Israel is invading Gaza right now. The IDF has announced it.

[Comrade Grumpy]

IDF Starts Gaza Ground Invasion:

http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Protective-Edge/IDF-intensifies-Gaza-attacks-with-artillery-fire-air-strikes-363289

IDF ground forces began to move into the Gaza Strip on Thursday evening, the prime minister's office confirmed.

The purpose of the operation was to destroy the Gazan terror tunnels leading to Israel, according to a statement released by the prime minister's office.

"Israel is committed to act to protect its citizens. The operation will continue until its goals are reached: To bring quiet to the citizens of Israel for a long period of time, and to seriously harm Hamas and other terrorist organizations' infrastructure in the Gaza Strip," the statement read.

Prior to the commencement of the ground invasion, the IDF launched a massive wave of combined air and artillery strikes on Thursday night.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

1. No doubt America will call for a "No Fly" zone and impose sanctions on Israel.

Or, maybe not.

[yeoman6987]

25. I hope the United States doesn't do that

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

27. I have little doubt that your hope will be fulfilled.

America is very forgiving of atrocities being committed by Israel.

[yeoman6987]

50. As long as the United States doesn't forgive the Humas Organization

They are the worst. Israel is a wonderful Country......they deserve every minute of our support and as much funding as they need.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

55. Even when they use our support and money to kill civilians?

[Vattel]

57. But they are the good murderers.

[malaise]

2. The world's bullies violate every law in the book

with impunity.
Enough of this madness. Say something Obama!

[HERVEPA]

4. Yes. Perhaps he can tell Hamas to stop firing rockets into Israel

[LittleBlue]

7. Perhaps they'll stop firing rockets if

they have a state instead of a quasi apartheid?

[HERVEPA]

12. Perhaps they'll have a state if they stop saying Israel has no right to exist.

[cpwm17]

17. They already recognized Israel as a nation in the past

That only got them more settlements and worse apartheid.

To say that Israel has a "right to exist" is the same as saying Israel had a right to commit the Nakba against the Palestinians. Of course the Palestinians can never say that. That demand is obscene.

What you wrote is ridiculous propaganda.

[Nevernose]

28. And how many Israeli settlements are in Gaza?

How does Israeli settlement n the West Bank (which is awful and illegal) effect the people launching the rockets in any way whatsoever?

[cpwm17]

45. Israel conducted a collective punishment campaign against the Palestinians

including attacking Hamas over the murder of the three Israeli teenagers by two Palestinians. It seems clear that Israel wanted to get a response, which Hamas unfortunately complied.

Gaza is a prison, controlled by Israel. The Palestinians have no means of self defense. Hamas shoots the rockets since that is all they have.

[malaise]

61. I think you mean affect n/t

[former9thward]

32. Hamas has never recognized Israel. Never.

They have sworn the destruction of Israel.

[cpwm17]

42. It wasn't Hamas, it was in the 1990's as part of the Oslo Accords

The Palestinians got absolutely nothing in return. It's obvious that the problem is that Israel refuses to recognize the Palestinians' right to exist: note the settlements and apartheid.

Palestinian unity government will recognize Israel: Abbas: http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2014/4/26/palestinians-continuetalks.html

Israel destroyed John Kerry's and Abbas' attempt to negotiate a lasting peace. In Israel's way of thinking, the unity government was a threat. That is why Israel started this current conflict over a crime by two Palestinians against those three teenagers. Israel is getting what it wants.

[former9thward]

43. Israel did not start this conflict.

Hamas started firing rockets into Israel. Forget that or just trying to re-write history? Hamas celebrated the murder of the teenagers BTW.

[cpwm17]

59. No, the barrage of rockets from Hamas started after Israel started its collective punishment campaign

On 12 June 2014, three Israeli teenagers were kidnapped in Gush Etzion, in the West Bank, as they were hitchhiking to their homes.

The Israel Defense Forces initiated Operation Brother's Keeper in search of the three teenagers. As part of the operation, in the following 11 days Israel arrested around 350 Palestinians, including nearly all of Hamas' West Bank leaders. Five Palestinians were killed during the military operation.

On 15 June, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu said that the teens had been kidnapped by Hamas, which Hamas denied. Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas maintained that as of 22 June there was no evidence that Hamas was behind the kidnapping. Hamas denied any involvement in the kidnapping:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_kidnapping_and_murder_of_Israeli_teenagers

The barrage of rockets from Hamas started in late June: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Palestinian_rocket_attacks_on_Israel,_2014

Some groups shot some rockets from the Gaza prison over time that rarely did anything gives no justification for Israel to claim self defense. Israel imprisons 1.7 million people in the Gaza Strip, many of them are people that have been ethnically cleansed from what is now Israel. It is the Palestinians that need to defend themselves, not Israel, Some rockets that rarey do any harm doesn't change that at all.

If Americans were imprisoned as the Palestinians are imprisoned, what would we do?

http://www.vox.com/2014/7/2/5863847/israel-hamas-gaza-kidnapping-punishment

[former9thward]

63. Oh, so Israel was supoosed to do no investigation?

That is what you are calling "collective punishment." Notice when the Palestinian teenager was murdered, Israel did an investigation and within a short time had arrested the killers. The Palestinians refused to give Israel any help whatsoever with the three teenagers that were murdered. But you call it "collective punishment." No, your attempt to re-write history will not fly.

[chrisa]

68. To think that Hamas will stop firing rockets if they get what they want is naive.

Their wish list will only grow. It's infinite. Even if Israel were eradicated, they would simply move on to their next target.

[ChazII]

101. Agree with you 100%. n/t

[840high]

105. Agree.

[cascadiance]

128. We probably killed more civilians with our own shooting of rockets on July 4th than Hamas has...

... leading up to this Israeli onslaught.

The SECOND casualty for the Israelis has been admittedly by the Israelis probably due to friendly fire rather than fire from Gazans.

I think the Israelis are a bit confused as to who is conducting "terrorism" in this situation!

[Purveyor]

8. Oh he'll say something alright to the tired old tune of 'israel has the right to

defend itself'...

I swear that the mossad must have a dirty file on every politician in DC. No other excuse for their support of international war crimes the criminal state of israel conducts with impunity.

[Fozzledick]

10. He already has.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/113469659

[chrisa]

64. The two bullies are fighting each other.

Both have a victim complex the size of the moon, and love to play Eddie Haskell when the other side responds.

[sabrina 1]

124. He won't. For whatever reason, US Presidents never condemn Israel. More Palestinians will die, but

this country will support it, no matter how many.

[Purveyor]

9. They would be there already if it wasn't for the new world of communications

Last edited Thu Jul 17, 2014, 05:04 PM - Edit history (1)

that instantly report their war crimes.

[HERVEPA]

13. The word is "there", not "their" and saying Israelis would build gas chambers is disgusting

[kysrsoze]

16. So is relentlessly bombing Gaza, cutting off water and electric...

Stealing land for illegal settlements, bulldozing homes, etc.

Many of us here are aware of the Israeli endgame of completely pushing out the Palestinians. Bibi has no intention of ever allowing a Palestinian state to exist, and he apparently doesn't care how much blood gets on his hands in the process. You can talk all you want about firing rockets, but that's the military hardware equivalent of throwing rocks when compared with Israel's military equipment and the resulting damage bestowed on Gaza.

[HERVEPA]

18. Yeh, exactly the same as murdering six million Jews, maybe 11 million people total

Just exactly.

Grow the fuck up. You can dislike what Israel is doing without that crap.

[kysrsoze]

20. Well, can you stop defending Israel's continued atrocities?

[HERVEPA]

21. Can you condemn Hamas sending rockets into Israel

Can you condemn a group that practices suicide bombing, murdering its own people?
And your post was not responsive to my comment.

[All_Corners]

22. So don't throw rocks...

[yeoman6987]

26. Israel needs to win big time.

[0rganism]

71. win what?

i'm not seeing any "winners" in this mess

[yeoman6987]

81. Well at least ensure they are not destroyed the countries that would like to see them gone

[0rganism]

83. and the ground invasion of Gaza will surely prevent the destruction of Israel by... who exactly?

help me out here, i'm not seeing it

[yeoman6987]

86. The Hamas MUST be stopped and the Israelis are stepping up to ensure it happens

They are brave. To be surrounded by countries that are not allies must be frightening. I find Israel to be one of the better countries in the World due to their ability to stay "alive". I am so glad I was able to visit this incredible country. So much history that they have preserved. I hope they continue to thrive. Most populations would feel sorry for themselves after what experiences these folks went through. Nope they don't. They get back up and make a wonderful country for themselves and did a great job I might add.

[0rganism]

92. do you think that Hamas could destroy Israel and invading the Gaza strip will help prevent that?

that's what i'm getting from your post, along with what appears to be some acknowledgement of the fact that the post-WW2 state of Israel was created in a very suboptimal situation for a Jewish homeland.

[LittleBlue]

5. This will mean a thousand or more dead

Oh well, they're brown

[cali]

49. ethnically, many Israelis and many Palestinians are indistingushable.

[LittleBlue]

58. And yet the ones in power in Israel are virtually all light-skinned

of European ancestry. The darker-skinned Jews of African or Middle-Eastern origin are at the bottom, which creates conflict within Israeli society.

Israel's cabinet:



Do they look like most of the Palestinians you've seen?

[JI7]

73. yes they do, netanyahu for sure does, there are light palestinians also

[LittleBlue]

76. lol yeah sure

Netanyahu's family is from Poland.

Keep it coming, though. I see some folks who will lecture me to death on cultural appropriation and the name of a football team, but make excuses galore for killing 200 Palestinians. You can't make this up.

[JI7]

77. i'm referring to the way they look and Netanyahu looks brown and could pass for Arab

and many jews from europe could trace their history back to the middle east.

and palestinians(arabs) are mixed in skin tones also.

[LittleBlue]

78. He could pass for Arab in the same way

a Pole could pass for Arab. Puhleeze

[JI7]

80. yes, he can pass for them, he looks more what one would think of as middle eastern

than european. although even in europe you will have difference in skin tones also. as is true across most of the world.

[neverforget]

6. Something about doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result

comes to mind.....

[Aerows]

23. My thought exactly

along with an eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.

[Tetris_Iguana]

95. I suggest the Israelis do something different

By not leaving Gaza.

Enough of the 2 state charade; if the Palestinians want to stay at home, they can choose to reject Hamas and become Israelis.

It'd be a heck of a lot better than what they've got going now.

[earthside]

11. That'll learn'em!

A starved, abused prisoner throws old, dried peas at the guards and is shot in 'self-defense'.

[Little Star]

14. This whole world is going to hell in a hand basket today. ugh!

[mylye2222]

19. Yes, everything is going too fast.....

[Fozzledick]

39. This was a long time coming.

Israel made it clear to Hamas that today's U.N. cease fire was their last chance to show good faith and avoid a ground incursion.

Hamas chose to show their contempt for the cease fire by firing an artillery barrage and launching a ground assault while the cease fire was in place.

[Algernon Moncrieff]

15. So now what? What is the end game?

Will Israel stay in Gaza? Will they dismantle the Palestinian Authority? Does Intifada 3 follow this invasion?

[hrmjustin]

24. this is a disgrace!

[tritsofme]

29. The Jewish State will continue to defend itself against Hamas terrorism.

I hope they crush Hamas.

[Larkspur]

31. The Jewish state is the problem not the solution

Gandhi said that Israel could not be both a Jewish state and a democracy. By doing so, Israel sanctions discrimination at best and apartheid at worse. Bot are anti-democratic.

[tritsofme]

35. Israeli Arabs have full political rights.

This canard is BS.

[RobertEarl]

36. Sounds like you are for violence?

Yep. You can retract, delete or let it stand. But you are now seen as one who is in favor of using violence.

[tritsofme]

46. I have nothing to retract or apologize for

I support the right of Israel to defend itself against terrorism, and I hope the Hamas terrorists are crushed and unable to launch further attacks.

[smiley]

60. Might as well keep hoping

Continued "crushing" will only breed more Hamas terrorists. It's an endless cycle unfortunately.

[tritsofme]

62. Until the Palestinians and their political leaders choose peace

it will never come. In the interim, Israel will defend itself.

[smiley]

75. And the palestinians will respond

and the Israelis will defend themselves....

and the Palestinians will respond....

and the Israelis will respond ....

and the Palestinians will defend themselves....

and the Israelis will defend themselves....

and the Palestinians will respond....

and the Israelis will respond ...

and the Palestinians will defend themselves....

and on and on and on.....

I don't have an opinion over who is right and who is wrong. I agree if Hamas would just lay down their weapons, then we might have peace, but I'm also fairly certain this will never happen. The Palestinian people are a beaten population. The only thing they have left is the do is to fight. War is their life, so it seems from the T.V.

I personally feel Israel would have a better chance of stopping the terror with goodwill, rather than bombs. But I'm smart enough to realize the MIC will never let that happen.

So endless war it is. Rah, Rah, Rah.

[tritsofme]

79. Arafat and Abbas have rejected Israeli offers of peace and an independent state three times.

In 2000, 2001, and 2008. I agree with you though, it is very difficult situation with few good options, but other than defending itself in the here and now, I don't know what much more Israel can do until there is a culture among Palestinians that desires peaceful coexistence.

[RobertEarl]

90. Here, on DU, tritsofme

You don't have to support killing and violence. But you do. Shame on you.

It is best to just support peace and not feed the violence. But you don't. No, You just keep on talking about how some people should be slaughtered. What is it that drives positions like that?

A proper position is to not support ANY violence. Why are you opposed to that position? I see these gawd damned rednecks day in and day out that support violence. I don't expect it on DU, but there you are. What kind of person are you to sit at your computer and support violence in a far away land?

[tritsofme]

111. You are certainly entitled to your position, neither is "proper"

I have never claimed to be a complete pacifist, and I am not.

[RobertEarl]

116. Yep

I'd say you are the opposite of a pacifist. What would one label that which you are? What do you call yourself?

It is just a wonder to me how anyone on DU, after being exposed to all the discussions and the stories about the history of human crimes, could sit there and post evil thoughts. Such postings are not, and never were, 'proper'.

[tritsofme]

119. Again, you can think whatever the hell you wan't.

I don't particularly care.

[RobertEarl]

120. Yes, well

I don't have evil thoughts about you or the innocents that Hamas has around them, as the Israeli bombs blow them away. Those innocents deserve nothing but the best thoughts from people like us. You should join.

[tritsofme]

121. I compleley agree, it is beyond reprehensible that Hamas uses innocents as human shields

instead of evacuating them to safety. It is an absolute tragedy.

[RobertEarl]

122. The bombs are the tragedy

Israeli bombs that you want to use to crush people you don't even know.
Little kids. Their schools. Their little homes.

Evil thoughts are evil thoughts. You might join us in wishing only for the best of the innocents?

[tritsofme]

123. I certainly wish the best for them, I wish Hamas would let them find safety.

I wish Hamas did not launch it's rockets from civilian areas to civilian areas and force innocents to act as their shields.

People that use children as human shields are worth crushing.

Let us not forget that it was Hamas who initiated hostilities here.

[RobertEarl]

125. You wish the best for the kids?

Then how could you be beating the war drums so loudly?

Do you know what integrity is?

[tritsofme]

126. I've explained my position.

I wish this confrontation did not occur, but that was the choice of Hamas, not Israel. Do you understand that?

[RobertEarl]

127. I care not for who is to blame

I only care for the innocents who are being bombed. How many so far?

War is not the answer i speak of, or even consider. To do so, would be, in my book and my education and upbringing, evil.

[shaayecanaan]

93. That is complete and utter rubbish

In relation to the 2001 Taba Talks, for example, it was Israel that walked away from the table:-

from Wikipedia:-

Clinton's initiative led to the Taba negotiations in January 2001, where the two sides published a statement saying they had never been closer to agreement (though such issues as Jerusalem, the status of Gaza, and the Palestinian demand for compensation for refugees and their descendants remained unresolved), but Barak, facing elections, resuspended the talks.

In 2008, the Israeli proposal made by Ehud Olmert was in response to Mahmoud Abbas' offer that would have allowed two-thirds of Israeli settlers to remain where they were:-

The below image shows the lands in green and that the Palestinians were prepared to grant to Israel:-

[hrmjustin]

65. What about the civilians?

[tritsofme]

67. Hamas should certainly stop using them as human shields

And allow them access to their underground bunkers.

However there is less propaganda value in that.

[hrmjustin]

72. But Israeli bombs are killing them.

Israel is responsible for killing them.

I am not saying hamas is innocent but Israel are the ones killing them.

[tritsofme]

74. Yes, it is incredibly tragic that Hamas consigns people to their death in this manner.

The IDF tries to leaflet and warn in advance, but Hamas keeps them there as shields, hoping for civilian casualties to use in their propaganda campaign.

Israel cannot allow Hamas' shameful human shield strategy to successfully prevent strikes on valid military targets.

[hrmjustin]

82. So it is justified to kill children then?

[tritsofme]

84. It is those who force children to remain in military targets that have unnecessarily killed them

and brought them into danger. That is where the blame truly lies.

[hrmjustin]

85. Does Israel have any culpability in these children's murder?

[tritsofme]

87. If they strike a valid military target

and civilians only remain to act as human shields, I would assign full culpability to the group forcing civilians into that situation instead of evacuating them.

[hrmjustin]

88. those kids on thel beach yesterday?

[tritsofme]

89. Don't know the specifics, but it sounds tragic.

As war is.

[hrmjustin]

91. Israel is responsible for their deaths.

[tritsofme]

96. Yes, and as I said it is a tragedy.

However there is a false equivalency between the intentional targeting and endangerment of civilians and what appears to be a horrible mistake.

[hrmjustin]

97. They are still responsible for those deaths.

[tritsofme]

99. I don't believe I said otherwise.

[hrmjustin]

100. It is a bad day for Gazans today.

[tritsofme]

107. Israelis have seen their share of bad days as well.

A situation that could have been avoided for all parties by Hamas not initiating attacks.

[hrmjustin]

108. Well Gaza is having it much worse.

[tritsofme]

109. Yes, it is quite shameful that Hamas initiated these attacks.

And made the positive decision to put civilians on both sides through such an ordeal.

[hrmjustin]

110. And that Israel is bombing the area.

[tritsofme]

112. A justified response to the situation initiated by Hamas

[hrmjustin]

113. And killing children?

[tritsofme]

114. We've already covered this ground. Not gonna go around like a broken record.

Very unfortunate situation Hamas has left these people in.

[hrmjustin]

115. Not justified in my opinion.

[chrisa]

69. While Israel isn't innocent, they're the better of two evils.

A moderate bully vs. fundamentalist terrorists. I would hope for an Israeli victory any day.

[BillZBubb]

103. You are wrong.

The good thing for the Israelis is that so far, the Palestinians have been remarkably free of Islamic fundamentalism. If Israel keeps up its brutal policies that will change much to the woe of Israel and the Palestinians.

Israel is worse than a moderate bully. They are an expansionist state annexing some and harshly occupying the rest of someone else's land. Yet, they expect the occupied not to resist--or be what they label a terrorist.

[chrisa]

118. Hamas exists to promote radical Islam. They are by definition radical fundamentalists.

Hamas, like Al Qaeda, has many goals in mind. Even if Israel gave them all of the land they felt was theirs, they wouldn't stop there. Their main goal is the promotion of radical Islam, mostly gained by exploiting poor / embattled populations like Palestine to use as pawns.

[840high]

106. ...^ that

[malaise]

129. What is more fundamentalist than people believing a group of men

who wrote a book claiming that some imaginary friend bequeathed all land to them and then setting out to steal said land by any means necessary.

Pick your religious book of choice - they are all fugging evil. Ask the Indigenous Americans, ask the Aborigines and the native peoples of Africa and everywhere else on the planet. Loot, plunder and enrich your particular group. Spare me please.

[chrisa]

130. Let's excuse the Palestinians for firing rockets, then, because

other people did bad things in history? Rather than saying, 'Bad things happen,' shouldn't we be discouraging all destructive and evil behavior?

I won't "spare you" calling out Fascist, fundamentalist murderers. If you think Hamas winning is a favorable outcome, you're rooting for an unstable world where fundamentalists are growing in power. Compared to Hamas, Israel is extremely moderate. I don't like Israel, but I don't want radicals in charge either.

[malaise]

131. That's your version

It's a sad say when the abused becomes the abuser. Remember how the Nazis justified their horrific slaughter of Jews.
The world is watching the Jewish slaughter of Palestinians. 300-1 and of course it's their fault.

[Nevernose]

30. The Palestinians can still travel to Egypt

Oh, wait, the Egyptians shut down their side of the border crossing back in 2012, because Hamas attacked THEM, too, and Hamas currently has an 83% disapproval rating in Egypt (although the Palestinian people are generally held in much higher regard).

The blockade is because the rocket attacks, not the other way around. The Israeli government didn't wake up one day and say, "let's blockade Gaza for no reason," they said "let's inspect incoming ships to see if they have weapons or weapon components." Egypt is responsible for the land border, which was closed after fundamentalist nut jobs decided t attack their allies.

[Larkspur]

34. B.S. Israel has never stopped their blockade of Gaza

They ban imports of building materials, won't allow their fishermen to into deeper water, ban Palestinian exports, destroy or refuse to rebuild Gaza's water supply.

Basically, during the non-violent periods, Israel tries to strangle the Palestinian people until they fire rockets that miss their targets. Then Israels launches another "Mowing the Lawn" operation to cull the Palestinian population, which is rising faster than the Jewish one. These invasions are in effect direct genocidal attacks on the Palestinian people.

[Fozzledick]

37. Does Israel control the Egyptian border?

What a disgusting load of crap.

[Nevernose]

38. Horseshit. Absolute horseshit.

There are what, two MILLION residents of Gaza? And Israel has killed two hundred people (sad, poor people for the most part, who happened to be near Hamas rocket launchers).

They don't ban imports of building materials, they ban imports of pipes, which are used to build rockets. Gaza has a water supply, but, again, needs the same pipes that are used to build rockets in order to maintain. The fishermen aren't allowed not deep water because they make contact with people providing them with materials to make rockets and bombs.

But, again, you blame Israel. If it's really an Israeli issue, then why not send all those things through the EGYPTIAN CONTROLLED southern border?

[tritsofme]

47. Why do people just "happen" to be near Hamas rocket launchers?

It's not just a coincidence, Hamas is using them as human shields, hoping for the death of innocent civilians to use in their PR war. Hamas is a sick and disgusting terrorist group.

[Whisp]

33. sickening bully

[spanone]

40. and it will go on and on and on and on and on and on.....

such hatred is hard to fathom...

[dhill926]

48. and all you have to do,

is follow this thread to see why….

[Joel thakkar]

41. No Solution in sight...

until a mass movement of people is done...

Unfortunately, israel is not going to stop..the only way i think will be the 1.7 million people in gaza will be forced to settle in west bank...although israel will also capture half of west bank...thus, leaving them with only the other half.

[alarimer]

44. We need to stop supporting this criminal regime.

No better than Iran or Syria at this point.

[BillZBubb]

52. One day America will wise up and pull the plug on Israel.

Our undeserved, one-sided, and unappreciated support for Israel is at the heart of many of our problems in the Middle East.

The Israeli strategy is unsustainable and dangerous in the long term. The US needs to understand that and leave Israel to its chosen fate.

[Karmadillo]

53. A Plague on One House

Links supporting the assertions made below can be found within the article on the Jacobin website.

https://www.jacobinmag.com/2014/07/a-plague-on-one-house/

A Plague on One House
7.17.14
by Greg Shupak

<edit>

This colonial inversion of reality is likewise present in Western reporting on the conflict, which must justify the Israeli assault on Palestine to its audience. For example, earlier in the current massacre we were frequently told that “both sides” fighting in historic Palestine are suffering and are in the wrong.

This rhetoric of “both sides” implies that pain and fault belong equally to Palestinians and Israelis. It erases manifold, unmistakable, qualitative and quantitative differences at play in Israel’s attack on the Gaza Strip and the political-historical context in which this is taking place — most centrally, that what is occurring is part of a settler-colonial invasion.

“Both sides” rhetoric refuses to make even the easiest, most obvious judgment, to which any honest evaluation of the information points: that Israel is massacring Palestinian adults and children, 77% of whom are civilians, and subjecting them to collective punishment; that Israel evidently claims for itself a right to extra-judicially execute anyone who it says is a Hamas member, a practice too few among even Palestine’s allies have denounced; that Israel is bombarding what is essentially a giant refugee camp home to an imprisoned population of a people Israel has ethnically cleansed, occupied, subjected to apartheid, and repeatedly slaughtered; that international law does not grant Israel a “right to defend itself” against the Gaza Strip. And that international law does grant Palestinians a right to resist using armed struggle.

To employ “both sides” rhetoric completely misrepresents the situation. It is not “both sides” who take thousands of political prisoners. Both sides do not systematically torture each other. Both sides do not control each other’s freedom of movement, or access to the sea, drinking water, and education.

more...

[countryjake]

54. Like a virile Goliath determined to tromple...

I'll be lighting a candle for the defenseless who will now be dying at the hands of this huge military might.

[99Forever]

56. In my personal opinion...

... Israel is the second worst terrorist nation on the planet.

[Blue_In_AK]

66. I'm sorry,

but I do not see Israel as blameless in this situation.

I never get into I/P stuff, never go into the group, but I have strong opinions on this which I will generally keep to myself.

Suffice to say, Israel is not blameless.

[G_j]

70. we don't need natural disasters

we make our own...

[McCamy Taylor]

94. Well how special. All those soldiers in their tanks up against all those civilians.

I am getting a sense of deja vu? Where have I seen something like this before? Oh, yeah. Now I remember. Maybe I'll go start a thread.

[McCamy Taylor]

98. And right in the middle of Ramadan! Oh, how history loves to repeat itself.

Except, of course, that other famous event happened during Passover, didn't it.



Remember, one person's terrorist is another's freedom fighter.

[BillZBubb]

102. As much as I oppose and denounce Israels' actions in Gaza

there is no comparison to the Warsaw Ghetto uprising.

The Nazis were intent on taking all the Jewish residents to death camps and the residents knew it. They rightfully and heroically fought back against overwhelming odds.

Gaza is an entirely different situation. The Israelis aren't trying to murder every Palestinian. Let's not go overboard in our analysis of the current mess.

[McCamy Taylor]

104. "Gaza is an entirely different situation." Depends on your point of view.

If you are a dead child---excuse me dead "little snake"---it probably looks pretty much the same.

[WatermelonRat]

117. What a vulgar comparison.

More innocent people were killed in one DAY at the height of the Jewish, Armenian, Cambodian, and Rwandan genocides than in eighty years of this conflict. You and all others making the vile comparison need to get that through your heads. All these years later, the world's Jewish population is only just beginning to reach pre-Holocaust levels. To call this a genocide is a mockery of all the victims of actual genocide.

So far, this operation has killed fewer people than were on that plane shot down over Ukraine. The holocaust killed 11 million people. Just sit back and visualize just how many people that is. Imagine every person in New York City dead. Imagine the entire country of Belgium depopulated. That's more people than you'll meet in your entire life. It's more than live in all but seven American states. Think of that the next time you're considering this comparison.

[McCamy Taylor]

133. There is no karmic ledger that says "The people of Israel are allowed X killings

to make up for what some other folks in Europe suffered." Murder of innocents is murder of innocents. If we are going to say that victims of past atrocities have a right to pay back, then my Irish blood says that I can go to London and take out a few Brits and my Cherokee blood says I can kill at least one white North Georgian. But I do not believe in murder, no even in capital punishment.

[WatermelonRat]

134. That has nothing to do with what I said.

My comment was entirely regarding the tremendous scale of genocide and the fact that applying the word to a comparatively minor conflict such as this trivializes it.

[malaise]

132. +1,000

Dead is dead