Is health care such a fundamental right that access to it should be in the constitution?

[CreekDog]

9 votes, 1 pass | Time left: Unlimited
	Yes, it should be in the constitution as a constitutional right
	8 (89%)
	No, it should not be in the constitution as a constitutional right
	1 (11%)
	1 DU member did not wish to select any of the options provided.
Show usernames Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll

[Skip Intro]

1. Now, this isn't one of your trap-polls where you do research on those who vote the "wrong" way

is it?

Like people have talked about:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4758521

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024744231#post67

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2165643

And even you admitted:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2165837

and nevermind that my thread was about a poster who voted in my gungeon poll where nobody should have voted for the first option --and one of the few that did, had NOT A SINGLE DU POST.

so i asked.

and if someone takes wingnut position in my poll (though this poll doesn't have a wingnut position) i just might talk about it.

[CreekDog]

4. nobody's forcing you to vote or even post in this thread

bye!

[SQUEE]

9. You do know it is obvious what your doing...

just so you know.

[Skip Intro]

10. I'm sure others would like to know too, if this is one of your traps where you encourage DUers

to offer honest opinions and then do research on those who vote the "wrong" way, digging into their previous posts, and profiles etc, to find something with which you can harass them and personally attack them.

I think people have a right to know.

So is it?

[CreekDog]

11. i'd like to know why you called me "cjeekdgg"

and why so many respond to your posts about me with "cjeekdgg".

https://www.google.com/search?q=cjeekdgg&sitesearch=democraticunderground.com&safe=on

[Skip Intro]

13. So it is one of your poll traps, then. (Desperate deflection is a huge tell). n/t

[CreekDog]

15. no one's forcing to you post in this thread, post about the poll, post your opinion

there is no trap.

don't you have some cattle ranchers to defend?

[Skip Intro]

21. A public service, alerting others of what they could be in for - months and years of

harassment and personal attacks from you for voting the "wrong" way in one of your trap polls, seemed warranted.

Now you say this isn't one of your trap polls. I don't believe you, you have a long track record of this kind of thing.

But others might believe you.

At least now they know the risks.

Btw, no one is forcing any of us to be here.

[CreekDog]

22. so you're here because you care about DUers

you're such a giver!

[Skip Intro]

25. Just trying to do my part. n/t

[CreekDog]

26. Obama thanks you for the support

[pipi_k]

32. After voting the "wrong" way

in a poll on The Race Card earlier today, I received a somewhat...odd...PM. Odd, because I had only voted, and had not left a comment.

The ensuing...discussion...quickly devolved into a lecture to me on my motives, desires, and mental state


After a few rounds, I decided to ask what the purpose of that communication was.

No reply.

[tazkcmo]

2. I voted no

Just establish a universal health care system and be done with it. I would be happy to vote yes if it was the quickest way to get said system though.

[SQUEE]

3. Already covered in the Preamble of the Constitution.

I do not see the actual idea of health care as a human right, i see it as an obligation of "Society" and the government to provide for the general good.

To many things are labeled as rights and are mistakenly conflated with positive oligations of the state, versus the negative restraints placed apon the same by the Constitution.

[CreekDog]

5. so guns shouldn't be in there either?

just wondering what the threshold is.

[SQUEE]

7. not relevant to your poll...

not even a good try pushie...

[Codeine]

6. Obviously.

Good luck ever achieving such a thing, but in an ideal world. . .

[WilliamPitt]

8. It already is in the Declaration of Independence.

Last edited Mon Apr 14, 2014, 04:35 PM - Edit history (1)

Without health, there is no "Life." Only death from illness.

Without health, there is no "Liberty." Only enslavement to disease.

Without health, there can be no "Pursuit of Happiness."

It's already codified. Our problem is not the words. Our problem is our priorities.

Edit: Derp.

[CreekDog]

12. yeah but slavery existed with all those things in there

i mean as an amendment to the constitution.

[REP]

23. He's quoting the Declaration of Independence

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.--Such has been the patient sufferance of these Colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of Government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.

[CreekDog]

24. true, i responded too quickly

[tritsofme]

14. You are quoting the Declaration of Independence

Not the Constitution.

[REP]

19. It's almost surprising how many people don't know what's in the Constitution

Almost.

The Declaration if Independence does not have any legal bearing in the United States of America - something that I'm sure you know, but many do not. There is no government guarantee of "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."

[LeftishBrit]

17. I was thinking the same thing; but I don't know whether the words of the Declaration of Independence

count as part of the Constitution, or otherwise formally binding?

[REP]

20. They are not part of the Constitution nor are they binding

[REP]

18. That's the Declaration of Independence

This is the Preamble to the Constitution:

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

This is the Declaration of Independence:

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.--Such has been the patient sufferance of these Colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of Government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.

[LeftishBrit]

16. It is, BTW, in the UN's Universal Declaration of Human Rights

Last edited Mon Apr 14, 2014, 04:53 PM - Edit history (1)

Article 25: Everyone has the right to a standard of living adequate for the health and well-being of himself and of his family, including food, clothing, housing and medical care and necessary social services, and the right to security in the event of unemployment, sickness, disability, widowhood, old age or other lack of livelihood in circumstances beyond his control.

[mike_c]

27. that's the main reason I voted YES in the OP poll....

As signatories of the UN Charter, we should ALREADY be guaranteeing access to affordable quality health care for all persons.

[loyalsister]

28. I don't think it can be done

Would said amendment require that health care be provided? Or would it prevent states from interfering with getting health care? Would it be available at no cost? How would delivery be paid for? Would all health professionals suddenly be employed by the federal government?
I think it's way too complicated to add to the constitution.

[plcdude]

29. "promote the general welfare"

I think the general welfare clause incorporates the right to be healthy

[Swede Atlanta]

30. No......

We don't have constitutional provisions for ensuring all Americans have access to a quality education, nutritious food, a safe and secure living environment, a job with a living wage, freedom from gun-driven violence, etc.

I do view healthcare, not health insurance, as a "right" in a most pedestrian context.

This is what we as Americans should share as common values and "rights". But "con"servatives believe it is all about what you have and what others don't.

What they don't realize is the country and our politics are bought and sold on Wall Street and among big-ticket donors (both Democratic and Republican).

[Puzzledtraveller]

33. ^^this^^

[Crunchy Frog]

31. It should replace the 2nd Ammendment.

[Puzzledtraveller]

34. rights do not exist

[dilby]

35. If it was could I sue the Government if I felt I was not getting adequate health care?

Just wondering because health care is a very broad term, for some it indicates if you are ever sick you are provided every necessary means to get better. For others it means if you get sick you get to see a doctor but you are not guaranteed the necessary care to get better. How would you word this amendment to the Constitution, till I know what I am getting I am voting no.