Sat Jun 29, 2013, 05:04 PM

So to sum up our new Realpolitik:

Under a Democratic president:

1. It's OK to spy on all Americans because Edward Snowden may have broken laws and/or not smiled at neighbors, and/or because FREEDOM.
2. It's OK to spy on other countries because we just kinda know they do it too and/or we heard something about this before and/or FREEDOM.

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73 replies	Author	Time	Post
So to sum up our new Realpolitik: (Original post)	MannyGoldstein	Jun 2013	OP
Well, with limits. First, a Democrat has to be in the White House. That's what makes it OK.	MotherPetrie	Jun 2013	#1
Yes indeed. Thanks for the clarification.	MannyGoldstein	Jun 2013	#2
Why would a Democrat say that?	treestar	Jun 2013	#17
Honest Democrats will say it, because it is a fact, watching the defense of policies that Democrats	sabrina 1	Jun 2013	#25
A Democrat supports Democrats	treestar	Jun 2013	#36
And blindly supporting their Dear Leader regardless is exactly what Republicans do.	MotherPetrie	Jun 2013	#38
No it is not blindly supporting Dear Leader	treestar	Jun 2013	#40
Your argument is utterly hypocritical, dishonest, and repugnant.	MotherPetrie	Jun 2013	#44
A Sith Lord by any other name is still a Sith Lord	Katashi_itto	Jun 2013	#62
Why WOULDN'T a Democrat call out Democrats for the same transgressions she calls Repugs out for?	MotherPetrie	Jun 2013	#35
Why it is a transgression to operate the Executive branch when elected to it?	treestar	Jun 2013	#39
Bullfuckingshit. Not even a good try.	MotherPetrie	Jun 2013	#46
Well you said it right here:	sabrina 1	Jun 2013	#47
Exactly. And this individual seems to have no problem with that. But I sure do. If that un-Dems me,	MotherPetrie	Jun 2013	#49
Realpolitik	kardonb	Jun 2013	#30
Yeah, that and 'I'll gladly trade YOUR privacy for my ( illusion of) security'. Because...FREEDOM!	idwiyo	Jun 2013	#3
Ha, pretty much sums it up. K&R	whatchamacallit	Jun 2013	#4
You emo racist paulbot	n2doc	Jun 2013	#5
Plus, he's scrumptiously handsome-riffic! n/t	cherokeeprogressive	Jun 2013	#10
Well, I will say in all honesty that he takes a good picture	n2doc	Jun 2013	#15
All that other stuff like having	treestar	Jun 2013	#18
It's how one uses them that matters n/t	n2doc	Jun 2013	#19
What powers? I thought he was powerless and that is why he can't push progressive policies	sabrina 1	Jun 2013	#27
He has the powers listed in the Constitution under Article II?	treestar	Jun 2013	#34
K&R	forestpath	Jun 2013	#6
We must invade your privacy to protect your FREEEEEEEEDOOOOOM!!! n/t	backscatter712	Jun 2013	#7
We have to kill it	nineteen50	Jun 2013	#21
I'm rooting for the Seahawks	mick063	Jun 2013	#8
Well, nice guys finish last.	East Coast Pirate	Jun 2013	#33
We must trust the NSA. We don't want to wait until we see a mushroom cloud do we?	L0oniX	Jun 2013	#9
I thought that he was/became a Centrist (C).	AnotherMcIntosh	Jun 2013	#11
Actually,	ProSense	Jun 2013	#12
The official position from the Truth	Savannahmann	Jun 2013	#13
Can you please remind us of Obama's victories in reducing	MannyGoldstein	Jun 2013	#14
Sure	ProSense	Jun 2013	#20
So, in one or two sentences, what exactly are you claiming	MannyGoldstein	Jun 2013	#37
Just great...huh?	mick063	Jun 2013	#55
re: Fox, reminds me of the Churchill quote:	MannyGoldstein	Jun 2013	#57
Du rec. Nt	xchrom	Jun 2013	#16
Freedom - That Indescribable Feeling Of Being Coddled In The Warm Glow Of Surveillance	cantbeserious	Jun 2013	#22
K&R Perfect description!	idwiyo	Jun 2013	#29
We must violate your rights in order to preserve them...	reformist2	Jun 2013	#23
Freedom - What's Good For Terrorists - Is Good For The Rest of You	cantbeserious	Jun 2013	#24
Those are some nice straw men you've constructed	Narkos	Jun 2013	#26
For Us Small Businesses here in America...we've already been feeling the restrictions	KoKo	Jun 2013	#28
For all that this OP, and so many other posts on this subject	cheapdate	Jun 2013	#31
That A Law Was Broken Is Not At Issue - At Issue Is The Underlying Surveillance	cantbeserious	Jun 2013	#32
Yes, the surveillance is the far more imporatnt issue	cheapdate	Jun 2013	#45
I think Snowden's crime is comparitively insignificant , don't you?	burnodo	Jun 2013	#42
Yes, Snowden's crime was relatively insigificant	cheapdate	Jun 2013	#48
some of us are trying to understand why so many need to make Snowden the entire story	burnodo	Jun 2013	#52
Snowden is an aspect of the story.	cheapdate	Jun 2013	#53
Yes it's OK until the law is overturned or repealed	treestar	Jun 2013	#41
Which Western European countries are spying on us?	MannyGoldstein	Jun 2013	#43
"Now, in a fresh leak, we're learning that Brits are snooping on us, too...	cheapdate	Jun 2013	#51
That's a cooperative effort with the NSA	MannyGoldstein	Jun 2013	#54
"They do it so we need to do it"	cheapdate	Jun 2013	#56
Obama's asking a country to spy on the American People is a bit different	MannyGoldstein	Jun 2013	#58
Yes, it is different.	cheapdate	Jun 2013	#59
Should a dominatrix be charged with assault and battery	MannyGoldstein	Jun 2013	#60
Not as far as I'm concerned.	cheapdate	Jun 2013	#63
That's like totally OK because they GCHQ is sharing the info with NSA. Them are twins separated	idwiyo	Jun 2013	#64
It's totally OK for British security agencies	cheapdate	Jun 2013	#68
"The World from Berlin: Electronic Surveillance Scandal Hits Germany"	cheapdate	Jun 2013	#65
That's evidence that Germany is spying on the US?	MannyGoldstein	Jun 2013	#66
No, it's not evidence that Germany is spying on the US,	cheapdate	Jun 2013	#69
I apologize, I did miss it	MannyGoldstein	Jun 2013	#70
Well, we are sitting here being spied on and not being able to spy back. All of us.	sabrina 1	Jun 2013	#50
Spying on other countries is "new" realpolitik?	Recursion	Jun 2013	#61
That it's OK to spy on other countries BECAUSE...	MannyGoldstein	Jun 2013	#67
Spying isn't about what's "OK". Why was Australia spying on us?	Recursion	Jun 2013	#71
Because the White House asked them to? (nm)	MannyGoldstein	Jun 2013	#72
It's OK to data mine	felix_numinous	Jun 2013	#73

Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 05:06 PM

MotherPetrie (3,145 posts)

So to sum up our new Realpolitik:

1. Well, with limits. First, a Democrat has to be in the White House. That's what makes it OK.

2. Yes indeed. Thanks for the clarification.

17. Why would a Democrat say that?

25. Honest Democrats will say it, because it is a fact, watching the defense of policies that Democrats

36. A Democrat supports Democrats

38. And blindly supporting their Dear Leader regardless is exactly what Republicans do.

40. No it is not blindly supporting Dear Leader

44. Your argument is utterly hypocritical, dishonest, and repugnant.

62. A Sith Lord by any other name is still a Sith Lord

35. Why WOULDN'T a Democrat call out Democrats for the same transgressions she calls Repugs out for?

39. Why it is a transgression to operate the Executive branch when elected to it?

46. Bullfuckingshit. Not even a good try.

47. Well you said it right here:

49. Exactly. And this individual seems to have no problem with that. But I sure do. If that un-Dems me,

30. Realpolitik

3. Yeah, that and 'I'll gladly trade YOUR privacy for my ( illusion of) security'. Because...FREEDOM!

4. Ha, pretty much sums it up. K&R

5. You emo racist paulbot

10. Plus, he's scrumptiously handsome-riffic! n/t

15. Well, I will say in all honesty that he takes a good picture

18. All that other stuff like having

19. It's how one uses them that matters n/t

27. What powers? I thought he was powerless and that is why he can't push progressive policies

34. He has the powers listed in the Constitution under Article II?

6. K&R

7. We must invade your privacy to protect your FREEEEEEEEDOOOOOM!!! n/t

21. We have to kill it

8. I'm rooting for the Seahawks

33. Well, nice guys finish last.

9. We must trust the NSA. We don't want to wait until we see a mushroom cloud do we?

11. I thought that he was/became a Centrist (C).

12. Actually,

13. The official position from the Truth

14. Can you please remind us of Obama's victories in reducing

20. Sure

37. So, in one or two sentences, what exactly are you claiming

55. Just great...huh?

57. re: Fox, reminds me of the Churchill quote:

16. Du rec. Nt

22. Freedom - That Indescribable Feeling Of Being Coddled In The Warm Glow Of Surveillance

29. K&R Perfect description!

23. We must violate your rights in order to preserve them...

24. Freedom - What's Good For Terrorists - Is Good For The Rest of You

26. Those are some nice straw men you've constructed

28. For Us Small Businesses here in America...we've already been feeling the restrictions

31. For all that this OP, and so many other posts on this subject

32. That A Law Was Broken Is Not At Issue - At Issue Is The Underlying Surveillance

45. Yes, the surveillance is the far more imporatnt issue

42. I think Snowden's crime is comparitively insignificant , don't you?

48. Yes, Snowden's crime was relatively insigificant

52. some of us are trying to understand why so many need to make Snowden the entire story

53. Snowden is an aspect of the story.

41. Yes it's OK until the law is overturned or repealed

43. Which Western European countries are spying on us?

51. "Now, in a fresh leak, we're learning that Brits are snooping on us, too...

54. That's a cooperative effort with the NSA

56. "They do it so we need to do it"

58. Obama's asking a country to spy on the American People is a bit different

59. Yes, it is different.

60. Should a dominatrix be charged with assault and battery

63. Not as far as I'm concerned.

64. That's like totally OK because they GCHQ is sharing the info with NSA. Them are twins separated

68. It's totally OK for British security agencies

65. "The World from Berlin: Electronic Surveillance Scandal Hits Germany"

66. That's evidence that Germany is spying on the US?

69. No, it's not evidence that Germany is spying on the US,

70. I apologize, I did miss it

50. Well, we are sitting here being spied on and not being able to spy back. All of us.

61. Spying on other countries is "new" realpolitik?

67. That it's OK to spy on other countries BECAUSE...

71. Spying isn't about what's "OK". Why was Australia spying on us?

72. Because the White House asked them to? (nm)

73. It's OK to data mine