Here is the only lesson I learned from the Occupy Movement

[1-Old-Man]

When it comes to crushing an insurgency this country is as good as any.

Just callin' them as I see 'em.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

1. With help from the media ...

... of course.

[indepat]

2. Big brother will not tolerate the temerity of organized opposition to the establishment,

including Wall Street, as evidenced by the mountain of official repression, assault, pepper-spraying, and arrests of peaceful protesters.

[SunSeeker]

14. Occupy was "organized"?

[indepat]

23. Well, would either loosely organized or spontaneous opposition work?

[Downtown Hound]

82. Do you spring up in hundreds of major cities and towns

all over America within weeks without being organized?

[SunSeeker]

83. Occupy prides itself on being a spontaneous, leaderless movement.

Individuals relied on social media to get the word out about various occupations. Past that, I am unaware of any organizational structure. What organizational structure are you aware of?

[HangOnKids]

84. Join Occupy and Find Out

You are hilarious BTW.

[SunSeeker]

89. You can't "join" Occupy. You participate.

I went to the L.A. City Hall encampment but there was not much to do other than peruse a pile of old books and listen to guitar playing and various rambling speakers. As it wore on it attracted a lot of homeless and runaways. There was a lot of drug use and fights among the campers. At that point, I stopped coming by.

Glad you find me so funny.

[HangOnKids]

90. Special!

Rambling speakers, drug use, homeless people, and fights. Care to cram a few more clichés in there? You are hilarious!

[Downtown Hound]

85. You're equating a leaderless "organizational structure"

with lack of organization. Just because Occupy didn't have leaders doesn't mean they weren't organized. They just did things by consensus instead of having somebody at the top tell them what to do.

You don't get as far as Occupy has without being organized. I think one of the things about it that terrified those in power so much was that it proved social movements can exist without hierarchies. If you were one of the 1%, I doubt you would like that idea very much at all.

[SunSeeker]

86. I wish you were right, but the 1% is not terrified.

I went to the big encampment they had at L.A. City Hall several times and the only people who seemed scared were the passersby.

If Occupy started getting candidates elected into office, then the 1% would start getting scared.

But Occupy did give us new vocabulary and a creative attitude. Unfortunately, it did not result in new Occupy candidates, let alone those sort of folks being elected into office.

[Downtown Hound]

87. So you were also hanging out with the 1% at the time

and got to see all their reactions and hear all their thoughts?

I doubt they would have reacted to Occupy the way they did if it didn't scare them.

[SunSeeker]

92. I don't hang out with the 1%, apparently you do.

Since you are so sure what they think. I go by their actions and what they're spending their Citizen's United protected money on. It is being used to battle Dems. Progressive, electable Dems are who the 1% is afraid of.

[Downtown Hound]

94. If you go by their actions

then what do you think of illegal arrests, harassment, undercover agents and provocateurs, slander in the media, and brutal crackdowns? Do you think they would do all that if they weren't afraid of them?

And what exactly do the 1% have to fear from the Democratic Party? It's not like the Democrats have really done anything to them. The only reason they hate elected Dems is because they make slightly less money than they do when Repukes are in charge. Other than that, they have nothing to fear from elected Democrats. They do have something to fear from mass populist movements.

[SunSeeker]

95. Those arrests were by local cops.

The 1% didn't have to lift a finger.

[Downtown Hound]

97. Yes, they do love to get the piggies to do their work for them

don't they?

[SunSeeker]

98. Cops brutally arrest protesters fighting for collective bargaining and pensions.

They don't seem to give a shit if what the protesters are fighting for is in the cops' best interest. Police work tends to attract right of center folks who like to bust heads.

[Downtown Hound]

99. Time for you to wake up:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2012/dec/29/fbi-coordinated-crackdown-occupy

Who do you think the police really work for?

[SunSeeker]

100. I'm awake and know several cops. They don't see themselves as working for the 1%.

They see themselves as being at war with "scroats"...lawbreakers who disturb the peace. The 1% are white collar criminals who commit crimes quietly in boardrooms instead of on the streets. Hence the cops don't care.

[Xyzse]

103. I'll have to defend your point in this one

I don't have anything against Occupy, and I thought their movement was good and necessary.

I understand the point of the leaderless structure.

However, a leaderless structure like that needs to at some point create a few things to affect some actual change, rather than just be considered a bunch of people whining about anything and everything without providing solutions.

Occupy could have been a great starting point to creating a more organized peaceful opposition group with codified demands and suggestions.

It could have been a great movement to build up leaders that can create a condensed message.

Without that, they were dispersed. A movement needs focus and workable goals, not a perpetual strike.

I am not saying that they didn't do any good, since they did. They brought to light some of the unfair practices in regards to corporations, banks and the education system. Then again, as per mentioned, it was diffused and lacking focus, which made them easily ignored.

They were not able to promote spokespersons that the media would actually be able to talk to. Many of the ones I have heard from on media was sadly lacking in clarity.

I am sad to say, that even the repeating mic, where a speaker would talk, and the others would repeat his/her words was embarrassing since it looked and felt childish. As a progressive, our message must be presented intelligently and with conviction, well enough that they could stand their ground against reporters and detractors without appearing belligerent or puerile, since fairly or not, more is expected of us in comparison from the Right.

If Occupy is still going, it has to evolve in to more focused groups that can promote their message clearly and concisely.

[demwing]

3. here's what I took away-

Lack of leaders may not mean a lack of leadership, but Americans respond better when they can put a face to a movement.

We need our 99% Gandhi or MLK.

[randome]

6. The world needs one. A new 'Jesus', even.

[hr][font color="blue"][center]You should never stop having childhood dreams.[/center][/font][hr]

[Uncle Joe]

28. Yet even Jesus was co-opted long after his death.

[Uncle Joe]

26. The only problem with that is if you put a singular face

on the movement, they; that primarily being the corporate media tear down the face.

Any flaw or sin by the face will be a condemnation against the movement.

Global warming climate change being one example, they don't tear down the overwhelming opinion of the scientific evidence supporting the theory, they claim it's a plot by Al Gore to enrich himself.

They tried to do the same thing regarding civil rights and the war with Vietnam against MLK via the FBI. The corporate media wasn't as condensed then as it is today.

On the bright side, I do believe the Internet provides a nice counter to corporate media propaganda and demonization, particularly as the peoples' voice via the Net grows in influence and power.

Having said that, The movement must be self-sustaining regardless of any face or leader.

[marions ghost]

36. ^^^ +++

Right. A movement must not depend on a single leader who can be demonized. Of course leaders are needed, plural.

[Uncle Joe]

42. I agree, leaders are needed. n/t

[1-Old-Man]

91. Joe, can I ask you a question?

Monkey's Eyebrow?

I don't know if you are the Joe I think you are or not. The Joe I'm thinking of told me his screen-name used here about 5 years ago before he (you?) moved west (well, over the river anyway). Is it you?

[Uncle Joe]

96. I think that must be someone else, Old Man

I haven't moved west or even over the river.

P.S. Do you live in Nashville?

[1-Old-Man]

102. Nope, I'm in WV and the Joe who is my friend lives in Kentucky now days

[truedelphi]

54. Uh, what can we do about that?

Every time we get ourselves our 99% Ghandi or MLK, they kill them off.

Look at what happened to MLK. Or to John Kennedy Jr.

Or to Paul Wellstone. And when he got taken down, so did two other members of his family, and staffers, and two pilots.

We also have had Binney, Mannings and Snowden.

[Marr]

105. I took away just the opposite.

The strength of the movement is all about the connections between the actual people who make up the movement; their perceived identity. In this case, the state, working with big business, was eventually able to stomp these particular gatherings out-- but the sentiment hasn't gone anywhere.

As for a Ghandi... I have no doubt some "leader" will jump in front of the parade and spin a baton once it's truly underway, but I think the sense of identity and purpose amongst the members of the movement is primary. Occupy was a success in that way. The "99%" as an identity has very much entered the popular consciousness.

[BelgianMadCow]

4. My take-home message was the change starts with me

and therefore, cannot be undone, unless I allow that to happen.

REVOLution = Occupy Love. It's pretty hard to do, because our society has become so individualistic and focused on greed and consumption. But it really works, and it's the most fundamental human trait: empathy. We are one.

[Rex]

5. No doubt!

http://www.brandchannel.com/home/post/2011/11/03/Mercedes-Occupy-Oakland-Flap-110311.aspx
They even get to run us over in their fancy cars!

[questionseverything]

7. i learned that lesson

from kent state

[Bake]

12. A lot of folks weren't around then for Kent State (I was, though).

So the lessons of Kent State need to be relearned in every generation.



Bake

[Capt. Obvious]

8. A few takes

1. Occupy allowed "class warfare" to be waged in 2012. It mainstreamed terms like the 99% and wage fairness. It allowed Democrats to effectively portray themselves as champions of the middle class as the media and regular folks were already comfortable talking about these issues. With Romney as the standard bearer, this was really the only clear path to victory in the existing tough climate.

2. Astro-turfing by some large conglomerates would have made sure Occupy had staying power.


Occupy was doomed to fail but I think their image accelerated the movement's demise. I visited Boston and Philly camps and all it was missing was a Phish concert.

[U4ikLefty]

13. The "dirty hippie" card....nice!!!

Yeah, branding Occupy with a corporate logo would have been grand.

[pinboy3niner]

24. +1! How are ya, ya dirty old hippie?

Nice to see you back, my friend!

[Uncle Joe]

38. That image looks more sinister on Time Magazine's Cover, doesn't it?

[U4ikLefty]

52. Hey niner!!! Long time no see.

Too bad about Fire. Good man.

Sorta lost hope for this place since I joined in 2003 after an Iraq War protest. How things have changed, eh?

Still some good folks aroud, but....

[pinboy3niner]

59. I've been in touch with our other friends from the Occupy L.A. actions

Mrs. coalition_uwilling made a GREAT sign for the antiwar protest in L.A. last Saturday:

[U4ikLefty]

61. Wow, very cool!!!

I'll look out for you at the next action. Unfortunately, I feel that will be sooner rather than later.

Okay, back to work.

[pinboy3niner]

74. We definitely have to march together again

If we coordinate, I know a few of our Occupy L.A. friends who will eagerly enlist.

In total, I met six DUers in person in Occupy L.A. protests--and I know all would love to have a reunion! In the streets!

[Scuba]

77. Awesome!!!!

[pinboy3niner]

79. Thanks, Scuba

She began with some tapestry-style signs which I jokingly tell her was her 'Green & Orange Period'. They were very good, but she's only gotten better since then.

This one really should be in an art exhibit--it's that good.

[randome]

75. What happened to fire?

[hr][font color="blue"][center]I'm always right. When I'm wrong I admit it.
So then I'm right about being wrong.[/center][/font][hr]

[Capt. Obvious]

80. More like disgusting hippy

[JaneQPublic]

9. What about the accomplishments of the Occupy Movement?

Can anyone list of few -- or any -- concrete accomplishments of Occupy?

[NuclearDem]

18. Strike Debt, Occupy Sandy relief efforts, and Occupy Our Homes.

[U4ikLefty]

29. Shhh, they really sisn't want an answer.

It was just to mock Occupy.

I call it DU's MOCKupy movement. They are very busy working on the anti-war movement in the Syria threads.

[AnotherMcIntosh]

39. The Occupy movement revealed that smooth, smiling politicians are not always on our side.

That the powers-that-be are willing to use co-ordinated excessive and unnecessary violence to suppress even peaceful dissent.

And that the federal authorities, rather than enforcing the Civil Rights laws, will further militarize the police to crush public criticism.



They also revealed that some people support authoritarianism and have little or no humanity in them.

[Democracyinkind]

81. Framing the debate. Introducing class analysis to the mainstream discourse.

If that isn't an accomplishmemt, how come nobody succeeded with it in the last 100 years or so?

[JaneQPublic]

88. Good point. (nt)

[iandhr]

10. What I learned was.

Twiddling your thumbs in a park instead of manning a phone bank for the Wisconsin recall of Scott Walker is an ineffective method of trying to make change.

Mac in the Newsroom was right about Occupy.

[U4ikLefty]

16. Blaming Occupy for Walker losing?

Why not blame Obama for not showing up to Wisconsin?

...and you don't know shit about Occupy.

[iandhr]

17. First off Walker won

Barnett the Democrat was the one who list.

2nd I am not blaming them for Walker winning. My point was they refused to put in work to defeat a Governor who was beholden to cooperate greed.


Occupy said they were not interested in electing candidates. If you want to get your agenda taken seriously thats what you have to do.

[U4ikLefty]

25. I meant "losing the Walker recall." BTW, it's not "loosing"

I notice you didn't mention Obama & his abscence...hmmmm

Occupy is about change, not rearranging the deck chairs of the Titanic.

We were taken seriously enough to get beaten, pepper-sprayed, jailed, and mocked (by the likes of you).

[iandhr]

31. Okay but what was the follow up.

Did you people recruit occupy candidates for office... NO

Did you people canvass neighborhoods..... NO

Did you people phone bank.... NO

Did you people register voters... NO

When the "beatings pepper spraying and jailing" were going on I was an OWS supporter.

When you did not translate that into real grassroots political action I said screw it these people do not know what they are doing. You had a huge chance and blew it.

OCCUPY sat on their hands in Wisconsin. PROGRESSIVES elected Elizabeth Warren

[U4ikLefty]

58. You were an OWS "supporter"

The way may people were "OWS supporters, but..."

Oh, and calling us "you people" is kinda revealing.

See, I was REALLY out there (on the streets) & can smell BS about Occupy a mile away.

[iandhr]

64. I was recovering from surgery at that time.

[pinboy3niner]

73. That may explain why you missed all the news of Occupy Wisconsin's involvement in the Walker recall

OccupyWI and Occupy groups in cities throughout the state, as well as some Occupiers from other states, worked for the recall. More than that, they continued to work to defeat Walker's agenda, even after the recall failed.

On the day after the recall election, Occupiers marching in Milwaukee were brutalized and arrested by police.

Police Brutality in Milwaukee
http://occupywi.org/2012/06/police-brutality-in-milwaukee/


Four Arrested In Milwaukee
http://occupywi.org/2012/06/four-arrested-in-milwaukee/

[pinboy3niner]

69. I can attest that you were out in the streets

I was there at your side, and on one occasion we were accosted by a couple of RWNJs because they didn't like your protest sign.

Good times, man, good times!

[VanillaRhapsody]

37. You probably shouldn't be correcting someone's else's spelling with that post...just sayin'

[U4ikLefty]

60. Yawn.....go back to shilling for war.

Nobody takes you seriously.

[VanillaRhapsody]

65. Yawn is right...go back to sleep..its what you do best.

[Scuba]

78. Bullshit. The same People I saw at Occupy Milwaukee were working hard on the recall....

Walker won because the corporate overlords bought every newspaper, TV and radio station in the State bussed in astroturfers, tried to intimidate our activists and spent a gazillion dollars convincing the uninformed that recalls were a bad idea and Walker was a savior anyway long before we even finished the primary to determine who would represent our side.

Blaming Occupy is just silly.

[iandhr]

11. Bill Mahar said it best

[SunSeeker]

21. Wow. Spot on. nt

[Spitfire of ATJ]

22. His follow up....

[Kolesar]

46. I was in so many canvasses, I lost count

It is tough work. The 2010 Governor's race burned me out.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

15. OWS was not an insurgency. It was a leaderless protest movement. nt

[NightWatcher]

30. ^^^^^This^^^

I saw people holding signs protesting a dozen different issues. I halfway expected to see a guy with a Free Nelson Mandella sign next to the Free Mumbia sign.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

19. Their message worked. This country no longer buys the idea that the rich make this country great.

[marions ghost]

43. And this is a lasting contribution

Occupy pointed the finger straight at Wall Street. And the corporates who own and control everything.

Whatever else Occupy does or is, this was pivotal.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

48. The Great Depression got everyone to thinking Wall Street was central to everyone's well being....

Now we see that what's good for Wall Street can be BAD for Main Street.

That and the utter contempt displayed by the rich for the little guy.

Romney displayed that too.

[marions ghost]

57. I think people finally get the connection

...you can never depend on the rich to look out for you. The rich look out for the rich. If they can skin you, they will.

Basic. Amazing how many people need to have it pointed out to them. But I understand the denial. We really want to think that things are OK, that the rich will be made to share, that the productivity of the working class is appreciated and rewarded (--and I include a lot of us in "working class" --the 99%--as opposed to those who sit on their butts and check their stocks all day long).

We deserve a nation we can be proud of, that invests in US. A nation we can feel good about living in, for a change.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

76. There really WAS a time in this country when all you had to do to get a raise,...

....was to get some backbone and go into the boss and ASK for it.

Hell, they used to give you a raise when you got married and another when you had your first kid.

[marions ghost]

106. How long ago

was that? Since the mid-Reagan Era when I was first out there, it has certainly not been the case. So I guess it was the period before that. Those were the good old days (at least for men--I remember my Mom couldn't get a raise & made half what a man did).

[Spitfire of ATJ]

107. The Reagan era ended that....

Reagan told everyone that their boss was barely scrapping by because of the burden of government regulations and taxes. He claimed everyone would get a raise if we cut taxes for the rich. It was ALSO those dirty hippies to blame for your low pay. Pity your boss who had to install smoke scrubbers at huge expense or go out of business in the name of "flower power".

[marions ghost]

109. Good points

the lies of the Reagan Era...very effective... and clearly they used "fear of hippies" and anarchy to roll back progress very effectively. It seems in hindsight, like the Big Revenge.

How dare people sneer at Corporate Rule!...we'll show em... and indeed they have. They have
decimated the middle class in their zeal to control the population's urge toward clean environments, fair wages, health care, fewer WMD-- you name it. All that nasty "socialism" and demand for a real peacetime economy, as opposed to constant war.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

110. The 70s and 80s was also the time of the rise of the legalized porn industry...

Prior to that, it was something hidden and illegal. Suddenly there were studios, stars, directors and crews.

America was having WAY too much fun and Reagan and the Right felt they had to put a stop to it so they pushed the old idea that it was a commie plot by degenerates (Liberals) to undermine society. A lot of people actually believe AIDS was introduced to get people to think of sex as "dirty" again. Just too much freedom for the likes of them.

[marions ghost]

111. Yeah

and then in the early 90's--the Jesse Helms rampage for "morality." Piss Christ and all that. That rightwing propaganda sold very well in the churches.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

112. These guys would rail about "morality" in the bedroom....

....while bribing judges and engaging in every form of corruption known and searching for new ones.

There was a scene in "The L Word" that comes to mind.

Because our people don't know how to play this game. We're progressives and we're accused of being morally bankrupt. They have so many fucking skeletons in their closets and we don't touch them. We take the high road, we wind up in the ditch. We leave our dirty laundry hanging out all over the place cause we're not so ashamed of it; they grab it and wave it around. They make us look like perverts! We have to get into their closets. We cannot afford to keep on being so high-minded... Because we're getting killed.

[1-Old-Man]

50. I'd be willing to bet a lot more people watch the Discovery Channels 'Men who made the World'

If the message had worked the 99% would have been out in the streets but that didn't happen. Meanwhile the Discovery Channel puts out a series of programs that attribute the entire rise of mankind to the very wealthy, without whom we would all still be wiggling our tails to move about the swamps.

One night I was watching the Occupy folks in NYC and it occurred to me that there were far more millionaires in the buildings surrounding them than there were Occupy protesters all together at every Occupy site in the country combined. Not good odds.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

70. The Republicans alienated a lot of people when they ran Romney....

You have to remember they had a strong base of shit kickers out there and then this slippery Wall Street city slicker shows up and thinks all it takes to get their vote is to stand on a bail of hay.

"We are the 99%" was given a "47%" boost.

[U4ikLefty]

20. As many of the comments on this thread demonstrate

As many of the comments on this thread demonstrate, the TPTB have many unwitting fools to carry water for them.

[brooklynite]

34. Yes, it's always a good idea to insult everyone who disagrees with your viewpoint...

[iandhr]

41. Its the standard reaction here.

Everyone is either a tool or a troll who disagrees with me.

[iandhr]

35. I am a tool for the powers that be because...

... I think those peoples time would have been better spent phone banking and recruiting candidates that share their views then twitting their thumbs in a park

[alfredo]

49. I think it worked. It was all about planting a seed.

They are now buying up mortgages and forgiving their debt.

[FSogol]

27. This is what I learned: When you capture everyone's attention have something better to say than,

"We don't have any leaders and we want a complete paradigm shift on financial institutions."

[iandhr]

32. THANK YOU

[VanillaRhapsody]

40. Anarchy doesn't work...

[alfredo]

51. They pointed out the rigged game.

[FSogol]

66. True, but the public only saw some guys camping in city parks without a permit.

[alfredo]

67. Those are the ones we will never reach.

[LittleGirl]

33. The only reason

I didn't 'join' OWS was because my husband was being 'background' checked for his citizenship request. I didn't want an arrest record or end up in the hospital with pepper spray or wrist injuries from cops working for the daylight robbery bankers or local gov't.
Yes, they were somewhat disorganized but their message was accurate. The system is fixed against the 99%.
The militarization of our police departments scares the crap out of me as I lived in and have since moved to another red state.
Oh and the citizens are armed.

[marions ghost]

44. Important realization

"the system is fixed against the 99%."

Some people are still just not willing to face that.

[LittleGirl]

47. That's my story

and I'm sticking with it. wink.

Elizabeth Warren is right. It's fixed.

[alfredo]

45. Occupy was a PR, and it worked. It put the 1% vs the 99%

into the minds of the public. When the occupy tactics ran their course, they changed tactics.

[Agnosticsherbet]

53. Occupy Activists' New Fight for Regulation, Affordable Housing and Social Justice

http://www.thenation.com/blog/176145/occupy-wall-streets-legacy-fight-regulation-affordable-housing-and-social-justice#

Actually, since the occupy movement is still alive and well, it seems this country did an incredibly piss poor job of "crushing an insurgency."

Just callin' them as I see 'em.

[WHEN CRABS ROAR]

55. This country crushed Occupy because it was afraid of it

they couldn't let it grow into something that might actually change anything and that's a valid lesson to be learned for the next time.

In our small town of 1200 persons, on the southern Oregon coast, one tenth of the towns population came out in protest and lined highway 101 with the support of all 3 of our cops, who also realized they were part of the 99%.

Unless things change for the better, there will be a next time and we need to learn from our mistakes and use better tactics.

[1-Old-Man]

93. Actually I think it was the opposite. The country thought Occupy was a joke

And people watched the evening news with their heads nodding as the police state and corporate media joined forces to denigrate the entire movement. Those who attended cared while the vast majority of the 99% simply didn't give a shit.

[Throd]

56. "Insurgency"? I think public apathy was more what killed it.

What I witnessed at Occupy Sacramento was a bunch of people in Cesar Chavez Park preaching to the choir while the surrounding downtown went about business as usual.

I found it to be most disappointing because in the beginning I thought it could tap into the resentment felt by Americans across the political spectrum that they were being jobbed by the system and there was finally a vehicle to make themselves heard. Seeing some bank executives and their lackeys brought up on fraud charges would have appealed to most everyone.

I think it was a great opportunity that got squandered by incoherence.

[1-Old-Man]

62. The word seemed to fit - not that we disagree.

Merriam Webster:


Insurgent: 1. A person who revolts against civil authority or an established government; especially : a rebel not recognized as a belligerent.

I'm afraid they did not give a definition of Insurgency as a noun to be applied to a group of like-minded people come together in public for some purpose but I figure if you know what an insurgent is you should be able to figure out what an insurgency is. The definition above seems to fit, particularly the part about not being recognition as a belligerent.

But I don't disagree with you. I thought it was brilliant to have no one leader, because of course they would have Snowdened (massive public denigration based exclusively on personal attacks and utterly devoid of substance or relevance to the matter(s) at hand) him or her, but there really had to be defendable and well articulated points as well as spokespersons for them. Absent that, exactly as you said, "the surrounding downtown went about business as usual".

[frazzled]

63. Yes, those missiles, jet fighters, and artillery the US used

to wipe out entire Occupy towns was horrific. Not to mention the mass killings, deaths in detention, and systematic rape. The millions of refugees we saw fleeing the the US to Canada and Mexico was proof of the terror the government used to crush this insurgency.

All I can say is, with OPs like this, it's no wonder we're not having a rational discussion about Syria. Clearly, people have no conception of what is going on there, or the scale of it. Poor analogies like this only serve to mislead and distract.

Please read the UN Right's panel recent report on the war crimes in Syria (yes, it includes crimes by the insurgent forces as well, but they rather pale in scale to the government-aligned forces). http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2013/09/11/world/middleeast/12geneva-doc.html

Sorry, but the Occupy Movement was was not so much crushed as fell apart. What might have been a successful movement, whose motto made sense to us all, was foiled by its own disorganization, its insistence on sleeping in parks and drumming over articulating clear and definable principles, etc. The unions that initially supported it fell away, as did the support of many people young and old, who just couldn't get with the tactics like preventing people from getting into their banks to cash their pay or SS checks.

But to compare the minor things that went on between local authorities and Occupy protesters to the truly horrific things that have been happening in Syria is, well, offensive. 100,000 dead and 2 million refugees is not the same as some pepper spray. (Bad as that was, you can in no way compare it to indiscriminate heavy artillery shelling of villages, launching of sarin gas into neighborhoods, and torture and disappearances on a massive scale.) If you can't tell, I'm kind of pissed that people here can be so rudely reductive.

Just callin' them as I see 'em.

[roody]

68. The US saves that big stuff for

places like Chile, El Salvador, Colombia, Iraq, Afghanistan, Viet Nam, etc.

[Warren DeMontague]

71. I learned that "lessons" and "messages" are hopelessly bourgeois outdated concepts

And that the best way to effect a specific change is to not tell anyone what specific change it is you're trying to effect.

[randome]

72. Occupy is a verb, not a noun.

It implies static behavior, not progressive movement. Names matter. If you start off with one that doesn't inspire, it becomes all the harder to inspire.

http://www.wired.com/opinion/2012/12/a-eulogy-for-occupy/all/

Because the GA had no way to reject force, over time it fell to force. Proposals won by intimidation; bullies carried the day. What began as a way to let people reform and remake themselves had no mechanism for dealing with them when they didn’t. It had no way to deal with parasites and predators. It became a diseased process, pushing out the weak and quiet it had meant to enfranchise until it finally collapsed when nothing was left but predators trying to rip out each other’s throats.

[hr][font color="blue"][center]I'm always right. When I'm wrong I admit it.
So then I'm right about being wrong.[/center][/font][hr]

[Nevernose]

101. Occupy should have taken a lesson from the Tea Party

After a few months of protests, they should have put on ties and worked politically.

It's worked for the Tea Party to the detriment of the nation and the world. I can only dream of what might have been if Occupy had gone the same route.

[alfredo]

104. 1% vs 99% It is still on our minds. The seed is planted, we need to tend the garden.

[L0oniX]

108. I learned that I may be in the scope of a gov thug sniper when I protest.