The Japanese had comfortable accomodations in the internment camps, too.

[WilliamPitt]

If you stretch the word "comfortable" to the breaking point.

No shower. No books. No television. No radio. No choice for Kaci Hickox.

"National security." "National emergency."

Tyranny will always find an excuse for its tyranny.

When you allow government officials to "quarantine" people in an atmosphere of fear, hysteria and political pressure, nothing good ever comes of it. George Takei can tell you all about it.

This could have and should have been handled much better, and when Kaci Hickox gets her multi-million dollar judgment after suing over her treatment, I will raise a toast to her.

And P.S., when you stomp on people who put themselves on the line to help other people in danger zones, pretty soon no one will be willing to help.

[Liberal_Dog]

1. K & R

Americans are always far to eager to give in to fear.

[riqster]

2. With you 100% on this one.

The road to Dystopia seems so attractive to the masses, at first.

[procon]

3. If this type of hysterical kneejerk reaction to a crisis

typifies Chris Christie's executive management style, he clearly not have temperament to even be considered as a presidential candidate.

[CountAllVotes]

4. The Navajo indians that were locked up w/them didn't much care for it

Sadly, one of my best friends (who happens to be Navajo) was forced to live in a Japanese concentration camp during WWII. Sad but true history this is. I wonder how many know about this crime against our Native Americans?

Nothing good can come out of such an atmosphere is correct Mr. Takei!

[malaise]

5. Seriously what they are getting away with so far

is frightening.

Word is she will be released today because they know they are up shit creek re her rights.

[riqster]

6. She will be allowed to finish her quarantine at home.

We'll see what that actually means.

[WilliamPitt]

8. "allowed"

She should never have been placed in this position in the first place.

[riqster]

20. Bulls-eye.

[yellowcanine]

27. I strongly suspect Christie got some belated legal advice. "Case by case basis" my ass.

If there was any doubt before, this proves Christie is seriously lacking in the presidential timber department. He panicked to save his political hide for 2016. Shameful.

[MrScorpio]

7. Tyranny is as American as cherry pie.

[heaven05]

14. when have AA mattered

Last edited Mon Oct 27, 2014, 01:37 PM - Edit history (3)

ever, at all, except as votes, cheap labor, police punching bags or target practice(take your pick), creators of 'Bitter Fruit' and being slaves? By and large, never. That graphic is telling and shameful. That ZERO, even more so. Obama is an exception, yet precisely BECAUSE of his race, the last six years have been an eye opener, not unexpected, for me on racial politics and culture in amerikkka. I hope Ms. Hickox can retire. Soon. Thank you for your service to people who need it.

[KamaAina]

31. Ooooh. Nice second post.

And nice username, too. Enjoy your stay.

[MrScorpio]

36. Poof! nt

[MrScorpio]

34. You signed up just to crap that out?

You know black soldiers died in that war too?

No, you didn't, I bet.

[heaven05]

43. lot of them

coming from discussionist.

[ZombieHorde]

41. Well that's an interesting chart. nt

[RebelOne]

50. I am glad to see that our Native Americans received some compensation.

But I believe that they should have been given back the lands we stole from them.

[Oktober]

66. You find me a person who was born then...

... Make a case and well talk.

This sins of the Father crap is ridiculous...

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

9. Consider the source: Chris Christie.

And I can't believe that people on DU are actually defending what he did. The American Bar Association doesn't think much of this sort of quarantine:

...states are required to protect civil liberties during public health emergencies. Quarantine and isolation orders must be conducted in accordance with substantive and procedural due process, and any restrictions of civil liberties should be legal and as minimally restrictive as reasonably possible. To this end, states should ensure that the following five threshold requirements are met: 1. the individual must pose an actual threat to the public; 2. the intervention must be reasonable and effective; 3. it must be conducted in a manner that comports with equal protection and due process; 4. individuals must be provided with safe and comfortable conditions; and 5. reasonable compensation for loss of income must be ensured.

First, the individual must have actually been exposed to an infectious agent (for quarantine) or infected with the agent (for isolation), and be in the period of communicability. There is no compelling state interest in quarantining or isolating an individual that does not actually pose a public health risk. In a situation where the individual does not pose a public health risk, the individual may use the writ of habeas corpus to challenge the legality of her or his detention, but the writ will not be available if a showing of legal cause for the detention can be made.

The rest is here: http://www.americanbar.org/publications/law_practice_today_home/law_practice_today_archive/april11/protecting_civil_liberties_during_quarantine_and_isolation_in_public_health_emergencies.html

[WilliamPitt]

10. Great link.

Thank you.

[malaise]

24. Great link

Thanks

[heaven05]

44. I think

the RW(christie) is punishing people, as in the case of Ms. Hickox, precisely because she went to Africa to help. To try to stop compassionate people from helping.

[ncjustice80]

64. Why are people on DU defending a rethug???

Sorry, anyone who stands up for that toad Christie needs a banhammer.

[SoapBox]

11. I know...I will have my ass kicked for this...

She POSSIBLY had a spreadable (yes, I understand how it spreads) deadly disease.

The Japanese did not.

Do we need better process and solution...yes.

But her arrogance and nasty "I know it all attitude" have not won me over.

And I would to see all of her supporters, go camp with her, unprotected, in the containment.

p.s...I see that she is going home to finish her quarantine.

[phil89]

12. I'm with you. She's making

a spectacle of herself. If quarantine is this mystifying to her, she needs another profession imo.

[heaven05]

15. geez!!!!!!

[uppityperson]

39. how DARE a nurse understand communicable diseases, especially returning from helping contain

an epidemic of a deadly one? Surely she can not understand that it is not contagious until she has symptoms, which she doesn't. How can she NOT understand being involuntarily incarcerated?

Seriously?

[Marrah_G]

61. If she were a good woman she would shut up and take it

Only bad women stand up for themselves. They get all arrogant and stuff.

[rhett o rick]

60. You might say she is getting quite uppity.

You might, I wouldn't. I think her reaction is commendable. Glad to see someone brave enough to speak out.

[heaven05]

16. Right!

you're so very right.

[yellowcanine]

17. "She POSSIBLY had a spreadable disease." Kind of like someone MIGHT commit a crime?

[riqster]

28. I might have a heart attack someday. Quick, take away my driving license!

[IMG][/IMG]

FFS...

[neverforget]

48. and all those Japanese - Americans could POSSIBLY have

been spies for Imperial Japan. Except they weren't.

Don't make decisions based on fear!

[LostInAnomie]

51. +1

[CBGLuthier]

55. shhhh logical thought can not compete with hyperbolic hyperventilating on the internet

just wasting your breath being all sensible and such.

[yellowcanine]

13. Forced quarantine of a healthy individual is false imprisonment.

I expect the SCOTUS to rule quickly that Christie does not have the right to do this.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

18. Tryrants have strong thumbs, weak fingers.

[riqster]

30. Nice point.

[wyldwolf]

22. REALLY?!? We had NO idea!

[hobbit709]

23. And your point is?

Or does it really matter. Bye-Bye.

[KamaAina]

32. Um, they were 'interned'

unless you're implying that FDR buried them.

[tclambert]

21. But are they feeding her lemon chicken?

[Dustlawyer]

25. Yes, we were so prepared for this!

Sarcasm

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

26. My brother-in-law was a guard at one of the internment camps.

Being from L.A., he even knew some of the internees. He was horrified, and begged to be transferred. He was, and guarded German and Italian POWs in Idaho.

[KurtNYC]

40. I used to pass Manzanar on my way to Mammoth Mountain Ski Area

75 miles from nowhere. Cold wind blowing dust and sand day and night. All that is left is the perimeter and a discreet plaque.

2 years later I worked on the film "Come See the Paradise"

[Stardust]

46. Your film looks really interesting. I'd love to see it. I had a friend who was sent to a camp along

with her family. Was there more than one camp? My friend did not elaborate and I didn't press her. I wish I had asked her more about it.

[KurtNYC]

49. Not my film -- Alan Parker (Fame, Midnight Express, Mississippi Burning) wrote and directed

Manzanar was the first of ten camps. Most were much further inland.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manzanar#Wartime:_1942.E2.80.9345

[Art_from_Ark]

62. There were a couple of camps in Arkansas

One was at Jerome, the other at Rohwer, both in the south-eastern part of the state. A few years ago, I visited the Rohwer site. The only features that identify the site as a former relocation camp are a monument and a cemetery.

[Rozlee]

45. Yes, the German and Italian POWs that were allowed more freedom than the Japanese internees.

They got to sleep in prison dorms and go out in the community to work on farms and factories. There were 400,000 Nazi POWs in the US during the war. They were given surprisingly great latitude. One African-American vet who had lost a leg in the war gave an account of how Nazi POWs were allowed to drink from WHITES ONLY water fountains while he still had to drink from COLORED ONLY. Very few of them tried to escape and the few that attempted to foment revolution didn't have much success; the POWs had it good. A group of a dozen escaped and fled into the Arizona desert. Bad idea. They wound up dying of dehydration and rattlesnake bites. One that escaped in North Carolina and was drinking from a water hose got shot by an old lady who thought he was 'a Yankee.' She said she wouldn't have shot him if she'd known he was German. Go figure. "Nazi Prisoners of War in America" by Arnold Krammer goes in great lengths about the situation. The POWs had it good compared to the Japanese internees. They were fed well and had a lot more freedom in comparison.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

47. And, according to my BIL, some of the local farmgirls became very friendly to the

Italian POWs who were digging potatoes. The Germans, mostly Afrika Korps, not so much.

[Rozlee]

53. The book did mention that.

It said they weren't allowed to stay in the US after the war, but that many American women followed them to Italy, married them and then brought them back. Your brother-in-law must have such interesting stories.

[JDPriestly]

37. You quarantine people in their home and watch their symptoms.

If the symptoms worsen, you take them to the hospital. But not until then.

That's the way quarantines used to work. I remember very clearly.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

38. I've come up with the 'split the difference solution' to the quarantine/no quarantine dilemma.

Mandatory 3 week paid (all expenses paid) vacations out of country, with the vacationers getting to choose any of the islands, central america, south america or europe.

Heh.

[DrBulldog]

42. Shameful that a Democratic governor has to act like an ignorant rights-usurping loon ...

... when partnering himself with a wacko Republican governor. no wonder people have no idea who to vote for these days.

[TM99]

52. This is just plain silliness.

One woman returns from an Ebola stricken country. She tests for a high fever at the airport. She is put into medical quarantine to determine if she is infected. She spends a mere few days in an isolation tent within a hospital wing in which medical professionals determine that the thermometer was not functioning properly, and she tests negative, for now, for Ebola. She is being released to return home to continue self-monitoring for the remainder of the incubation period.

She had internet access and her cellphone. She did interviews and received fucking take-out if requested.

Could it have been handled better? Sure, I suppose so. So could Texas and Thomas Duncan. This is a new disease in the US. There will be some fuck ups until policy, protocols, and politics are in alignment with realities both medical and ethical.

Where was the outrage when Duncan's family broke self-monitoring protocols and were placed in mandatory isolation?

To equate this to internment camps is insulting and stupid.

And P.S. - No, only self-entitled little arrogant narcissists will decide not to help. Thousands of men and women from the military to civilian medical centers will continue to go to danger zones and won't act like immature nits when faced with an unknowable situation that may be potentially harmful to others.

[sunnystarr]

54. Your facts are wrong

The tent was not in a hospital wing it was outside behind the hospital. There was no shower or other bathing there. The toilet was a camping chemical toilet tent. She was given no reading material, had no internet, no TV. They finally gave her reading material and internet on her last day there after public complaints. She had no fever during her stay in that tent. She never felt ill.

In contrast the 5 year old who returned from Guinea and was taken to the hospital 2 days later with fever and vomiting was put in isolation in the hospital and tested for Ebola. He didn't have Ebola. No tent either.

[TM99]

56. No your facts are wrong.

Hickox arrived in Newark Liberty Airport on Friday afternoon and after a seven-hour wait at the hospital. She was put in an isolation tent inside University Hospital in Newark.

http://www.wcvb.com/health/quarantined-nurse-knocks-ebola-policy/29346786#ixzz3HJbrKROM

A University Hospital spokeswoman said measures were being taken to ensure Ms. Hickox was “as comfortable as possible” while she remained in a “climate-controlled, extended care facility area.”

“A CDC team has toured the facility and consulted on site,” she said. “Our primary concern is ensuring the health of the patient and the public.”

Ms. Hickox has access to her cell phone, reading material and has received take-out food and drink upon request, the spokeswoman said. Federal, state and hospital officials are continuing to evaluate her medical status, she said.

When asked about how quarantined individuals would be housed, a spokeswoman for the New Jersey Department of Health said that “the preference is to quarantine individuals at home.” If that isn’t possible, the state Department of Human Services will find temporary housing for them.

http://online.wsj.com/articles/nurse-detained-in-new-jersey-for-ebola-calls-conditions-really-inhumane-1414352575

The hospital was not equipped for the sudden need for an isolation area, and they did as best as they could given the circumstances. She was inconvenienced in an unfolding situation, and now it is resolved.

[sunnystarr]

58. That wasn't until later

In a telephone interview Saturday with CNN, Hickox said she did not initially have a shower, flushable toilet, television or reading material in the special tent she was in at University Hospital in Newark.

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/jersey-releases-quarantined-nurse-26490836

Her lawyer was on Up with Chris Hayes tonight and revealed that the tent wasn't in the hospital or outside, so I was mistaken by other reports I read. The tent was set up in a "garage" like structure.

When she arrived back in the US the laser thermometer read normal but she was still detained for a while. During that time she became agitated and when they used the laser thermometer again it read 101. However he reported that these laser thermometers aren't very accurate (how comforting to know). So when they took her to the hospital and took her temperature the normal way, she had no elevation and it was normal. So she wasn't symptomatic at all. No reason for a quarantine in a tent in a garage.

[SiobhanClancy]

57. I'm just sick about this....

Just as troubling were the responses to the Portland Press Herald post on Facebook about this (major Maine newspaper). The majority expressed anger and outright hatred toward Kaci and hope that LePage(hopefully soon to be ex-governor) would take steps to keep her away or at least isolated. People can be so mean-spirited,ignorant and selfish that sometimes it is hard not to despair of the human race altogether.

[renegade000]

59. I'm for potentially drastic government action in the case of an ACTUAL emergency, but...

the fears about Ebola in this country are so overblown it's embarrassing (and frightening of itself).

I mean I get it, I'm a pretty cautious individual myself, and "better safe than sorry," is a decent mantra in my books. But you have to try to couple your degree of concern to the actual risks. The only two cases of Ebola transmission in the US have been between a terminally ill patient and two of his caregivers (the people tasked with literally handling his bodily waste) who had insufficient protective gear. It strikes me that the communicability of this disease is pretty darn low.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

63. Jews were comfortable in gas-chambers of Auschwitz, after Nazis told them they were getting showers;

however, they were more "comfortable" in the ovens.

[WilliamPitt]

65. Um...

[Oktober]

67. Say what?

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

68. What?