And people are worried about the NSA?

[leftyladyfrommo]

I googled myself a few days ago. Not only did all sorts of info pop up but so did a picture of my house on my street. My age is out there, my address. No pyhone numbers because I have cell phones.

And how about those license plate scanners? Police in Kansas City have 12 of those. All that info goes into a database somewhere. They know where you drive. And it is not illegal for private people to buy those scanners and use them. Private companies use them for all sorts of stuff.

And stores have cameras everywhere. They know what you buy and where you buy it.

This kind of stuff is way scarier to me than anything the NSA could come up with.

Pretty soon everything I do will be common knowledge. Everywhere I go. Everything I buy.

I hate it.

[The Magistrate]

1. That, Ma'am, Is Just Private Enterprise Making Profits: Only Government Is A Problem....

Or so some say....

[Maedhros]

32. I don't believe that anyone has said that "only Government" is a problem. [n/t]

j

[The Magistrate]

33. A Great Many Say That, Sir

Though not necessarily here, of course....

Personally, I am a good deal more leery of private bureaucracies than public ones.

[Maedhros]

35. The salient point is that there really is no difference, anymore.

When it comes to the Pentagon and the National Security State, there really is no separation of private and public.

[okaawhatever]

45. I can't tell you how many times someone has responded to me that "yeah, well these companies

can't throw you in jail." My argument is also that the government can buy most of the info from one of these companies so private and government need to comply with privacy laws. Also, if a private company has it there will be a day when the gov't wants it (if you're a criminal) and will be able to get it with a warrant.

[Maedhros]

46. Well, that's not the same as saying that ONLY data collection by the Government is a problem.

It's a counter-argument to the claim that since private companies collect data, it's okay that the Government does it too, with the added risk that the Government is empowered to use the data to restrict your freedom while private companies cannot.

I've been fighting against corporate data collection since the 90s. It is my contention that information about me and my buying/browsing histories belongs to me, not the myriad of corporate entities that gather, store and trade this data. However, I refuse to accept the notion that because this happens the NSA's activities somehow are of no concern.

[okaawhatever]

49. I agree, but i'm afraid there are too many who aren't concerned with the private sector's

actions and are rabid anti-NSA. I think the new laws/rules need to address both and they should be addressed together. I've also been outspoken about how I think some of the internet companies who are coming out anti-NSA are really only doing so to divert attention away from themselves and help craft legislation that protects their info gathering but prohibits NSA gathering.

[Maedhros]

51. The other part of this that is even more frighteninng is that the barriers

between the Pentagon/security agencies and corporations are coming down. There really is no meaningful difference between Government and Corporation when it comes to the Military Security Industrial Complex.

[okaawhatever]

54. +100 nt

[Kelvin Mace]

2. How unique is your name?

I have a VERY common name and you have to search for it in a very specific context to get it to come up.

[leftyladyfrommo]

16. My name is the same as a very famous TV show.

For a long time I couldn't find anything about me because there were pages and pages of info on the TV show.

But I found myself very easily this time. Yuk. I hate that.

[Kelvin Mace]

20. How far down?

If I type just my name and middle initial, you have to dig about ten pages down before you find a link remotely associated with me. Include my high school (fairly unique name) or a phrase I coined (unique) and I am #1.

[leftyladyfrommo]

37. I haven't looked at that for a long time.

There used to be pages and pages and my name never did show up.

[deafskeptic]

22. I guess it helps if your last name is Smith. n/t

[bettyellen]

3. Not nearly the big issue economic and social problems are.

The only friend I have that is concerned about it (or possibly aware) also goes on about chemtrails.

[leftyladyfrommo]

4. I don't want a picture of my house out there.

I don't want to feel like I have to keep my yard perfect because you never know who is photographing it.

And look at all those Rewards cards out there. Stores know so much about their customers.

Is it even possible to live off the grid anymore?

[bettyellen]

7. If you have a cash only existence, but that Google map car will photo your house

and you can't do jack shit abut it. Maybe it's different being a city dweller, you can have a very anonymous life here compared to small towns. I would not want neighbors up in my business for sure. And you can be very social, but yeah- there are cameras and scanners everywhere and it doesn't really bother me. I don't imagine anyone is all that interested in me.

[RKP5637]

5. Yes, I know what you mean. It's very invasive, and some of the information is totally

incorrect. Also, in some cases they have relatives listed, people I supposedly know, etc., etc. and I have absolutely no idea who these people are. They also have me living in one state where I never lived. When I applied for a mortgage once I was questioned on this, apparently they searched the internet and saw my name listed by a state I had never lived in. Frankly, I trust NSA more than these profiteers and shysters. I also resent having my financial information, housing, etc. publicly posted. It should be stopped, but TPTB in the US are too lazy or too much on the take to do anything.

[abelenkpe]

6. NSA is troubling

But yeah the info corporations gather and put out there that bothers me. To get that info removed is a difficult seemingly never ending process.

[L0oniX]

8. Epic false equivalency fail.

Let me know when Google can put you in prison.

[Puzzledtraveller]

10. ^^this^^

[MineralMan]

11. Neither can the NSA.

Now, the FBI can, your local police department can, but the NSA cannot put you in jail.

[leftyladyfrommo]

13. You can sure get arrested for stuff you put out on Facebook or Youtube.

Stupid kids film themselves doing illegal stuff, put it out there, and get arrested.

Do they not realize the FBI and local police can access their Facebook account just like their friends do?

I am pretty careful about what I say when I'm on my cell phone. And I am also careful about my e-mails. Not that my life is all that exciting. But I don't want to have to explain to some government official just what I meant by some off the cuff remark.

[MineralMan]

25. The NSA is not interested in that, nor can the NSA

arrest anyone in the USA. They have no powers of arrest at all in the U.S.

[Fumesucker]

14. Last time I checked the NSA was part of the government

You know, the entity which claims sole legitimate police powers.

[MineralMan]

26. The NSA has no powers of arrest in the US.

They can't put you in jail. The FBI can, and other federal law enforcement agencies can, but not the NSA. The NSA is not the government. It is one agency, with specific authorities and powers. Arresting and jailing people in this country are not among those powers.

[Maedhros]

34. Come on, MineralMan. You're being deliberately disingenuous.

You're a bright guy. You can't tell me you weren't aware of the issue with the NSA giving data to law enforcement agencies and then coaching them on how to hide the source of the data?

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jennifergranick/2013/08/14/nsa-dea-irs-lie-about-fact-that-americans-are-routinely-spied-on-by-our-government-time-for-a-special-prosecutor-2/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-switch/wp/2013/08/05/the-nsa-is-giving-your-phone-records-to-the-dea-and-the-dea-is-covering-it-up/

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/05/us-dea-sod-idUSBRE97409R20130805

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20130827/17564624327/congress-asks-eric-holder-to-explain-why-nsa-supplies-dea-info-which-it-then-launders-to-go-after-americans.shtml

Why do you expend so much effort trying to downplay what the NSA is doing?

[frylock]

23. it's called a magazine, not a clip

[MineralMan]

28. I Like Outside Magazine.

I use a clip to hang the outline of my current project where I can see it as I work.

The NSA is an intelligence agency, charged with collecting electronic data having to do with international governments and organizations. It has no power of arrest within the United States. We have other agencies that have those powers. Your terminology comparison makes no sense.

With regard to firearms, magazines hold rounds of ammunition and are inserted in the firearm. Clips hold rounds of ammunition to be inserted into the firearm. They're similar, in that they both have to do with ammunition and firearms.

The NSA has no power of arrest, so it is not similar to law enforcement agencies. It is not a law enforcement agency.

[Ichingcarpenter]

31. 'We kill people with metadata'' NSA quote

didn't read that from apple, google or sears.

[L0oniX]

40. You are uninformed. Google "NSA police"

[MineralMan]

41. No, I'm not. The NSA police force works at NSA installations only.

It's right there in the description of the job. Now, if you try to get into an NSA building, I suppose you might get arrested. But, otherwise, not.

[L0oniX]

42. *

http://forums.officer.com/t190094/

Quote Originally Posted by ajdeployed12 View Post
Do the NSA police have statutory powers of arrest and fall under LEOSA?
Yes and yes.

There authority is derived from the National Security Agency Act and also from amendments following the Intelligence Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2002.

Under 18 USC 926B they meet all requirements.

[Maedhros]

47. Don't forget how the NSA routinely gives information to law enforcement agencies,

then coaches them on how to obfuscate that fact in their reports so defense counsel won't know that the NSA provided data:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jennifergranick/2013/08/14/nsa-dea-irs-lie-about-fact-that-americans-are-routinely-spied-on-by-our-government-time-for-a-special-prosecutor-2/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-switch/wp/2013/08/05/the-nsa-is-giving-your-phone-records-to-the-dea-and-the-dea-is-covering-it-up/

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/05/us-dea-sod-idUSBRE97409R20130805

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20130827/17564624327/congress-asks-eric-holder-to-explain-why-nsa-supplies-dea-info-which-it-then-launders-to-go-after-americans.shtml

[L0oniX]

50. Yes but we have nothing to fear from the NSA...

Can't believe there are still people on DU who trust the NSA and our government.

[MineralMan]

9. Pretty amazing, isn't it.

I do that a couple of times a year, and each year, they have more information. The last time, I found my house, too, connected with my name, complete with a street view photo, the price I paid for the house, and my address and telephone number. Fortunately, I have a common name, but I'm pretty easy to find on the Internet, if you know any other info about me.

We're all part of the great data collection process by business interests. It's not going to decrease, either.

[leftyladyfrommo]

12. I googled an old boyfriend

who never had any money and was always hitting me up for stuff.

There is a picture of the $300,000 house where he is now living. Even had the price of the house out there. I think he found a richer girlfriend. The jerk.

[Fumesucker]

15. The poorest mouths have the most money surprisingly often n/t

[leftyladyfrommo]

17. He didn't have jack shit when I knew him.

And unless he has managed to strike it rich as a truck driver that house doesn't belong to him. He's just sucking the life blood out of someone else - once again.

Oh, and according to his Facebook page he is also a rightwing second amendment stuff wacko now. So I guess I should just feel lucky some other poor slob is having to put up with him now. Yes, he finally found someone with big boobs.

[TreasonousBastard]

18. Yup. Imagine if you had a stalker...

Gummint can be a horrible intrusion-- ask a guy I met who was wrongfully convicted of murder and narrowly escaped execution.

But, the daily assumption by so many here and out there that everyone from Campbell's Soup to Google knowing the intimate details of your life is a good, or at least neutral, thing is amazing.

Amazon is not really a retailer-- it uses retail to feed its information business with acres of servers it rents out to Netflix and hundreds, maybe thousands, of others. It uses your purchase records, Netflix viewing history, and web hits to build a profile. A profile, btw, that the government can see if it wants to. Admittedly, that's a bit of an overstatement but the ability is there, unlike NSA with its almost random bits and pieces.

But, hey, let's shake our heads at some asshole rancher fighting a war from 50 years ago and fear the NSA that hasn't actually bothered any of us. And while we're at it, let keep googling and buying from Amazon while we complain about Wal-Mart.

[randome]

19. Be careful. If you hurt The Google's feelings, he/she/it may make you regret it.

(All hail The Mighty Google!)
[hr][font color="blue"][center]TECT in the name of the Representative approves of this post.[/center][/font][hr]

[Thinkingabout]

21. Information has been collected for years, maybe not on the internet but

Nonetheless it has been collected. When a baby is born Social Security card are issues. Birth certificates are recorded. This is just the beginning. Whether you are an internet user this information is collected. Records are being kept for many things one does in their lives.

[jmowreader]

24. Try an experiment

Open two windows in your browser. Put realtor.com on one, Google Maps on the other.

Set realtor.com to search in a city you've never been to in your life. Find a house.

Go to Google Maps and start typing the address. Almost as soon as you key in the numbers, the whole address for the house you just looked at will pop up. Something's drastically wrong with that.

[Maedhros]

48. Most sites run a script called "googleanalytics" that records your activities.

I use an add-on for Firefox called NoScript. It prevent scripts from running unless the user specifically allows them. I never allow googleanalytics.

[SwankyXomb]

52. Unfortunately

a lot of sites don't work correctly, or at all, unless you allow googleanalytics.

[villager]

27. It's not really an either/or proposition, though it makes for a neat rhetorical trick

One doesn't excuse the other, however.

[bowens43]

29. you don't see a difference between government surveillance and this? Really?

[leftyladyfrommo]

36. What difference does it make?

Everybody has everything. One just has to assume that nothing you do outside your own home is private. And the phone calls and e-mails and internet stuff are not private.

I just can't believe how dumb people can be when it comes to personal stuff. Look at the derogatory personal stuff people put on their Facebook pages. Employers check all that stuff out.

Nah. It doesn't bother me that the government might be listening in. I grew up on a party line. But I think the worst time that I can remember was during the Commie scare. So many people were blacklisted. I don't know if that could happen again. One good thing about having so much information out there is that it is a lot harder to brand individuals as being subversive. Shoot, your whole life is a damn open book.

[Puzzledtraveller]

38. I understand what you are saying, but at what point would it cross the line, or be enough for you,

the government intrusion that you would demand action to cease the invasion of your privacy by the government? I too feel like it's all so out of control it can't be reeled back in yet I cannot allow that to make me complacent or less incensed about said intrusions.

[leftyladyfrommo]

39. Right now I don't really feel like anyone is really paying attention

to individuals. The info is all out there somewhere but it's harmless as long as no one looks at it. If I felt like there was a real person sitting somewhere whose job it was to check out information on me on a regular basis I would be looking for another country to live in

I was flabbergasted really when I went to Social Security for the first time. They knew everything about me. Every job I've ever had, how much I made, when I worked and where. And that was just one agency. Clay County, Missouri knows everything about my residence. Where it is, how much it's worth. They know what kind of car I drive. The police scanners keep track of license plates. They know where I go during the day. My bank and credit card companies know everything about me. Where I shop, how much I spend and on what for everything.

It's too late. The horse is out of the barn and galloping down the road. But I don't really feel like anyone is paying any attention to me.

[Puzzledtraveller]

43. I do SNAP and Medicaid

You are correct. I have clients who's jaw drops open when I can tell them more about them than they know. We have accounts as well as our own systems data that can tell us where you have lived, worked, where you have paid taxes, if you have paid taxes, vehicle registration, make and model, who lives with you, etc. Experian provides us with data on where you worked, when you got paid, how much, where you lived, if you have or had insurance, phone numbers, retirement data, investment data and much more. We run all of this before the client sits down in front of us.

[leftyladyfrommo]

55. So, see? Having someone maybe listening in

while I'm on my cell phone doesn't even phase me. I just make sure all my phone calls are generic. I do the same with my e-mail.

NSA doesn't have to listen to my phone calls to find about me. They can just Google my name and they probably find out how much I weighed at birth.

You know, I just don't worry about it. The chances of anyone listening in to one of my calls are pretty slim.

[DirkGently]

30. You think the NSA doesn't have "that stuff?"

The corporate world wants your private information to make money.

Secret government agencies in the United States have been known to use private information to wield power a bit more directly. Blackmail, harrassment, arrest, deportation. That kind of thing. Hoover's FBI would cower in terror from the intel gathering of the modern NSA. He liked to go after people like Martin Luther King, John Lennon, anti-war activists.

Anyone with an opinion, basically.

There's plenty to worry about either way.

[SwankyXomb]

53. Even if they didn't already have it,

the NSA could procure all that data for a surprisingly small fee.

[Demo_Chris]

44. Google kills family in raid on wrong address. nt