Carl Bernstein (of Watergate fame) writes open letter to Guardian editor, in support

[BelgianMadCow]

As we have learned following the recent disclosures initiated by Mr Snowden, intelligence agencies – especially the NSA in the United States – have assiduously tried to avoid and get around such oversight, been deliberately unforthcoming and oftentimes disingenuous with even the highest government authorities that are supposed to supervise their activities and prevent abuse.

That is the subject of the rightful and necessary public debate that is now taking place in the US, the UK and elsewhere.

Rather than hauling in journalists for questioning and trying to intimidate them, the Commons would do well to encourage and join that debate over how the vast electronic intelligence-gathering capabilities of the modern security-state can be employed in a manner that gives up little or nothing to real terrorists and real enemies and skilfully uses all our technological capabilities to protect us, while at the same time taking every possible measure to insure that these capabilities are not abused in a way that would abrogate the rights and privacy of law-abiding citizens.

There have always been tensions between such objectives in our democracies, especially in regard to the role of the press. But as we learned in the United States during our experience with the Pentagon Papers and Watergate, it is essential that no prior governmental restraints or intimidation be imposed on a truly free press; otherwise, in such darkness, we encourage the risk of our democracies falling prey to despotism and demagoguery and even criminality by our elected leaders and government officials.

With warmest regards and admiration,
Carl Bernstein

Entire piece is at The Guardian. The Guardian editor, Alan Rusbridger, has been hauled before parliament to testify. MPs have now called for the intelligence agencies to substantiate their claims he endangered national security.

A committee of MPs challenged the existing system of oversight for the security services by asking the head of MI5 to justify his claims that the Guardian has endangered national security by publishing leaks from the former NSA contractor Edward Snowden.

In an unprecedented step, Keith Vaz, the chairman of the home affairs select committee, announced that spy chief Andrew Parker had been summoned to give evidence in public to the Commons committee next week.

That Bernstein fellow sure has a long-winded way of saying Snowden is a hero.

[hootinholler]

1. This needs a kick n/t

[malaise]

2. Great letter

Adding link to my thread

[BelgianMadCow]

4. thanks, malaise

I didn't see your thread on Rusbridger before I posted, or I would have tacked on instead. Had in fact logged off for the night, saw the Bernstein piece, logged back on & driveby posted.

Now we look like us crazy lefties are spamming the board.

[WillyT]

3. HUGE K & R !!!

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

5. K&R

[Uncle Joe]

6. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, BelgianMadCow.

[antigop]

7. k&r nt

[DeSwiss]

8. ''..oftentimes disingenuous....''

- LIES! They're called LIES goddammit!!!


“But if thought corrupts language, language can also corrupt thought.” ~George Orwell

[BelgianMadCow]

9. Good catch. I just reread Orwell's 1984 (not an instruction manual)

and didn't remember that quote, so I went Ixquicking, and..

Orwell tried to promote the use of more precise language in political discourse, and he criticised political language popular at the time, such as "running-dog lackey" and "Fascist octopus", which he said prevented thought. It seems unlikely that Orwell would have approved of many of the uses to which his pseudonym is applied. The loose definition of the term and the often poor correlation between the real-life situations people describe as Orwellian and his own dystopian fiction leave the use of the adjective at best inexact and frequently politically inaccurate. In his essay "Politics and the English Language", Orwell derided the use of cliché and dying metaphors, which "even think your thoughts for you, to a certain extent" and went on to say "But if thought corrupts language, language can also corrupt thought."

You actually have a very good and broad point. If we would redo all the M$M, cleansing it of newspeak, we'd get very interesting news. I read a lengthy analysis of the use of the phrase "giving oxygen to the economy". Newspeak for giving more profits to big corps. Here, it's used all the time as synonym for tax breaks for corporations. Very useful. These days, we need to challenge every word.

[DeSwiss]

11. Stephen Fry recently made note of a similar phenomenon from our past:

- And thanks for your recognition of this so important point. As these days, few seem prepared or able to see it. And then they'll fall right into step using these bogus words and phrases without realizing the power they're giving away by surrendering to other's definition of the truth. Here are a few more examples:

Marijuana = Mexican, illegal, sex, death

Cannabis = Rope, clothes, health, energy, long-life, caancer-cures

Quantitative easing = Tax dollars given to investment bankers to cover their gambling bets

Collateral damage = Killing innocent babies and parents because, damns are not given

Trickle-down economics = Piss-on the 99%

[BelgianMadCow]

13. Had no idea about Stephen Fry, thanks.

That highlights the point very well.

I only knew Stephen Fry (besides the comedy stuff, and only tangentially) from this:

Given the state of the world today, and given that our identy forms ONLY as a result of the boundaries society gives us, is a reflection of it if you will, it's no wonder so many people get ill. 1 in 10 belgians is on antidepressants.

Maybe the ill ones really are the sane ones. Not all of them, but you get my point. Surely, remaining alert about abuse of language requires being weird in some way. You have to look past or ignore the constant onslaught of propaganda.

Whilst I'm linking docu's: here's the best I've seen on PR (of which such language misuse is an extreme case): The Century of The Self.

It has the following parts:
Happiness Machines. Part one documents the story of the relationship between Sigmund Freud and his American nephew, Edward Bernays who invented Public Relations in the 1920s, being the first person to take Freud's ideas to manipulate the masses.

The Engineering of Consent. Part two explores how those in power in post-war America used Freud's ideas about the unconscious mind to try and control the masses. Politicians and planners came to believe Freud's underlying premise that deep within all human beings were dangerous and irrational desires.

There is a Policeman Inside All of Our Heads, He Must Be Destroyed. In the 1960s, a radical group of psychotherapists challenged the influence of Freudian ideas, which lead to the creation of a new political movement that sought to create new people, free of the psychological conformity that had been implanted in people's minds by business and politics.

Eight People Sipping Wine In Kettering. This episode explains how politicians turned to the same techniques used by business in order to read and manipulate the inner desires of the masses. Both New Labor with Tony Blair and the Democrats led by Bill Clinton, used the focus group which had been invented by psychoanalysts in order to regain power.

[Enthusiast]

16. Excellent...........nt

[Enthusiast]

15. I will add that Orwell quote to my collection.

Yes, they are lies! Goddamned lies!

[ReRe]

10. K&R

His last paragraph in The Guardian LTE is the most important one:

"There have always been tensions between such objectives in our democracies, especially in regard to the role of the press. But as we learned in the United States during our experience with the Pentagon Papers and Watergate, it is essential that no prior governmental restraints or intimidation be imposed on a truly free press; otherwise, in such darkness, we encourage the risk of our democracies falling prey to despotism and demagoguery and even criminality by our elected leaders and government officials."

[friendly_iconoclast]

12. K&R

[BelgianMadCow]

14. UK investigators threaten Guardian editor with terrorism charges over Snowden’s leaks

UK officials claim that Snowden’s trove of data included information about British spies and that the information’s publication puts lives in direct danger. Rusbridger said his paper would not publish any such information and that Guardian editors have not even looked at some of the information Snowden provided regarding the Iraq war.

Lawmakers also threatened Rusbridger by implying Guardian staff had violated Section 58A of the Terrorism Act, which stipulates that it is against the law to publish or even transmit any information regarding members of the armed forces or intelligence employees.

“It isn’t only about what you’ve published, it’s about what you’ve communicated,” committee member Michael Ellis said. “That is what amounts, or can amount, to a criminal offense.”

Ellis later asked assistant commissioner Dick if investigators were also looking into possible infractions under Section 58A.

“Yes, we are indeed looking at that,” she said. “We need to establish whether they have or they haven’t.”

from RT.

[woo me with science]

17. K&R

[KoKo]

18. "Democracy Now" did an interview with him after he appeared before Parliament

being asked: "Are You a Patriot!"

It was her show tonight...but, I can't find the You Tube Link and "DN" is doing a fundraiser so I can't get the site up to do search. Anyway the clips she showed were shocking what he was put through. Cameron sounds like he's following the Tony Blair script with what he's pushing through in GB. "New Boss...Same as Old Boss." Although there was an "interim" PM...it does seem continuous.

[DirkGently]

19. KNR

[DrDebug]

20. kick it n/t