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Benton D Struckcheon

(2,347 posts)
Sat Aug 23, 2014, 11:07 AM Aug 2014

Deng Xiaoping - the world's greatest economist

Entire piece here: http://ablog.typepad.com/keytrendsinglobalisation/2014/08/deng-xiaoping-the-worlds-greatest-economist.html

August 22, 2014 is the 110th anniversary of the birth of Deng Xiaoping. Numerous achievements would ensure Deng Xiaoping a major position in China's history – his role in shaping the People's Republic of China, his steadfastness during persecution in the Cultural Revolution, his extraordinarily balanced attitude even after return to power towards the development and recent history of China, his all-round role after 1978 in leading the country. But one ensures him a position among a tiny handful of people at the peak not only of Chinese but of world history. This was China's extraordinary economic achievement after reforms began in 1978, and the decisive role this played not only in the improvement of the living standards of Chinese people but the country's national rejuvenation. So great was the impact of this that it may objectively be said to have altered the situation not only of China but of the world.
China's economic performance after the beginning of its 1978 reforms simply exceeded the experience of any other country in human history. To give only a partial list:

• China achieved the most rapid growth in a major economy in world history.

• China experienced the fastest growth of living standards of any major economy.

• China lifted 620 million people out of internationally defined poverty.

• Measured in internationally comparable prices, adjusted for inflation, the greatest increase in economic output in a single year in any country outside China was the U.S. in 1999, when it added US$567 billion, whereas in 2010 China added US$1,126 billion – twice as much.

• During the beginning of China's rapid growth, 22 percent of the world's population was within its borders – seven times that of United States at the beginning of its own fast economic development.

Wholly implausibly, it is sometimes argued that this success was merely due to "pragmatism" and achieved without overall economic theories, concepts, or a leadership really understanding the subject...In reality this argument is entirely specious. Deng Xiaoping's approach to economic policy was certainly highly practical regarding application – the famous "it doesn't matter if a cat is black or white provided it catches mice." But it was extremely theoretical regarding foundations – as shown clearly in such works as In Everything We Do We Must Proceed from the Realities of the Primary Stage of Socialism, We Are Undertaking An Entirely New Endeavour, and Adhere to the Principle to Each According to his Work....Underlying Deng Xiaoping's analysis from 1978, frequently in its literal wording, was Marx's famous "Critique of the Gotha Programme" – his most extensive commentary on the construction of a socialist society.


This is an extraordinarily interesting critique of what has happened in China. Worth reading at the original site in its entirety, and not just once.
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snagglepuss

(12,704 posts)
1. What BS. More Chinese propaganda. One could could also argue that Hitler
Sat Aug 23, 2014, 12:28 PM
Aug 2014

was a brilliant economist. What is so brilliant about forcing people to work like slaves at slave wages? No genius IQ is required to know that creating a manfacturing base using what is essentially slave labor and next to no environmental or safety standards regulations would be extremely attractive to capitalist worldwide.

 

hifiguy

(33,688 posts)
2. Hitler was a terrible economist.
Sat Aug 23, 2014, 12:52 PM
Aug 2014

The pre-war German economy under AH was basically a ponzi scheme fueled by rearmament. It was a reasonably prosperous time for the average German but it was wholly unsustainable.

I spent nearly a month in China in the summer of 2013. Not in Beijing, Guangzhou or Shanghai, but in a nothing-special place called Fuyang City, outside of Hangzhou and functionally a suburb of the larger city. I saw a country that has made astonishing steps towards first-world status in a shockingly short period of time. China is not there yet, but it will be far sooner than you would think. Every last one of the amenities and businesses one would expect to find in any American city was present and most businesses were packed to the gills with individuals and families shopping. There is an immense middle class in China and to deny this is to deny reality.

snagglepuss

(12,704 posts)
3. The point about Hitletr is that he like the Chinese used slave labor and didn't have
Sat Aug 23, 2014, 03:59 PM
Aug 2014

to worry about unions and regulations. It is appalling that on DU of all places people would praise unregulated Capitalism that has resulted in massive enviromental damage and oppressive working conditions. Furthermore what evidence have you that their economy isn't going to crash, according to the FT its just a matter of when.

 

hifiguy

(33,688 posts)
4. China has a LOAD of problems
Sat Aug 23, 2014, 04:12 PM
Aug 2014

to be sure. There seems to be more interest there than in the US government regarding renewable energy and environmental issues judging from what I saw on the (very good) English language news channel while I was there. The country's president made a couple of major speeches about environmental and energy issues while I was there and they were well-covered on the news.

There is no doubt that the standard of living of the average Chinese citizen has skyrocketed in the last thirty years, however, and that is an admirable accomplishment. I am not editorializing, only describing what I saw over a reasonably extended visit.

Unfortunately, these days American employers don't need to worry about unions either. And a lot of them ignore regulations and go unpunished

snagglepuss

(12,704 posts)
6. There is no such thing as a good news channel in China, they are all have govt censors so of
Sat Aug 23, 2014, 04:23 PM
Aug 2014

course you'd hear wonderful accomplishments. As for US companies ignoring unions or busting them and ignoring regulations, that has happened in response to what is happening in China. China is bringing down all countries to their level.

 

hifiguy

(33,688 posts)
7. All I can say is what I saw.
Sat Aug 23, 2014, 04:27 PM
Aug 2014

They reported extensively on a couple of natural disasters that occurred while I was there - terrible flooding in western China. On the scene reports, death/injury tallies, lengthy footage of the damage caused, interiews with survivors. That looked like honest reporting to me but what do I know?

 

hifiguy

(33,688 posts)
8. My only real point was that China has come a long way
Sat Aug 23, 2014, 04:29 PM
Aug 2014

in a short time.

And to be frank in our elections we only get to choose between the slightly less oppressive wing of the Money Party and the REALLY OPPRESSIVE wing of the Money Party.

Benton D Struckcheon

(2,347 posts)
9. The article was making a point about the economics of the place,
Sat Aug 23, 2014, 07:00 PM
Aug 2014

not the politics. If you actually read the whole thing, you will note that there is a very interesting mix of Keynes and Marx that Deng appears to have put in place, that the author thinks is what is responsible for their stunning success economically, and it is stunning. Time will tell if he is right or not, but I put it up because I thought the point he made was very interesting. It doesn't imply any endorsement of the Chinese political system or of any particular stance the Chinese gov't has on any issue, for that matter. It does merit some thought, for those who are interested in those kinds of questions.

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
10. We have never seen a truly Marxist/Socialist/Communist economic society.
Sat Aug 23, 2014, 07:52 PM
Aug 2014

The great experiment continues in the People's Republic of China. The transition from a Chinese feudal system to a Marxist system with only nominal capitalism (a natural state of greedy selfish humans) in these numbers is historically remarkable.

The transition is ongoing, people have to adapt. From the bottom up, the Chinese have a democratic system of local control, which works up through the Party. The article describes how Deng created an amalgam of Keynesian state control of the means of production while allowing smaller segments of private enterprise to infuse capital in pursuit of a Communist state. The insular nature of an enclosed state beginning in feudalism has been the problem.

Since so many of us in the US are merely peasants and work for slave subsistence wages with ultimate dependence on the State, are we all that different from the vast number of Chinese?

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