General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThe South bashing is getting really old.
Look, the states that make up the old Confederacy aren't perfect. They were the home of some of the most abhorrent racial discrimination in the country and are currently run largely by far right extremists who are determined to screw the lower classes and minorities.
But the bullshit circulating here recently pinning all of our problems as a country on this region is getting tiresome.
The Tea Party isn't exclusive to the South. California has more teabagger representatives in Congress than most individual states in Dixie. Neither is racism--Indiana is a Klan stronghold, and Idaho has a fair concentration of white supremacist preppers.
We have a lot of good progressives in the South, but a broken election system and partisan voter purges keep them from the polls. Some are afraid to be active for fear of reprisal from their communities.
In short, stop demonizing the South. No part of this country is beyond saving, and the South isn't even the worst we have to deal with.
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)Thank you.
texanwitch
(18,705 posts)There are republican office holders from all the states.
How did they get there, someone voted for them.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)Except it's an urban vs. rural dichotomy now, not North vs. South. Plenty of countryside to be had, and consequently plenty of far right voters and racists.
bvar22
(39,909 posts)[font color=white]..............................................[/font][font size=1](Precinct Map of the 2008 election)[/font]
...but Hatin on the South is Bigotry that is still applauded at DU.
Baitball Blogger
(46,736 posts)I live in a Repub community and I spent years listening to city tapes. The drawls and twangs are hard to overlook.
Fawke Em
(11,366 posts)Baitball Blogger
(46,736 posts)The kind of corruption you might find in Boston is different than the kind of corruption you might find in Orlando. Here there are strong signs of pursuing a neo-confederate way of life. And by that I mean, they do not respect the Fourteenth Amendment.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)I think region-bashing becomes tedious when arguments devolve into the "kinds" of corruption in one area vs. another.
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin
(108,034 posts)Last edited Wed Oct 16, 2013, 01:24 PM - Edit history (1)
But I get your point. Boehner's from Ohio, Paul Ryan's from Wisconsin and Steve King's from Iowa for example.
NightWatcher
(39,343 posts)Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)hopemountain
(3,919 posts)sarah palin just has marbles in her head.
pipoman
(16,038 posts)ChiciB1
(15,435 posts)can bring Democrats together than any other I've seen in the modern era... BUT, one thing that has always stuck in my craw!
DLC! And then NAFTA! It did start something that upset me at the time and does to this day. Don't get me wrong, I worked for his election big time each time... but ALWAYS knew I was to the left of him. I love that Al Gore brought awareness to Climate Change, a serious subject that needed attention long before he was able to push & define the issue.
But let's not forget NRDC, GreenPeace, National Wildlife Federation and on and on. But kudos to Gore for his dedication to our environment. Yes, these men both can add a long list of issues to their resume, but I was and have been distressed by the DLC.
I of course know, I'm not included in the "middle ground progressives" consider myself a liberal, but do know how very much my family benefited from UNIONS for so many Americans who were unable to grab that ring and go onto college. Unions had/have their corruption issues, never disputed... but compared to the overall GREED and turning back the clock to the Robber Barons of the past, which is worse?
Living where I do perhaps I've let cynicism grab me and pull me down, but I can honestly say I never stopped working to help the common man. Unfortunately I live in a very rich county that is Ruby Red and I've now tired of butting my head against the wall. I'm distressed to see that the generations that have come behind me, including my own grandson, going to FSU, my grand-daughter going to a local college, know so very little about what goes on in D.C. and really could give a rat's ass. It amazes me what THEY DON'T KNOW, and heavens knows I DO give them lessons all the time. They listen for a while, agree a lot about issues, but they don't want to get involved.
And so it goes.
pipoman
(16,038 posts)a decision that will, sooner or later, come home to roost..
bvar22
(39,909 posts)Along with Ann Richards,
Molly Ivans
Bill Moyers,
Jim Hightower,
and THIS guy:
ChiciB1
(15,435 posts)moved to FL because my husband's father retired, & moved back to his home state. My husband was born in Tampa. What a trade off, huh?
I actually met Molly Ivins, but it was here in Florida close to the time she passed away. As army brats, we lived at Ft. Hood for an extended period of time. Graduated from school in Killeen, TX and actually settled down there until I was 28! Ivins stomping grounds were Austin, about the only place I can deal with anymore. One of my sister's still lives in Cedar Park outside of Austin. BUT, she drank the Kool-Aid and is a fundamentalist Christian who thinks Obama is the Anti-Christ.
We get along extremely well, but she knows how I feel. She knows I talk trash about her, and she admits she does the same about me. Politically we couldn't be further apart. I took that test that was on here yesterday and I'm a Bleeding Heart Liberal! Of the 6 girls in our family, we were the closest in age and actually went to the same high school together. I go back for all my class re-unions and see her friends and mine. She graduated the year I was a freshman, but we do have memories in common which keep us close.
It works, but probably not if I was still living there. My parents were strong Democrats & most of my other sisters, but I've always been the political activist and sort of the black sheep! And PROUD OF IT!
ChiciB1
(15,435 posts)We've been around DU for a long, long time, I remember you well. Old Elm Tree & All!
bvar22
(39,909 posts)That is an anonymous Texas Liberal outside the Governor's Mansion in Austin back when Bush was President.
Yep..the whole demonize the south thing is actually culture war based on stereotypes...some people have hated every neighbor they have ever had too..
ChiciB1
(15,435 posts)Let me be clear. I said I pretty much grew up in Texas, I live in Florida now (maybe not real south) but I also have MANY SOUTHERN friends and neighbors and get along with them well. And for the record, I'm not the one screaming about southern states. There is a map somewhere from the last election that breaks down RED/BLUE. The amount of red is astounding, and not only in the south. If one where to look at the map, at first glance it would be impossible to imagine that Obama actually won the election! True, I was SHOCKED when he took Florida, happy but can't deny my shock.
Partly because of where I live here, the affluent per capita income of this county and the people who vacation here and the many celebrities who own 2nd homes here. BTW, I'm far, far away from being ONE of them. Still, I can ride down to the beach (gulf) and see a long winding road of very expensive houses. I've met & seen Steven King who rides his bike on that road. Sounds like I'm some sort of "name dropper" but no way! Just explaining. Many, many top tennis players call this place home away from home. I know King is no "right winger" but boy are there a LOT of them here! And you can spot them rather quickly if you've lived here long enough.
I don't think I recall anytime when this county went blue. Maybe Clinton squeaked by once, and also Obama, but don't think either quite made. Not sure. But since Obama's last election things here turned very nasty and it hasn't stopped.
Bottom line though, I think where one should TRULY point the finger of WHY the south has the perception it has, is because of THE MEDIA! I'm not sure a good argument could be given against their influence in this fact.
True, I find most of Texas difficult for me, but Austin is a great place. I hear the state is turning more purple, that's great.
As for MY close neighbors, and I've lived in this same house for a LONG time... for some reason there's a clan of liberals, Democrats and middle to left Independents. Strange, but I like it. Not to say that I haven't had signs stolen from my yard. My little enclave is small, most came from middle class (Union) backgrounds and I do like living here. If I were to get on the road and drive inward, well... there would be a, what many would call "very redneck" mud bogging, not so politically informed abundance of people. It is what it is.
So enough, not deriding the south, but I didn't give them a "red state" reputation.
pipoman
(16,038 posts)I haven't addressed you in this subthread..?
PBass
(1,537 posts)BlueToTheBone
(3,747 posts)bash the mentality that pervades most of the people. In many cases it seems inbred. I quit trying to work with the democratic party here because I was told straight to my face that they did what they did here and they would not be changing, no matter what.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)I'm not saying it would be easy to change, but nothing is going to get better if we all collectively decide to wash our hands of an entire region.
BlueToTheBone
(3,747 posts)They like what they are doing and too stupid to know they are killing themselves.
Uncle Joe
(58,366 posts)As if "they" weren't human, in case of the former, all judgment is based on skin color, and the latter it's because someone was born and/or lives where they do.
Ignorance and fear posing simple answers to complex questions make for a dull mind.
BlueToTheBone
(3,747 posts)right out of their hearts.
Uncle Joe
(58,366 posts)guess that means Jimmy Carter and Martin Luther King are/were beyond hope?
ChazII
(6,205 posts)for pointing this fact out. These men were great leaders both in civil rights and in their religious community.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)And I'm one of those, too.
young_at_heart
(3,769 posts)I think I may be in an "oasis" but I am want to think that some of us newcomers may be able to facilitate positive changes throughout the state.....at least I'm hoping for this to happen!!
DAMANgoldberg
(1,278 posts)As a long-term resident of Charlotte, I can vouch for this, despite our heaping of hizzoner on the rest of the state. I apologize for McCrory.
srican69
(1,426 posts)where is the Jealous smiley??
snooper2
(30,151 posts)I usually post a bad ass video, but this thread calls for a funny
A Texan, a Russian and a New Yorker go into a restaurant in London.
"Excuse me, but if you were going to order the steak, I'm afraid there's a shortage due to the mad cow disease," says the waiter.
The Texan says, "What's a shortage?"
The Russian says, "What's a steak?"
The New Yorker says, "What's 'excuse me'?"
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)adirondacker
(2,921 posts)BlueToTheBone
(3,747 posts)now that they've fracked their water away.
snooper2
(30,151 posts)You ever check out the demographics of the Dallas metroplex?
BlueToTheBone
(3,747 posts)and what do you mean about the metroplex demographics. I lived there for a few years
snooper2
(30,151 posts)Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)An entire tour bus got swept down a "wet weather" creek; fortunately everyone got out okay. A friend of mine had to clear out in the middle of the night, and her car had only the roof showing. I only have to worry about a 2-gallon roof leak! More rain on the way.
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)creating a total cluster fuck such as we have right now, we would be happy to stop blaming the former confederacy for being at least partially responsible for this mess.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)And I'm not absolving anyone of putting crazies in Congress, but the constant berating of an entire region when many other states are only marginally better is but disingenuous and aggravating.
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)That split has accelerated since the civil rights movement of the 60's and went nuclear after the nation elected an African American president. The insanity is not confined to the former confederacy, but that is where it is strongest and where the infection breeds.
LonePirate
(13,425 posts)I am not going to turn a blind eye to the root of the problem in contemporary American politics which is the powerful and concentrated Republican base in the South.
Also, with maybe one or two exceptions, almost all of the Republican Congressional reps from CA (assholes one and all) are not as rabid or as racist as the ones from the South.
Fortunately demographics are slowly changing Texas which seems to be the heart of this beast. With enough time and money, we can attack the problem head on in Texas and turn the state blue in 2020 or maybe even in 2016 if Hillary were to run. She would sweep several of the states repulsive Congressional reps as well.
Dustlawyer
(10,495 posts)than anyone! If you really want to help, support Wendy Davis for Governor! That would do more than anything to jump start the Democrats here. Add in the Castro brothers and then we will have something!
GreenStormCloud
(12,072 posts)But don't let facts stop you from bashing the South.
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)GreenStormCloud
(12,072 posts)jeff47
(26,549 posts)A lot of those big red areas in the midwest on your map are one or two representatives in the House. Because those big red areas are relatively empty.
Meanwhile, there's blue cities in the south, but the rural areas are far more populated. With teabaggers.
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)I did not include border states, if I did the numbers are much worse.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_Caucus
I'm sorry if the plain facts are uncomfortable.
cpwm17
(3,829 posts)We have one person, one vote elections in the US; not one acre, one vote. Those bright red areas in the center and west are very sparsely populated.
Even though there is much truth to some of the criticisms of the South, I must say that region bashing does often go way too far on DU along with other types of bigotries.
Hekate
(90,714 posts)... and neither is Sarah Palin. Not all Morans wave the Confederate flag.
There is plenty of blame to go around.
bvar22
(39,909 posts)quinnox
(20,600 posts)and its largely backwards beliefs and backwards politics. That doesn't mean they are all right wingers, but its a fact the big majority of them are, they keep sending their right wingers to congress, and that alone has a huge negative impact on this country.
texanwitch
(18,705 posts)The countryside not so much.
I have never voted for a republican in all my voting years.
Lots of people in non southern states do vote republican.
Cruz wasn't born in Texas, Bush either.
I don't blame democrats in other states for the republicans in congress.
Remember a lot of republicans moved to Texas for jobs.
Lots of them.
I know, I worked elections for along time.
Both as a precinct judge and at early voting.
I have seen a lot of out of state drivers licenses.
We had Billy Hobby as Lt. Governor for 18 years before Bush became governor.
That is a long time in that job.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)Maybe other regions do too, but accepting/excusing this bigoted stupidity here really won't improve anything.
BlueToTheBone
(3,747 posts)and don't back down. I'm not nasty, just factual; as in, oh, of course you are a racist.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)Warpy
(111,276 posts)The south as a whole has a little introspection to do about why people in the rest of the country have a low opinion of it.
Of course, that's hard. It's far easier to play the victim.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)That freaks em out, and they tell you how they weren't here back when racism and talibanesque behavior were overt. Then they turn on hate radio and make a sick comment about the poor, Obama, and liberals, or switch topics to the AR15s they bought to put one in every room of their house in the event of a home invasion.
Response to Warpy (Reply #31)
carolinayellowdog This message was self-deleted by its author.
carolinayellowdog
(3,247 posts)So many "progressive" DUers I've stood up for and rec'd against the onslaught of centrist bullies. You damn well won't stand up for me when the bullying is regional so FUCK YOU.
Virginia has two Democratic senators, is about to have a return to Democratic governance, has voted for Obama twice. I'm a lifelong Democratic voter, but too far left to be a Democrat anymore. I'm gay, involved in environmentalism, have friends all over the country none of whom express this disgusting Othering towards me for the state I live in...
and come to DU and the "they're all alike, they're all to blame, stereotype 'em, scapegoat `em, humiliate 'em, and HOUND THEM OUT OF DU" never stops, never. I give up. Even in a thread devoted so solidarity and support people like you I felt friendly to have to come in and shit on us.
madinmaryland
(64,933 posts)Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)The region, not the island.
madinmaryland
(64,933 posts)The region, not the island.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)Egnever
(21,506 posts)the south is an easy target.
Comparing California to the south is silly. 25% of California's reps are pukes that doesnt compare in any way to the south where the ratio is closer to 85% puke. For every puke vote California puts in congress they put in 3 Dem votes. Thankfully California negates a large part of the south.
Sure there are a lot of great folks in the south but they are horribly outnumbered by people to send bat shit crazy people to congress.
tillikum
(105 posts)Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)LGBT people in housing, employment and the rendering of services, while NY State has marriage equality. Chew on that. Additionally, every Southern State keeps those anti gay laws on the books, not all of the 29 States are Southern, but all Southern States are among that 29.
But you were saying that you have 'seen' otherwise....so many say so many things.
tillikum
(105 posts)shared experiences and all but thanks!
Boom Sound 416
(4,185 posts)And it's often rooted on a narcissist national pride thing. "I live here and because I chose to live here nothing could be wrong with it. The reason why it's going to hell in a hand basket is because of you people and the shit you pile on us"
Like Florida is the only SYG state
Racism is encapsulated by a 150 year old dead boundary and on and on.
YoungDemCA
(5,714 posts)Chew on that.
Also, social oppression need not be formally legalized. Did the dismantling of Jim Crow end racism? Of course not.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)other States? What does NY have to do with the anti gay laws in the every Southern State? Nothing.
Every Southern State is on the list of 29 States that allow discrimination against minorities they don't like. Don't expect praise for that, and don't expect my custom either. This does not mean you have the market cornered or that the North is superior, it means this: Every single State in the South allows legal discrimination against minorities they don't like. So do a few non Southern States, other Red States.
Boom Sound 416
(4,185 posts)Speaking as a southerner who lives in NYC.
I love my town and it's the nicest big city I've ever been, but damn, it's pretty friggin segregated here.
starroute
(12,977 posts)Nixon started it with his Southern strategy, of course. Just as the South was starting to emerge from a hundred years of isolation and become part of the modern world, Nixon told them that he loved them just the way they were. So not only did Southerners move over the the Republican Party in large numbers, but they brought their most regressive attitudes with them. That didn't have to happen -- it happened because it was to the Republicans' advantage.
Then starting twenty years ago, Karl Rove determined that it should be possible to systematically eliminate the remaining Democratic office holders in the South and turn it almost solidly Republican, with the exception of a few isolated areas that are rural, black, and desperately poor. This isn't something people generally pin on Rove -- but I became aware of it when looking into Rove's connections with the US Attorney scandal and the prosecution of Don Siegelman.
Once again, the South doesn't have to be the way it is. It doesn't have to be poor and backwards and anti-union and ready to whore itself out to any corporation looking to build auto factories or atomic power plants. But it's been kept that way because it's to certain people's advantage -- not just in economic terms but also in terms of building a power base and insulating it against any progressive impulses that might crack the system wide open.
The South has been victimized over and over. It's flaws have been exploited ruthlessly and its virtues have been used against it. And until we start asking who benefits by that and where the lines of power run, we won't be able to understand what's been going on in the country as a whole.
Response to NuclearDem (Original post)
LumosMaxima This message was self-deleted by its author.
nolabear
(41,986 posts)I have nothing, NOTHING against calling out specific government representatives and people who demonstrate all the things we at DU supposedly hate - Bigotry, lack of empathy, tribalism, willful blindness to the good in people, broad-brushing, - but using those very things here is just as pointless and divides what should be a cohesive party that can work together for the good of all.
But, you know, that's me. And you all know where I was raised.
Uncle Joe
(58,366 posts)here to "divide and conquer" that's the Republicans' modus operandi.
Puzzledtraveller
(5,937 posts)but sadly I think it is more due to hate, rage and ignorance, with a sprinkling of ye old divide and conquer. What I do not get is why do some feel they have to match the vitriol of the very people they despise. Personally I could never become that way. It is in a way an admission of personal defeat because you are letting those you oppose actually dictate your emotions and reactions. IMO.
cordelia
(2,174 posts)The ignorance is astounding, exceeded by the hate and bigotry.
I'm not sure what they're trying to accomplish.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)There are 29 such States, not all are in the South, but every Southern State has those anti gay laws. The ignorant bigotry of the cultures, peoples and governments that keeps such hateful laws on their books is clear, horrific and must be answered by good people. To look the other way at vicious prejudice is to be part of that bigoted culture.
Stop excusing bigotry.
cordelia
(2,174 posts)Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)against my people? I must accept that bigotry or I am the bigot? Are you serious? You think I owe my custom to places that treat my people as less than human?
Those of you who refuse to stand up against that evil discrimination allow it to continue. Those anti gay laws are wrong. To defend or excuse them is wrong.
I will never agree with you that States have the right to practice discrimination against minority groups with impunity, I will always criticize that shite. Sorry if it crimps your culture. Not.
Uncle Joe
(58,366 posts)When an early cave person was threatened with danger, there was little to no time in surmising whether they should climb up a tree or not.
It had to be an instinctive decision based on fear to increase chances of survival, emotion overruling reason is built in to our DNA.
It's a circle or triangle, emotion overrules reason, reason overrules faith and faith overrules emotion.
Well said.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)We can always find plenty of "facts" to condemn every state, from Florida to Minnesota. We can do the same thing to condemn blacks, Hispanics, Jews, and Gays.
And all those facts are probably true. That is the foul beauty of prejudice and bigotry. We can always find "facts."
There is a swollen chancre on DU's body politic which seeks to condemn not just other DUers, but whole swaths of people outside of our little enclave. By the millions they are condemned on the altar of Shame. On the outside, their thinking is that if you Shame some group of people long enough, they will change. Ha. My impression is that when millions of people are Shamed, they...
DIG IN AND RESIST.
Perhaps therein is the real reason for so much hateful bashing of people: the desire to confront and engage in the same kind of violent murder-mouthing they hear from individuals and groups who bash racial, religious and life-status groups. Only, here on DU, the animosity is aimed at whole geographic regions. Maybe these folks here think that a geographic line, like the Mason-Dixon, insulates them from the same kind of condemnation a racist or sexist might receive. But it doesn't. It's the same game: Hate whole regions...
And find the "facts" to back you up.
Incitatus
(5,317 posts)We have more than our fair share of crazies and **** Scott is our governor, but we had enough people turn out to help keep McCain/Palin out of office. You make a good point on voter suppression, Florida would also have given Gore the vote in 2000 without it.
eilen
(4,950 posts)There is a reason it is dubbed "The Transient State" as it was often the haven for those going bankrupt who wanted to keep some property. But they also have their hardcore republican native population. The over 65 cohort trend conservative in their voting habits.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)Incitatus
(5,317 posts)I assume there's quite a few of them.
Logical
(22,457 posts)Shoud you!
cristianmarie533
(51 posts)It's worth noting that Ronald Reagan, a major hero for the GOP and Tea Party, was born in Illinois and lived in California for much of his life.
Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)have come from the South (Johnson, Carter, Clinton), while the last 4 Republican presidents have all come from outside the South (although bu$h Jr. had spent most of his adult life in Texas and his father spent much of his adult life there, but both attended Ivy League schools).
Hekate
(90,714 posts)Thanks for saying this for me.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)Sadly all Southern States maintain laws on their books allowing discrimination against gay people like Williams. Or like Truman Capote. Ironic that their finest minds are subject to termination and eviction for daring to be gay and reside in the South.
Some regions might embrace equality because of having such famous residents who are also so famously gay. But not the South! Hell no.
Hekate
(90,714 posts)... Harper Lee, and more.
Southern writers black and white, male and female, gay and straight, fill an enormous book case of their own in the library of great American literature. Where would we all be without their voices?
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)Marjorie Kinnan Rawlings wrote about what was slipping away, Hurston about what was coming on. Did you know that Hurston spent the night at Rawlings' Cross Creek home? Pretty edgy stuff in 1940s North Florida. Of course, Rawlings also held salon with the likes of Frost and the president of GE. I grew up in the same county, and always swing by to visit Rawlings' place. Wonderful tangerines from her old 1930s grove.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)it's hard not to take shots at them. Yesterday there was a story about wacko saying that California, Massachusetts, New York, and Connecticut should secede.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014620729
I don't hate Texas, I hate the people who are wackos in Texas. I did jokingly say maybe we should give Texas back to Mexico and then again jokingly that it would be too cruel.
I know these people are just a small minority of people in southern states that like to blather like idiots for attention.
Even parts of Oregon were notoriously bad back even back in the early 80's when I lived there.
mc51tc
(219 posts)but it has not always been that way. Texas was the home of the great Speaker of the House, Sam Rayburn, who would not take a donation larger than $25.00. He was known as Mr. Sam and was very respected. Almost too honest to be in politics.
Also, LBJ twisted arms that gave us Medicare, Medicaid, PBS, the Civil Rights Act, the Voting Rights Act, the Great Society, the War on Poverty. When was the last time you ever heard a President even mention the word "poverty" since his time. So without someone from Texas, these programs more than likely would have had a much harder time becoming the law of the land.
Yes, it is very hard to live in Texas as a Democrat these days living with so many current wackos. Our so called leaders are just nuts. It is very understandable why most of the rest of country hates us. However, I know of many Texans that are currently ashamed to call this home.
Tx4obama
(36,974 posts)... here in the fourth largest city in the USA - Houston - we have as our mayor Annise Parker (one of the first openly gay mayors in The USA).
In my opinion Texas is more Purple these days than it is red.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)and it is getting worst, not better.
There are good books on the subject, but it is not just the South. It is a collection of seven dominant cultures that at times do not get along. This is one of those moment.
Rain Mcloud
(812 posts)Besides,its hard to stay mad at the home of Elvis,Gibson Guitars,the Nissan Leaf,Jimmy Cottah and Bill Clinton,okay and James Carville.
Its been so long since i had a damn good plate of chicken fry and fried okra slathered in thick red eye gravy and greens with sweet iced tea,Mmmmm.
Making me want to lick my eyebrows!
paulkienitz
(1,296 posts)where the Old South values finally recede into history.
We might see four or five confederate states voting blue before many more cycles go by.
bvar22
(39,909 posts)AND, we were making some progress under Howard Dean's 50 state strategy,
but have lost some ground after Dean was banished from the DNC.
The Democratic party should start spending some money campaigning in The South.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)And no, you're not alone. A lot of crappy legislators come from Wyoming, or the Central Valley in California.
...No, every single Southerner is not responsible for the craptastic Red State shennanigans that go down;
and unlike some people on this board who seemingly live for it, I'm not a big fan of collective guilt for groups of people based upon what a majority (much less a small minority) of them do.
That said, let's get honest; let's get real. The states that make up the old Confederacy are a BIG part of the reason the country is going through the shit it is, now.
That's not "bashing", that's simple numbers.
ohheckyeah
(9,314 posts)if you quit making fun of people, have actual discussions, and make reasonable arguments they often come around.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)I'd say that liberals and progressives in Red States, while certainly not in an enviable position politically, at least have a significant opportunity to move the political ball in ways that those of us in Blue states, can't.
ohheckyeah
(9,314 posts)conservative to supporting gay rights (including marriage), taking a pro-choice position, and wanting a female president that ISN'T Sarah Palin. He would "even" vote for Hillary who he previously thought he hated. It took months of long discussion and mutual respect but he has come around. I'm the ONLY person he talks to on the phone for more than 10 minutes. We often talk for hours. Oh, he also now supports universal healthcare for everyone, even illegal aliens, and affirmative action. My parents have changed. They voted for Bush and are now embarrassed and vote for Obama twice. They left a church because of it's anti-gay and anti-choice positions. They are 87 years old. There's HOPE when you extend a hand of understanding and respect.
Unfortunately, my sisters, all three, are still rabid Republicans but that doesn't mean that can't and won't change.
Hekate
(90,714 posts)I hope others can follow your example.
ohheckyeah
(9,314 posts)what people often ignore are the alternatives. I remember my brother asking me if I though illegal immigrants should be able to walk into a hospital emergency room and get care. I sarcastically replied, "no, I think we should just step over their dead bodies in the streets." He got it.....what is the alternative, what is the consequence. He never thought about it before. He didn't support the ACA because he didn't want the government in his business. I pointed out he had just applied for Social Security, partial disability as a veteran, and got his health care at the VA Hospital and asked him if the government could possibly be any more up his butt than that. LOL
noiretextatique
(27,275 posts)and this reality is not "bashing."
bvar22
(39,909 posts)This map is a more realistic representation.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Like I said, progressives living in red states have a tremendous opportunity, especially now.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)to Trash the South and make fun of that area of the Country when it's pocketed and Embedded all across USA (due to Media Deregulation: Limbaugh, Beck and the others that folks without money listen to because it's free in their Cars/Trucks and they do Delivery or other occupations where they spend much time in Car/Truck/Hauler)...means that we Trash those who are less advantaged by making them into grotesque cartoon figures.
The stuff that goes on here on DU and other Lib/Dem Sites blaming everything on the South, Racism and Confederacy has the advantage of ignoring what's going on down the Street in other Areas of the US where the Poor have no alternative except to rail against a SYSTEM that they see as Corrupt. It's just that they are driven by the Limbaugh types to focus on it being "Pointy Headed Liberals and Big Government (but not MY Senator or Congressperson) and Elitist Dems causing their destruction or holding them down from advancing.
It's a tactic that not only Repugs use...but, our Democrats in the Party Elite learned to use for their own purposes, too.
I had hoped that Bill Clinton's election would slay the Beast. But the Beast bit him in the Butt.
The Beast is NOT the Southern Confederacy....it's the lack of Education Funding, Media Deregulation and Poverty Programs that never met the targets. There are other factors...but, I'm too tired to go into something that would take too much time and no one here would read...given the EUPHORIA OF TODAY.
So..whatever. Sick of Southern Bashing here on DU.
ChiciB1
(15,435 posts)more "red" recently. And that southwest purple part of Florida is above me. Tampa/St. Pete area. It used to be more blue years back, then went pretty red, now moving nicely back to purple.
AnotherMcIntosh
(11,064 posts)It should also be noted that some people have a chip on their shoulders and are willing to gratuitiously "defend the South" or "defend Texas" when no intended slights are made against the South or Texas.
As one example, some criticial comments were made about Texas cops who were caught on camera delivering unnecessary and excessive violence. A response by one person, and I swear I'm not making this up, was along the lines of "Why do you have to bash Texans?"
RosettaStoned77
(53 posts)My wifes family is from VA and I lived there, as well as in N.O.L.A. and MS. I am a Seattle native and must admit it was quite a culture shock. There were things I liked and other things not so much. But for the most part I disliked the whole place. And by place I mean the people I met everywhere I went. They fly the stars and bars with pride and BELIEVE the south will rise again. The only place I did not encounter any racism was living in the housing projects in Roanoke. It's just the way it is down there. I understand why the rich vote the way they do. But the PWT will always baffle me. They could live in the same neighborhood, send kids to the same schools, work the same jobs. But at the end of the day, go home and complain about the Ns this and the Ns that! They just don't want to see that they are playing right into the hands of the real enemy. That if they could put aside their BS and voted their pocketbooks everyone would benefit. But, no. Might benefit the Ns! I love my family, and have many good friends there. There are just too many assholes and life is too short. Fuck the south. I will never again live where they fly the stars and bars right next to Old Glory. Whew!!! Damn! Guess I really needed to vent.
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)So's Illinois...
melody
(12,365 posts)It makes me mad when the south is singled out, too. Much of my family came from there. My son lives there.
It's also important to remember that Jimmy Carter and his mom, Miss Lillian, are and were both solid Democrats from the state of Georgia. Al Gore is from the south, too. And Bill Clinton is from Arkansas, which is close. lol
Nanjing to Seoul
(2,088 posts)Pryor (yes, him too), Coker, Paul, McConnell, Haley, Scott, Barbour, Gingrich. . .and people like that, I will relax on the South.
Until then, I can bash the South as much as I bash Arizona (which is where I am from).
cordelia
(2,174 posts)Wisconsin - Scott Walker, etc., too?
Puglover
(16,380 posts)crazy congress critters out of the ENTIRE STATE to a state that goes all red. You do see that right?
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)Al Franken and Amy Kolboucher to the Senate and 5 out of 8 Reps are Democrats. See how that balances out?
Also Minnesota has marriage equality, while each of the Southern States still allows discrimination against gay people in housing and employment and rendering of services. See the difference there?
Pointing out facts, facts that harm real humans is not 'bashing' but defending. I will criticize those doing wrong to good people because I care more about the people being wronged than I do about some daft culture of intolerance.
Nanjing to Seoul
(2,088 posts)Homophobic, Sexist, Racist, Xenophobie, Jingoistic and intolerant to anything except their brand of fundamentalist Christianity (usually in the realm of Boko Haram, except with out the violence. . .except you don't include killing OB/GYN and blowing up black churches, dragging gay men to their death, lynching and blowing up pre-natal clinics), then and only then will my opinion of the Southern (and alot of mid-west and intermontain states will change.
Again, I am from Arizona. . .don't talk to me about bashing a state. The difference is I accept that AZ is populated with idiots. . .the southerners don't.
Skittles
(153,169 posts)the way I see it, Texas never misses an opportunity to embarrass itself
longship
(40,416 posts)State capital building.
Enough said?
I hope so.
Dark n Stormy Knight
(9,760 posts)Behind the Aegis
(53,959 posts)longship
(40,416 posts)Behind the Aegis
(53,959 posts)longship
(40,416 posts)It's a done deal. The Confederate flag displayed today is nothing less than a racist statement.
Behind the Aegis
(53,959 posts)longship
(40,416 posts)I don't need to go there, do I?
Behind the Aegis
(53,959 posts)That was easy.
bvar22
(39,909 posts)I would bet that most of the 100 "protesters" at the White House last week end are from north of the Mason Dixon Line.
I've seen more Rebel Flags in the White Flight northern suburbs of the Twin Cities (Michele Bachmann's stronghold)
than I have seen in our new neighborhood in rural Arkansas.
Most of the people still fighting the Civil War and trying to Keep the Old Divisions & hatreds alive on DU are people who live elsewhere.
The South is beautiful,
and belongs to us ALL.
In 2006, my Wife & I moved from a Big Blue Northern City
to a very RED area of the Rural South.
We love it here, and won't be leaving.
You CAN go wherever you think you need to go,
but please don't come to The South.
We don't need or want your kind of "help".
There are people who work for "change",
and people who choose to live in the past and keep comfortable hatreds alive.
--bvar22 & Starkraven
turning The South Blue,
one vote at a time.
cordelia
(2,174 posts)no matter how much progress is made.
Is it too slow? For me, yes. But we can only do so much.
The hatred runs too deep for some - on both sides of the issue.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)upi402
(16,854 posts)Or do you mean it the other way around?
The progressives down south are my absolute heroes. Let there be hope.
Jamastiene
(38,187 posts)miyazaki
(2,244 posts)cordelia
(2,174 posts)Gravitycollapse
(8,155 posts)And not even in totality. It means it shows a considerable trend towards sucking.
I live in Arizona. Do you think I'm particularly proud of this place? Hell fucking no. It fucking sucks. It's a political cesspool and I'll be the first person to tell you that.
GreenEyedLefty
(2,073 posts)B Calm
(28,762 posts)Evolution is Satan's religion and other crazy shit like that comes from the south.
ileus
(15,396 posts)is being a 2A progressive. Some love to paint with a broad brush...
stlsaxman
(9,236 posts)to allow its progressive citizens to make arraignments to evacuate and those in "The United States" to leave for The Confederacy if they so please, then...
throw up the border. Done.
Let 'em go. America doesn't need them.
CBGLuthier
(12,723 posts)Both senators are Democrats and 2 of 3 reps. And now that they have killed Walter White their meth problem should abate some.
Jeff In Milwaukee
(13,992 posts)Guffaw!
Sissyk
(12,665 posts)There has to be a divide somewhere. You can't go trasping through one bad state to get to another good state. Gotta have a line, according to some!
lol @ Walter White!!
kentauros
(29,414 posts)If you've ever paid attention to threads like this one, or the ones about secession, you may have noticed something rather telling. That is, the majority of members here calling for the breakup of the Union are not from the South.
In fact, most of us in or from the South are often the most strident supporters of keeping the Union united. Why are you so against the United States of America remaining a Union? Do you truly want to see the world economy crash? I think you do, or you wouldn't post such drivel to begin with.
And you seem incapable of foreseeing the reality of such a proposal. You're talking about many tens of millions of people moving out of their Home and off to places that might be more welcoming of them. Think about that. Tens of millions of people from the South, moving north. Do you honestly believe that everyone up there would be nearly as welcoming as you seem to think? You're already showing a prejudice against the South, and you're a progressive. How do you think the rest of your fellow state residents will feel, and react?
JoeyT
(6,785 posts)will be thrilled to pull up roots from where their family has been for generations, sell everything they have for a pittance, and flee before they're killed just to make people like you happy.
No really, we totally would.
cordelia
(2,174 posts)I've often wondered if blanket hatred of the South like this wasn't tinged with just a little something extra.
If you get my drift.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)carolinayellowdog
(3,247 posts)you secede, asshole
HereSince1628
(36,063 posts)Although its membership is of some geographic uncertainty (is Texas southern or Southwestern? is Florida part of New Jersey?) The South has a coherence in history and culture that make it at once the most easily identified, celebrated, and stereotyped national region.
Many regions of the US have distinctive qualities of speech and dress that are used to pan their inhabitants--U-pers of Michigan, Northern Minnesotans, Mainers, western cowboy culture, etc. But few regions of the nation have both a strong coherence in regionally distinctive identifiers and the capacity to seriously compete politically with all the remaining regions combined...and a history of "bowdaciously" taking that competitive capacity into military, economic, and popular cultural battles.
And like all competitions and colonizations of one region by another it garners both admiration and indignation.
Some, maybe many, people in the now post-hegemonic rust belt, harbor resentment that the emergence of the South is a consequence of it not competing fairly and of operating in peculiar and objectionable ways to steal away manufacturing, political influence, etc.
Yet, success garners emulation, and we see in 'northern states (Michigan, Ohio, Wisconsin among others) the promotion of regressive legal and regulatory approaches to labor, environment, food safety, that from a "northerner's" point of view look to be aligning with more southern ways of doing business.
Seems to me that as a region, The South, is a strong (and particularly in recent decades) largely successful competitor of other US regions. With that success there is a sense in other regions that southern culture is on a march towards a new hegemony.
I can't say what sort of mounds southern kids play on, but up here where snow creates mountains along the borders of playgrounds and parking lot...we learned a childhood lesson: being 'bowdacious' enough to be king of the hill means all others are going to be coming at you to try to pull you down.
*I do realize bodacious can be spelled in a variety of ways...bowdacious comes from the comic strip Lil Abner.
kentauros
(29,414 posts)Thanks for taking the time to write it up and post
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)If you say so. Sure. Alabama, home of affluence and innovation!
HereSince1628
(36,063 posts)and about recognizable regional identity AND influence in American culture and politics?
I'm really not sure that there is a region more prominent than the south.
I'll admit to finding that stressful, but there it is. My home town was a center of precision manufacturing and famous for watch and aeronautical instrument making...until it was raided by a Carolina town offering free land, no taxes and cheap labor---and that was back in the early '60s.
Sure there are greater individual states than Alabama in terms of economy, political influence and culture. Certainly there are cities (New York, Hollywood) that aren't southern but are giants in culture. What cities push American politics more than San Francisco?
But, consider it as I posed it..."The South" is as "big" as any region in terms of identity, cultural influence and influence on politics and American business practices. I wouldn't say that the Southern/Right to work/WalMart model (part-time, anti-union, no benefits, etc.) is good for America, but it's damned successful and it has spread into all corners of the national economy.
When one considers the country...what region beats "The South" in terms of Identity and influence in culture and politics?
New England? no
The Mid-Atlantic States? no
Eastern North Central (midwestern 'old foundry states" no
Western North Central (aka that grassland "desert" in James Fennimore Cooper's The Prairie)? no
The Mountain States? no
The Southwest? no
The West Coast? Well, especially with respect to California, it probably IS the most equal competitor to the south.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)Your post makes no sense. The South is influential more than other regions? That's something you believe, but it is far from accurate. The South as a region has the vast majority of the poorest counties, cities and States in the Union. These are just facts.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_lowest-income_counties_in_the_United_States
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_poverty_rate
HereSince1628
(36,063 posts)Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)This is what makes it hard to deal with this shit. California is not worse, nor does it have as many 'baggers'. To say so is daft. Oregon and Washington have none. Texas still has 11.
The 'broken election system' which you say 'keeps' progressives from the polls is YOUR system. Not ours, YOURS. Our system here is not broken. Yours is. Who has not fixed that? The residents of those States. It is State law, it is their job. My State's elections are just fine, thanks. Yours. Not ours.
You say good people don't vote in the South for fear or reprisal, then say stop criticizing the South? Do you hear yourself?
Puglover
(16,380 posts)I would have a more positive attitude towards the region. I have never bashed ANY region on this board. But personally I cannot tell you that I look at GA as anything but a place to change planes. And I would not be curious about visiting MS AL or Florida for that matter. More about the fact that I loath hot weather then the politics.
That said bashing the area on this board is insensitive towards fellow members that might live there.
Whiskeytide
(4,461 posts)...your courtesy. People often forget that a red state is sometimes red by a relatively small percentage - maybe 54 to 46. And while that might be a "landslide" in election terms, it also means that here in the South there are millions of progressives in our midst. They're just not as loud and obnoxious. The republicans win most of the state and local elections, and that skews the politics, making us all look bad. But I have many progressive friends here, and we're making progress. Baby steps.
carolinayellowdog
(3,247 posts)accepted all my arguments and then said "Virginia is a northern state" and KEPT ON BASHING! Where Virginia has gone, Florida is going, NC and GA next.
MFrohike
(1,980 posts)VA and NC went for Obama in 08. NC had 7 Democratic and 6 GOP representatives before the latest gerrymandering. I think the total votes for Congress in NC in 2012 were 2.5m Democratic and 2.3m GOP (somehow that translates to 9 GOP reps).
JoeyT
(6,785 posts)My state's unofficial motto is "Thank God For Mississippi", so bashing it really isn't hard. What I loathe are the calls to kick the South out of the Union.
Southern African Americans have absolutely no desire to participate in an exodus. If they did, they'd have already done it. Nor do the Native American tribes that have been here since before Moses was a thing. We already tried being dispossessed and moved around, and we're not in any hurry to do it again, thanks. It didn't sound like much fun the first time. Not really in a hurry to give it another shot.
Of course we would give it another shot, as would the Southern African Americans. We'd sell our houses and land for whatever pittance we could get, or just abandon them outright, and GTFO of here because once all the alleged progressives bailed out to move to Bluetopia, the only thing keeping us from being rounded up and wiped out would be federal laws, so we'd have to leave before that was up.
The people screaming to kick the states with heavy minority populations out of the US don't ever take any of that into account, thus demonstrating that acting like minorities totally don't matter isn't a regional thing after all. It never seems to occur to them they're advocating a policy that would, in the not even very long run, lead to genocide. Or if it does occur to them it doesn't bother them very much. (It also doesn't seem to occur to them they'd be creating a Christian Dominionist run territory right next door that would be a nuclear power. A bunch of dipshits that want nothing more than the endtimes having unrestricted access to nukes. Won't that be fun.)
And after ensuring multi-generational poverty among African Americans and Native Americans (Ok. Further poverty), you'd still have Michelle Bachmann in the Bluetopian Congress.
Phentex
(16,334 posts)LuvNewcastle
(16,846 posts)I'm disgusted with them myself. But no one should put down all the people in the region because of its politicians. There are a lot of good people down here. The biggest problem down here is ignorance, not stupidity. Ignorance can be fixed, and plenty of us fight the battle against ignorance every day, even in our own families. So can we limit South-bashing to teabagger politicians-bashing? It's really shitty for us southerners to have to come in here and deal with criticism from people who don't even know what they're talking about.
Thanks for the thread, NuclearDem.
sulphurdunn
(6,891 posts)the South is crazy, I might suggest a visit to the Idaho Panhandle.
treestar
(82,383 posts)and Teabaggers everywhere else.
The South is not going to secede - that whole idea is a joke.
There are a lot of red states there - the majority is conservative and thus sends insane people to Congress in larger numbers (Bachmann notwithstanding, the state itself may not have other Bachmann types).
There's nothing bashing about acknowledging that.
I actually think that the South making victim of itself and feeling sorry for itself is more obnoxious than the occasional "let them secede" thread (unrealistic and just venting). The white folks of the South are not the victims of much, whether they are liberals or progressives, tea partiers, or those in between.
librechik
(30,674 posts)somebody is going to point it out. It's not demonizing either, not when the problem is REAL.
Patiod
(11,816 posts)She reminds me that every time I hear a Southern voice on the radio or TV, it isn't necessarily spouting nonsense. It usually is, but not always.
(I should note that yesterday I endured my idea of hell, which is a 90 minute airline ride in front of a dopey woman who had a heavy Boston accent and was loudly trying to explain to another dopey Bostonian how to do Sudoku. For the entire ride. So even though Southern accents on TV tip me off that I'm likely to be hearing nonsense, Southern accents in real life are far preferable to some New Englander, New Yorker, Philadelphian, or Baltimorean bleating in my ear).
librechik
(30,674 posts)But i don't remember any of them shutting up about the flaws of their regions. Rather the opposite. And they made changes!
I'm sure it's annoying to live in the area which is largely responsible for our divisions. But telling others to stuff it is not helpful, unfortunately. How i wish I could get ted cruz to shut up. But let the fool talk. It is revealing.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)and many others for your region-bashing. EVERY state (what is yours?) has its problems, but it seems the South is everyone's place to feel holier-than-thou. And I will continue to "point it out."
librechik
(30,674 posts)stop shooting arrows at the messenger.
And I don't restrict myself to criticizing the south. I have criticisms for just about everything and everybody. But we are talking about the problem of the unrepentant South in this post.
And as far as being holier than thou, there are many who think the South has a corner on that one. (lots of corners, tho, aren't there? Ow.)
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)and you are not going to get it.
librechik
(30,674 posts)please tell Santa Claus for me--he's probably on your speed dial. And don't tell me what I asked for! I like surprises.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)It's the approval thing that you're not getting.
librechik
(30,674 posts)I'm sorry, I'll leave you alone now. I usually enjoy toying with the mentally unstable, but , gosh, Eleanor, i like you. Please forgive all my smartass remarks and have a good day! I'm sure you are a sweetheart.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)But I'll take your comment as sarcasm, though that is the lesser of the evils.
The point of the OP is the "peculiar institution" developing in DU where regionalism is seeking legitimacy, and for no constructive reason. We've all read the same books, and we know the deficiencies, so what is the Purpose of this singling out a region? To counter the far right's equivalent of sneering at NE libs? At San Francisco-types? Or just to bash outnumbered Southern liberals for not bailing water fast enough?
Other than throwing facts & figures about to "justify" a throw-down in the face of fellow DUers, I have Yet to see anything constructive or positive in this recurring righteous lecture.
I appreciate your equal-opportunity criticisms of everything that goes bump in the night, but we have to gain at least some support and trust from this area of the country. I'm sure you would agree.
I apologize for my ill-tempered remarks, and hope to sustain your respect and affection, even if it is through an ether of ions.
PassingFair
(22,434 posts)That's just CRAZY TALK:
ERA ratification map of the United States:
bvar22
(39,909 posts)Gravitycollapse
(8,155 posts)number of voters.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)Gravitycollapse
(8,155 posts)And I have a feeling that Duval County has a traditional Democrat. Although I could be wrong.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)AlinPA
(15,071 posts)is a teabagger and the State House and State Senate are both controlled by ignorant teabaggers. It's not just the South.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)Indeed its getting old. And, it doesn't fit what the Democratic Party needs to be talking about.
There's an Eliteness in the Dem Party which is growing that looks down on those who aren't CHOSEN... It's something that's going to hit us in the future.
BUBBA's are ALL OVER THE USA! And Mullets didn't just belong to the South when they were in fashion....they were in pockets (see "bvar22's Map" and read a little of Joe Bageant's books because what he describes exists all over America as the Poor Grow in Numbers and the Education only goes to the TOP 1% for Private Schools and being recognized because you went to Harvard, Yale, Princeton, MIT...or the other Top Universities.
For the rest of us "Down Tier University Graduates"....Our jobs went with NAFTA OVERSEAS during REAGAN AND DOWN.
ALL WAS OUTSOURCED...and the TPP and Other TRADE DEALS by Obama and the ELITES will grind us down so that we will learn how to be "Bubba's" at some point in the FUTURE if we don't stand up NOW and Force our DEMOCRATIC PARTY TO LISTEN TO ALL OF US! Not...MAKE FUN of the LESSER OF US!
ladyVet
(1,587 posts)There's three things you can count on getting bashed here: Southerners, fat people and women.
I'm a fat woman from North Carolina. I'm doomed, I guess.
Oddly enough, I'm more liberal than most people on this site, but hey, don't let that get in the way of putting me down.
Edited to add: How could I forget the poor? That's another segment of the population that gets little sympathy here.
So I'm a poor, fat woman from North Carolina.
Fuck. I really am doomed.
carolinayellowdog
(3,247 posts)I resisted that feeling, have been here since 2002, but in an otherwise happy life filled with pleasant interactions, DU is the one place that inevitably and daily fills me with despair. 2/3 of that has been the relentless centrist attacks on progressives, but when the progressives start relentlessly attacking fellow progressives over geography, it is long past time to go.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)etherealtruth
(22,165 posts)It is hotter than hell and there are bugs the size of kindergartners.
As for the rest ... my extremely northern state of Michigan has turned into inbred knuckle dragging right wing hell. I grew up in metro Detroit (again a very northern metro area) ... the Detroit area was historically one of the most segregated metropolitan areas in the country.
I dislike a great many southern politicians ... and I am sure those liberals in the south despise them as much or more than I do.
It's all about percentages
renie408
(9,854 posts)will continue to do so. It is so much easier to just lump everybody in together and ignore the fact that with demographic shifts and the degree of immigration to the South that things are constantly shifting here. I have friends who live in the mountains of Washington state whose neighbors would freak out even my most conservative Southern friends they are such whackadoodles. I have another friend who lives in the Redding, California area and I met more conservative rednecks there the week I visited than I see here in a month. But it doesn't matter than conservatives are everywhere. Some portion of the DU needs somebody to sneer at and the South is their target of choice.
Anecdotal, yes, but the most extreme case of racism I've personally known of occurred in NJ. A fellow AA LEO told me of an encounter he had there as a teen before his family moved back home to the south. He was stopped for speeding, frisked roadside and was dared to run, encouraged to run. He was told that because he was black he'd be shot in the back with no repercussions because the officer would swear my friend was resisting, evading. Despite such blatant, violent racism by NJ LE this man eventually became a LEO, a damned good one.
pstokely
(10,528 posts)blame them also
JonLP24
(29,322 posts)We deserve it