ourselves from the one man who is already in the WH is just plain stupid.

[AnotherMcIntosh]

51. What's one more betrayal?

[dennis4868]

52. don't know what the big deal is if...

as part of the President’s proposals for changes to SS, he would make sure that the most vulnerable were exempted out from this change.

[EmeraldCityGrl]

54. That we are having this conversation is testament to

Last edited Wed Dec 19, 2012, 06:36 PM - Edit history (1)

how screwed we are. Every hard working America should be enraged, I
don't care which party you are from. Repukes that vote for those that
rob the peoples treasure on behalf of the 1-3% are hell bent on seeing
this country descend into absolute misery for those that are the most
vulnerable Those that think they will never find themselves in that
position are one illness, financial or personal crisis away from joining them.

This filthy rich nation made a contract with the people and the people kept their
part of the bargain. That we have been brought to our knees fighting for crumbs
should ignite absolute rage in every American.

Wall Street, Elected Officials, MIC and all the rest of the Robber Barons have
robbed the treasure that was ours. They are now like buzzards fighting over the
scraps, the scraps that are designated for the most vulnerable among us. We
cannot lower the bar. This is NOT negotiable.

This is not just a right vs. left issue. This is an issue between the 1-3% of the population
and the rest of us. That 1-3% is capable of your worst nightmare to protect what
their greed has afforded them. The game has been rigged so that the average hard
working, middle-class American will need S.S, Medicare and Medicaid to survive. There
have been no regulations put in place after the collapse. Whether it will be a bond bubble
or a dollar bubble we are in for very difficult times ahead and it has become every man
for himself as far as they're concerned.

[Faryn Balyncd]

55. Every Democratic Congress-person should receive a few thousand copies of this from constituents.

[indepat]

56. In no way could the MIC instead absorb this cut and still insure no American would ever

die at the hand of a foreign terrorist. Instead we must sacrifice the quality of life and life itself of countless thousands of Americans who would either starve or freeze to death or be unable to buy their medicine and there is no limit to the number of lives the politicians will gladly allow to be snuffed out so millions of its inhabitants can legally pack a weapon of mass murder on their hips. The dichotomy and duplicity are unparalleled, the egregious stupidity manifest, and the abject cruelty absolutely breathtaking.

[Melinda]

57. Best post of the thread, seriously. Best. Post.

After reading your second sentence, I immediately felt as if I should be calling everyone Comrade. After reading your last sentence I cried.

Beautiful, painful post. Thank you.

[indepat]

58. My progeny and I thank you

[Doctor_J]

95. DOn't forget the Pentagon volunteered to make cuts

and were turned down. That is how criminal the Congress is right now

[Oilwellian]

97. Very well said

I agree with Melinda, it's the best post in the thread.

[YoungDemCA]

65. K&R. We have to draw the line SOMEWHERE.

If not here, then where?

[Poll_Blind]

72. DU REC +1 nt

PB

[ELI BOY 1950]

77. He will not do this...he is your president

[jbp23]

80. reply

Yes that is how i see it.

[1-Old-Man]

99. All this can do is make sure a whole lot of Representatives and Senators don't come back

A vote for reducing benefits to seniors is the kiss of death. And you can bet AARP will get that word out as well as a list of who voted for what, district by district by district.

[TheKentuckian]

100. We don't have to break from the President, he broke from us just by accepting the corporate frame.

Folks really need to grasp that fundamental aspect and work from there. Once he ceded the frame there was no way to a just ending here.
It is way past time to either sit the "centrists" in a corner with a dunce cap on or to make the party inhospitable to them so they go back to trying to restore sanity to the TeaPubliKlans and that at ALL COST, whatever it takes.