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cali

(114,904 posts)
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 03:41 PM Feb 2014

Parts of this country are being made uninhabitable by Fracking, and it's getting worse

Worst threat to our environments by far.

Fracking Boom Leaves Texans Under a Toxic Cloud

This story was produced by InsideClimate News in collaboration with the Center for Public Integrity and The Weather Channel.

<snip>

Today, however, the ranch-style house she shares with her 66-year-old husband, Shelby, is at the epicenter of one of the nation's biggest and least-publicized oil and gas booms. With more than 50 wells drilled within 2.5 miles of their home, the days when the Buehrings could sit on the deck that Shelby built and lull away an afternoon are long gone. The fumes won't let them

Known as the Eagle Ford Shale play, this 400-mile-long, 50-mile-wide bacchanal of oil and gas extraction stretches from Leon County, Texas, in the northeast to the Mexico border in the southwest.

Since 2008, more than 7,000 oil and gas wells have been sunk into the brittle, sedimentary rock. Another 5,500 have been approved by state regulators, making the Eagle Ford one of the most active drilling sites in America.

<snip>

In addition to the wells near their home, there are at least nine oil and gas production facilities. Little is known about six of the facilities, because they don't have to file their emissions data with the state. Air permits for the remaining three sites show they house 25 compressor engines, 10 heater treaters, 6 flares, 4 glycol dehydrators and 65 storage tanks for oil, wastewater and condensate. Combined, those sites have the state's permission to release 189 tons of volatile organic compounds, a class of toxic chemicals that includes benzene and formaldehyde, into the air each year. That's about 12 percent more than Valero's Houston Oil Refinery disgorged in 2012.

<snip>

The regulation of oil and gas extraction falls primarily to the states, whose rules vary dramatically. States are also responsible for enforcing the federal Clean Air Act, an arrangement that is problematic in Texas, which has sued the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency 18 times in the last decade.


<snip>

For the past eight months, the Center for Public Integrity, InsideClimate News and The Weather Channel have examined what Texas, the nation's biggest oil producer, has done to protect people in the Eagle Ford from the industry's pollutants. What's happening in the Eagle Ford is important not only for Texas, but also for Pennsylvania, Colorado, North Dakota and other states where horizontal drilling and high-volume hydraulic fracturing, or fracking, have made it profitable to extract oil and gas from deeply buried shale.

<snip>

Texas' air monitoring system is so flawed that the state knows almost nothing about the extent of the pollution in the Eagle Ford. Only five permanent air monitors are installed in the 20,000-square-mile region, and all are at the fringes of the shale play, far from the heavy drilling areas where emissions are highest.

<snip>

More horrifying facts at link:

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-02-20/fracking-boom-leaves-texans-under-a-toxic-cloud.

President Obama strongly supports fracking and expanding fracking- including on public lands.






82 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Parts of this country are being made uninhabitable by Fracking, and it's getting worse (Original Post) cali Feb 2014 OP
If this is legal Politicalboi Feb 2014 #1
kick. who gives a shit? It'll mostly harm and kill poor people cali Feb 2014 #2
eventually it will affect every1 questionseverything Feb 2014 #17
More cali Feb 2014 #3
but heck, syrup spills and gossip are so much more compelling to DUers cali Feb 2014 #4
I'm right next door to all the fracking monsters. Rex Feb 2014 #5
The information in the posted article is horrifying! Texas cali Feb 2014 #7
Actually many of us do truedelphi Feb 2014 #8
I know. And I appreciate your post cali Feb 2014 #10
I'm watching local farmers sell their water to these fracking monsters. Rex Feb 2014 #12
Fracking operations require large amounts of water Harmony Blue Feb 2014 #13
CA already has LOTS of fracking. This, just in, is encouraging though: cali Feb 2014 #16
That is indeed an encouraging thought. But local city council members have truedelphi Feb 2014 #36
yes, those are big concerns cali Feb 2014 #42
CA doesn't have a lot of fracking like Texas Harmony Blue Feb 2014 #77
K&R...n/t BronxBoy Feb 2014 #6
Shanghai air quality. Coming to an area near you. nt Earth_First Feb 2014 #9
Interesting. ProSense Feb 2014 #11
Fracking is, imo, the biggest environmental threat cali Feb 2014 #14
So ProSense Feb 2014 #18
that diesel law is like a throwing a a drop of water on an inferno cali Feb 2014 #19
Again, ProSense Feb 2014 #20
about that diesel regulation that you hang on to so desperately: cali Feb 2014 #39
Apparently you are not here to discuss fracking. Just here to make insinuations about the rhett o rick Feb 2014 #21
Did I respond to a comment detailing the poster's opinion of Obama on the issue? ProSense Feb 2014 #24
I want the President to issue an executive order to halt all fracking until it can rhett o rick Feb 2014 #27
I want the President ProSense Feb 2014 #30
Wonderful. But why are you compelled to defend his inaction? And plez rhett o rick Feb 2014 #33
LOL! "spare me the links" ProSense Feb 2014 #35
the more agitated and desperate you get, the more you use that smilie. cali Feb 2014 #43
That's friggin hilarious ProSense Feb 2014 #45
squirm, pro, squirm. As President Obama is the most powerful person cali Feb 2014 #50
"As President Obama is the most powerful person" ProSense Feb 2014 #53
Because TX is a foreign nation! Not really a state! cali Feb 2014 #56
It's common knowledge, ProSense ReRe Feb 2014 #25
Well, there ProSense Feb 2014 #26
This message was self-deleted by its author rhett o rick Feb 2014 #31
? Again, a non-answer ReRe Feb 2014 #40
There is no much we can do but try to let the public Harmony Blue Feb 2014 #15
OIL kwolf68 Feb 2014 #22
k&r thanks for posting. nm rhett o rick Feb 2014 #23
Pffft. You vastly underestimate the places people will inhabit! jeff47 Feb 2014 #28
kick G_j Feb 2014 #29
As long as you paint the pipes and equipment blue, it a good kind of uninhabitable. Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #32
Makes me glad I live in a state with so few natural resources to be exploited cali Feb 2014 #44
"The business of a natural gas pipeline in Vermont" ProSense Feb 2014 #57
Are you actually going to dispute that Vermont has few natural resources cali Feb 2014 #59
No. Do you "dispute" that Vermont depends of fracked oil? n/t ProSense Feb 2014 #60
More good reads: ProSense Feb 2014 #63
Just you wait... Egalitarian Thug Feb 2014 #74
404 error B2G Feb 2014 #34
Public Integrity link Agony Feb 2014 #72
I don't know much about the situation in Texas, but sadoldgirl Feb 2014 #37
sacrifice zones magical thyme Feb 2014 #38
We need more regs. toby jo Feb 2014 #41
actually, there is increasing evidence that it might not be much better cali Feb 2014 #46
LOL! ProSense Feb 2014 #48
could you squrim any harder? Nope. Could you appear any more desperate? cali Feb 2014 #52
LOL! ProSense Feb 2014 #55
Are you really sure about the coal? sadoldgirl Feb 2014 #49
there have been recent articles and studies that cali Feb 2014 #54
Methane is much heavier than CO2, sadoldgirl Feb 2014 #64
No, what makes methane worse is it retains heat better. jeff47 Feb 2014 #76
Come On Now, the five air monitors sprinkled along the perimeter of bkanderson76 Feb 2014 #47
YEP. Texas standards. Rex Feb 2014 #51
K & R historylovr Feb 2014 #58
Just how do they have over 50 wells within 2 1/2 miles of their house doc03 Feb 2014 #61
that you have seen little harm from fracking doesn't counter cali Feb 2014 #65
We would rather send our coal to China that apparently has no environmental doc03 Feb 2014 #66
You have accurately described the problem pscot Feb 2014 #82
How do they drill over 50 wells within 2 1/2 miles of their house? n/t doc03 Feb 2014 #67
They are putting up to ten wells on one pad here Champion Jack Feb 2014 #71
Don't understand ten wells one pad. You mean they are drilling horizontally doc03 Feb 2014 #73
Basic hydrology is how. appal_jack Feb 2014 #78
K&R marions ghost Feb 2014 #62
Thanks, Cali. Let's hold his feet to the fire Pretzel_Warrior Feb 2014 #68
So True! Thanks for the Post...K&R! KoKo Feb 2014 #69
strong rec to this frwrfpos Feb 2014 #70
After we ruin out planet and kill all life...can it ever come back with time? Auntie Bush Feb 2014 #75
K&R.... daleanime Feb 2014 #79
Vote Republican, lose your air, land, and water. Genius. aquart Feb 2014 #80
Boycott Texas - they are killing everyone! dbackjon Feb 2014 #81
 

Politicalboi

(15,189 posts)
1. If this is legal
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 03:46 PM
Feb 2014

Meth labs should be legal too. Both could blow up and cause damage, but only the meth head would go to jail.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
2. kick. who gives a shit? It'll mostly harm and kill poor people
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:03 PM
Feb 2014

On April 10, 2012, a family in Atascosa County reported an odor "so bad that their lungs feel as if they will burst."

"Help us residents of South Texas before we all die," a Gonzales County resident pleaded the same day. The complaint alleged that an operator had dug a hole in the ground and buried "oily drilling waste…sometimes with diesel fuel, chemicals and oil floating on it."


http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-02-20/fracking-boom-leaves-texans-under-a-toxic-cloud.html

questionseverything

(9,654 posts)
17. eventually it will affect every1
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:55 PM
Feb 2014

every1 is downstream from somebody

besides the terror of having deadly chemicals injected in the groundwater I have seen devastating pics of northern Wisconsin (where they are stripping the land to mine the sand used in fracking)

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
3. More
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:09 PM
Feb 2014

Texas’ toxic air: Major investigation reveals how unregulated pollution from fracking is making people sick

<snip>

A damning investigation released Tuesday by the Weather Channel, the Center for Public Integrity and InsideClimate News describes an oil-happy culture where those against drilling are seen as being against Texas itself, and where those seeing the devastating health effects of pollution are left to their own devices as politicians rush to defend the industry. In case you just want to know how outraged you should be, the team was kind enough to summarize their major findings


Texas’ air monitoring system is so flawed that the state knows almost nothing about the extent of the pollution in the Eagle Ford. Only five permanent air monitors are installed in the 20,000-square-mile region, and all are at the fringes of the shale play, far from the heavy drilling areas where emissions are highest.


Thousands of oil and gas facilities, including six of the nine production sites near the Buehrings’ house, are allowed to self-audit their emissions without reporting them to the state. The Texas Commission on Environmental Quality (TCEQ), which regulates most air emissions, doesn’t even know some of these facilities exist. An internal agency document acknowledges that the rule allowing this practice “[c]annot be proven to be protective.”


Companies that break the law are rarely fined. Of the 284 oil and gas industry-related complaints filed with the TCEQ by Eagle Ford residents between Jan. 1, 2010, and Nov. 19, 2013, only two resulted in fines despite 164 documented violations. The largest was just $14,250. (Pending enforcement actions could lead to six more fines.)


<snip>

http://www.salon.com/2014/02/18/texas_toxic_air_major_investigation_reveals_how_unregulated_pollution_from_fracking_is_making_people_sick/












 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
5. I'm right next door to all the fracking monsters.
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:16 PM
Feb 2014

And you are so correct, nobody cares until an untold number of us die from fracking exposure...meh, probably that won't even get any media attention. This is Texas and we love us some oil!

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
7. The information in the posted article is horrifying! Texas
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:20 PM
Feb 2014

is so fucked up. Sorry, but I'm just shocked by this shit.

truedelphi

(32,324 posts)
8. Actually many of us do
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:30 PM
Feb 2014

Care. The plight of small towns in Texas has been turning my stomach into an acid waste heap for some time now.

And the fracking monsters are about to descend on Californians, this summer.

Since the on going drought is going to decimate small farmers, they will be more open to accepting good hard cash offers from Big Energy, that will enable them to keep their farms going.

The fact that five or ten years from now, their farms will become a toxic nightmare once fracking is unleashed, that won't be as important as staving off foreclosure that is more immediate.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
10. I know. And I appreciate your post
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:32 PM
Feb 2014

I'm sorry that GD has become so much more of gossip/shock of the day forum than a forum where difficult, complex issues are discussed.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
12. I'm watching local farmers sell their water to these fracking monsters.
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:33 PM
Feb 2014

Giving away their children's future for an easy buck.

Harmony Blue

(3,978 posts)
13. Fracking operations require large amounts of water
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:38 PM
Feb 2014

it is highly unlikely they will be able to set up in California even if the small farmers want to cut a deal with the Frackers.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
16. CA already has LOTS of fracking. This, just in, is encouraging though:
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:44 PM
Feb 2014

Leaders in Los Angeles seem to have been paying attention to Hollywood. A little more than a year after the release of Promised Land, a movie about the dangers of fracking starring Matt Damon, members of L.A. City Council are trying to ban hydraulic fracturing.

“Fracking and other unconventional drilling is happening here in Los Angeles, and without the oversight and review to keep our neighborhoods safe,” Councilman Mike Bonin said during a committee hearing on Tuesday. Here’s more from the L.A. Times:

The council is slated to vote Friday to draft new rules that would prohibit hydraulic fracturing and other forms of “well stimulation” in Los Angeles until the council is sure they are safe. …

Several Angelenos complained [during Tuesday's committee hearing] about vibrations and other problems that they blamed on oil extraction activities at nearby wells.

“Our walls are crumbling,” said Llewyn Fowlkes, part of the Harbor Gateway North Neighborhood Council, which backs a ban. “Our sidewalks are pulling apart and cracking.”

The move coincides with a renewed effort by California lawmakers to impose a moratorium on fracking across the state. A recently introduced bill, SB 1132, would expand the scope of a multi-agency review of the economic, environmental, and public health impacts of fracking — and bar the practice until the study is complete. Some state lawmakers tried to push a fracking moratorium last year, but all they managed to get was weak regulation of the fracking industry.

<snip>

http://grist.org/news/l-a-and-california-lawmakers-move-to-impose-fracking-moratoriums/

truedelphi

(32,324 posts)
36. That is indeed an encouraging thought. But local city council members have
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 05:53 PM
Feb 2014

To be re-elected, and as Big Energy has the Big Bucks to see to it that their people get in, the battle against fracking is a battle that will be waged again and again and again.

Plus if one community doesn't allow it, the equipment exists to "slant it in" from another county!
Then even if LA is successful in keeping out fracking interests, another community can allow for it, and people in LA will be out the money an d revenue that might be theirs, will still having all the problems.

Preventing fracking needs to occur on at least a state if not a Federal level.

But since 85% of all elected officials are bought and paid for, and the other 15% are simply trying not to be smeared by their local mafiosa of a city council member, or trying to avoid being affected by some time of investigation (Look at how John Conyers' wife got investigated, when Conyers didn't make the Powers that Be happy, and then the same thing happened to Maxine Waters,) I have no idea what the solution will be.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
42. yes, those are big concerns
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:13 PM
Feb 2014

but frankly, we part company when it comes to Conyer's wife. The evidence against her was overwhelming. She was guilty.

Harmony Blue

(3,978 posts)
77. CA doesn't have a lot of fracking like Texas
Thu Feb 27, 2014, 01:07 AM
Feb 2014

Fracking isn't so simple when the geomorphology varies so much like it does in California compared to Texas. And California also doesn't have good water sources so fracking has yet to take off in the farm fertile regions in CA. The attempt will be tried but the water resources by the summer will not be there.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
11. Interesting.
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:32 PM
Feb 2014

"President Obama strongly supports fracking and expanding fracking- including on public lands. "

From the article:

<...>

The TCEQ is led by three commissioners appointed by Gov. Rick Perry, a Republican who favors dismantling the EPA and voices doubt about climate change. TCEQ officials often go on to jobs as lobbyists for the energy industry they once regulated.

The Texas Railroad Commission, which issues drilling permits and regulates all other aspects of oil and gas production, is controlled by three elected commissioners who accepted more than $2 million in campaign contributions from the industry during the 2012 election cycle, according to data from the National Institute on Money in State Politics.

State legislators who enact the laws that regulate the industry are often tied to it. Nearly one in four state legislators, or his or her spouse, has a financial interest in at least one energy company active in the Eagle Ford, a Center for Public Integrity analysis of personal financial disclosure forms shows.

"I believe if you're anti-oil and gas, you're anti-Texas," state Rep. Harvey Hilderbran, a Republican from Central Texas, said during a media panel discussion in September.

<...>

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-02-20/fracking-boom-leaves-texans-under-a-toxic-cloud.html

Obama isn't even mentioned in the article.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
14. Fracking is, imo, the biggest environmental threat
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:39 PM
Feb 2014

extant and it's getting worse with dizzying rapidity.

President Obama has ACTIVELY promoted fracking and is doing so in the present.

The EPA under President Obama has delayed and buried fracking studies.

He has promoted more fracking on public lands.

As the person in this country with the biggest megaphone and with power to regulate

And don't forget, President Obama voted FOR the Energy legislation with the Halliburton loophole which exempted big gas and oil from having to comply with many EPA regulations.


So yeah, he's part of the overall story on the fracking boom.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
18. So
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:58 PM
Feb 2014
Fracking is, imo, the biggest environmental threat

extant and it's getting worse with dizzying rapidity.

President Obama has ACTIVELY promoted fracking and is doing so in the present.

The EPA under President Obama has delayed and buried fracking studies.

He has promoted more fracking on public lands.

As the person in this country with the biggest megaphone and with power to regulate

And don't forget, President Obama voted FOR the Energy legislation with the Halliburton loophole which exempted big gas and oil from having to comply with many EPA regulations.

So yeah, he's part of the overall story on the fracking boom.

...you didn't post the article to condemn what these people in Texas are doing, but to call attention to Obama?

The "EPA under President Obama" is trying to get a handle on a process controlled by states.

EPA Releases Final Guidance for Fracking with Diesel
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024484308

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
19. that diesel law is like a throwing a a drop of water on an inferno
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 05:05 PM
Feb 2014

and most environmental orgs consider it cosmetic and pretty inconsequential

most of my op is not about President Obama, but his involvement in promoting fracking to the degree that he's doing, is a piece of the overall fracking picture- and not a small piece.

http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2013/08/16/2471231/administration-expand-fracking-public-lands/#


ProSense

(116,464 posts)
20. Again,
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 05:16 PM
Feb 2014

what is your solution to the information cited here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024569123#post11

"most of my op is not about President Obama, but his involvement in promoting fracking to the degree that he's doing, is a piece of the overall fracking picture- and not a small piece. "

The OP article has absolutely nothing to do with Obama, but it appears that your only goal in posting it is to call out Obama.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
39. about that diesel regulation that you hang on to so desperately:
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:06 PM
Feb 2014

<snip>

The agency’s action, however, will have very little overall effect on fracking, since only about 2% of oil and gas operations in the country use diesel. The new measure also leaves many forms of diesel unregulated.

http://www.latimes.com/nation/politics/politicsnow/la-pn-obama-administration-diesel-fracking-20140211,0,4568510.story#ixzz2uT6EPU6G

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
21. Apparently you are not here to discuss fracking. Just here to make insinuations about the
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 05:21 PM
Feb 2014

motive of the OP.

Do you have an opinion about fracking?



ProSense

(116,464 posts)
24. Did I respond to a comment detailing the poster's opinion of Obama on the issue?
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 05:37 PM
Feb 2014

Yes, because the poster hasn't once addressed the situation in the article.

"Apparently you are not here to discuss fracking. Just here to make insinuations about the motive of the OP."

What are you here to discuss? I mean, where is your comment on the what Texas is doing?

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
27. I want the President to issue an executive order to halt all fracking until it can
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 05:40 PM
Feb 2014

be proven safe. Now your turn.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
30. I want the President
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 05:43 PM
Feb 2014

"I want the President to issue an executive order to halt all fracking until it can be proven safe. Now your turn. "

...to ban all fracking...tomorrow.


 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
33. Wonderful. But why are you compelled to defend his inaction? And plez
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 05:47 PM
Feb 2014

spare me the links to the petty-assed actions the EPA are doing.

"The EPA is recommending that the regulators tell the frackers to be careful."

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
43. the more agitated and desperate you get, the more you use that smilie.
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:16 PM
Feb 2014

for you the earth revolves around President Obama.

I've been clear about why I included him in the OP: You can't really discuss the current status of fracking in this country without including him. He's the one leading the charge.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
45. That's friggin hilarious
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:19 PM
Feb 2014

"for you the earth revolves around President Obama. "

...coming from some who posted an article about Texas' fracking situation to call out Obama...an article that has nothing to do with Obama.




 

cali

(114,904 posts)
50. squirm, pro, squirm. As President Obama is the most powerful person
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:24 PM
Feb 2014

in the country and as he is directly involved in the push for more fracking, including fracking on public land, its absurd not to mention that in the context of problems caused by it. It's his energy policy that pushes it.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
53. "As President Obama is the most powerful person"
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:27 PM
Feb 2014
The TCEQ is led by three commissioners appointed by Gov. Rick Perry, a Republican who favors dismantling the EPA and voices doubt about climate change. TCEQ officials often go on to jobs as lobbyists for the energy industry they once regulated.

The Texas Railroad Commission, which issues drilling permits and regulates all other aspects of oil and gas production, is controlled by three elected commissioners who accepted more than $2 million in campaign contributions from the industry during the 2012 election cycle, according to data from the National Institute on Money in State Politics.

Thanks, Obama!




 

cali

(114,904 posts)
56. Because TX is a foreign nation! Not really a state!
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:30 PM
Feb 2014

I do appreciate your kicking this thread though. I love seeing it get so much attention.

thanks pro, old gal.

ReRe

(10,597 posts)
25. It's common knowledge, ProSense
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 05:38 PM
Feb 2014

PO's been in office now for 5 years.

Does this mean you support environmentally dangerous gas fracking and tar sands pipelines?

Why isn't PO against this? Why isn't he out there in Texas standing in the middle of it vowing to shut it all down?

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
26. Well, there
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 05:40 PM
Feb 2014

"Why isn't PO against this? Why isn't he out there in Texas standing in the middle of it vowing to shut it all down? "

...you have it. Obama should march into Texas and take over the state.

<...>

The TCEQ is led by three commissioners appointed by Gov. Rick Perry, a Republican who favors dismantling the EPA and voices doubt about climate change. TCEQ officials often go on to jobs as lobbyists for the energy industry they once regulated.

The Texas Railroad Commission, which issues drilling permits and regulates all other aspects of oil and gas production, is controlled by three elected commissioners who accepted more than $2 million in campaign contributions from the industry during the 2012 election cycle, according to data from the National Institute on Money in State Politics.

State legislators who enact the laws that regulate the industry are often tied to it. Nearly one in four state legislators, or his or her spouse, has a financial interest in at least one energy company active in the Eagle Ford, a Center for Public Integrity analysis of personal financial disclosure forms shows.

"I believe if you're anti-oil and gas, you're anti-Texas," state Rep. Harvey Hilderbran, a Republican from Central Texas, said during a media panel discussion in September.

<...>

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-02-20/fracking-boom-leaves-texans-under-a-toxic-cloud.html





Response to ProSense (Reply #26)

ReRe

(10,597 posts)
40. ? Again, a non-answer
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:06 PM
Feb 2014

PO can go anywhere he damn well pleases.

And you know what I think of all that big talk from the oil barons you drag up? It's an excuse to not do what needs to be done. It has to stop somewhere. We just can't keep kicking the can down the road.

Harmony Blue

(3,978 posts)
15. There is no much we can do but try to let the public
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 04:42 PM
Feb 2014

know about the dangers with fracking operations. Most are blissfully unaware of the dire consequences before it is too late. That is why fracking operations are working at a dizzying pace to get in, and get out before the local community they pillaged realizes what has happened.

Basically modern day robber barons.

kwolf68

(7,365 posts)
22. OIL
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 05:23 PM
Feb 2014

the judge said, is "a natural resource that's given by God to allow us to function … I don't think there’s anything wrong with that."


-the stupid, it burns

 

Egalitarian Thug

(12,448 posts)
32. As long as you paint the pipes and equipment blue, it a good kind of uninhabitable.
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 05:44 PM
Feb 2014

Silly Vermonter.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
59. Are you actually going to dispute that Vermont has few natural resources
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:47 PM
Feb 2014

to exploit?

I didn't say there weren't environmental problems to face- though there are reasons why Vermont is the greenest state in the country.

You really love to demonstrate your, uh, shallow knowledge of my state, its reps and its politics in general.

go for it, propro,

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
63. More good reads:
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 07:07 PM
Feb 2014
Propane production up, but U.S. shortage looms

Shale gas producers across the country are pulling so much propane out of natural gas wells, they have quadrupled exports in the last three years. By the end of 2014, Sunoco Logistics Partners will have the capacity to load a million gallons a day of Marcellus Shale propane onto ships at its Marcus Hook terminal south of Philadelphia.

But this winter's weird weather, and a bumper crop of Midwestern corn that required four times more propane for drying, has triggered an unprecedented domestic shortage of the fuel, a byproduct of natural gas production and crude oil refining.

<...>

Elected officials in propane-dependent states are demanding relief. On Feb. 14, the congressional delegation from Vermont, where 15 percent of households heat with propane, called on the U.S. Commerce Department to impose a temporary export ban.

"The problem is that almost all new propane production over the past three years has been exported to more lucrative overseas markets instead of being used to meet consumer demand right here in the United States," said the letter from Sens. Bernie Sanders and Patrick Leahy and Rep. Peter Welch.

- more -

http://articles.philly.com/2014-02-24/business/47607065_1_much-propane-national-propane-gas-association-marcellus-shale


Emergency Proposal on Propane Prices
http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/recent-business/emergency-proposal-on-propane-prices



sadoldgirl

(3,431 posts)
37. I don't know much about the situation in Texas, but
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 05:59 PM
Feb 2014

here, in Colorado, it is a gushing rush to frack. Our Senator (D) is all in favor for it unfortunately. It is a question between the disaster of the land and jobs. Homo sapiens is like every other creature reactive not proactive. And still I will have to vote for Udall.
SIGH!

 

magical thyme

(14,881 posts)
38. sacrifice zones
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:00 PM
Feb 2014

I wrote about a year or two ago, that I felt like the 1% are dividing the world up into sacrifice zones.

Fracking areas are one type of sacrifice zone.

 

toby jo

(1,269 posts)
41. We need more regs.
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:11 PM
Feb 2014

The gas is better than the coal used almost everywhere, especially here in the east. But they need to slow down, quit racing each other to next quarter's profit statements.

The pres could get involved in a real way: establish an oversight panel to keep carbon-based fuels in the picture long enough to get us totally off of them. Then keep them around in a small trickle, as a back-up and for future situations that may arise. If the expansion were federally mandated, it would go a long way towards ending the toxic free-for-all we're seeing.

Our environmental health is a collective issue. Profits are not. Overrule Cheney and his ilk.

From the corporation's perspective, I get it. It's a 'we drill now or he will' mentality. And there is ALOT of money at stake. Somebody just needs to stand up and be the adult in the room.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
46. actually, there is increasing evidence that it might not be much better
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:19 PM
Feb 2014

The President has promoted fracking at every turn and done little to increase regulation- there is virtually no regulation now.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
48. LOL!
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:20 PM
Feb 2014

"The President has promoted fracking at every turn and done little to increase regulation- there is virtually no regulation now."

LOL: "for you the earth revolves around President Obama. "
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024569123#post43

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
52. could you squrim any harder? Nope. Could you appear any more desperate?
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:26 PM
Feb 2014

Probably. You have a way of outdoing yourself.

linking to the op?

sadoldgirl

(3,431 posts)
49. Are you really sure about the coal?
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:21 PM
Feb 2014

Not that we should keep on using it, but I heard recently that the methane released by fracking makes the air even more poisonous than oil. I could be wrong about that though.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
54. there have been recent articles and studies that
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:28 PM
Feb 2014

indicate that the advantages of fracking over coal are not as pronounced as has been claimed.

And when you think about the amount of fracking and the exponential growth of it, that makes some sense.

sadoldgirl

(3,431 posts)
64. Methane is much heavier than CO2,
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 07:24 PM
Feb 2014

which makes it worse. I heard on the Thom H. show, that the ice in the poles contains huge amount of methane and of the fear of the melting and release is real. It seems we are on the way to self extinction.

jeff47

(26,549 posts)
76. No, what makes methane worse is it retains heat better.
Thu Feb 27, 2014, 12:22 AM
Feb 2014

In other words, methane is a better insulator than CO2.

bkanderson76

(266 posts)
47. Come On Now, the five air monitors sprinkled along the perimeter of
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:20 PM
Feb 2014

this 20,000 square mile facility are showing minimal emissions....well within all Texas standards.
Texas standards
Texas standards
Texas standards
Texas standards
Need Anyone Say More?

doc03

(35,332 posts)
61. Just how do they have over 50 wells within 2 1/2 miles of their house
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 06:54 PM
Feb 2014

with horizontal drilling used in fracking? One well serves 1 square mile or 640 acres, the things must be stacked on top of each other.
I have seen very little ill effects around here from fracking. It has given us a badly needed economic boost since we lost several thousand
manufacturing jobs.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
65. that you have seen little harm from fracking doesn't counter
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 07:37 PM
Feb 2014

the mounting scientific evidence that it is bad for the environment; air, water and earth.

do a little research.

doc03

(35,332 posts)
66. We would rather send our coal to China that apparently has no environmental
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 08:13 PM
Feb 2014

laws. We can't use fracking, we can't use a pipeline to transport our oil and we can't use rail either now. We can't build nuclear plants
they aren't safe. We can't put a hydro plant on the river it will cause environmental damage of some kind. We can't build wind turbines
they kill birds. We could go to horses but they expel gas when they fart.

pscot

(21,024 posts)
82. You have accurately described the problem
Thu Feb 27, 2014, 02:31 PM
Feb 2014

We're headed for a 4 degree centigrade rise in global temperatures.

Champion Jack

(5,378 posts)
71. They are putting up to ten wells on one pad here
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 09:11 PM
Feb 2014

I could see how they could cram five pads into a 2 1/2 mile area.
My friend has 32 wells on the hill behind her house and they are going to add 12 more in the next few months . The noise is loud and 24/7 , the trucks run all day and night. When they flare the wells the sky is lit up for miles , the fumes are overwhelming and it sounds like a jet engine.
By the way, they don't always have to have 640 acres for a play the minimum around here is 350 acres.
If you don't believe that there is no negative impact from Fracking come down here to West Virginia I'll introduce you to people who have had their water wells ruined by arsenic and benzine from Fracking. Try selling your property when all of a sudden you're surrounded by this horrible mess.

doc03

(35,332 posts)
73. Don't understand ten wells one pad. You mean they are drilling horizontally
Wed Feb 26, 2014, 09:28 PM
Feb 2014

in ten directions. That would be just 5 wells not 50 separate wells. I live just a few miles from WV and haven't heard of no such thing. The fracking fluid is being
injected a mile or more under the ground how does get into a water well?

 

appal_jack

(3,813 posts)
78. Basic hydrology is how.
Thu Feb 27, 2014, 11:15 AM
Feb 2014
The fracking fluid is being
injected a mile or more under the ground how does get into a water well?


Basic hydrology is how.

A mile is just over 5,000 feet. It's not uncommon for domestic water sources to be located nearly 1,000 feet down. While the intervening 4,000 feet may sound like a lot, it is only an impermeable barrier in textbook-ideal-theoretical-land, not in real earth. In real ground, soils and rock layers are often heterogeneous, ground shifts due to weather, seismic activity, the high pressure of the fracking itself, etc., and the fracking chemicals themselves are powerful solvents. These chemicals will move. Also, the fracking and injection wells and casings themselves are subject to failure. When (not if, but when) they fail, the well itself becomes a superhighway for groundwater pollution.

-app

Auntie Bush

(17,528 posts)
75. After we ruin out planet and kill all life...can it ever come back with time?
Thu Feb 27, 2014, 12:04 AM
Feb 2014

Or is it doomed forever?

aquart

(69,014 posts)
80. Vote Republican, lose your air, land, and water. Genius.
Thu Feb 27, 2014, 01:47 PM
Feb 2014

Idiot on Twitter yesterday so ignorant he still thinks Keystone will bring jobs.

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