"Religious Freedom" -- This is NOT "Religious Freedom!"

[Sparkly]

They are pushing the "Religious Freedom" slogan hard this morning on the talk shows.

What about a WOMAN'S religious freedom? Why do they think men should have the "Religious Freedom" to override the religious freedom of a woman??

YOU don't like birth control? Don't use it. There. Your "religious freedoms" are preserved.

This is about health insurance, not churches dispensing pills or having condom machines!! It is none of their business what choices women make for their own health, and there is NO "religious freedom" that gives them a right to dictate it.

It's so infuriating to hear this "religious freedom" nonsense over and over again. WOMEN HAVE RELIGIOUS FREEDOM TOO. All citizens do. There is no "religious freedom" to erase someone else's religious freedom!!

[valerief]

1. Religion is hate and power for a few billionaires. Nothing more. nt

[ClassWarrior]

4. So bigotry against religion is okay?

One good hate deserves another?

NGU.

[valerief]

7. I can hate ALL religion. I just can't hate a SINGLE religion. nt

[Occulus]

15. False equivalency.

American progressives have never passed laws aimed at specific religions. Members of specific religions have passed laws aimed at certain (nominally liberal-leaning) groups for religious reasons.

I'm gay and I live in MI. I have very good reason to distrust religion in general, Christianity in particular, and no, I won't apologize for it.

[ClassWarrior]

16. It's always a "false equivalency" in the offender's eyes.

NGU.

[msongs]

19. religion is fine with me long as believers keep it to themselves & don't try to impose it on me nt

[ClassWarrior]

23. You sound like some folks I know who believe Christians are highly persecuted in America.

You hear what you wanna hear...



NGU.

[cleanhippie]

20. You cheapen the meaning of the word when you try to apply it in such a manner.

Religious beliefs, like any other ideology, are not immune to sharp criticism, especially in the face of hard evidence of it's destructive potential.

Using the word bigotry in such a way only serves to cheapen its meaning.

[ClassWarrior]

21. So being subject to sharp criticism gives you permission to smear an ideology?

Hippie ideology, by your account, is subject to sharp criticism too. Therefore it's okay to call it a support network for child rapists?



NGU.

[cleanhippie]

24. Does hippie ideology (whatever that is) protect and hide child rapists as the Catholic Church has?

I mean, the guy who was largely responsible for protecting and hiding them got promoted to the position of head poo-bah of the church.


You tell me, is it okay to call THAT a support network for child rapists?

[ClassWarrior]

25. Yeah, it is easier to change the subject to recognize one's own hatreds.

I get that. (sigh)

NGU.

[cleanhippie]

26. Change the subject? I'm discussing what YOU brought up.

What. The. Fuck.

[ClassWarrior]

27. How do you feel about cheddar cheese? After all, you brought up the word "sharp"...

Nice try, Francis.

NGU.

[cleanhippie]

28. Ahh, fuck it. I see that you are not to be reasoned with.

Have a nice day, Penelope.

[gratuitous]

5. No it isn't

But in accordance with our faultless DU juries, I'm not allowed to respond further.

[LeftishBrit]

6. No. It is too often USED by the rich and powerful to perpetuate their position...

'divine right of kings' and all that.

But there is a lot more to religion than 'hate' or 'power for billionaires'. People throughout history, and from all one can gather, prehistory, have used some form of religion to explain and interpret the world and their own position in it.

I am totally non-religious, but religion can't be reduced to such an oversimplified statement.

[valerief]

8. In today's world, it can be boiled down to just a tool to keep the powerful powerful.

In today's world, we have science and sophisticated communication tools.

[ClassWarrior]

17. Oh, ANYthing can be reduced to an oversimplified statement...

...in certain people's worlds.



NGU.

[ProfessionalLeftist]

2. They whine "religious freedom" every time

they are prevented from ramming THEIR religion down someone ELSE'S throat. If they can't do that, they screech "you're taking away our religious freedom!".

You're right. It's not religious freedom. It's bullying, abuse, control and oppression.

The media gets their marching orders from their corprat bosses. They say what they're TOLD. And that's all.

[Skidmore]

3. Peggy Noonan was going on about this issue as a first amendment

concern on "This Week." I don't understand why no one speaks up in the middle of this and point out that not all people are Catholic and share the same belief system as some of these groups. That an individual woman has an inherent right to her own body and what happens to it.

I have no hesitation with saying that the older I get the less use I have for religious institutions, the men who head them, and the women who acquiesce and cede power to them at this very fundamental level of personhood.

[Gidney N Cloyd]

10. And could she have talked down to Donna Brazile any more?

[LeftishBrit]

9. Yes. 'Freedom' is being misused to mean 'the right to enforce what others can do'.

And 'religious' is being misused to refer to a very PARTICULAR form of hardline religious belief. Most religions do not forbid birth control; and even among Catholics, most people accept it in practice.

[dickthegrouch]

11. Religious exceptions were denied in the UK

When the civil rights laws caught up to modern times and denied people or organizations who provide services to the public the ability to discriminate, some tried to claim religious exceptions. They were rightfully denied those exceptions.

The US needs to evolve to the same stage.

[eShirl]

12. They're all about "religious freedom" until somebody wants to

build a mosque a few blocks from Ground Zero.

[Stinky The Clown]

13. By the way, proving your point is someone named "freeper" at the cave site

http://www.conservativecave.com/index.php/topic,70169.0.html

No need to comment. He says it all. No doubt the other screech monkeys will be there soon enough.

[Sparkly]

14. A perfect example of the circular rhetoric

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002381858

They say "religious freedom," I say "women's rights," they say "who pays for it?"

Next, I say "insurance," they say "religious freedom," and around we go.

(Do they really not understand the concept of insurance??)

Edited to add: So far, I've seen them compare healthcare to running shoes (O'Reilly) and booze (this person). Reaching for ridiculous analogies is more proof they've got no argument.

[uppityperson]

30. I don't think they understand the concept of insurance.

Insurance should pay for legally prescribed medications. Not take religious issue with 1 type. Let's say someone believes ethically, based on their religion, that people with high blood pressure brought it on themselves. So why should they get their medicine paid for when it was their own fault they got that way.

Why doesn't insurance pay for booze or running shoes? Maybe because they aren't prescribed medications?

[cleanhippie]

18. Don't you get it? Religious Freedom means the freedom to push their religion onto you.

Period.

[mainer]

22. Fine. No more Medicare and Medicaid payments to Catholic hospitals.

These hospitals survive on money contributed by non-catholic taxpayers. They get paid by health insurers whose clients may not be Catholic.

A hospital who survives on money paid by non-catholics does not get to dictate to the clients footing the bill.

[Stinky The Clown]

29. Here's another quote from the Cave site, by one of the head mouth breathers

Sergeant Snuggle Bunny sez:

I am no more obligated to pay for someone else's recreational sex any more than I'm obligated to pay for their recreational eating, cable TV, vacation, etc.

This is another mental defective who needs to bone up on basic human biology and the workings of lady parts. This is the result of listening to Pigboy and having your brain go to mush.

Hey Sarge, check yourself in to some community college adult ed self improvement course. You might be better for having done it.

[Initech]

31. What pisses me off is that hardcore super fundies don't seem to get..

That freedom of religion also means freedom from religion. Not everyone has to conform to fundamentalist Christianity. They are seriously going into scary and dangerous territory with this birth control shit.