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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThis Is TRULY Outrageous & It REALLY Pisses Me Off!
Last edited Sun Jan 6, 2013, 10:48 AM - Edit history (1)
This picture is from a Milford, Delaware playground. Milford is in Southern Delaware in the very conservative Sussex County. I originally saw this picture on Facebook, from a liberal friend downstate, who was sharing it via an original posting of the very nonliberal Dan Gaffney, a conservative talk show radio host. It is nice to know that the outrage concerning this photo is bipartisan. And what is so outrageous about it, you ask?
Well, you can read what it says in English. In Spanish it says (paraphrasing) [font color=red]"You have to have a permit to play here or you will be arrested." [/font] The english version contains no information about needing a permit or else you will be subject to police action. It is an obvious intimidation tactic and a not so subtle "Whites Only" sign.
exact translation:
So if you are a white English speaking "American," you can play here at your own risk so long as you have a parent or guardian watching. If you are brown, if you dare play here without a permit we will arrest your immigrant ass. That is the fucking height of racism, and I will see to it that who ever is responsible for this sign will have their public careers ended immediately.
Make this go viral.
UPDATED:
with MORE signs (for those who doubt this is real) PLUS:
Update 3:
WAY MORE PICS HERE!!!:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/05/1176645/-Outrage-in-Delaware
Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)I've kicked this on. Others will see it.
aikoaiko
(34,170 posts)ReRe
(10,597 posts)the OP said "South Delaware." just saying..
RandiFan1290
(6,232 posts)Canuckistanian
(42,290 posts)kelliekat44
(7,759 posts)Ikonoklast
(23,973 posts)Luminous Animal
(27,310 posts)Drunken Irishman
(34,857 posts)LynneSin
(95,337 posts)There are 3 counties in Delaware. Sussex county is the furthest south and when you get away from the beach towns it's like stepping into the deep south.
Beach towns are very progressive including Rehobeth Beach which has been considered one of friendliest proLGBT beaches in the country.
riverbendviewgal
(4,252 posts)I met a woman in her 60s in Florida this past winter. She is my boyfriend's brother's girlfriend. She just moved down permanently from a gated community in NJ to a gated Community in Florida. We were going to dinner and out of the blue she said she could not understand why Obama would not produce his birth certificate. I was shocked and said he did. I was not going into any argument because I did not want my BF to be upset. That was one of the moments while there that winter that made me decide winter of 2012 would be the last time I would be in the USA. The hatred is too overwhelming.
lunatica
(53,410 posts)We have tons of people of all races, cultures and countries here and we're proud of it. If you come and visit UC Berkeley you'll be very impressed at how diverse we are.
RevStPatrick
(2,208 posts)And yet, by far the worst incidents that I have seen with my own eyes of cops treating dark-skinned people horribly all happened in San Francisco or Berkeley.
lunatica
(53,410 posts)riverbendviewgal
(4,252 posts)I have been to San Diego. my son has been to San Franciso and other friends. They say it is very much like Toronto, lots of diversity. I love that. It is funny when my son was 9 we visited relatives in NJ. A small town all white then. My son noticed this to my surprise. He asked me where were all the people of colour. His third grade at home was a little United Nations. He now lives near London England now and is as diverse as you can get. I was raised in a racist family but I read a lot when I was a kid. I guess it was what made me the progressive I am today. I was the weird one in the family.
Now that my son is in UK I will travel there. I have seen much of eastern, Midwest, southwest and south USA. I got to see the Grand Canyon. And all this traveling was driving. I got the feel of the land and people. It has changed so much since 2000. I think big cities are more progressive but small towns and rural areas are much more conservative now. and now all these guns are scary.
lunatica
(53,410 posts)I really can't stand to be around bigots.
Brainstormy
(2,380 posts)to Atlanta.
calimary
(81,265 posts)Glad you're here! This seems to be typical - of the damn double-standard that reeks, seemingly EVERYWHERE. Something we ALL need to work toward ENDING from here onward.
Some examples:
Why is it okay when republi-CONS do it but not okay when Democrats do it?
Why is it okay when whites do it but not okay when Latinos and blacks do it?
Why is it okay when men do it but not okay when women do it?
Why is it okay when booze-drinkers do it but not okay when pot-smokers do it?
Why is it okay when Second Amendment militants do it but not when gun-control advocates do it?
Why is it okay when Pox Noise does it but not okay when MSNBC does it?
Why is it okay when teabaggers do it but not okay when Occupy does it?
Why is it okay when CONservatives do it but not okay when liberals do it?
Why is it okay when the red states do it but not okay when the blue states do it?
Why is it okay when Operation Rescue does it but not okay when PETA does it?
Why is it okay when the rich do it but not okay when the poor do it?
And I could go on... Hell, we ALL could!
I mean - we ARE - ALL OF US - created equal, are we not?
hunter
(38,311 posts)Some white communities are cosmopolitan and accepting of most everyone and are actively working to erase historical racism, but many actively maintain their homogeneity or segregations by harassing people who are not white.
I haven't lived in a neighborhood where the majority of people are white since the mid 'eighties. The town I grew up in was "whites only" in the same ways these signs represent. It's become very obvious to me which communities do not welcome people who are not white.
tblue
(16,350 posts)of Latinos in the Bay Area too! We do have some segregation in Oakland and East Palo Alto but we are very tolerant for the most part. Thank God. I could not live in a state where there is a lot of racism. I am not white but I wouldn't tolerate it anyway. I got a BIG mouth.
GoneOffShore
(17,339 posts)I was born in New Castle County. It was true 50 years ago and it's still true.
LynneSin
(95,337 posts)which seems odd because to me LSD is a drug.
But when you get close enough to read it - turns out it's for Lower Slower Delaware
randr
(12,412 posts)Southern Delaware, where we spent our summers, was most definitely the "South". All the examples of racism we see from Mississippi or Alabama were present as we grew up. We still have a place in Fenwick Island where my brother lives year round. The racism expressed openly by locals to this day is appalling and black folk still occupy old "slave towns" way off the beaten path.
raccoon
(31,110 posts)Papanui54
(4 posts)Lower Slower Delaware(LSD) is more southern than you would think. We were the reason for the Mason-Dixon Line and a "border" state in the civil war. Anything south of the canal is like anywhere else in the south.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)Delaware is indeed in the South. Like all the Delmarva peninsula.
My wife is African-American and from the Maryland part. She was the first black child to desegregate local schools as a kindergartner in 1965 in a local town. Crossing the Bay Bridge into western Maryland and the DC area is like going through a time tunnel.
I mention white potato pie because it is wonderful, and a delicacy from the African-America population of the eastern shore. Aunt Sissy's pie, which I had on Thanksgiving.
As well as steamed crabs, which we are also known for.
20score
(4,769 posts)penalties? They damn well should be.
Baitball Blogger
(46,706 posts)Equal Protection under the law.
arthritisR_US
(7,288 posts)loudsue
(14,087 posts)I wish it was just the older people who have antiquated ideas that are racists. They would be dying off before too long. Unfortunately, the south (North & South Carolina, I know for certain) are raising a whole new crop (generation) of racists. It just has to stop. Globally....it has to stop.
arthritisR_US
(7,288 posts)your President, for his first term, that racism would decrease. I believed that people had come to terms with their struggles with race and their better angels had ruled. I was wrong on so many levels it makes the head spin!
Racism didn't magically disappear or suddenly increase. I think my thinking was flawed. I think there was greater PC pressure on some in the collective society and they masked their underlying racist bents and beliefs. Once he was sworn into office the gloves came off.
I remember his state of the union address where Joe Wilson yelled out "You lie", was he condemned by his party for such disrespect? No, he wasn't even sanctioned for it. Chief Justice Roberts sitting there shaking his head and mouthing dissent, when the justices of the past would sit stoically and respectfully neutral. It's like they gave the green light in letting racism out of the bag, they opened Pandoras Box to it, if you will.
The voter suppression in federal elections had been rearing its ugly head but this cycle it was taken to unprecedented heights. My inbox, in the past four years has seen record amounts of racist emails and so called "humour". It is all so sickening and depressing.
loudsue
(14,087 posts)It blew my mind that overt racism suddenly was in vogue as soon as the republicans took the reins of power....the reagan years started it ("welfare queens", for instance) , but it sort of went underground for a while until the bush regime. Then when Obama was elected, it's like every latent bully in the world came into vogue...and racism is just another face of bullies, latent or actual, and bullying has become a HUGE problem. Fox / Murdock is the gasoline on that fire.
arthritisR_US
(7,288 posts)Fox/Murdock have had in this. Such an ugly network, totally bereft of empathy. The national bullhorn for bullies...absolutely sickening and a cancer on your society.
MrScorpio
(73,631 posts)darkangel218
(13,985 posts)That's truly disgusting. I lived in the deep south once as an adult, and the town had a segregated swimming pool. Not knowing, I went there once. After I seen the sign, I never took my kids back there again. Our church had pool parties and we had all nationalities of folks. All parents and children had some wonderful times there.
WashingtonConsensus
(29 posts)Butterbean
(1,014 posts)krispos42
(49,445 posts)Spanish sign to English
English sign to Spanish:
Hmmmm... racist much?
Igel
(35,309 posts)I think when you typed it in you left off the ' that made it possessive.
More below.
The Wizard
(12,545 posts)No coloreds
JEB
(4,748 posts)Lifelong Protester
(8,421 posts)I speak Spanish, I caught it right away. WTH?
socialist_n_TN
(11,481 posts)However, most people don't and expect the translation to be the same as the English. This is not only racist, it's insidious.
patrice
(47,992 posts)siligut
(12,272 posts)And everybody will move on.
Separation
(1,975 posts)[img][/]
Regardless it needs to be removed and an apology addressed.
awoke_in_2003
(34,582 posts)they keep the cucumbers and squash?
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)BlancheSplanchnik
(20,219 posts)Hilarious sign.
That's the only funny thing here.
Ikonoklast
(23,973 posts)Cucumbers and squash are found in the Fuck Meat Aisle.
That doesn't sound quite right...
ibegurpard
(16,685 posts)the translation from Spanish to English is correct (it could mean permit or permission) and it's not just someone who didn't translate it right...two very specific and completely different meanings.
eppur_se_muova
(36,262 posts)RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)at http://www.engrish.com
Like this one:
Or this one:
And this one:
It's not that unusual.
And don't slam me for being against Orientals. Sometimes these are just funny.
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)It's the 21st century. That term has been wrong for decades.
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)My brain is slow, and I couldn't think of the proper term... My bad, perhaps you can enlighten me.
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)or if you're talking about China, "Chinese".
etc.
it's not that complicated and your profile says you're in NYC. you can figure this one out.
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)Like I said, my bad. Please excuse me.
Oh, does my profile say NYC? I am actually about 90 miles north of NYC. Just so you should know.
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)not realizing you weren't there anymore.
Tab
(11,093 posts)I bet there's lots more of these examples floating around.
Curmudgeoness
(18,219 posts)that I do not speak or read Spanish, so I would not even realize this. And they were probably counting on that.
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)ladym55
(2,577 posts)Joe Shlabotnik
(5,604 posts)residents have let their kids play there without ever knowing what the sign reads. If that town now knows, and presumably cares, it shouldn't be hard to find out who is specifically responsible for erecting that sign.
caseymoz
(5,763 posts)Is it issued by the Public Segregationist Office? Does it say, "Subject has paid for and is hereby temporary white status in public places?" Wouldn't a permit like that alone be incriminating?
What embarrasses me is I didn't even try to read the Spanish. I might not have got the meaning, but I would have been able to see it didn't say the same thing as the English part of the sign.
On so many levels.
AlinPA
(15,071 posts)BlancheSplanchnik
(20,219 posts)tra laaa
RVN VET
(492 posts)I damned near spritzed my coffee!
Bitingly funny. Should be the goddam Delaware state song.
BlancheSplanchnik
(20,219 posts)What's TW3?
Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)Or perhaps a hundred or so Hispanic people can Occupy the park.
niyad
(113,303 posts)rightsideout
(978 posts)I've gone camping in that part of Delaware. The one campground we go to has tons of Confederate flags plastered everywhere and a Confederate flag flying high on their flag pole. Even the lifeguard at the pool was wearing a Confederate Flag bikini and had a Confederate Flag towell. She took a cigarette break and walked to her red Chevy S-10 which had a Confederate flag on it. Their gift shop was full of Confederate stuff. Their golf carts have Confederate flag logos. I was amazed.
So I'm not too surprised.
mike dub
(541 posts)And expanding on your comment: the larger "border state" to the west and south of Delaware, Maryland, offers drivers the choice of having the Confederate flag on their Maryland license plate (Sons of Confederate Veterans). So, the fact that you saw that flag in several places in southern Delaware doesn't seem totally shocking to me.
And nice post/catch by the OP. I only understand a little bit of Spanish, but when I actually read the Spanish sign, even I could tell that it had a completely different meaning than the English sign.
Firebrand Gary
(5,044 posts)DrewFlorida
(1,096 posts)by all citizens who speak Spanish. And by all English speaking citizens as well.
Response to kpete (Original post)
maindawg This message was self-deleted by its author.
Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)freshwest
(53,661 posts)RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)A lot of localities have sign shops at their DPW garage. They typically make the signs that you see on roadways for turns, route markers, curves, street names, and the like.
It wouldn't take many signs to break even on the cost of the supplies, and devices needed to create these signs.
I know that where I work in Dutchess County in NY, they have a sign maker. She has a plotter, and dedicated software to make just about any sign she wants. They cut out the letters to the size that they want, and buy pre-backed signs in the colors, sizes and shapes that they want, and can put whatever lettering available, in whatever font they can on them.
It's actually quite simple.
freshwest
(53,661 posts)RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)A low level civil servant, just doing what her or his manager ordered. Someone working for the town or the county.
freshwest
(53,661 posts)Iggo
(47,552 posts)joesdaughter
(243 posts)The white edges on the perimeter of both signs make it look like a photo-shopped pic. If it is genuine, it is disgusting.
Kennah
(14,265 posts)pinboy3niner
(53,339 posts)...
...
The sign is real folks, now stop wasting your energy on conspiracy. But if you are still a doubter, the address is LuLu Ross Elementary School, 310 Lovers Lane, Milford, DE. Have fun.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/05/1176645/-Outrage-in-Delaware
tavalon
(27,985 posts)I didn't until I read your post. Strange how I just filtered that out as unimportant. It's not unimportant, it's shameful.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)The English sign refers to the "playground" (i.e. where the swings and slides are) and the Spanish sign to the "field" (like a baseball or soccer field). Quite possibly they make English and Spanish signs for playgrounds (stating that parental supervision is required) as well as English and Spanish signs for fields (saying that a permit is needed). And someone screwed up and paired an English "playground" sign with a Spanish "field" sign.
Lots of speculation on this over on Kos: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/05/1176645/-Outrage-in-Delaware
A few people there also suspect a photoshop, but (as is usually the case) incompetence is the most likely explanation. Enough people are bilingual that it is impossible to believe that someone would think they could get away with such blatant racism.
heaven05
(18,124 posts)incompetence, never what it really is. One of the racist signposts of what that state and the people of that state think. Browns and more than likely, blacks NOT WANTED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Blatant racism permissible in Delaware. Not likely, huh.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)I'm not ruling anything out, but I still think incompetence is the most probable explanation.
it's an outside reason possibility.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)Old Union Guy
(738 posts)teach1st
(5,935 posts)There is a person in a green top running toward the sliding boards.
LynneSin
(95,337 posts)We like to call that area SLOWER DELAWARE
Igel
(35,309 posts)You should see some of the signs in Texas. I know what they mean because when I translate them (sort of) back into English they're grammatical. Not so in Spanish, but natives understand them well enough.
"Ustedes debe"? Really? And that didn't make anybodies thinks something are wrong?
For what it's worth, my dictionary says that "permiso de padre" is "parental permission." Hardly a "permit"--although "permit" is a possible translation of the word "permiso." I'd also drop the word "un".
The "subject to arrest" is boilerplate and strange.
I figure Hanlon's razor applies here, but that requires a certain amount of good will towards strangers.
lunatica
(53,410 posts)And other than the incorrect 'Ustedes debe' part the message definitely says they need a permit to play there. If you leave out the 'un' then the message would say 'you need permission' to play there. Either way it doesn't say the same thing as the English version.
You gotta be sh*tting me, Pis tell me your joking right, In 2013?
woo me with science
(32,139 posts)Kids now need parents to use a *playground*? WTF?
Then I read the Spanish version, and this is beyond the pale.
marble falls
(57,083 posts)heaven05
(18,124 posts)is one of the real faces of amerikkka.
HereSince1628
(36,063 posts)I hope that in Delaware the public "servant" that invented this this isn't protected from prosecution.
MineralMan
(146,308 posts)I predict the signs come down shortly.
I'm in that area every year. I'm going to pay more attention to the signs there but everywhere else too, where there is a "translation".
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)See below for a picture from Kos that has the English version of the Spanish "you must have a permit" sign.
So there are English and Spanish signs for both "playgrounds" (i.e. play areas with slides and swings, etc., stating that parental supervision is required) and "fields" (like baseball and soccer fields, saying that a permit is needed). Both the English and Spanish signs for "fields" warn of police action against violators. And someone screwed up and paired an English "playground" sign with a Spanish "field" sign.
You may now cancel your outrage and resume normal activities.
sammytko
(2,480 posts)Campo translates to field in Spanish.
heaven05
(18,124 posts)is always possible as an outside chance as to why an offensive sign such as in the original post. Yet with the horrendously racist rethuglican political machine seen in this last national election cycle coupled with the description of all the confederate flag waving in this state of Delaware, I cannot see any other realistic choice as to what is going on with original signs in yellow saying permission needed by browns and more likely blacks also to have their kids play here. I am sure incompetence could be ascribed to something like above sign, from another state, but not in the Delaware town of original post. Like you say, anything is possible, but Delaware? Nah! Americans may have voted to reelect a minority POTUS, but right wing Amerikkkans definitely showed their numbers and their preferences for their own kind and allen west friendly blacks(color that non-threatening blacks). This country is still racially divided and healing will take time, if it ever happens.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)of the "offensive" Spanish language sign?
I guess some people are not happy unless they are outraged.
heaven05
(18,124 posts)proud to be an american, whatever you believe, you are entitled. I believe what I believe and that is it. The town with it's confederate flags is racist. period.
jeff47
(26,549 posts)How come the signs are the same color on the playground? If they grabbed the wrong field sign, wouldn't it be white and black?
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)which could be why the incorrect sign was used.
The main point is that when there is a sign in English that says the exact same thing that the sign in Spanish says, this is probably not the second coming of Jim Crow.
jeff47
(26,549 posts)And wanted to "gently discourage" those people from the playgrounds. By using the sign from the fields, then people like you show up to say "it's just an innocent mistake!".
I have difficulty believing that they are as stupid as you claim.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)But feel free to continue your outrage despite the debunking.
jeff47
(26,549 posts)Even if you don't know Spanish, it's very easy to see the exact same words are on your Spanish "field" sign and your Spanish "playground" sign. You don't have to speak the language to tell the same words are on both signs. Yet your English "playground" sign is different from your English "field" sign.
Innocently making the mistake you claim requires being really, really dumb.
Javaman
(62,530 posts)You might be happy.
heaven forbid.
rocktivity
(44,576 posts)Last edited Sun Aug 10, 2014, 10:00 AM - Edit history (1)
But note that it's near a playing field rather than a playground.
I think that either out of laziness or frugality, someone thought the same Spanish would work at both locations.
rocktivity
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)Bolo Boffin
(23,796 posts)It sounds more like a mix-up in ordering the signs in the first place, i.e., it was done with an online form that remembered the previous order.
TUgradstudent
(1 post)Kpete you are right in your indignation and the sign is offensive. However, this is a public playground and the sign probably reflects the laziness of the public employees responsible for mounting the sign. In many people, emotions control their lives and a dramatic response such as yours only tends to fan the flames of hatred without fixing the problem. You should have pointed this out to the parks employees for correction and THEN crowed about your victory...although it is more humble to sit back and reflect on the fact you made a difference. .
The really disturbing aspect for me is that the park is devoid of any happy, laughing, running children of any race, color, sex, religion, or ethnicity. Where are the kids?
Angry Dragon
(36,693 posts)Response to kpete (Original post)
Post removed
arcane1
(38,613 posts)pinboy3niner
(53,339 posts)arcane1
(38,613 posts)How was MIRT able to see through that disguise?
jmowreader
(50,557 posts)The sign was placed so it's about 10 feet from the pathway. The equipment is what, about 20 feet from it?
Now compare the heights of the sign to the yellow plastic slides. Those slides are probably 15 feet from the ground to the top of the arch atop the ladders...but they're less than half the height of the English-language sign. The most common billboard on America's freeway system has a posterboard 14 feet high - meaning that if this picture was even close to being real that little sign would have to be 30 feet high.
Also consider: anyone who puts a "this is not a photoshop" warning on one of those mass email forwards usually photoshopped it himself. And he did a crappy job at it - the perspectives of the sign and playground don't match, and there's a white artifact around the sign.
pinboy3niner
(53,339 posts)The OP link has been updated again with this local news report from Delaware:
3:46 PM, Jan 6, 2013
Adam Taylor
The News Journal
...
Today, Milford School District Superintendent Dr. Phyllis Kohel learned of the signs. She told her husband to grab his tools so they could immediately remove them. They were in the process of doing so this afternoon.
I didnt want to wait, Kohel said.
...
She said she doesnt know why that message was only put in Spanish at the elementary schools. Kohel said the signs have been up for about a year. Kohel started as superintendent this school year, after the signs were installed.
I certainly assume there was not an intent to discriminate, Kohel said. We have a great working relationship with all of the communities at the school, and there is absolutely an understanding that no ethnic group will be discriminated upon.
http://www.delawareonline.com/article/20130106/NEWS/301060075?gcheck=1&nclick_check=1