on this day...my thoughts on dubya

[srican69]

i had a couple friends over and we had a political discussion over some fine single malt...and the discussion became quite spirited as the evening wore on...

bottom line...i felt that,as terrible Bush has been for this country...he probably had some realization of the damage he had done by letting the people he had trusted run wild somewhere in the middle of his second term....he sidelined his neocon buddies incl Cheney..and has been respectful of President Obama by keeping his mouth shut and largely staying to himself (its another thing that nobody from gop will have him over at public events)...but in comparison Cheney did not stop running his mouth until he felt safe from prosecution...

Bush is no visionary...but i don't think he is evil either...

My friends were less forgiving to put it mildly.....they felt that he clearly bought into the Neocon agenda...and is no less evil than any of the actors involved...what do you guys think?

[peacebird]

1. Pure evil.

[NRaleighLiberal]

2. worst. president. ever. Just for how he devalued intellect. So much harm

in so many places and in so many ways.

Unforgivable.

[Skittles]

3. he is a fucking moron

the only reason he isn't out and about is no one fucking wants him

[femmocrat]

4. I was thinking of him today.

When I saw the grace and elegance of the Obamas, I couldn't help but remember what a crude, classless clod he was (is).

[TheOther95Percent]

5. The presidenting thing was hard work for Dubya.

I also think he had sociopathic qualities; certainly a lack of empathy on many occasions. I think he was not up to the task and made some terrible decisions. We will be paying for his mistakes for a long time.

[Siwsan]

6. he is a self serving cowardly chicken hawk

His whole agenda was to one up his daddy and make himself and his friends richer. And he didn't care how many people died in the process.

[WinkyDink]

7. I think you have very smart friends.

[Solly Mack]

44. ^This^

[rgbecker]

8. W. Bush never should have been given a position of any responsibility much less presidency.

A rich drunk kid set up to fail. Run like a puppet by some extremely evil men.

[uppityperson]

9. He was a narcissistic fool. papabush & cabal ran the show for 5 terms.

reagan reagan papabush babybush babybush
papabush went from running the CIA to running the country for too damn long.

[Politicalboi]

28. Yup!

I believe all of that. Daddy ran the show.

[Vox Moi]

10. Evil has a habit of looking banal.

Bush was a pander to plutocrats, a shallow and uninterested president, a man without a compass - moral or otherwise.
He is a war criminal who is responsible for the death, injury and displacement of millions of people and the complete sell-out of the American Armed Forces and their cherished honor to the quest for some sort of Corporate Empire.
The man should be in jail.
Other than that, he loved his daughters and father and liked baseball.

[Taverner]

29. Spot on - Eichmann in Jerusalem comes to mind

[sad-cafe]

11. I think he is staying to himself because he knows everyone realize what an idiot he was

he is selfish and childish

[pkdu]

12. I will never forgive him for the innumerable lives he cost , US forces , Iraq , Katrina...on and on.

And if I can question your definition of "fine single malt" ?

[srican69]

17. Mccallan 12

It hit the spot was a real smooth ride

[pkdu]

18. Ahh...good place to start ...nice solid , caramel flavour, ...have you tried Islay alts yet? Nt

[A HERETIC I AM]

20. Nothing under 36 is "fine". n/t

[srican69]

24. clearly my standards are lower given that i am relatively

new to the world of single malts...

and i couldnt afford a bottle of an 18 much less 36

[A HERETIC I AM]

33. LoL

I'm just busting your chops, man.

Drink whatever floats your goats boat.

[srican69]

35. i thought you were being a whiskey snob.

[A HERETIC I AM]

38. Naaah

I got all of the Scotch drinking out of my system 15 years ago when I drank too much of the stuff on a rented speedboat and got it back to the dock god knows how!

Bourbon for me now, and only on occasion ( tonight is one) and ALWAYS in moderation unless I am at home and don't have to worry about getting arrested! (I hold a CDL and I am considered under the influence at .04, whether I am walking, driving my car or my car hauler)

People who pick apart ones choice of drink are douchebags, plain and simple.

I like Bud Light and Jim Beam. Occasionally a Stella Artois.

Fuck anyone that has a problem with that.

[Ohio Joe]

13. I don't much think he is evil, I think he really believes what he did was right...

The fucker is still a criminal though and should be in a jail cell.

[condoleeza]

14. I don't think he's bright enough to even understand the Neocon agenda

I don't think he was even President, wasn't that Cheney?

[WinkyDink]

25. Don't kid yourself.

[TTUBatfan2008]

15. 19% approval rating when he left office...

And even the diehard conservatives don't support him anymore. His administration looks worse and worse as time goes by.

[Mariana]

16. I think his religion played a part.

I think he truly believed he was chosen by God to lead the country, and that the policies he put in place and the laws he proposed were God's will. I think that explains why he refused to even consider that any of them had been mistakes, no matter how disastrous the results were.

[WinkyDink]

26. If by "God" you mean "Satan." Bush was as religious as a wart-hog.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

19. Horrible President and probably low on the IQ....

But I don't think he's evil. He surrounded himself with evil. That was wrong and he deserves to be brought up on charges for it. But Cheney and Rumsfeld ran ram shot over him.

[A HERETIC I AM]

22. It's "Rough shod".

Sorry. Been drinking fine single malt.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

23. I think it's geographical?

I could be wrong.

[A HERETIC I AM]

31. I've been in every one of the lower 48....

And I have never heard the expression "ran ram shot"

And I talk to people.

A lot.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

45. Well, I was raised by a socially inept woman stuck in a different time.

I blame her for my crazy verbiage.

[A HERETIC I AM]

46. Lol...fair enough. n/t

[niyad]

21. I suggest that you read molly ivins books "shrub" and "bushwhacked" to really learn about

that incompetent, hateful, war-mongering, murderous bastard. Evil is a kind word for him and all his cronies.

[WinkyDink]

27. EXACTLY. Bush loved/loves death and destruction while being a coward himself.

[Dawson Leery]

30. Bush inherited a nation with a strong economy, budget surplus

and great respect globally. He ruined everything with his neo-con advisors. He allowed big business to whatever the hell they wanted to and let fundies to over-run the military academies.

Nothing good will ever come from a drunk frat boy who never earned anything.

Horrible President, horrible person.

[northoftheborder]

32. Very unintelligent, pampered rich kid, egotistical, stupid (meaning unable to learn);

Above traits allowed him to let evil take over his presidency, (Cheney, Rumsfeld). A bumbling, foolish, dunce; my feelings for him have NOT mellowed. He allowed, or caused great damage to this country.

[graham4anything]

34. Reagan, Bush41 and Ford were just as bad as W. Beware of Jeb in 2016. They are all the same.

the question is- was 43 rude to not show up?
Nobody would have wanted to see him there, except using 41's illness excuses 41, but not 43.

I would think it would show the difference to the world (especially the naderites out there,
that the world is alot different now, from then.
Very rude and immature IMHO.

Voters should be just as rude in 2016 and not vote for Jeb when Hillary45 kicks his ass.

[loyalsister]

36. My spite is reserved for Chenney

I think Bush the extent of his involvement was to give speeches, show up at meetings and events, and sign what he was told to sign. He didn't seem to me to be very interested in being president.

Chenney on the other hand had an agenda.

[srican69]

39. that was my point too...Bush did not realize that he was being had

until much later..

[Mr.Bill]

37. He was a moron

whose brain was damaged by years of alcohol abuse. I think the evil came from people aroung him, mainly Cheney. I don't think Bush had the brain power to even see how he was being manipulated.

[RedCappedBandit]

40. No. The neoliberal elite know exactly what they're doing.

Their greed controls them and they don't give a shit about the rest of the world, period.

[Volaris]

41. I think the Bill Maher quote expresses correctly how I feel about the former President...

"Stupid has killed more people than evil."

[renate]

42. interesting question--did he have an evil intent, or was he just a very, very dim megalomaniac?

"Megalomaniac" sounds rather dramatic, but then again, he was the most powerful person in the world, placed in that position despite being completely without any merit. I'd be pretty confident in my abilities, too, if that happened to me, and I don't know whether I could be convinced of my unsuitability for the job if I were anointed by almost half the country and five members of the Supreme Court.

I think he was completely stupid, intellectually incurious, intolerant of negative news or criticism, high on power, and utterly lacking in introspection. Evil? Well, he started a war for personal reasons, so there's that. But he was encouraged to do it by people who were smart enough to know better and were therefore undeniably evil. I think he could have been persuaded out of a lot of his actions if somebody around him who had a sense of decency had ever actually tried to do so.

I'm not saying he's not evil, but I do think the case could be made for his simply being out of his depth, easily manipulated, way too confident of his talents, satisfied by being kowtowed to without having to work to earn it, and not being smart enough to know that he was nothing special. That was always the thing that stuck in my craw with him even when he was just sitting there not bombing other countries or whatever--I could put up with a GOPer who weighed the evidence and simply came to a different conclusion (e.g. Jon Huntsman), but the ones like Michelle Bachman and Sarah Palin who are just too dumb to know how dumb they are drive me crazy. And of course there's a whole different category for people like Cheney and Wolfowitz and Bolton (and, and, and from that administration) who are out and out evil.

[MrMickeysMom]

43. Dumb and as "non-evil" as some think...

He's a war criminal.

In fact, he's the criminal that keeps on giving.

He had to be a war president for daddy
He had to have a "mandate" and political capital, which he couldn't distinguish from country club house membership

He will be remembered permanently for allowing the WORST attack on American soil and using it to lie us into TWO wars that were off budget and drove the deficit to kingdom come.

In short, you don't have to be evil to do evil, and it's on him like a scarlet letter.