Why should we pay hundreds of dollars for airline travel

[malaise]

and then be told that we have to pay an additional $40 for every bag we use.
How the fugg do they expect us to travel without bags? This is capitalist exploitation on steroids.

[DURHAM D]

1. I just flew Southwest - no charge for first 2 bags.

otoh - Southwest does not go where I usually want/need to go.

[enlightenment]

2. They're thinking of changing that.

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304799404579155741368853418

[Initech]

4. I was on JetBlue yesterday. They don't charge either.

[countryjake]

11. I'm pretty sure Southwest doesn't fly in the Caribbean.

So it's of no use for malaise's trip, but yeah, I just flew home on Southwest and was pleased to find that they've now expanded which airports they go to, making my journey from one boonie to another much easier (along with that free baggage checking!).

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

3. The only airline that charges for carry-ons is Spirit.

Their basic ticket prices are low so they make up the difference with bag fees.

http://www.airfarewatchdog.com/blog/3801089/airline-fees-us-carriers-updated/

[malaise]

5. Two of us for five days

We'll have to check in at least two bags.

[wercal]

7. Some people fed-ex their bags to the hotel. No kidding.

[FarCenter]

8. I've done 5-day trips out of a carry-on

Hardly ever checked bags.

[LibDemAlways]

26. I went to France for a month with a

carry-on. I took only what I needed and washed clothes out in the sink. Always get a chuckle out of seeing people haul steamer-trunk like suitcases through airports. They can't decide what to take so they take everything.

[mercuryblues]

46. you would be surprised

what you can fit into a carryon. When the family went to Maine we all had 1 carryon. I checked 1 bag that held all the hair care products and soaps and shoes.

[DrDan]

22. nope - Allegiant charges 30 bucks for a carry-on

[SomethingFishy]

35. Frontier as well.. but they have different grades of ticket..

You can get an economy plus ticket that gives you free bags and carry ons.. Frontier also charges for soda now too.

Sorry folks. I'm with the airlines here. People have complained about the prices so much that they had to do something. I bought a round trip ticket from Nashville to Denver and back 2 weeks ago. Total cost of the ticket... $196.00 Insanely cheap. Less than $100 bucks each way. How do you expect an airline to pay for pilots, crew, fuel, ground crew, gate fees, gate crews, baggage handlers, not to mention maintenance, and the cost of planes with ticket prices that low?

You think it's bad on our end. Talk to airline workers who are stuck having to explain to customers all the new weird rules.

Flying sucks these days. Why? Because the middle class is no longer the middle class, they can't afford to fly. You want to fix the airlines? You'll have to start by paying a wage where people can afford to fly.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

39. Yup, I'm a retired airline employee

and those cheap fares - and yes, they are cheap compared to what they used to be - are possible at the expense, largely, of airline employees, whose work has been outsourced and unions busted. People whine about air fares, but you couldn't drive from Nashville to Denver and back for $196.00. There is a lot wrong with flying these days, but if you want it to be like the good old days you'd better be ready to pay accordingly. Back in the '60s and '70s, when the seats were comfortable, the food was good and you didn't have to get a colonoscopy to get through security, flying was relatively expensive (though not nearly as safe as it is now).

Why do you have to pay baggage fees now when you didn't have to back in those good old days? A couple of reasons: Extra weight costs money in fuel, and fuel is the biggest expense airlines have that they can't control. So those baggage fees tend to discourage people from packing everything they own for a 3-day trip. Also, people now shop online for airline tickets, and they buy according to the base fare without considering the extra fees, or the route. So if Cheapo-Air's web site says it charges only $100 to fly from, say, LAX to ORD, people will snap up that ticket before they realize that they will have to pay $50 per bag and they'll be stopping in DEN, OMA, and DSM.

[SheilaT]

42. Another former airline employee here.

Ticket counter agent at DCA for ten years. Back in my day, while the job was often quite stressful, it paid reasonably well and there was the free travel. It was quite easy to get on planes with a little planning to avoid the very busiest times. Nowadays most flights are completely full so I expect the airline employees don't take as much advantage of the travel.

I cannot imagine how difficult it must be to be an airline employee these days.

Plus, there used to be more service to smaller cities, thanks to the system of regional and trunk carriers.

Personally, I haven't flown in over six years mainly because I refuse to put up with the bullshit of the TSA and don't want to risk the ordeal of having my flight delayed or cancelled, no matter what the reason. I drive if I want to go somewhere. If I ever get a yearning to go overseas again, I think I'll take a boat.

[Redford]

37. Frontier charges for carry ons also. EOM

[HERVEPA]

6. Because it costs to fly planes, a lot less relatively than it used to.

Put he stuff in a carry on. If you need to check a bag, you're making the plane heavier, more fuel, and you pay for that.
Those that pack lighter don't need to pay for it.

[FarCenter]

9. Plus a lot of other costs associated with checked bags

Getting them from the counter to screening, security screening, sorting them out and getting them to the right plane, shifting them from one plane to another if checked through at a connection, unloading them and getting them to the pickup carousel.

But the costs really go up whenever a bag doesn't make a connection, goes to the wrong place, etc. Like many business processes, the all-goes-well transaction is fairly cheap and the not-all-goes-well transaction is very costly.

[malaise]

12. We've been checking bags for decades

We are not novice flyers. We always pack light but we like check in and it used to be part of the fare.

[HERVEPA]

18. Ok, so get rid of the charge and we'll all pay higer fares.

Pay for the services you use. This is not a necessity, like health insurance. So no need to spread the cost among all users.

[KurtNYC]

10. They keep coming up with more of these add-on "options"

4 inches of addt'l legroom $20

board before others $15

a "free" (?) drink on board $20

"preferred" seating $25

private plane $3500/hour

Running an airline is a tough business. AA used to be subsidized, not sure now. The rules regarding price fixing and collusion are different for airlines than for other industries. Use of air travel is down almost 30% since 2001:

http://www.transtats.bts.gov/fuel.asp

[malaise]

13. Well we travel as little as possible

Too much inconvenience

[FarCenter]

16. Business travelers used to subsidize leisure travel fares more

Airlines are have a harder time using "yield management" strategies to extract maximum revenue from business travelers.

Communications is becoming more competitive with travel as a way of doing business.

[LibDemAlways]

29. I called American to get a seat assignment and

was told the charge would be $25.00. Having worked as a travel agent at one time I am we'll aware that to lock in a seat assignment takes seconds. This is a huge rip-off. I told her I'd take my chances at the airport. The day is coming, however, when a credit card will be required to gain access to a plane's lavatory. No way will that cost center go unexploited forever.

[TroglodyteScholar]

34. The market is signalling...

...that we travelers are sick of paying for way more than we get out of the air travel experience.

I love to go places, but I will do my very best to avoid flying. The industry has refused to change with the times in the correct ways.

[raccoon]

14. ITA. Flew last summer on Delta and had to pay for bag coming and going. nt

[stevenleser]

15. Yes, this is annoying. In the transit business, weight = cost in fuel.

That is true whether the method of transit is plane, train, bus or car.

The theory is that you are costing the airline more in fuel than someone who doesn't check a bag.

[Ron Obvious]

17. They're nickle and diming us to death

Want a seat rather than being strapped to a wing? $110. Your bag weighs 1 gramme more than 23 Kg? $110 extra. And you don't get to talk to a human being at any point along the way, either. You can't argue with a computer. So humiliate yourself by unpacking your bags on the floor and trying to repack in such a way you have more in your carry-on and under 23 Kg in your checked luggage while everybody sees your unmentionables if you want to avoid the penalty.

And what's the point? Whether you're carrying it on or it's in your checked luggage, the exact same amount of weight is going on the plane so fuel-use isn't an argument.

It's the pointless humiliation that gets to me. Bloody Delta.

[SheilaT]

19. These women describe the problem perfectly:

[malaise]

28. Thanks for this

Delish

[PumpkinAle]

40. Never seen this group before

they are great - thanks for posting.

[oldhippie]

20. You shouldn't. Don't fly.

It's crowded enough already. Flying is no fun. Drive or take a train. Europe or Asia? There are boats.

[Blue_Tires]

21. Ironically, we as consumers brought this on ourselves...

[geek tragedy]

23. Because fliers shop based on ticket price not bag fees.

People will buy a $350 ticket with $100 in bag fees quicker than they'd buy a $400 ticket with no bag fees.

[FreeJoe]

36. I think that you are right

People use Expedia, Orbitz, etc to find flights and the cheapest flights show up first. Someone needs to make a flight search app that lets you put in all of your specifics (# of checked bags, # of carryon bags, meal expectations, legroom expectations, etc) and then have it return flights by total cost using that criteria.

I think that airlines are just responding to what consumers are asking for. Consumers, because of the way search apps work, are demanding the lowest possible fairs. Airlines have found that they can get a lower fair by unbundling services and charging for those separately.

Leg room is one of the most interesting ones. Virtually everyone complains about the lack of leg room in a plane, but more leg room means fewer passengers, so it is expensive for airlines to offer. When they do offer it as a premium price option, people complain about that as well.

[cbdo2007]

24. Would you rather they just roll it up and charge everyone an extra $27....

or that they have just the people with a bag pay for the extra space??

I would rather they just have the people with a bag pay for it rather than have the rest of us subsidize it for them.

[Gormy Cuss]

32. I'd rather they charge everyone the extra cost and have easier boarding and deplaning.

I'm also concerned that in the event of an emergency all of that baggage underfoot and dropping from overhead bins in the cabin may interfere with a swift evacuation.

[DesMoinesDem]

25. What's the difference if it's included in the ticket price or a seperate fee?

You'll end up paying the same amount. Some airlines add it into the price, some have a separate fee. Figure it out before you buy the tickets. For people that don't check any bags it makes flying less expensive. And there are a lot of people that don't need to check bags.

[virgogal]

27. These capitalists gave me the ability to fly from the East Coast to

Honolulu in about 13 hours. When I went in the 50s it took 24 hours.

I'll happily pay the extra fee for the speed of travel.

[LibDemAlways]

30. Just be thankful they aren't yet

charging you to use the lavatory onboard. Don't think they haven't thought about it.

[MicaelS]

31. Because Americans are cheap.

Not frugal, we're cheap. That's why people will buy a ticket that is $20 cheaper than another flight. Quality costs money. You get what you pay for. You won't get a Lexus at Kia prices.

Personally I'd like to go back to re-regulating the entire airline, bus, trucking and railroad industry. I'd rather everyone be served in all those podunk towns and cities that lost airline travel. Even if meant the cost of tickets tripled. Flying was never meant to be a cattle car experience. It was meant to be classy and luxurious. That costs money. If it's too much, then don't fly.

[joeglow3]

33. I think this is a good thing

Before, EVERYONE had to pay for all the "benefits." You wanted to travel? Well, you were paying for luggage, pillows, fully cooked meals, etc. You couldn't afford the ticket, but wanted to pay just for the transportation and none of the perks? Too fricking bad.

Today, you can pay the base price of just a flight, making it more affordable. If you want additional perks, you can pay for that.

And the last 6-7 times I traveled, I fit everything in a carry-on and paid no fee.

[FreeJoe]

38. You don't have to

You can find airlines that include baggage in the cost of the flight. You can sign up for programs that give you "free" bags. The simple fact is that it costs money to run an airline. Bags are a part of that cost. Most airlines appear to have concluded that people prefer lower fares with separate charges for bags rather than higher fares that include bags. I just look at the total cost and make my decision to fly or not based on that cost, not what line items make up the total bill.

[MineralMan]

41. Pack light and use carry-ons.

I can travel for a week with a carry-on.

[SheilaT]

43. If it weren't for the restrictions on liquids you can carry on board I could do the same.

I'm a woman. I have various lotions and creams for different purposes. Plus, when I used to wear contact lenses I had a couple of different lens solutions with me.

Like I'm going to figure out a way to combine mascara remover, shampoo, and wrinkle cream to blow up an airplane.

[MineralMan]

44. Yes, I understand.

Still, such products are readily available almost everywhere. I don't take liquids on the plane. I buy them at my destination in small quantities.

Now, if the cost of doing that was more than the cost of checking a bag, I'd probably check the bag. It's not, in my case.

My wife figured that out, too. She also has various lotions and creams, etc. She discovered that she could get by with quantities that were small enough to put in small bottles for her carry-on. In fact, she keeps a quart bag with those small quantities all ready to go.

Something to consider. 3 oz goes a long way for most such things.

[SheilaT]

48. I was under the distinct impression that there was a limit as to the actual number of bottles

of liquids you could carry on, like three.

I do decant things like my shampoo and cream rinse into the smaller bottles, as I buy them in the ginormous size to begin with. So that's two bottles. Then mascara remover, at least two face lotions as I have incredibly dry skin. And when I needed contact lens solution plus liquid tears, even in small bottles I seemed to be over the limit.

Anyway, not flying at all is far easier for me.

[MineralMan]

49. Nope. They just all have to fit into the 1-quart bag.

But, if your travel requires you to take lots and lots of stuff, then a checked bag is probably your best bet. Put those bottles in gallon zip-lock bags, though, to prevent spills.

Or, as you suggest you already do, don't travel by air. That's pretty limiting, though, and I couldn't do that.

I actually take no liquids at all. Everywhere I go has shampoo, and I can buy toothpaste anywhere. So, there it is.

[SheilaT]

50. For me, not flying does not feel

very limiting. I have already travelled lots and lots, mainly in my ten years as an airline employee. These days where I can get to by car suits me just fine. I just wish we had better train service in this country.

[Violet_Crumble]

45. None of the airlines I've flown on do that...

I've flown Qantas, British Airways, and Air New Zealand and they don't charge for carry-on baggage. They do charge when it comes to excess baggage, though, and that's fair enough, imo...

[brooklynite]

47. I'm sure you'd prefer flying in the "good old days" when fares were regulated...

and cost 5-10 times more?

The reason you're paying for your bag is that you and other customers respond as a market only to the lowest possible fare. Unlike hotels, restaurants etc, which have endless gradations in quality and cost, the airline industry is built around coach seats sold at the lowest possible cost and a handful of First Class/Business Class seats for the people who can afford them. Every airline which has tried a marginally better service for a marginally higher price has given up because customers don't respond to it. Very few legacy airlines do well financially, so if coach seats prices are forced down by competition, the airlines make up for it by eliminating freebies and adding fees for extras.

[pa28]

51. Air travel is actually a very good value.

The costs involved are astronomical and the fact you can take a trans-pacific round trip flight for $1500 or 2k never ceases to amaze me.

The airlines made a deliberate decision to charge fees for food, baggage and other extras in order to keep base fares low.

Of course the flip side of this is the fact flying is now a living nightmare. I think I'd rather pay more for a decent coach seat without the worry of extra fees.

[HereSince1628]

52. Why travel by air to get to Thanksgiving so you can damage old wounds

or to be forced into the role of the 12 year old you once were?


I find this aspect of American Life absolutely completely frickin irrational and wasteful of money.

[malaise]

53. We have lovely family reunions

and great fun with three generations.

[HereSince1628]

54. There are always exceptions. It's great that you can enjoy reunions

Last edited Mon Nov 18, 2013, 07:24 PM - Edit history (1)

but I wonder about the mental health of siblings, etc. who don't experience it as you do.