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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsI Passed for White and Straight, Even Though I'm Not -- How Looks Hide My Identity
http://www.alternet.org/i-passed-white-and-straight-even-though-im-not-how-looks-hide-my-identityI first became aware of my passing as a young child confronted with standardized testing. My second grade teacher had walked us through where to write our names in capital letters and what bubbles to fill in for our sex, our birth date and ethnicity. But in the days before biracial or multiracial or choose two or more of the following, I was confronted with rigid boxes of white or black a space that my white father and black-Italian mother had navigated for some time.
But even at 8 years old, I knew I could mark white on the form without a teachers assistant telling me to do the form over with my No. 2 pencil. I could sometimes be exotic on the playground to the grown-ups who watched us for skinned knees and bad words. But with hair that had yet to curl and a white-sounding last name, I was at first glance and many after a dark-haired white girl with a white father who collected her after school.
That girl came with me to junior high and even high school. Even as my hair became wiry with puberty, the frizziness soon a universal topic in the girls bathroom as girls began their marriages to the straight iron, I became aware that I read no differently. Another curly-haired white girl who wished that her hair was straight.
School records could be curiously inconsistent, occasionally marking me as white and sometimes other, my recorded ethnicity changing year to year as I would pass and then suddenly not.
madokie
(51,076 posts)when there is no reference made to ethnicity at all. We're all human
MyNameGoesHere
(7,638 posts)I was very comforted that the current trends on applications contain "I choose not to self identify" on race questions. In the past this was only sporadically a check-box, now it seems the norm. It give me a little hope that people are finally realizing race isn't a indicator of qualifications. Of course that isn't the same as changing personal racial bias in the interview room, but I am hoping more people are at least getting in the door.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)the vast majority of those opting out of that question are racial/ethnic minorities, as most white folks understand that the checking "white/Caucasian" box, is not a negative.
gollygee
(22,336 posts)Can employers even ask that question when someone is applying for a job?
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)and most store the information apart from the application, so (and in the hope) that the decision-making does not have access to the information.
MyNameGoesHere
(7,638 posts)So most white folks can do as they wish, I choose to be anonymous until it isn't
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)I guess that's a benefit of NOT having to constantly think about how our actions set up avoidable obstacles.
MyNameGoesHere
(7,638 posts)Same reason I choose to not identify as a veteran. It's not who I am.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)on both counts.
But I won't debate this further.
rucky
(35,211 posts)It could also improve the chances of getting an interview for companies under EEOC scrutiny, or just knowing there needs to be more diversity in their culture.
Excellent post.
DamnYankeeInHouston
(1,365 posts)to the question, "What race are you?" is "Human."
JustAnotherGen
(32,011 posts)I'm forty- bi-racial - and had blonde hair as a kid . . . that fair. Like many bi-racial kids- we get a bit darker and curlier as we get older.
There are very concrete experiences that only a woman with my 'family dynamic' can HAVE experienced.
This woman's experience was probably very much like my paternal grandmother's experience - but she went out and found the darkest black man she could find to marry in 22. Her reasoning to do that was because of how she experienced the world in the deep South as a child in the turn of the last century.
My experiences born abroad, spending my formative years in the military culture in a foreign land - and my 'culture shock' even coming back to the North East in the late 1970's as a 4 (almost five) year old - are imprinted in me.
Yes - in an ideal world - it SHOULD be Human Race.
But in America - I don't have that luxury. I simply don't. And it's not my fault - or the fault of any minority Americans. The Dominant Culture must ALL change - and then we can. Until then - we can't have our voices or experiences down played. Because our voices speaking up and out - well that's what will make the dominant culture stand up and take notice of the 'card' they placed in the deck.
alfredo
(60,078 posts)When they become the minority.
JustAnotherGen
(32,011 posts)You know?
It's like the person who says: You better not cheat me!
The person who is fearful . . . does what they accuse or anticipate others of doing.
alfredo
(60,078 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)"One accuses another (without supporting facts) of what they can conceive themselves of doing."
Frustratedlady
(16,254 posts)against blacks. I thought she gave an excellent answer.
"You know, I have many students per day, but I would have to stop and think which ones are black. Why do you ask?"
NM_Birder
(1,591 posts)JustAnotherGen
(32,011 posts)I don't know that the black American community is going to give that up. I still donate every year. SPLC, UNCF, and NACCP. . . every single year.
NM_Birder
(1,591 posts)Just like poling data like X% of blacks think.....X% of whites think and X% of Hispanics think.......needs to stop.
The Black Caucus, the NAACP, Hispano Chamber of Commerce and so on........all help to keep the notion of "inequality" alive and well.
JustAnotherGen
(32,011 posts)Because you stated this -
As a minority (I'm assuming you are one of us) - do you TRULY believe that we (minorities) put those race cards in the deck?
The we are the Powers That Be ANNNND we are the Dominant Cultural force that is most visible and prevalent in America?
NM_Birder
(1,591 posts)Are you asking me to tell you what race I am, and if so what difference does it make ? One parent born in Clayton New Mexico, one parent born in New Iberia Louisiana could be anything huh?. Race will always be a factor, so long as race matters to some people.
Your last sentence hurt my head trying to read it, you were too anxious to put one race above others, .....point proven.
All those silly white people got no culture ? -or- what exactly did you try to say ? When "the white race" is longer the majority population, what do you want to be labeled as ?
JustAnotherGen
(32,011 posts)My race is well - all over the place.
But I know when dealing with certain people in the dominant culture in America - they want to peg me into a specific one. They have no idea what my mother looks like. They have no idea what my husband looks like. And it wouldn't matter anyways to them - because well - they did the pegging.
That said - I've experienced America in a very specific way which well - colors my world view.
Re Last sentence - It's something my mother has impressed on us (a 67 year old caucasian woman) - and well - it's true.
The Dominant Culture in America is that of white descendents of Europeans. Their ancestors (mine TOO ) put the race card in the deck by policy, beliefs, and behavior. Those policies, beliefs, and behaviors are still in existence today - the minority populations merely react to it. Everyone teaches (I hope) their children to be respectful - yet cautious of the authorities. However, I'm certain my nephews had a stern talking to by their father, my father, their mother, grandmother, etc. etc. about how they specifically must interact with the police.
It's not their fault (my nephews). They didn't do it. They didn't make that police man/woman believe what that police man/woman believes. But they must adjust to that reality in order to survive that person working on behalf of the dominant culture's belief system. Yes I wrote, "survive".
That's just one example - but it's one of many. I certainly hope at DU I don't need to give a full dissertation on the state of race in America. I shouldn't have to that at this site.
NM_Birder
(1,591 posts)no ...no you shouldn't write one. I got asked, so ....."which one of us are you"
JustAnotherGen
(32,011 posts)And here is my precise c/p statement -
The we are the Powers That Be ANNNND we are the Dominant Cultural force that is most visible and prevalent in America?
I never said which one of us are you.
I'm mixed raced - direct product of a black/white marriage that was till death do us part. . . I'm currently married to a man off the plane from Italy.
Perhaps I interpreted what you wrote upthread wong - I'm always interested when I hear/read - Actually it was black folks and their organizations that created the system.
It's such a 180 from what many black Americans have experienced - I.E. I'm personally shocked when I find out I have had that much power and was responsible for the formation of black organizations, HBC's, etc. etc. I mean - I haven't even been on this earth for 40 years - so it alway shocks me when I find out I'm responsible. I didn't know I put the race card in the deck.
That's all.
But I thank you for educating me on that.
M0rpheus
(885 posts)Currently, there's no upside to eliminating such groups past making the majority comfortable.
Once being a person of color is no longer stigmatized/considered a determining factor of "failure", then maybe the NAACP can consider it's mission accomplished and fold.
There may come a day when organizations formed as a reaction to inequality are no longer needed, but it ain't today.
NM_Birder
(1,591 posts)Minority status requires assistance in todays America is bullshit, and I hate that, "A person of color" is it too much to just be called "a person".
Let me ask you the same question I asked above. When "the white race" is no longer the majority population, what will everyone else be ?
"Black, and formerly a minority" "Hispanic, formerly known as a minority" ?
You are assuming I'm white aren't you ? be honest.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)"Minority status" will require assistance so long as folks think that the idea of racism in today's America is bullsh!t.
"Black, and formerly a minority" "Hispanic, formerly known as a minority" ?
You didn't direct the question to me; but I will hazard an answer ...
I will ALWAYS be a Black man, proud of my unique heritage.
M0rpheus
(885 posts)Mostly because I don't really care that much, and the internet has taught me that anyone can be behind that keyboard. My answer is the same regardless of your ethnicity.
I've chosen to take people at face value, rather than make assumptions, pending further evidence. As a result, I've made some really good friends/contacts but, I've also been burned badly.
I'd love to just be "A Person". To myself, I am just that. Outside of my self-perception, it's considerably different in the real world. The onus is not on me to change how people perceive me, when I do nothing to engender a negative response past existing. It's not my assumptions that are the problem.
The groups are not the problem. They weren't 50 years ago and, they aren't today. The inequality those groups result from is still the problem. When you count all the intersections from there, it's an even bigger one. Would you argue that groups that serve LGBT, or women also be eliminated as obsolete?
Should it come to pass that I'm no longer a minority, then I'll be me (as I always am, to myself). If asked, I'll still Identify as a black man as, that is a part of who I am.
I don't long for a world of varying shades of beige. Homogeneity, is not the answer.
I long for a world where my particular shade of brown provides me with no assumptions on my intelligence, responsibility or, criminality.
When that occurs, I'll call up GWB and ask if he's still using that "Mission Accomplished" sign.
Number23
(24,544 posts)Oh my God, do I long for the same.
gollygee
(22,336 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)when we get rid of the Black Caucus, the NAACP, Hispano Chamber of Commerce and so on........ racism will go away. Right?
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)that is a real .... duh
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)You just want to do away with organizations fighting for civil rights and minorities. No mention of the NRA who are fighting against minorities every day. Plenty of other organizations you could have mentioned.
marmar
(77,114 posts)Heidi
(58,237 posts)gollygee
(22,336 posts)What are your thoughts on the NAACP?
NM_Birder
(1,591 posts)Response to NM_Birder (Reply #15)
HangOnKids This message was self-deleted by its author.
JustAnotherGen
(32,011 posts)Very interesting take on who put the race card in the American deck . . .
nomorenomore08
(13,324 posts)Glassunion
(10,201 posts)LWolf
(46,179 posts)I'm white. To "keep it or kill it" has to be up to the people of color the NAACP represents, and whether or not they still feel the need for that representation.
hfojvt
(37,573 posts)Apparently my name and address were put on a list. So I was invited by mail to join the NAACP. Since I had recently been beaten out for a job by two black people, both of whom seemed less qualified than I was, it seemed from where I sat that colored people were advancing just fine already.
Maybe it was time for people to advance because of the content of their character instead of the color of their skin. So I declined.
Also got many solicitations for the SPLC. Almost donated to get a biography of Morris Dees, but other online research made me wonder if that organization was a scam. Hard to know what to believe on the internet, but he was reported to be worth $2.9 million in 1979 http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1817&dat=19790926&id=7kggAAAAIBAJ&sjid=2p4EAAAAIBAJ&pg=6786,5749028
and he gets a salary of over $200,000 a year.
So really did he need a piece of my $13,000 annual income?
JustAnotherGen
(32,011 posts)Uh -
Sorry - just not used to reading or hearing it unless it's from an uneducated person over the age of 80.
I always thought it was funny (thinking back to reruns of all in the family - A.B. used it) -
Like what? My mother has no color? Is that why she's out there baking with baby oil? But my father does - so he wears a hat?
It's not easy being mixed race!
xchrom
(108,903 posts)JustAnotherGen
(32,011 posts)hfojvt
(37,573 posts)but isn't that what the CP stands for in NAACP?
JustAnotherGen
(32,011 posts)We have a history you and me. . . so I'll leave it at that. My best wishes on your journey through this world.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)Fred had been robbed and a Black cop and white cop were sent to check out the scene.
The white cop asked Fred: "Was the perp colored?"
And Fred answered, "Yeah ... white."
hfojvt
(37,573 posts)or was that the episode where he pretended to be robbed because he had broken his son's collectibles while cleaning them? Because I vaguely remember a re-run I saw a few months ago.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)I just remembered the joke line.
JustAnotherGen
(32,011 posts)Off topic - if you've never seen The Chappelle show - try and catch it in old reruns on the Comedy channel. Paul Mooney - friends with and a writer for Richard Pryor appears on and wrote for Chappelle - he also wrote for Sandford and Son. He had a book come out two years ago - "Black Is The New White" - if I recall correctly - he wrote that episode/line.
ONLY Mooney could make that observation! Same man that said he never "knew" racism (he's in his early 70's now to put a time reference on it) until his family left Louisiana when he was a kid - and moved to Southern California in the 1950's. And he is scathing to Liberal thought and so-called bastions in that book. Just scathing - yet accurate.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)your getting picked over had little, if anything, to do with your competition being Black. But I wonder ... what are your thoughts when you lose out to a couple of, seemingly, lesser qualified white male candidates?
See the stinkin' in your thinkin'?
Here let me spell it out for you ... seemingly lesser qualified Black candidate picked = race-based decision; seemingly lesser qualified white male candidate picked = Crickets? ... a bad break? ... just the general unfairness of life? ... maybe, they had something about them you seemingly could not/did not see?
... And please don't tell me you have never lost a job opportunity to a seemingly lesser qualified white male!
hfojvt
(37,573 posts)I don't believe it was. 1) both of those guys looked good on paper, ten years experience and such 2) both of them were clearly bigger and stronger than me.
It was only when I worked side by side with them, that they seemed far less qualified.
The point was, whether the decision was race based or not (and I am conceding that it was not) those black men WERE advancing while I, myself, remained stuck working a part-time job.
But yes, this did represent a fairly unique event in my work life, where I got to see and work with the person who got the job instead of me. Now, I could point to the Kraft plant where I worked many years as a temp while a couple other white guys got hired (and fired), but a) it was not nearly so direct. Kraft would generally hire five or six at a time, so was there really ONE who beat me out? and b) other than Dennis, I did not really work directly with any of the others, and even Dennis was working in other areas that I was not.
Starry Messenger
(32,342 posts)hfojvt
(37,573 posts)"If I had friends, you could ask them." - Splash
Glassunion
(10,201 posts)- I'm glad you included your "I'm not racist resume"
- But then you make a comment that could be taken as racist. But thankfully you supplied your credentials.
So, two black men "seemed" less qualified than you. How exactly did you measure their qualifications? Funny thing about jobs, is that they are not all just about qualifications. As a person going through the hiring process right now, I think of many things when choosing a candidate. Only one of which is their qualifications. The rest range from, how well do I get along with them in the interview, are they taking me seriously, what is their job history, how well would they get along with the other folks on my team, etc... I've recently turned down an experienced, skilled person because of their attitude and how we interacted during the interview. I'm considering another candidate, who does have less experience and skills, however, due to their willingness to learn, and how I feel that this individual would be a positive addition to my team, I am considering them for the position. I can teach you skills, I can send you to school, I can help you get experience, I can't fix your personality.
hfojvt
(37,573 posts)thank you very much.
I judged their qualifications by working beside them. Then too, there was the fact that both of them eventually got fired and I finally got the job.
I was already on the job as a part-timer, trying for a full time job.
I did finally realize though that my supervisor always went to war against whoever had that full time job. He saw them as a threat.
What a team.
Glassunion
(10,201 posts)skills, or race of the other two, and yourself. But more of an issue with the hiring supervisor?
I have worked for similar managers that went to "war" with their direct reports. The dude would seemingly hire folks that he would have the easiest time intimidating and controlling.
hfojvt
(37,573 posts)but I never said the hiring was based on race. My point was that black men were already advancing while I was being left behind, so I had no interest in helping to support a National Association for the Advancement of Colored People.
That's kind of the trouble when you live in a society that does not have enough good jobs, enough full time jobs for everybody. When some people advance that means other people get left behind.
gollygee
(22,336 posts)And that leads you to believe that as a whole, African American are doing better than white people and no longer need the NAACP?
It almost sounds like you wouldn't believe race didn't play a part unless no people of color at all got hired before you. That the only way it could be race neutral is if you got hired first.
hfojvt
(37,573 posts)and I didn't say that race played a part. I have specifically said several times that it did not.
My point was that here I was a 41 year old white guy with two college degrees working as a part-time janitor and apparently unable to even advance to the awesome status of full time janitor.
So why should I help colored people to advance when I, myself, am stuck at the bottom?
It was at that point though, while sweeping the gym and raging about my life, that I decided to give up. To admit that it was over. I was never going to get a good job. I was never going to get married or have a family. I had gone up to the plate and taken my swings, but that was that. Mighty Casey had struck out.
Well, at least I went down swinging.
Number23
(24,544 posts)I was terrified that you were going to say that you accepted. But I should have known better, right?
hfojvt
(37,573 posts)But I am not sure if "join" was the right word. It was perhaps more a matter of "send them some money".
haele
(12,692 posts)have a reason to bring up that question.
We are currently in the phase where race and prejudice is being discussed and recognized, not that "the problem is fixed". Just because there are more "black people" in power, or who have made a lot of money, does not mean that the promise land has been reached.
There are also more blacks in prison, and blacks are being profiled, stopped, frisked, and suspected in greater numbers than previously - just as they are beginning to step out into the greater public instead of being relegated to red-lined neighborhoods and segregated out of sunset towns and do not have the same perception of social worth that those who have lived within the existing society of those communities receive on a daily basis. The newcomer is "the other", the red-headed stepchild, the bumpkin who is a leach diminishing local resources because they have "a different culture they don't want to change to fit in", or "their families haven't paid their dues like the generations living there before them" or some other such nonsense. While under the law, race relations have gotten better -but socially in some areas, it is getting worse as some people who already have privilege are afraid of losing their own status or money if they are forced "to share".
The classic race problem is still opportunity for advancement or positions. Nobody wants to think they didn't have enough skills and "lost" in a competition for a job or a school slot where there are a large number of applicants, including minority representatives, competing for the same position. So if the minority gets the work, it's assumed that it's gotta be because of "race" or "quotas" - "you're just as (or maybe more) qualified as that other guy, but they got picked because they looked different than you" - instead accepting that it was a weighed business or educational decision that always has a lot of other factors involved than just race or quotas.
In my experience, unless it's a completely blind hire or advancement, when someone in a "majority" racial or gender class is "passed over" for a position and a minority gets the job, that person rarely ever questions their own status or capabilities - or the organization that made the final decision - because the minority sticks out like a sore thumb, no matter how qualified they are. It's gotta be the race (or gender, or religion), because that's the "only difference".
There is still a great prejudice - a pre-judging - based on race, color, and class, both within American society and within the black community itself, as the black middle class is disappearing at a greater rate than the white middle class. The pendulums of reaction and backlash need to be addressed and mitigated before you can say "NAACP - keep it or kill it?"
The NAACP will either evolve or disappear naturally as the issues of race equality, opportunity, and accessibility evolve themselves.
Haele
JustAnotherGen
(32,011 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)pnwmom
(109,023 posts)Since there wasn't a box for "multi racial," it would seem to make sense that you checked "white."
What I never understood was the idea that a "drop of black blood" magically turned a person black.
nomorenomore08
(13,324 posts)kelliekat44
(7,759 posts)It breaks some people's heart when they find out I am not Hispanic, Asian, or even Philippine.
I see how differently other members of my family are treated when we are out together.