ACLU to Pres. Obama . . .

[bigtree]

ACLU National ‏@ACLU 47m
.@ACLU to Pres. Obama: "We must ensure that the govt’s surveillance programs once again adhere to the 4th Amdt" http://www.aclu.org/national-security/aclu-comment-president-obamas-proposed-surveillance-reforms …


ACLU Comment on President Obama’s Proposed Surveillance Reforms

August 9, 2013

WASHINGTON – American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) Executive Director Anthony D. Romero responded to President Obama’s four recommendations to reform the government’s surveillance policies and programs made at a press conference today with the following statement:

"While the initial reforms outlined by the president are a necessary and welcome first step, they are not nearly sufficient. The bulk collection of Americans' phone records is only one of several troubling programs disclosed over the last two months. The president must work with members of Congress to reform all of these surveillance programs, including those authorized by Section 702 of the FISA Amendments Act, which collect, monitor and retain the contents of Americans' communications without a warrant. We also urge the president to release the relevant FISA Court opinions and agency memos that have created a body of secret law that is far removed from public oversight and adequate congressional review. We must ensure that the government's surveillance programs once again adhere to the protections afforded by the Fourth Amendment."

[JaneyVee]

1. He should kick the can down the road. This program didn't start with him and

Will never end, especially with this congress. Besides, the Obama bashers will never give him credit for reforming this program. Stay focused on the economy Mr. President.

[ProSense]

2. It'll be lucky if

While the initial reforms outlined by the president are a necessary and welcome first step

...he gets to that part (from the ACLU's statement), including working with Congress to pass any legislation.

Wyden Statement on President Obama’s Proposed Reforms to the FISC and PATRIOT ACT
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023436039

Blumenthal Applauds President Obama’s Support For Special Advocate In FISA Courts
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023435963

[freshwest]

8. Looks like he's on top of it. In between battling the GOP nihilists and RWNJs.

[JDPriestly]

14. Thank you.

Notably absent from President Obama’s speech was any mention of closing the backdoor searches loophole that potentially allows for the warrantless searches of Americans' phone calls and emails under section 702 of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. I believe that this provision requires significant reforms as well and I will continue to fight to close that loophole. I am also concerned that the executive branch has not fully acknowledged the extent to which violations of FISC orders and the spirit of the law have already had a significant impact on Americans' privacy.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023436039

This is not the time for half-measures and new laws full of loopholes and vague language.

[bigtree]

3. can's open, worms spilling out

Congress will certainly act, but they'll have to take into account how this administration has interpreted and used the Bush-era changes to the FISA. Many of the reports which prompted this effort to regain public trust in their intelligence operations (both domestic trust and from our allies) reveal data-gathering on a level which many in Congress feel goes beyond what they intended.

ACLU urges the President to "release the relevant FISA Court opinions and agency memos that have created a body of secret law that is far removed from public oversight and adequate congressional review."

It's reasonable to expect the Obama administration to fully account for their own interpretations they have used to justify their own intelligence operations. It's reasonable to expect this administration to be held accountable for any abuses, overreaches, or illegalities incurred in their own intelligence operations. It's a reasonable an expectation for this Democratic administration as it was for the last republican one.

[ProSense]

5. No one

"It's reasonable to expect the Obama administration to fully account for their own interpretations they have used to justify their own intelligence operations. It's reasonable to expect this administration to be held accountable for any abuses, overreaches, or illegalities incurred in their own intelligence operations. It's a reasonable an expectation for this Democratic administration as it was for the last republican one. "

...really cares about that stuff: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023435538

And whatever anyone does, never suggest that documents should be read.

[bigtree]

7. I expect that the ACLU got a heads up about these measures on Thursday

. . . when the President met with their representative and others.

I'd expect folks with real concerns will read thorough the report released this afternoon and respond to the assertions made in the 'white paper'; probably tomorrow.

Yet, even the administration acknowledges in this document that there will be issues and questions which are not completely spelled out and answered in those pages.


from the White Paper:

BULK COLLECTION OF TELEPHONY METADATAUNDER SECTION 215 OF THE USA PATRIOT ACT

This white paper explains the Government’s legal basis for an intelligence collection program under which the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) obtains court orders directing certain telecommunications service providers to produce telephony metadata in bulk. The bulk metadata is stored, queried and analyzed by the National Security Agency (NSA) for counterterrorism purposes. The Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (“the FISC” or “the Court”) authorizes this program under the “business records” provision of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA), 50 U.S.C. § 1861, enacted as section 215 of the USA PATRIOT Act (Section 215). The Court first authorized the program in 2006, and it has since been renewed thirty-four times under orders issued by fourteen different FISC judges. This paper explains why the telephony metadata collection program, subject to the restrictions imposed by the Court, is consistent with the Constitution and the standards set forth by Congress in Section 215. Because aspects of this program remain classified, there are limits to what can be said publicly about the facts underlying its legal authorization. This paper is an effort to provide as much information as possible to the public concerning the legal authority for this program, consistent with the need to protect national security, including intelligence sources and methods. While this paper summarizes the legal basis for the program, it is not intended to be an exhaustive analysis of the program or the legal arguments or authorities in support of it.


Administration White Paper Section 215 (August 9)

http://www.scribd.com/doc/159214490/Administration-White-Paper-Section-215

http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/government-releases-white-paper-on-collection-of-metadata

[ProSense]

10. Possibly, but it was released for everyone to see.

"Yet, even the administration acknowledges in this document that there will be issues and questions which are not completely spelled out and answered in those pages. "

I mean, the President outlined proposed reforms in addition to these releases. Much of the reaction has been dismissive.

The ACLU acknowleges that this is a start, and they will keep pushing for more.

[Th1onein]

4. I disagree.

In case you're wondering why? I DON'T LIKE BEING SPIED ON. And if he "kicks the can," then I'm going to continue being spied on.

Not everything is about politics and "winning." Good grief, we're Americans, man; we're better than this.

[JDPriestly]

17. I agree.

I DON'T LIKE BEING SPIED ON. And if he "kicks the can," then I'm going to continue being spied on.

Not everything is about politics and "winning." Good grief, we're Americans, man; we're better than this.

I get a video of my grandson singing his favorite song: Happy Birthday to one fictional character after the other. Nothing remarkable about the video, but it's PRIVATE. I don't want that to be spied on.

I DON'T WANT THE GOVERNMENT KEEPING A RECORD OF EVERY TIME I CALL MY FAMILY.

Maybe I'm just funny that way, but I want my relationships with my family to be STRICTLY PRIVATE.

I am not a terrorist. Couldn't be further from it. But I want to have my privacy.

In fact, I believe that privacy and the respect for others that is inherent in respecting the privacy of others furthers security and peaceful living. Surveillance is incompatible with peaceful living. I don't snoop on my family members' business, much less my neighbors. I respect the privacy of others as long as they are not obviously doing something harmful.

[sabrina 1]

21. I don't like being spied on either. And since when did we elect a President merely to 'kick the

can down the road?? Unbelievable some of the stuff we see on this forum these days.

[rhett o rick]

6. I think I hear you saying that these violations of our Constitution were started before

Obama and therefore he should ignore them because even if he reformed the NSA he wouldnt get credit.

I hope that's not what you mean. Those that you deride as "Obama bashers" are fighting for our Constitution. You either believe in the fourth amendment or not. You dont "kick the can down the road" for a possible Republican President to abuse these tools.

Fighting for our civil liberties isnt "Obama bashing".

[snappyturtle]

11. +! nt

[leftstreet]

16. +1

[GoneFishin]

20. +1. That's pretty messed up.

[rhett o rick]

27. It smacks of desperation. nm

[cantbeserious]

26. + 1

eom

[Spitfire of ATJ]

9. I can see them now,...scrambling in fear of the ACLU.....

.....uh huh....

[bigtree]

12. I don't think the ACLU expects the WH to 'scramble in fear'

. . . they do hope to be part of the efforts to ensure accountability and due process of law which we should all expect and pursue from our government.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

13. I wasn't talking about the White House....

I figured long ago all this was news to Obama as well. He just can't say it because it would reveal there really IS a shadow government. At this point it's all about how to message this.

Funny how the Right is willing to say Reagan was clueless about Ollie and Fawn but Obama is the mastermind in this.

[JDPriestly]

18. " I figured long ago all this was news to Obama as well."

I've been wondering about that. He probably has some vague idea that there is a program but did not know the details until the Snowden revelations. That is what I have suspected all along. I think he really thought it could be contained and limited to the metadata collection. And I don't think he ever thought about what a goldmine a huge collection of metadata and some super-high-speed computers could be for the NSA.

His daughters are or soon will be in their teens. He had better think about protecting their privacy from internet snoopers in the NSA as they move into their 17th or so years. That tends to be a bit of a rebellious period, and no child should be snooped on during their teenaged years. Nobody deserves to be a teenager in the first place. But a teenager under NSA surveillance. Oh, no.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

19. I chuckle thinking about if Romney had won,....

....imagine him trying to deny he was behind it when the server farm is in Utah.

[mick063]

15. Funny how priorities change.

I used to send money to Organizing for Action.

Last week I sent fifty bucks to the ACLU instead.

[bobduca]

28. Speaking of supporting the ACLU ...

I support the ACLU's advocacy with a monthly donation.

https://www.aclu.org/donating-american-civil-liberties-union-and-aclu-foundation-what-difference

[AppleBottom]

22. I see that the deniers have decided to deploy the infamous Chewbacca defense in response to the ACLU

[rhett o rick]

24. They are getting more and more desperate because their comfortable denial bubbles are being burst.

I feel for them. After 8 years of Bush I was desperate for a savior. For one reason or another Pres Obama has failed to be that savior. Some recognize that and want to work thru, but others refuse to believe and will attach all messengers that say otherwise. Some believe ignorance is bliss.

[bigtree]

23. .

[sabrina 1]

25. We must ensure that the government's surveillance programs once again adhere

We must ensure that the government's surveillance programs once again adhere to the protections afforded by the Fourth Amendment."

It's so simple, really, isn't it? All our elected officials are required to do is to honor their oaths which make only requirement of them.

'To defend and protect the Constitution of the US against all enemies, both foreign and domestic'.

Very few of them have done a very good of this over the past 12 years. If they had, we would not need Whistle Blowers, we would be more in need of Prosecutors.

[millennialmax]

29. They're probably mad that OFA is shaping up to me a more efficient organization. eom