Let's get one thing straight about the farmers squawking about their farms going under

[Aviation Pro]

These aren't 40 acres and a mule types; most independent farmers are millionaires with vast holdings and a majority voted for the fucking pedophile.

They are worried that the market will price soybeans at $10 rather than $12, which will eat into their profit margin.

So, spare me that they are the latter-day equivalent of the Joad family, they are just as parasitic as corporations because they are corporations.

[markodochartaigh]

1. This started with Earl Butz, Nixon's Secretary of Agriculture

His advice to farmers was "Get big or get out". He reversed New Deal policies which helped small farmers. He finally lost his job over a racist joke. Newspapers in the South didn't print the joke, but you could stop by the newspaper office and request to see it.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earl_Butz

[Paladin]

15. Jeez, Earl Butz. Haven't thought of him in years, thankfully.

Still remember how happy I was that he got kicked out of office, on account of that nasty racist joke.

[11 Bravo]

36. Good old Earl "tight pussy, loose shoes, and a warm place to shit" Butz.

Fucker would be considered a squishy moderate in today's GOP.

[Paladin]

38. Yeah, he'd fit right in with the rest of the Repube pond scum, now. (nt)

[walkingman]

2. TRUTH!! Farmers have been using the government to enrich themselves for decades.

Farm Subsidies are America's largest corporate welfare program.

[allegorical oracle]

14. So true. I live near a $2.2-million "small" family farm. They work hard, admittedly, but

they go straight to the USDA if a crop fails and is reimbursed. They pay almost zero property taxes.

Another farmer (a county official) was caught "double-dipping" and was fined. He claimed that deer and coyotes had eaten his watermelon crop -- but it turned out he had sold the crop to a local melon middleman. Wasn't that farmer's first time, either, he succeeded with being paid twice for his "failed" crops in the past.

Believe I've read and heard that soybean farmers in djt's first term were well reimbursed after China didn't buy their crops because China switched to buy from Brazil.

[PatSeg]

24. And then some of them run for congress

insuring that those subsidies keep on coming.

[SergeStorms]

23. I've seen it first-hand.

They started out small family farmers in the early 20th century, then they discovered "soil bank," government grants for land improvement, no-interest loans for farm equipment, etc. They bought more and more land, priced out small family farms and absorbed them, all under the aegis of the federal government. Now this "small" family farm is worth near $750,000,000 on paper, but they're still crying poor.
Our tax dollars at work.

[Prairie_Seagull]

3. Word!

Does anyone still say that?

[rubbersole]

11. Word up!

[TexLaProgressive]

4. If my math is correct a drop from $12 to $10 is about 15%

15% is the average profit margin the farmer can hope for.

[Aviation Pro]

5. Closer to 17%

But consider the loss as a tax deduction on their other holdings.

[ProfessorGAC]

7. Which, Of Course, Is Not How It Works

First, even large independent farmers need to maintain large reserves of cash. So, a good portion of the holdings are low yield & short term.
Second, the only tax deduction is the actual loss when expenses exceed revenue.
So, that whole 16.67% is never going to be completely recovered by tax reduction.
Finally, not far out if our town is where "rural" begins.
There are many farmers out there that have significant worth on paper but aren't within screaming distance of 7 figure net incomes.
Your zeal to demonize has clouded your perception of farming as a business.

[modrepub]

10. I'd Like To See Farm Net Worth

Because I’ve heard lots of different points of view on the extremes. Once upon a time, journalists would write about this but that’s not happening anymore.

There are a lot of Amish where I live. They’re as true a farmer as I could come up with. In the last 30 years I’ve lived among them, I’ve never seen one doing poorly. In fact, in my neck of the woods they’re buying up properties and expanding their range. So based on this observation, I’d say farming is a lucrative business for those who know what they’re doing.

[Ms. Toad]

18. You would be wrong.

I grew up on a family farm. My first year teaching ('78) I earned $10,500. I was shocked to learn that that year was the first year my father (with a degree in agriculture - so yeah, he knows what he is doing) earned that much. His was the sole income for the family (7 of us), and had been farming at that point for 19 years (although he grew up as a farm kid). We always filled out the free lunch paperwork because we were always close enough to being eligible that it was worth it.

He is now 93, and has been out of farm debt once since he started farming in '58. You borrow to plant the spring crop - gambling which crop will pay for itself - and hope the rains are good enough for you to grow a healthy crop - but not too good because if everyone else's crops grow well the price goes down.

He is land-rich and cash poor, and always has been. As have been his cousin (and farming partner), his siblings (who all worked off the farm to make ends meet - and one of whom went bankrupt), as have my cousins (at least one of whom went bankrupt).

The up side for my siblings and I, since none of us are farmers, is that my parents being land-rich will make a nice in heritance.

Amish are not a comparison for family farms. The culture/economics/etc. are very different for the Amish than they are for a typical family farm.

[ProfessorGAC]

19. While Possible...

...it doesn't relate to what I posted.

[hamsterjill]

25. Amish makes a lot of money on puppy mills, too.

I will not buy anything that is Amish. We have stores in our area with their furniture, and even a restaurant within driving range. (I'm in Texas, no less!!!) But I will not spend a penny with them because of their treatment of animals. They are horrific to their working animals, especially.

[modrepub]

29. Well Aware of That

But they generally believe their financial success reflects God’s approval of their life style and choices. I’m close enough to know the dark side of Amish living. Among the Amish, there are darker things than poor animal treatment IMHO; maintain your boycot by all means.

I’ve tempered my observations with my experience of working many years with a guy, college educated like myself. He never once proselytized to me or gave me the slightest hint he was a devoted Christian. I found out at his funeral that he was Mennonite and why he studied Attic Greek; to translate the Bible for himself from original scripture.

Whenever I get ruffled by Evangelicals or Christian’s in general, I remember my friend and the quiet path he walked towards his salvation.

[Wonder Why]

16. True. A lot of farms are "land rich, cash poor" (an old saying).

The land brings in a moderate income but they could sell it to a developer who will build a community of upscale homes on what would be called "Farmer Jones Acres" but then would no longer have an income since the money they get isn't enough to retire on while young enough to work and not qualified to do anything else.

We have a lot of apple orchards and farms in our area that have become "Farmer Jones Acres" communities of townhomes and houses.

[allegorical oracle]

31. Happening in my rural area of Fla., too. One of the creepiest trends is turning farm

acreage into RV "subdivisions". Land is divided into hundreds of small plots that have electric, water, and septic hook-ups. Grass is planted, roads are paved. People move their various RVs in and put up potted trees, awnings, and all have a car, as well. Guess they retire and die there. Reminds me of what the old, outdoor movie drive-ins looked like, only without a big screen.

[ForgedCrank]

32. To me it

is very obvious that few here know much about farm business.
You are correct, it's not what it is being presented as by folks who know literally zero about the business.
A never ending circle of debt and credit are the real life of small farmers, and they sure as heck aren't eating steak and shrimp for dinner. Some years are negative, some years are a bounty. Budgeting and saving are all that get one through the next cycle most times. You can have a great year, but that doesn't make the ulcers settle down because next year is always coming.

[TheProle]

34. K&R

[DiverDave]

6. Wall Street got into

Farming a long time ago.
Hedge funds own millions of acres.
But tell a maget that? They scream that's a lie.

[bottomofthehill]

8. Farmers Welfare Kings and Queens living in Chicago Hotels driving Cadillacs

The Ronald Reagan Welfare Queens

[Mr.WeRP]

9. These "Farmers" made an investment choice and lost

The invested in growing Soy Beans that China has historically bought. When they lost their two main customers: USAID and China, they lost their investment. Sounds like Capitalism at work, and they lost because Trump killed their second best customer and pissed off their best customer. Don’t ask blue state taxpayers to bail these fuckers out!

[Paladin]

12. If they voted for trump, fuck 'em. (nt)

[rubbersole]

13. I'll weep when Monsanto applies for SNAP assistance.

[Wiz Imp]

17. Not accurate. USDA statistics:

https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/farm-economy/farm-household-well-being/farm-household-income-estimates

[Gimpyknee]

20. It's nice to see facts expressed.

[Historic NY]

21. Some large farms are multi generational family operations...

that been running for generations. They also lease additional land in total they have 1000 acres. The equipment is crazy priced, plus most farming is done by computers, yes. They plot the course in the fields, speed, and communication between various pieces of equipment. The repairs are expensive 10k for one set tractor tires. 2 Truck (tractor trailers) 1990 vintage repairs. Then there is dryers and the huge silos for storage. One million dollars.They bought a second used tractor for 600k and its was broke, they do most repairs in house.

I follow a family in Iowa that farm soybeans and corn. The startup cost for seed is 150k. This year they employed a drone (reaper) to spray crops because the fields were constantly awash with heavy rain. In a few days they will begin harvest of corn. That goes on some 14-16hrs a day. Families aren't paying themselves, they pay their hired help and that is a problem. Getting hired help so other friends and farmers now pitch in to help each other.

Every year they make improvements to cut costs and improve harvest. I think last year he said they needed 1.5 million to break even.

My family was in farming from c1910 one of those 40 acre and a mule team. We still kept up some truck farming into the 80s mostly tomatoes and peppers to local restaurants and vegetable stands. Lands and cattle were sold off by 1953.

[Grokenstein]

22. "ONLY THE WEAK WILL FAIL!" -- diminished donnie

May everyone have the day they personally voted for.

[pandr32]

26. Perhaps there is a silver lining.

It would be nice to see farming return to local farmers within states. We need a 'eat local' movement across the country.

[lark]

27. Umm, not all of them, just most.

My daughter's partner is from farming country in MN. and they hace a small family farm, not a corporation. They are struggling too.
Don't know if they voted for rump, haven't asked. If they did, they earned it - even if they aren't hate filled magats - they voted for them.

[littlemissmartypants]

28. HEAR! HEAR! Why don't we just round them all up while we're

Rounding up the field workers and deport them to ALL to South America and Africa!! Or jail them in tents here and electric cattle prod them until they agree to work for NOTHING while growing our food for free!!

Someone's been brainwashed into thinking it's not the oligarchs but farmers who are the devil.

The real concern should be the purchasing of the farms left by farmers in bankruptcy or dead by suicide being owned by "vulture" capitalists like our current VP an his cronies.



https://mediaproxy.snopes.com/width/600?url=
While this is an imprecise description of the type of land this company brokers — it deals only in agricultural properties — it is true that Vance provided early funding to, and may still be invested in, AcreTrader. https://www.snopes.com/news/2024/10/08/jd-vance-acretrader/

But just keep bashing those farmers while the oligarchy keeps us distracted so they can steal our candy and piss in our Cherrios.

[Cirsium]

30. Small farms here

No one is getting rich, far from it. A couple of big operators are building vertical monopolies, but most are struggling. And yes some of those big operators are gaming the system and getting a lot of public funds. But that is true in every industry. That's capitalism. Agriculture is more committed to benefiting the public than most industries.

The subsidies to agriculture are for the benefit of the general public: Cooperative Extension, the Land Grant colleges, the USDA, state ag agencies, Farm Credit, etc. As progressives we should strongly support the public ag infrastructure. It is under attack.

40-45% of the growers here vote Democratic. But so what? Owners in every industry trend Republican. Even in heavily agricultural district such as where I am, farmers - farm owners - are a very small percentage of the electorate. There are something like 100,000 people in the three counties here and about 350 growers. That is pretty much true everywhere. There are not enough farm owners to impact election results.

Let's look at Missouri, for example. There are 3,000,000 or so workers in Missouri, and there are about 27,000 farm workers, a few of whom are actually owners — “farmers.”

By way of comparison, there are 358,470 people working in office and administrative occupations; 251,150 transportation workers; 200,200 heath care practitioners; 257,610 food service workers; 239,430 work in sales; 197,350 factory workers; 181,350 in financial occupations; 169,240 work in education; 159,960 health care support workers; 120,100 installation and repair workers; 116,510 construction workers; 85,000 computer related jobs; 82,140 maintenance workers; 60,980 law enforcement and emergency services; 58,460 personal care workers; 46,640 social services workers; 35,520 in engineering jobs; 33,440 in arts and entertainment.

The Republicans make great hay with their "rugged individualism" stereotypes - Reagan on horseback, Bush and his phony ranch, Trump with all of his macho posturing. The Walter Mittys fantasizing about being pioneers, or cowboys, or ranchers, whatever, fall for that crap.

The endless attacks on farmers just make Democrats look ignorant and out of touch. It is extremely bad politics.

[markodochartaigh]

33. On a very positive note,

Jim Hightower was the Texas Agricultural Commissioner back in the 80's. He is very progressive and strongly promoted small family farms. He is still kicking and his substance is here:

https://jimhightower.substack.com/

[GoodRaisin]

35. They want an infusion of socialism.

[flashman13]

37. I am far too busy to write the meaningful commentary this subject requires. Three points:

I see a lot of not especially informed comments.

I also see far too much farmer bashing just because the majority of farmers think they are Republicans. That is really counter productive.

It is really foolish to bite the hand that feeds you. We are still the recipients of the greatest and most varied food supply found anywhere on the planet. Farm products do a great deal to maintain favorable trade balances. And that food is also far less expensive than it would be without the government farm programs.