Thanks, sort of. One of the three most appalling things I've ever seen:

[MannyGoldstein]

This thread from last night: Which is better?, along with Stiv Bator puking in his pants then rolling around in it on stage, and... I can't remember the third.

I know that nobody believes me, but I was just pathetically trying to make a point that we could work better together. I'm actually not very good at secret agendas, my poor executive functioning gets in the way of the secret part.

Well, anyway, at least I have a new superlative to cringe at.

[sabrina 1]

1. You are too nice Manny, I am not nearly as patient as you when it comes to people with obvious

agendas. Which is why they always end up saying to me 'I'm done here'. When you actually ask them questions, it upsets the agenda I suppose. But watching what's been going on here over the past few weeks has NOT accomplished what they thought they were accomplishing, it has cause a whole lot of people to question whether we are on the right forum anymore.

People need to stand up to them and point out the sheer garbage that is being spread around here or, and I can understand what many have told me, they don't even want to get involved, maybe best to find a Progressive forum where such tactics can be and will be called out loud and clear.

Loved the thread, it revealed so, so much that needed airing.

[MannyGoldstein]

2. Oh well.

It's gotten pretty weird. But it's all just the play of the creation, we all do our part.

[sabrina 1]

4. Just ignore them, most people ARE working together and in this election year, we won't be letting

people whose agenda is obvious to stop US from finding and supporting every actual Progressive Dem we can find. Fortunately now we have real Liberal Organizations helping to organize Liberals so we no longer are dependent on the leadership of the party who as we know, will choose the Third Way candidate every time, to find the candidates that belong in the Dem Party and who best represent us, the voters who put them there.

Yes, it is 'part of the play' and not new, in fact I've seen it so often over the past number of years it has become boring, not worth wasting time on. We have work to do taking back OUR PARTY from Corporate interests that do not care much about us until election time. And then go right back to the same old corporate agenda afterwards. But that is our fault. We are the majority, and it's time we stop acting like the minority in this party.

[MannyGoldstein]

7. And we are making progress.

You're right!

[pacalo]

3. Wasn't that something?

GD is becoming what Meta used to be & the cast is pretty much the same. You struck some nerves, Manny.

[sabrina 1]

5. I was just thinking that yesterday, you really have to search now to find actual worthwhile

discussion of issues important to people in this country. GD IS Meta. I did not miss that forum when it finally shut down, but apparently some did and have managed to turn GD into their favorite 'divide and conquer' playground.

[pacalo]

8. Clearly, that is the atmosphere that the squeakiest wheels have a need for.

Hostility is normalcy for some when many of us want good-faith discussions.

You've done a great job of speaking up, Sabrina. I appreciate you so much.

[sabrina 1]

13. Yes, hostility, lol, I've certainly been met with lots of it simply for trying to find out

where they are coming from, to make some sense of the efforts to divide this party. Thankfully I am unaffected by personal attacks, having been attacked by the masters on the Right during the old Bush days. Although I must say sometimes I get an odd sense of deja vu here, a throw back to when we used to engage Bushbots who roamed the internet looking for 'lieberals' to try out the latest Limbaugh epithet, specially constructed for Democrats, expecting to deliver a knockout punch only to find themselves wondering what hit them. Lol, I used to go sites to find them just for the fun of it. Oddly enough I've seen some of the same talking points here.

Thank you for your posts, pacala, always love to read them.

[pacalo]

14. I've got thick skin, too...

At this point, I'm just fed up to here & am trying to spare myself from re-living my grade-school years by avoiding the pettiness.

[sabrina 1]

15. I know, most people feel the same way from what I am told. I don't go into the flamebait threads

preferring to let them sink, as they should, but when I meet one of them in, say, a Manny thread, put it this way, they help me kick his threads! Lol, I sure don't take them seriously, although THEY seem to take me VERY seriously. Don't disagree with them, or you'll get a 'label' slapped on you!

[MannyGoldstein]

6. That's the crazy part. I struck nerves by doing *nothing*.

Blows my mind. But there it is, a 100+ post food fight complete with what seemed like a threat in response to what I thought was call to be nice to each other.

I'll STFU now, but wow.

[pacalo]

9. I know you intended for people to take that poll at face value.

Some people make assumptions & act on them, which is what happened in that thread.

[sibelian]

19. Pffff. Manny's thread was an example...

But you should have seen Sarah whatserface's reaction to Bonobo supposing that the 5-1 ratio of male to female successful suicides was a gendered issue. Even if you disagreed with his stance...

Piece of work.

They are not here to discuss politics. The are here to strike poses on DU.

[pacalo]

20. I hadn't seen that thread...

so I looked it up & that is indeed a piece of work.

[sabrina 1]

12. Lol, how dare you try to get people to work together. Really, if that were to happen we might

get a government that represents us rather than Wall St. But it is happening, despite the efforts to prevent it. That must be frustrating for those who are trying so hard to divide this party.

[Whisp]

28. ok

[L0oniX]

31. Alerting ...for telling yourself to STFU!

Hey ...someone has to alert on you ...might as well be your friends.

[ohheckyeah]

10. Was that poll supposed to be serious?

I don't know what was behind it and picked "you suck" because I'm a smart ass, not that I think YOU personally suck. I didn't actually read the thread, I just like to vote.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

11. We are all just arguing for a piece of pie in the sky, anyway. The 1% is laughing their ass off.

It is done deal, baby. We are fried.

[sabrina 1]

16. Btw, who is Stiv Bator? And why did he 'puke in his pants and roll around in it on stage'.

Is this the guy: ?

[nomorenomore08]

21. Stiv Bators was the lead singer for the late-70's punk band The Dead Boys and also

the 80's goth rock band Lords of the New Church. And I suspect his onstage antics had more than a little to do with drug/alcohol intoxication, much like Iggy Pop before him.

[sabrina 1]

22. Thank you n/t

[BainsBane]

17. You mean some DUers thought you were mocking something?

How dare they! I can't imagine why anyone should think such a thing.

If that's the most appalling thing you've ever seen, I hope that you are very grateful for your good fortune in life.

[bemildred]

18. Well, as you can see, not everyone wants to work together better.

Personally, I had that figured out by fourth grade or so, but everyone at their own pace.

[CJCRANE]

23. This is getting to be a habit. Write an OP, then the next day write an OP commenting on the previous

day's OP. It's all getting very circular.

Imagine if you were to turn your prodigious writing skills, time and effort to countering the RW talking points emanating from the KOCHS/FOX/GOP...

[Fumesucker]

29. Meh, I've done more than many to "counter right wing talking points"

And I like Manny's commentary.

In this GD OP that got 240 recs for instance I posted practical and concrete advice on how to hurt Rush Limbaugh and the stations that carry him in the only place that counts, the wallet.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002374653

[CJCRANE]

30. Fair enough. My post wasn't directed at you.

I prefer Manny's more straightforward political posts, rather than his Third Way sarcasm or other vague posts. Everyone has different tastes and different reasons for coming here.

(And BTW I noticed I had rec'd your OP that you linked to).

[seabeyond]

24. you start a thread saying your 17 yr old son is not to listen to beetles cause of prudes. do you

have a 17 yr old son living at home? and you are not devious? is that the word you choose? edit... i checked, "secret agendas" so the beetle thread had no secret agenda and was truly all over your 17 yr old sons tush over a beetle song. cause you do not do secret agenda. or not good. well, i will agree, you are not good at doing secret agenda. way too obvious, lol

yet you start ANOTHER op to tell all how you are misunderstood?

[SidDithers]

26. Nailed it...

Sid

[seabeyond]

27. i do not think i had read one of mannys Op in all the years. the beetles being the first. i have

been well versed in just a couple weeks.

[SidDithers]

33. Good to see you back, btw...

Sid

[seabeyond]

34. thank you sid. nt

[rrneck]

25. One of the best polls I've seen.

I could blather on about "masks slipping" and wotnot, but I don't really think that's the case. People are passionate about the issues. Their reasons for that passion are more important, and an honest discussion about how best to proceed politically can reveal those reasons.

I don't think successful political coalitions are made by some agreement about how to divide up and dominate a group or an issue. You win by finding common ground to be passionate about. The law of unintended consequences can work for or against you.

[whatchamacallit]

32. I got you man

It's pretty obvious many of the "DU Wars" OPs are more about drama and shaming than enlightenment and progress. Makes this place suck hard lately.

[1awake]

35. Told you it wasnt going to work. nt