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brentspeak

(18,290 posts)
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 01:51 PM Jan 2012

Steve Jobs colluded with other tech co's to keep US employee compensation low



http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/01/27/us-apple-lawsuit-idUSTRE80Q27420120127

Steve Jobs told Google to stop poaching workers

By Dan Levine
Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:40pm EST

(Reuters) - Apple's Steve Jobs directly asked former Google Chief Executive Eric Schmidt to stop trying to recruit an Apple engineer, a transgression that threatened one junior Google employee's job, according to a court filing.

The 2007 email from Jobs to Schmidt was disclosed on Friday in the course of civil litigation against Apple Inc, Google Inc and five other technology companies. The proposed class action, brought by five software engineers, accuses the companies of conspiring to keep employee compensation low by eliminating competition for skilled labor.

snip

According to an unredacted court filing made public in the civil litigation on Friday, the now-deceased Jobs emailed Schmidt in March 2007 about an attempt by a Google employee to recruit an Apple engineer. Schmidt was also an Apple board member at the time.

"I would be very pleased if your recruiting department would stop doing this," Jobs wrote.

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Steve Jobs colluded with other tech co's to keep US employee compensation low (Original Post) brentspeak Jan 2012 OP
Just one more reason why I hate Apple and its products n/t Tansy_Gold Jan 2012 #1
Jobs was certainly a well rounded scumbag tridim Jan 2012 #2
You're destroying an icon. undeterred Jan 2012 #3
My daughter was a pro-Apple products user (she's 20) BlueCaliDem Jan 2012 #4
Jobs should have tried to convince other ceos to work for $1 a year. nt julian09 Jan 2012 #5
Not Excusing Apple, but most computers are made there we can do it Jan 2012 #8
it is once again the 'everyone does it... ProdigalJunkMail Jan 2012 #15
No, it is more like "stop pretending Apple is the only one" emulatorloo Jan 2012 #23
Thank you. we can do it Jan 2012 #37
It is not about meeting good consumer price points.... WCGreen Jan 2012 #48
Yes, I agree emulatorloo Jan 2012 #66
+1 Shankapotomus Jan 2012 #54
FFS yourself give it a rest they ALL suck we can do it Jan 2012 #35
It reads more like Dorian Gray Jan 2012 #59
And Apple charges us 3 times the amount for the priviledge laundry_queen Jan 2012 #19
You've got to stop paying retail price emulatorloo Jan 2012 #29
they work better shanti Jan 2012 #44
ymmv is right laundry_queen Jan 2012 #50
"what they are able to do on it is limited" emulatorloo Jan 2012 #68
Oh, and... laundry_queen Jan 2012 #51
Please show me where you get that Toshiba products are made in china. juajen Jan 2012 #52
Well, I Google "Toshiba made in China" we can do it Jan 2012 #69
Let's step out of the noise of this thread for a while and talk about your daughter's needs emulatorloo Jan 2012 #28
This message was self-deleted by its author brentspeak Jan 2012 #32
I can't recommend Toshiba laptops enough. 2ndAmForComputers Jan 2012 #38
It gets 5 stars everywhere I look BlueCaliDem Jan 2012 #53
i hope she doesn't consider it shanti Jan 2012 #45
Are all tech billionaires huge douchebags? Initech Jan 2012 #6
Here, let me help... Neue Regel Jan 2012 #7
Can't argue with that. Initech Jan 2012 #10
Gates isn't a douchebag. At least not any more. tridim Jan 2012 #20
He gave us charter schols and turned the GOP against public education. Initech Jan 2012 #24
And he just called for the IRS to raise his tax rate tridim Jan 2012 #27
And billions to charityh Logical Jan 2012 #34
I don't think his intentions were bad. For many people, the public schools ecstatic Jan 2012 #64
Oh PLEASE we can do it Jan 2012 #39
It sure seems like it, douchebags and dropouts. newblewtoo Jan 2012 #22
And then there's Michael Dell who's synonymous with outsourcing. Initech Jan 2012 #25
Not to mention his overall Reaganite politics. HughBeaumont Jan 2012 #56
Yes. Starry Messenger Jan 2012 #58
still people will line up around the block, waiting all nite for the store to open so leftyohiolib Jan 2012 #9
Watch out, the Apple fanboys will come after you. Odin2005 Jan 2012 #11
I like to think I'm a recovering Apple fanboy. Initech Jan 2012 #14
AppleBots are going to show up at your home in the middle of the night. bluestate10 Jan 2012 #40
Noooooooooooooooooooo!!!!! Initech Jan 2012 #43
Okay, so I don't get it, and I know I'm probably a bit dense on this hyphenate Jan 2012 #12
Well, I have a little different perspective emulatorloo Jan 2012 #31
The MAC OS is limited, at best. bluestate10 Jan 2012 #41
lol. What is this, some kind of dick size contest? emulatorloo Jan 2012 #46
They have a cult following. People pay more for a cult. Logical Jan 2012 #36
You guys sound like Freepers... LuvLoogie Jan 2012 #13
And someone lost their job over a rich boy email exchange. Ruby the Liberal Jan 2012 #16
This isn't about wages... LuvLoogie Jan 2012 #21
All workers should be free agents. bluestate10 Jan 2012 #42
It's hard to be a free agent LuvLoogie Jan 2012 #71
"Apple Derangement Syndrome" emulatorloo Jan 2012 #26
"Steve Jobs didn't write the trade laws" brentspeak Jan 2012 #33
Bernie broke the law... LuvLoogie Jan 2012 #49
PFFFFFFT. Bernie defrauded fellow rich guys. HughBeaumont Jan 2012 #57
It's still fraud... LuvLoogie Jan 2012 #70
If you want to advocate something effective, pick on the living bhikkhu Jan 2012 #17
This is an example of a broader problem associated with semi-monopolies. Democrats_win Jan 2012 #18
Rec? Well, at least you're not promoting a hatchet job on Obama! emulatorloo Jan 2012 #30
But he was a visionary!!11! progressoid Jan 2012 #47
I worked in a factory in the U.S. for 8 years Shankapotomus Jan 2012 #55
AWESOME variation on the "everybody's doin' it!" excuse! Now, NOBODY wants to work! Romulox Jan 2012 #62
I should have added a sarcasm emoticon Shankapotomus Jan 2012 #67
scum fucking Jobs. Whisp Jan 2012 #60
To iMasters GeorgeGist Jan 2012 #61
All you Apple haters are ridiculous, pretending as if Dems have an historical responsibility Romulox Jan 2012 #63
This message was self-deleted by its author emulatorloo Jan 2012 #65

undeterred

(34,658 posts)
3. You're destroying an icon.
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 02:15 PM
Jan 2012

For many people Apple/Jobs is sacred.

I never bothered to master their computers and technologies or the sense of smug superiority that their devotees have.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
4. My daughter was a pro-Apple products user (she's 20)
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 03:22 PM
Jan 2012

but after I told her about the horrific Foxconn working environment in China, and it was confirmed by her boyfriend who is studying to become a computer engineer (he is working on making an OS that's compatible with both Linux and MAC - and making great strides!) she's rethinking her loyalty.

She wanted to buy a new Mac laptop next month, but I advised against it. I told her go for a cheaper one like Toshiba or Dell, and although those also manufacture their products in China and other countries, they're half the price of a MacBook.

She's now seriously considering it.

we can do it

(12,235 posts)
8. Not Excusing Apple, but most computers are made there
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 03:52 PM
Jan 2012

why? they are made in the low wage shitty plants? toshiba is also made in china

Foxconn manufactures products for companies including:

(country of headquarters in parentheses)

Acer Inc. (Taiwan) [27]
Amazon.com (United States)[28]
Apple Inc. (United States)[29]
ASRock (Taiwan)[citation needed]
Asus (Taiwan)[citation needed]
Barnes & Noble (United States)[citation needed]
Cisco (United States)[30]
Dell (United States) [31]
EVGA Corporation (United States)
Hewlett-Packard (United States)[32]
Intel (United States)[33]
IBM (United States)[citation needed]
Lenovo (China)[citation needed]
Microsoft (United States)[34]
MSI (Taiwan)[citation needed]
Motorola (United States)[31]
Netgear (United States)[citation needed]
Nintendo (Japan) [35]
Nokia (Finland)[29]
Panasonic (Japan)[citation needed]
Samsung (South Korea)[36]
Sharp (Japan)[citation needed]
Sony (Japan) [37]
Sony Ericsson (Japan/Sweden)[38]
Vizio (United States)[39]

edit for link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foxconn

ProdigalJunkMail

(12,017 posts)
15. it is once again the 'everyone does it...
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 05:10 PM
Jan 2012

so that excuses it' post...

the 'but' in your post is the part that makes it an excuse... again.

FFS

sP

emulatorloo

(44,296 posts)
23. No, it is more like "stop pretending Apple is the only one"
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 07:07 PM
Jan 2012

Last edited Sun Jan 29, 2012, 09:58 PM - Edit history (1)

Until you folks figure out that This problem is bigger than Apple, there isn't going to be any point in discussing it.

You have to let go of your fixation on Apple. Your obsession is blinding you to the larger issue.

The platform wars were over years ago. Windows won. Let it go.

You've seen the list of FOXCONN's other major clients. Sony, Dell, Microsoft, Amazon, Samsung, and so.

This is about an ENTIRE INDUSTRY that has moved its manufacturing to FOXCONN in order to meet consumer friendly price-points.

It is all about sales and who can get market dominance. You get a good consumer price point, if you have a good product the money will roll in.

Everybody at DU knows what I am talking about and how we got to this place.

I doubt there is a single person posting on this thread that does not own something manufactured by FOXCONN. It is almost impossible not to.

WCGreen

(45,558 posts)
48. It is not about meeting good consumer price points....
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 01:37 AM
Jan 2012

It is all about continuing to rise profits so their stock remians high and their retirements and protfolios keep rising.

They could easily manufature them here in the US for a bit more cash but also a bit lower profit margin.

Make no mistake about it, all the decision makers well being is tied to stock performance and that is based on continued high profit margins...

It's not okay to see what 5% to 8% profits, they want 25% to 30% profits.

Dorian Gray

(13,549 posts)
59. It reads more like
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 09:17 AM
Jan 2012

"everyone does it, so we should boycott all of them."

I think anybody who used any products made in that factory but criticizes only Apple is being disingenuous. It's more about their dislike of Apple than anything else.

There is a real problem in those Chinese factories. I'm happy that it's getting more press in the USA, and I hope that will affect change. All those companies should be ashamed.

laundry_queen

(8,646 posts)
50. ymmv is right
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 02:27 AM
Jan 2012

My daughter bought a mac book pro. So did my friend. They've already had issues and what they are able to do on it is limited. My friend is in school with me and has had serious issues with compatibility with our course software (even with the conversion software installed). I have 2 acer laptops that I paid $300-$400 each and have had no issues.

emulatorloo

(44,296 posts)
68. "what they are able to do on it is limited"
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 01:21 PM
Jan 2012

What is the problem they are having? Maybe somebody in the DU Macintosh group can help.

Or better yet

Have they called or written Apple Tech Support? Apple Tech Support is consistently one of the highest rated in the industry. Did they talk to anybody at their local Apple Store? Again they are quite good and helpful and can get any issues they are having sorted out.

What are their "serious compatibility with course software". Some of the poorer course software development programs do not test for browser compatibility. On our local campus, Google Chrome is the issue. So, is it a browser issue? Have them try Firefox. Have they spoken with their professor?

laundry_queen

(8,646 posts)
51. Oh, and...
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 02:33 AM
Jan 2012

I'm not anti-apple. I own an iPod, will get an iPhone as soon as my current contract is up. However, what they do imo is price gouging. There's also a lot about their programs (for example, iTunes) that drives me fucking crazy, things that they don't have, or aren't set up that are really common sense things. And when I bought my iPod, which was a 'new release' at the time, I wished it had a few things, but bought it anyway since it was the most recent model. Then 2 months later they came out another model that had everything I lamented about with the first one. And that's Apples MO - buy a new one, wish it had more gadgets/capabilities - and then soon after they come out with a NEWER one that has the very things you wanted. I'm happy to say I was too damn stubborn to go out and buy the new one but I know that's rare and Apple makes a great deal of their profit in that manner. I dislike being played like that.

juajen

(8,515 posts)
52. Please show me where you get that Toshiba products are made in china.
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 03:20 AM
Jan 2012

I have searched on wikipedia and find no reference to China anywhere, except a cooperative effort with a University in China to improve environmental research. Interesting reading here about this Japanese company.

emulatorloo

(44,296 posts)
28. Let's step out of the noise of this thread for a while and talk about your daughter's needs
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 07:57 PM
Jan 2012

Last edited Sun Jan 29, 2012, 08:27 PM - Edit history (1)

If your daughter is pro-Apple, it is probably because she is pro Mac OS X (Macs) or pro iOS (iPhone, iPod, iPad).

The value of an Apple product to an Apple user is the OS and user experience. How the device interacts with you and how you interact with the device to get shit done.

So a Toshiba or a Dell is not going to be the same experience for her.

I use both Windows and OS X, I am a platform agnostic. However I prefer Mac OS because I feel I am more productive on that OS.

Additionally I spend much more time troubleshooting my Windows machines than I do my Mac OS machines.

So ultimately, your daughter may be unhappy that she's taken your advice.

As to the Foxconn issue, I am not sure how it is "OK" for Dell to manufacture in China and not for Apple.

It is not "OK" for any of these companies to do so. All of these jobs need to come back to the US.

This is the real contradiction I see in a lot of these threads. I am not thrilled that Apple manufactures with FoxConn. But it is difficult these days to find ANY computer type device that is not made their. Even your XBOX, your Amazon Kindle, your Samsung Phone.

On the other hand, Apple does seem to be actually making a big effort to improve the working conditions in the factories where their products are being made:

Apple - Supplier Responsibility
www.apple.com/supplierresponsibility/

Many people in this thread will dismiss the things Apple is doing as "just PR." But if you read thru the pages you will see it is not.

As far as I know, none of the other companies that use Foxconn have done a damn thing about the conditions where their items are being manufactured.

If she is looking for good pricing on Macs, I recommend the following pricetracker site:

http://www.macprices.net

P.S. There are already several distributions of Linux that run on Macs. Hopefully her boyfriend is putting one together with a top notch user-interface. FYI: Windows can also be installed on modern Macs if you need access to a program that is Windows only.






Response to emulatorloo (Reply #28)

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
53. It gets 5 stars everywhere I look
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 05:13 AM
Jan 2012

and a Toshiba laptop is a third the price of an Apple Macbook.

I'll be getting a Toshiba for hubby, too. I love the 4 gig ram.

shanti

(21,675 posts)
45. i hope she doesn't consider it
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 11:58 PM
Jan 2012

apple products i've owned have NEVER had any viruses. i didn't own an apple computer until 2008, and that one was a used 2004 ibook - 4 years old. it lasted 2 years, and it had heavy usage before i bought it (educational use). the screen just went blank on me one day and it bit the dust, but it never had a virus. my other laptops, (toshiba, compaq, hp) all had the hard drive die after two years, and several crashes and virus issues.

i don't have a lot of money to waste, and it just seems more practical to buy apple

Initech

(100,193 posts)
6. Are all tech billionaires huge douchebags?
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 03:44 PM
Jan 2012

Mark Zuckerberg is a huge douchebag, Bill Gates is a huge douchebag, and now it seems Steve Jobs is part of that group.

You know what they say - no one ever got rich being completely honest.

 

Neue Regel

(221 posts)
7. Here, let me help...
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 03:47 PM
Jan 2012

This:

Are all tech billionaires huge douchebags?

Works better like this:

All billionaires are huge douchebags

Initech

(100,193 posts)
10. Can't argue with that.
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 04:26 PM
Jan 2012

But it does seem that tech billionaires are a special breed of douchebag more than regular billionaires are.

Initech

(100,193 posts)
24. He gave us charter schols and turned the GOP against public education.
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 07:17 PM
Jan 2012

One of the chief financial backers of last year's ultra-controversial propaganda documentary "Waiting For Superman". Still a douche? I say yes.

tridim

(45,358 posts)
27. And he just called for the IRS to raise his tax rate
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 07:51 PM
Jan 2012

He makes mistakes, but he has a good heart. He is giving away his fortune.

Not a douche.

ecstatic

(32,838 posts)
64. I don't think his intentions were bad. For many people, the public schools
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 10:38 AM
Jan 2012

really do suck. I'm 100% certain, you would never send your child to the high school down the street from me. I'm not pro-charter schools but I don't want to pretend a problem doesn't exist.

newblewtoo

(667 posts)
22. It sure seems like it, douchebags and dropouts.
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 06:49 PM
Jan 2012

To me Apple has always been the red car of computers. (It just looks like it's going faster.) Jobs played the buying public like a Stradivarius. Coming from a working family it was dissapointing how anit union he was. Douchbag might be an upgrade for him.

Initech

(100,193 posts)
25. And then there's Michael Dell who's synonymous with outsourcing.
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 07:19 PM
Jan 2012

Yup just a lovely group, they are.

 

leftyohiolib

(5,917 posts)
9. still people will line up around the block, waiting all nite for the store to open so
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 03:56 PM
Jan 2012

they can buy the next i-turd

Initech

(100,193 posts)
14. I like to think I'm a recovering Apple fanboy.
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 05:04 PM
Jan 2012

Once my contract is up in March I'm totally done with them. I had a Mac laptop and liked it but Mac OS is so freaking limited compared to Windows. I had an iphone 3 and really liked it but not iphone 4. I've fully converted to PC and my next phone is either going to be Windows Phone 7 or Android 4.0, I really like both I've looked at so far.

bluestate10

(10,942 posts)
40. AppleBots are going to show up at your home in the middle of the night.
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 11:34 PM
Jan 2012

And drag you kicking and screaming away. BLASPHEMY have you committed Sir! Proudly typed on my Windows 7 computer, as I play with my Droid smartphone.

Initech

(100,193 posts)
43. Noooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 11:48 PM
Jan 2012

Yeah I can see people in silver-colored Apple jackets hauling me and my credit card to the nearest Apple store.

hyphenate

(12,496 posts)
12. Okay, so I don't get it, and I know I'm probably a bit dense on this
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 04:30 PM
Jan 2012

And before I start, I want to apologize before I make any unkind remarks--it's just my opinion on the subject, that's all.

I don't give a rat's ass about Steve Jobs. I don't give a fuck about Apple. I think their equipment is overrated, expensive and utterly without redemption.

The popularity of their machines is elitest and arrogant, just like Jobs. And yet, when I was younger, as a geek, we often sneered at Apple buyers (and still do, at times) because they were the computers people bought when they didn't know diddly about REAL computers. Those of us who purchased PC clones and built our own machines knew more about the insides of a computer than almost anyone who worked on or bought them (Macs).

While at one time Apple might have "superior" graphics, PCs caught up with them. I would challenge almost any Mac owner to a graphix contest, and I believe I would win.

PCs flourished because there were cheaper alternatives to the expensive Macs, and thus, clones and the MS system were there to give the masses an "in" to the internet. If it weren't for PCs, there is a likelihood that this would have been a 99% circumstance, where only those with lots of dollars could afford a computer.

PCs aren't perfect, but if we look at the whole internet/PC equation, it's obvious that Apple can't cut it when it comes to a wide disbursement of available software, popularity, peripherals, availibility, and cost.

Steve Jobs was an arrogant SOB. And allegedly he created new equipment to "dazzle" the world, because the products from Apple, while often inovative, were matched easily by PC makers in a short period of time. If it comes down to whiz-bang novelty, Jobs was a winner. But he easily became a whiner instead, as he was matched, nearly 1-1, on everything that Apple created.

Perhaps some praise him for being a paradigm smashing force, but in this geek's brain, there is very little I can see which was not derivative in some way, in some other situation. Hip? Perhaps. Ahead of his time? Hardly. Before Apple, before Jobs, going back over a few centuries, we should think about Leonardi da Vinci, who predicted marvels that his peers could never imagine. Jules Verne, HG Wells, and almost any science fiction authors from the 1920's and on. Innovative? Perhaps to some extent. But again, there have been precedents to almost any of his products.

Here, with this article, his ability to cut throats is visiblse. That puts him on par with almost any other CEO of a company, regardless of the product they sell. But there are still innovators out there who defy conventional practices, like Ben and Jerry's Ice Cream, which has an outstanding record, Costco, which offers decent wages and employee benefits, and Zappos.

I know this is all my own opinion, and that's fine. We all have an opinion, and someone, maybe many of you are more keen on Apple, and that's okay. I've been part of the PC vs Mac ongoing discussion for about 20 years now, and many of those I argue with on the topic were huge Mac fans. I'm just not one of them.

emulatorloo

(44,296 posts)
31. Well, I have a little different perspective
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 08:24 PM
Jan 2012

Last edited Sun Jan 29, 2012, 09:03 PM - Edit history (1)

So let's see if we can have a rational discussion about this difference.

- some people would prefer not to know anything about the inside of their computers. Not everybody wants to work on cars, they would spend their time driving one.

- you did not build your computer, you used your skills with a screwdriver to assemble the parts. I've done the same thing with my PC's, there is really nothing that special about it. I've also assembled macs out of spare parts. It doesn't mean you and I possess special insight or are better than people who just want an off the shelf solution.

- Apple users do not buy the products because they are "stupid" or "arrogant" or "hip". They buy the products because of the OS. While they may not be able to articulate that, Mac OS X and iOS offers them something that they do not get with Windows or Android (or what ever the current flavor is). This is why they are repeat buyers.

Let me give you an example. I work on both Windows and Mac OS X. I think the latest Windows is a fine OS. On the otherhand, I am more productive on Mac OS because at least for me, there are fewer steps for me to get from point A to point B on Mac OS X.

Additionally I find that I spend more time troubleshooting my Mac than my Windows machine. It has been that way for me over multiple PC's and multiple macs.

Just a couple comments on your history of computing.

"the products from Apple, while often inovative, were matched easily by PC makers in a short period of time." Perhaps with tech specifications. But the tech specs only tell part of the story. I refer you back to the prior two paragraphs.

"Jobs was an elitist . . .If it weren't for PCs, there is a likelihood that this would have been a 99% circumstance, where only those with lots of dollars could afford a computer" Did you forget the Apple II? That's the machine that made computing available to average people and really democratized the notion that computers were for "real people" not just experts.

Additionally a little trivia> Jobs wanted the Macintosh to be priced low, but was over-ruled by then CEO John Sculley. Job's idea for the mac was that it should be as ubiquitous as the toaster. Soon after that, Sculley kicked Job's out of the company. There was also talk of opening the mac up to cloning, but Sculley and Jean Louis Gasse shot that idea out.

Best Regards, and have a great night.

bluestate10

(10,942 posts)
41. The MAC OS is limited, at best.
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 11:44 PM
Jan 2012

A moderately skilled PC user would carve up a top MAC user any day of the week. For me, MAC systems can't provide the creative versatility that I get from my PC and the wealth of application software that I can buy for any endeavour under the sun.

emulatorloo

(44,296 posts)
46. lol. What is this, some kind of dick size contest?
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 12:08 AM
Jan 2012

"A moderately skilled PC user would carve up a top MAC user any day of the week."

C'mon, what a ridiculous thing to say.

" the wealth of application software that I can buy"

Trust me, I have never had trouble finding apps to do what I need to do.

--

Look, the platform wars was over long ago. Windows won, you don't have to keep fighting. Let go.

Cool you like your PC. I like mine too.

What I don't get is why it makes you so crazy that I like my Mac.

Example: Do you think I give a rat's ass about what car you drive?

LuvLoogie

(7,100 posts)
13. You guys sound like Freepers...
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 04:46 PM
Jan 2012

talking about Obama. The OP accuses Jobs of wage collusion. One line in an e-mail doesn't prove it. If you are going to get a head hunter to go cherry picking another company's proven top engineers, expect to have objections raised. That isn't collusion to keep wages low. Steve jobs didn't write the trade laws. You all sound more bent than any Apple fan boy. You're just pissed because he bitch-slapped Michael Dell.

Ruby the Liberal

(26,219 posts)
16. And someone lost their job over a rich boy email exchange.
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 05:12 PM
Jan 2012

for *gasp* doing their job and trying to recruit talent to the company.

From the link:

[div class="excerpt" style="border: solid 1px #cccccc; border-radius:0.5385em; box-shadow: 3px 3px 3px #cccccc inset, 1px 1px 1px #cccccc;"]"I would be very pleased if your recruiting department would stop doing this," Jobs wrote.

Schmidt forwarded Job's email onto other, undisclosed recipients.

"Can you get this stopped and let me know why this is happening?" Schmidt wrote.

Google's staffing director responded that the employee who contacted the Apple engineer "will be terminated within the hour."

He added: "Please extend my apologies as appropriate to Steve Jobs."

How much you wanna bet Schmidt has the staffing director's compensation based on recruiting top trained talent.

LuvLoogie

(7,100 posts)
21. This isn't about wages...
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 06:35 PM
Jan 2012

It's about protocol.. This guy wasn't recruiting; he was trolling for big fish. There is a difference. He probably wasn't doing his job. He was trying to get lucky and fucked up.

bluestate10

(10,942 posts)
42. All workers should be free agents.
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 11:47 PM
Jan 2012

Free to work for whomever they chose. I hope that the fired employee sued the shit out of Google

LuvLoogie

(7,100 posts)
71. It's hard to be a free agent
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 11:23 PM
Jan 2012

Without a public, non-employer-based health care system. If everyone is a free agent, what is the point of collective bargaining? You would have to become your own contractor and file as 1099, perhaps incorporate to protect your home from liability. Some can afford to be a free agent. Others would just like steady employment.

There is probably some head-hunting protocol that this guy violated. If the engineer put feelers out on his own, no one would oppose him. But why wouldn't an engineer seek advancement within Apple?

Face it. This recruiter was trying to snag one.

emulatorloo

(44,296 posts)
26. "Apple Derangement Syndrome"
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 07:28 PM
Jan 2012

So Jobs asked Google to please stop recruiting his employees? Any sane business person would have done the same.

So Google backed off? Any ethical business person would do the same.

Some DU'ers have some bizarre pathological obsession with Apple.

I am going to be straight up with you, LuvLoogie. This is not the first time that BrentSpeak has posted and spun articles in a dishonest way. Usually his target is Obama or Democrats. So this is standard operating procedure for him.

brentspeak

(18,290 posts)
33. "Steve Jobs didn't write the trade laws"
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 11:08 PM
Jan 2012

Bernie Madoff didn't write the securities laws. What an outrage he's in jail...

LuvLoogie

(7,100 posts)
49. Bernie broke the law...
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 02:24 AM
Jan 2012

What law did Steve Jobs break. Did he misrepresent his dealings? That he builds products in China is your beef? Where was the computer made that you are posting from? Apple was one of the last (if not the last) computer makers to outsource production. Did you have stock in Gateway or Dell? Sounds like it.

HughBeaumont

(24,461 posts)
57. PFFFFFFT. Bernie defrauded fellow rich guys.
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 07:35 AM
Jan 2012

Wall St and the Mortgage industry fleeced trillions of wealth from the millions of Nickeled and Dimed.

That's why Bernie's in jail and the other billionaires . . . . remained billionaires. Bit easier to prove crimes when you're a specialist.

Rule #1 among the wealthy: Don't step on your fellow club member's toes.

That rule is the reason we don't have Universal Health Care in this country.

LuvLoogie

(7,100 posts)
70. It's still fraud...
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 11:12 PM
Jan 2012

Are you saying he shouldn't have gone to jail because he stole from rich people bitten by their own greed? Steal from the mob; you're dead. Steal from your mom; karma's gonna get you. Is someone accusing Jobs of fraud or stealing?

Steve Jobs was driven to build the world's best personal computers. One could argue that he did that. He adapted to the conditions set up by Wall Street and legislators. He turned Apple around, when the tech high and mighty said he should just fold. While others were content to assemble components and slap a brand name on a box, Jobs drove ahead.

Everyone on this board posts from a machine made not in the USA. Perhaps you don't respect Apple's efforts to modernize/humanize its supply channel. Perhaps you think that Apple should unilaterally assemble all it's products in the US with union labor. Don't you think that's like Mitch McConnell saying that if Warren Buffet wants to pay more taxes he is free to do so?

Until we demand more from our representatives and support them for their efforts, then we are just full of shit. Buy American when you can, or just buy what's cheaper as some on this board have suggested. Steve Jobs is dead.

bhikkhu

(10,730 posts)
17. If you want to advocate something effective, pick on the living
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 05:19 PM
Jan 2012

There's plenty of them around to shed light on where it might make a difference.

Democrats_win

(6,539 posts)
18. This is an example of a broader problem associated with semi-monopolies.
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 06:02 PM
Jan 2012

This month's Harper's magazine discusses the collusion problem in Silicon Valley and describes other situations around the country.

By not enforcing the Sherman anti-trust act, these large corporations have finally reached a point where they can collude to keep wages low. This is in contrast to the 90s when engineers would often switch jobs in Silicon Valley (SV) to get higher wages. The collusion, according to Harpers has meant that SV corporations aren't hiring engineers that worked for other firms. Even though these engineers could bring valuable expertise to their firms, they're standing firm on this collusion.

Harper's describes a massive factory (owned by a huge Brazillian company) in the eastern U.S. that sells under the Pilgrim's pride brand. That company has set up a "standard" for the chickens they purchase from area farmers. However, they refuse to be transparent about what the standard actually entails. In essence, they set the price they pay at different rates for different farmers. They tell the farmers not to tell any of the other farmers what they were paid. They are removing the vaunted "transparency" of the market.

Harpers website (Harpers.org ?) has a small blurb on this but if you can, check out the actual magazine.

emulatorloo

(44,296 posts)
30. Rec? Well, at least you're not promoting a hatchet job on Obama!
Sun Jan 29, 2012, 08:07 PM
Jan 2012

Last edited Sun Jan 29, 2012, 09:34 PM - Edit history (1)

I almost want to rec your thread for that reason alone.

Romulox

(25,960 posts)
63. All you Apple haters are ridiculous, pretending as if Dems have an historical responsibility
Mon Jan 30, 2012, 10:33 AM
Jan 2012

to look after human rights and the interests of labor.

Response to Romulox (Reply #63)

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