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Faryn Balyncd

(5,125 posts)
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 01:11 AM Jan 2015

"Your job is to hold my feet to the fire."




"Your job is to hold my feet to the fire. So, you need to be out there everyday raising these issues, telling us when we’re doing the right or wrong thing. My role is to be President of the United States, and your role is to be a strong voice for people who aren’t always heard."





http://www.stanforddaily.com/2011/12/01/a-foot-in-two-worlds/








"I think that’s a powerful message — what produces good policy is not just the expertise of people inside the government, but the pressure that comes from outside."

Jeremy Weinstein


". . . I think at the core of the president’s agenda on democracy and human rights is recognizing that sustainable political change comes from the bottom up,” Weinstein said. “. . . . .You tend not to get the kinds of outcomes that you’re interested in unless you have that base of support and interest with people willing to take risks. . . . ”

http://www.stanforddaily.com/2011/12/01/a-foot-in-two-worlds/





The president instructed his supporters to hold "my feet to the fire" for the simple reason that without this pressure to change course when wrong, without his supporters assertively being a "voice for people who aren’t always heard.", his ability to achieve democratic outcomes is made much harder.

Blind approval is the last thing he needs: To the contrary, such misguided "support" all but guarantees that the political pressure to triangulate will result in continued shifts of the Overton Window even furthers to the right.

Blind, unquestioning approval is thus not helpful (but harmful) even when the President is fighting for correct policy, because it does not provide the positive pressure of an assertive base that is essential in this age of sold-out corporate media.

But blind, unquestioning approval is catastrophic when the President's policy is in need of the correction that can only be provided by a vigorous base of support that demands that a ill-begotten course be corrected.




Our President had the foresight to explicitly instruct us to hold his feet to the fire when he is doing the "wrong thing" that used an example of us being a "voice for people who aren’t always heard".

This wisdom could is particularly appropriate in 2015 as we (following on the heels of a budget deal that capitulated to Wall Street) confront a multifaceted corporatist attack on workers, on the ability of governments to protect the environment, on citizens, on due process through our judicial system, and massive inappropriate expansion of intellectual property laws in ways that hinder rather than promote innovation, that enrich the 1% on the backs of everyone else, all written in secret by corporate lobbyists, and falsely peddled as a "trade deal", and demands that Congress vote with no input or amendments, on faith alone.





If ever there was a time that our President NEEDS us to be that voice for people who aren’t always heard., and to hold his feet to the fire, to tell him when he is wrong, and to provide the public pressure necessary to prevent a policy disaster much worse than NAFTA, is this not the time?



































76 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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"Your job is to hold my feet to the fire." (Original Post) Faryn Balyncd Jan 2015 OP
light em up. n/t wildbilln864 Jan 2015 #1
Exactly! marym625 Jan 2015 #2
Yes, not calling him a "pos used car salesman" and tell him to "stfu-unicorns blah blah blah" Cha Jan 2015 #3
That's not cool marym625 Jan 2015 #4
To me it's just childish disrespect. Criticize all we want.. "hold his feet to the fire"! but, the Cha Jan 2015 #5
I'm sure that they wouldn't marym625 Jan 2015 #7
I agree. Ridicule is not productive but passionate disagreement can be. Kablooie Jan 2015 #22
Thank you, Kablooie Cha Jan 2015 #24
We MUST all unite to tell the President that we don't want the TPP and related trade agreements. Enthusiast Jan 2015 #68
You are right Cha sheshe2 Jan 2015 #8
The hot shots spewing venom.. President Obama gets all that from the right wing and he just Cha Jan 2015 #13
The hot shots spewing~ sheshe2 Jan 2015 #26
Yeah, like they haven't been. Just drop the "******* pos used car blah blah blah" & the "stuf blah" Cha Jan 2015 #29
Repeating that "POS used car salesman" line over and over and over... beerandjesus Jan 2015 #21
FYI, beerandjesus.. it was repeated on DU today.. you can tell them to knock it off if it upsets you Cha Jan 2015 #23
It doesn't upset me. beerandjesus Jan 2015 #25
It upset me that someone called the President that again today.. and it wasn't hidden. Hold his Cha Jan 2015 #27
Good statement. On the substance, then, we agree. beerandjesus Jan 2015 #31
"Stupid name calling" aspirant Jan 2015 #32
The ones calling President Obama a "pos used car salesman" and telling him to stfu are setting Cha Jan 2015 #33
Repeat "stupid name calling" aspirant Jan 2015 #35
Cha, marym625 Jan 2015 #37
Right, Mary.. no one is "infallible".. the President makes mistakes.. and there's always many around Cha Jan 2015 #50
As do I marym625 Jan 2015 #51
That's just wrong to accuse someone of being a "hater and a racist" because they disagree.. there's Cha Jan 2015 #66
Thank you, Cha. marym625 Jan 2015 #67
FU Mr Pres is once again..... sheshe2 Jan 2015 #30
Look out everybody sheshe2 is checking out the Recs. bahrbearian Jan 2015 #40
And exactly how am able to ban these people? sheshe2 Jan 2015 #52
Come on tell the truth , you'd love to ban people wouldn't you. bahrbearian Jan 2015 #74
... sheshe2 Jan 2015 #75
What's more damaging? MannyGoldstein Jan 2015 #70
No, more blind unquestioning approval!!! Balloons and rainbows!!! NewDeal_Dem Jan 2015 #6
Obviously.... kentuck Jan 2015 #9
You nailed it. Faryn Balyncd Jan 2015 #10
only problem with that is because he is no longer running for office there is no more liberal_at_heart Jan 2015 #11
Too bad labor Democrats are forced to spend time "raising issues" and holding feet to the fire. pa28 Jan 2015 #12
no kidding. liberal_at_heart Jan 2015 #14
It is almost unbelievable. Faryn Balyncd Jan 2015 #15
You are right about that... kentuck Jan 2015 #16
Yep. And if Clinton wins Union Scribe Jan 2015 #38
No, BubbaFett Jan 2015 #17
No problem.. there's plenty of others who are taking up that action. Cha Jan 2015 #19
The essence of a "job" BubbaFett Jan 2015 #20
I'm not worried about the President doing his job. He's good at it. Cha Jan 2015 #28
Have those who crashed the global economy been prosecuted ? SamKnause Jan 2015 #18
How HAVE you held his feet to the fire? brooklynite Jan 2015 #42
honor us with some suggestions Doctor_J Jan 2015 #44
I'm not the person claiming to have "held his feet to the fire" brooklynite Jan 2015 #46
so there wasn't any way to make him do what he said he would do Doctor_J Jan 2015 #47
"A conservative republican"... brooklynite Jan 2015 #48
sorry. corporate republican Doctor_J Jan 2015 #49
... SammyWinstonJack Jan 2015 #60
...^ that 840high Jan 2015 #64
I suspect that he wears asbestos socks. CentralMass Jan 2015 #34
HA SammyWinstonJack Jan 2015 #61
.... DeSwiss Jan 2015 #36
+1 Nuff said. nt raouldukelives Jan 2015 #41
He was talking to the Koch Brothers and Jamie Dimon unfortunately. Doctor_J Jan 2015 #39
Keep reminding them, Turd Wayers don't have very good memories. 99Forever Jan 2015 #43
There is no worse heresy than that the office sanctifies the holder of it. Lord Acton Tierra_y_Libertad Jan 2015 #45
Oh my God, you guys are dusting off ALL of the used up, over played cards this weekend! Number23 Jan 2015 #53
Absolutely nailed it, 23 Bobbie Jo Jan 2015 #54
I sincerely can't understand the point of all of this impotent, deranged and moronic screaming Number23 Jan 2015 #55
who is "you guys"? Ramses Jan 2015 #56
'You guys' would be the ones now leaping like kangaroos now that Obama-bashing season is back Number23 Jan 2015 #58
well i cant speak for others here and im fairly new Ramses Jan 2015 #59
Your analysis is incorrect. DisgustipatedinCA Jan 2015 #69
I disagree with that 100%. And I sure as shit ain't the only person that's noticed Number23 Jan 2015 #72
That shouldn't give anyone the right to write a thread telling him to 'stfu' Hutzpa Jan 2015 #57
Do you think he hears any of us on the TPP? Even the Unions are telling him no. jwirr Jan 2015 #62
He hears us. Does he care? 840high Jan 2015 #65
I don't get it. pangaia Jan 2015 #63
K & R !!! WillyT Jan 2015 #71
And he can take the fire but I'm sure he wasn't expecting the bitten ankles. great white snark Jan 2015 #73
Well that last Midterm election sure held his feet to the fire huh? VanillaRhapsody Jan 2015 #76

marym625

(17,997 posts)
2. Exactly!
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 01:16 AM
Jan 2015

If supporters don't speak out then we're no better than the GOP calling anyone that spoke against them, traitors.

K&R!

marym625

(17,997 posts)
4. That's not cool
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 01:25 AM
Jan 2015

I saw that post. I honestly thought it was in reply to someone who was saying that they disagreed with President Obama. Maybe it was a continuation of something I missed on a different thread.

Cha

(297,270 posts)
5. To me it's just childish disrespect. Criticize all we want.. "hold his feet to the fire"! but, the
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 01:30 AM
Jan 2015

venomous pot shots do nothing. Wonder how the poster would like to be told to "stfu"? Hmm.. probably not so much.

Enthusiast

(50,983 posts)
68. We MUST all unite to tell the President that we don't want the TPP and related trade agreements.
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 12:55 AM
Jan 2015

No childish disrespect necessary. But we must speak out with a loud voice, in no uncertain terms.

The President has demonstrated that he is not infallible.

Join us in reining in the influence of the corporations.

The President is wrong! Tell him!

sheshe2

(83,780 posts)
8. You are right Cha
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 01:39 AM
Jan 2015

With this statement...above

Our President had the foresight to explicitly instruct us to hold his feet to the fire when he is doing the "wrong thing" that used an example of us being a "voice for people who aren’t always heard".


Well he is sure hearing from those level headed people now is he not Cha? Those awesome truth tellers, the voice of the people. Here at DU holding his feet to the fire means calling him an F'ing piece of shit used car sales man. Or Dear President Obama Shut the F' up. Bravo DU. The sane voices of the people giving incite to how to run this government and ideas as how to correct the problems. Do any of them understand the irony Cha?

If this is the voice of the people then we are truly lost.

Cha

(297,270 posts)
13. The hot shots spewing venom.. President Obama gets all that from the right wing and he just
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 02:03 AM
Jan 2015

brushes it off his shoulders. He's had so much experience fluffing away the hate and focusing on his job.



Obama shows everyone respect but too many feel they can just fling their ***** at him.

Cha

(297,270 posts)
29. Yeah, like they haven't been. Just drop the "******* pos used car blah blah blah" & the "stuf blah"
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 03:35 AM
Jan 2015

'cause that does nothing but make them look small.

Thought you were beddy bye?!

beerandjesus

(1,301 posts)
21. Repeating that "POS used car salesman" line over and over and over...
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 02:58 AM
Jan 2015

....sounds a hell of a lot like repeating "you didn't build that" over and over and over.


And it's equally useful in the conversation.

Cha

(297,270 posts)
23. FYI, beerandjesus.. it was repeated on DU today.. you can tell them to knock it off if it upsets you
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 03:08 AM
Jan 2015

beerandjesus

(1,301 posts)
25. It doesn't upset me.
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 03:24 AM
Jan 2015

I can tell the difference between substantive disagreement and blowing off steam.

What does upset me is when a line like that is used in an unfair attempt to dismiss a valid argument. Hence the analogy to the "you didn't build it" crowd.

In fact, the OP is saying that we should take Obama at his word. I'd think you'd be on board with that.

Cha

(297,270 posts)
27. It upset me that someone called the President that again today.. and it wasn't hidden. Hold his
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 03:30 AM
Jan 2015

feet to the fire with criticism but not stupid name calling.

beerandjesus

(1,301 posts)
31. Good statement. On the substance, then, we agree.
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 03:50 AM
Jan 2015

I have to admit, I probably wouldn't have voted to hide (I did see the post, but it didn't make an impression, so I don't remember the context), but for my own part, I *always* prefer thoughtful criticism to name calling.

aspirant

(3,533 posts)
32. "Stupid name calling"
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 04:00 AM
Jan 2015

"Tell them to knock it off" How about the other OP " I stand with President Obama(Redux)" which you posted on.

Poster on this OP, "Fuck all the deranged fucks who hate him" Are you calling this valid criticism and telling him to knock it off?

Cha

(297,270 posts)
33. The ones calling President Obama a "pos used car salesman" and telling him to stfu are setting
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 04:04 AM
Jan 2015

themselves up to be condemned. Not everybody on here thinks they're such hot *****.

Oh, and I know where I post.. thanks anyway.

aspirant

(3,533 posts)
35. Repeat "stupid name calling"
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 04:26 AM
Jan 2015

"DERANGED FUCKS" is stupid name calling by any rational human being.

I pointed out that you posted on the same OP as this name caller and didn't take your own advice and tell him to knock it off.

"they're such hot *****" is this your more dignified way of stupid name calling

marym625

(17,997 posts)
37. Cha,
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 09:58 AM
Jan 2015

There are many on this site that do not accept any word that isn't complete support. It is frustrating and counter productive.

I and many others agree with you that using the kind of language you speak of doesn't do any good and is wrong. But this OP is right.

To continually just support and berate those that don't support everything President Obama says and does just detracts from the conversation. No one is infallible.

Cha

(297,270 posts)
50. Right, Mary.. no one is "infallible".. the President makes mistakes.. and there's always many around
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 08:28 PM
Jan 2015

to point that out. But, President Obama gets blamed for many things that he has no control over. He's not Magic man, either.

Obama shows respect to everyone even his enemies.. that's just who he is. I think some of it has to do with his upbringing in Hawaii. But posters on an internet board spew bitter epithets and telling him to STFU.. calling him a "pos used car salesman&quot yesterday) with many "boy howdys" and RECS.. that's not constructive criticism.

President Obama supporters get berated too(for even daring to have a Group (where others can't go to call him names) so I know how that feels.. We're accused of being a cult.. Ha! But, that doesn't bother me because I consider the source..

Anyway.. personally I don't have a problem with criticism.. hold his feet to the fire. I just want it based on facts. But, that's just me.

marym625

(17,997 posts)
51. As do I
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 09:22 PM
Jan 2015

I have absolutely no problem with a group specifically for President Obama. Weird thing to be upset about.

But I also don't like being lumped in with being a hater or racist, which I have been.

I don't know. I think he is magical. He's the first Black President of the United States. That's magical.

Regardless of the many issues I have with him now, I campaigned my butt off for him twice and was so in awe when I met him, I have absolutely no idea what was said. But I made him laugh. I know that.

Cha

(297,270 posts)
66. That's just wrong to accuse someone of being a "hater and a racist" because they disagree.. there's
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 12:44 AM
Jan 2015

plenty of evidence of that really happening without jumping to conclusions.

I campaigned for him too.. and would do it again, Mary. Never got to meet him in person though.. glad you got to do that. I bet you made him laugh!

sheshe2

(83,780 posts)
30. FU Mr Pres is once again.....
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 03:41 AM
Jan 2015

pause for the drum roll Kudos DU&!!!!

AT THE TOP OF THE PAGE ON DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND,

Take a bow DU you are the best Democratic Site Around. You Kicked our first Black President once again to the top of the page by saying SHUT THE FUCK UP! I suppose I should give you kudoos for saying please, yet I will not. What a fucking joke this place has become.

Next up. I will check the recs. I doubt there will be any surprises.

bahrbearian

(13,466 posts)
40. Look out everybody sheshe2 is checking out the Recs.
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 11:34 AM
Jan 2015

I'm sure she will ban a large number of members now.

sheshe2

(83,780 posts)
52. And exactly how am able to ban these people?
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 09:34 PM
Jan 2015

A magic wand? They posted in the BOG? How am I going to ban them?

 

MannyGoldstein

(34,589 posts)
70. What's more damaging?
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 01:08 AM
Jan 2015

Someone calling the President a POS used-car saleman when His wife was denied medicine for a very serious disease by a private health insurer, or the President trading away American jobs, what's left of American middle-class prosperity, and significant American sovereignty in exchange for some pieces of silver for his posse of bankers?

kentuck

(111,098 posts)
9. Obviously....
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 01:45 AM
Jan 2015

some folks did not want to hold his feet to the fire. They thought we were trying to burn his feet? They were perfectly happy with cold feet and wrong answers, so long as he stayed in the Democratic Party. They were like snails - slithering around on DU with no backbone.

liberal_at_heart

(12,081 posts)
11. only problem with that is because he is no longer running for office there is no more
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 01:59 AM
Jan 2015

accountability for him. He is not listening to the voters. He doesn't have to anymore. He can do anything he wants including pushing for the TPP and my personal favorite (not) Race to the Top.

pa28

(6,145 posts)
12. Too bad labor Democrats are forced to spend time "raising issues" and holding feet to the fire.
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 02:01 AM
Jan 2015

I never imagined we'd be desperately fighting to block our own president from pursuing Republican policy objectives. What a cruel joke.

kentuck

(111,098 posts)
16. You are right about that...
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 02:39 AM
Jan 2015

That is not something Democrats should be spending a lot of time upon...

Union Scribe

(7,099 posts)
38. Yep. And if Clinton wins
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 10:38 AM
Jan 2015

we're going to look back on these as the good old days. Dem leaders, with a few notable exceptions, have basically abandoned economic planks that brought in blue collars.

 

BubbaFett

(361 posts)
17. No,
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 02:39 AM
Jan 2015

my job is to "put food on my family."

I have more than enough to do working close to 70 hours per week.

If roasting Obama's feet is another job I need to do, I want to get paid for it.

 

BubbaFett

(361 posts)
20. The essence of a "job"
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 02:52 AM
Jan 2015

is the getting paid part.

I gotsta get paid.

Obama has a job too, he gets paid for it and it involves "Buck Stopping."

SamKnause

(13,107 posts)
18. Have those who crashed the global economy been prosecuted ?
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 02:40 AM
Jan 2015

I think we held his feet to the fire on that issue.

Have the torturers been prosecuted ?

I think we held his feet to the fire on that issue.

Has the White House been flooded with Wall Street insiders, Bush holdovers, Public Education foes, Pharmaceutical lobbyists, etc.

I think we held his feet to the fire on these issues.

Has NAFTA been addressed or reworked ?

I think we held his feet to the fire on this issue.

Did he support the unions when thousands were in the streets fighting for their jobs and benefits ?

I believe he lost his walking shoes on the occasions that we needed his support.

Did we hold his feet to the fire when he kept preaching bipartisanship with the party of no ?

I think we made our feelings clear.

How many times have the majority called for raising the taxes on the rich ?

Did he not hear us ?

Is he unaware ?

Candidate Obama and President Obama made many statements.

Remember the one about TRANSPARENCY ?

brooklynite

(94,585 posts)
42. How HAVE you held his feet to the fire?
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 11:58 AM
Jan 2015

I mean, other than blogging to each other about how unhappy you are.

 

Doctor_J

(36,392 posts)
44. honor us with some suggestions
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 04:54 PM
Jan 2015

as to what we might have done to get him to stop breaking his campaign promises

brooklynite

(94,585 posts)
46. I'm not the person claiming to have "held his feet to the fire"
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 04:59 PM
Jan 2015

NOw, off the top of my head, I might suggest writing an actual letter to the President, rather than just "voting" in online polls; joining or forming an advocacy group in support of issues you care about; challenging your elected officials to pressure the President, upon threat of withdrawing political support...of course those would all require hard work, as opposed to complaining about what's not getting done and then blaming "TPTB" for making the electoral process useless.

 

Doctor_J

(36,392 posts)
47. so there wasn't any way to make him do what he said he would do
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 05:04 PM
Jan 2015

I agree. He knew long before Nov 08 that he was going to govern as a conservative republican, and nothing any of the proletariat said or did was going to change that

 

Doctor_J

(36,392 posts)
49. sorry. corporate republican
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 05:15 PM
Jan 2015

Still waiting to hear what, besides marching, writing, signing petitions, supporting occupy, voting in huge democratic majorities, and giving campaign Obama an electoral landslide, we were supposed to do.

 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
36. ....
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 06:50 AM
Jan 2015

[center]







Hold Your Feet to The Fire : Phrases

Meaning:

To hold one accountable for a commitment, make good on a promise.

Example:

You made a fair bet with me on the Superbowl and I am going to hold your feet to the fire for payment.

Origin:

Pertains to torture used during the Crusade's. As a method for extracting confession for heresy, non-believers were positioned in a manner that allowed the inquisitor to apply flames to the feet of the accused. This was done until the accused confessed or died.

As ridiculous as that method of obtaining a confession seems by today's standards, consider a modern parallel - plea bargaining. The accused is offered the choice between a reduced sentence in exchange for a confession, or prosecution with the risk of more severe penalty (possibly death). link

[/center]

- This has been a Public Service Message for Presidents who may find it useful.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
53. Oh my God, you guys are dusting off ALL of the used up, over played cards this weekend!
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 09:43 PM
Jan 2015

Let's see, we've got this really obviously deliberately stoked up hysteria over TPP although absolutely nothing has happened on it in weeks as far as anyone, including the ones screaming about it, knows.

I've seen the "I voted, canvassed, gave money and a piece of my small intestine to this president and I get the right to criticize him" bits as well. Is the "comfortable shoes" bit up next? I'm sure the proven bullshit "he said HISSELF that he's a moderate Republican!1" can't be too far behind.

We get it, people have been way too energized and in unison lately. The racism and police brutality threads were troll bait mainly because many DUers were on the same page and were actually participating in activities to do something about it. So it makes perfect sense that now that it's the new year, the crowd that absolutely LOVE the bullshit, the fighting, the disorganization and endless impotent wailing that has become GD's hallmark over the last 6 years or so are restaking their territory. And if that's the way you guys want to roll, then that's your business. Just don't pretend that any of this is anything other than that.

Bobbie Jo

(14,341 posts)
54. Absolutely nailed it, 23
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 10:06 PM
Jan 2015

We get it, people have been way too energized and in unison lately. The racism and police brutality threads were troll bait mainly because many DUers were on the same page and were actually participating in activities to do something about it. So it makes perfect sense that now that it's the new year, the crowd that absolutely LOVE the bullshit, the fighting, the disorganization and endless impotent wailing that has become GD's hallmark over the last 6 years or so are restaking their territory.


We came dangerously close to having a moment of solidarity. This will not stand.

You couldn't have nailed it any harder if you tried.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
55. I sincerely can't understand the point of all of this impotent, deranged and moronic screaming
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 10:12 PM
Jan 2015

And over something that has had no movement in weeks (that anyone knows of), and is still largely unknown, even by the majority of people here braying the loudest about it.

The people so invested in making DU so irrelevant and unreadable act as though this place still has some political cache, as though they haven't drained if of every drop years ago. If there is a point in all of this, it is unfindable and I'm sure equally as stupid.

 

Ramses

(721 posts)
56. who is "you guys"?
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 10:15 PM
Jan 2015

Those awful leftists? Those hippies? Those that actually give a shit about economic justice?

I know what side im on. How about you.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
58. 'You guys' would be the ones now leaping like kangaroos now that Obama-bashing season is back
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 10:21 PM
Jan 2015

but many of whom were silence as corpses when the topics of racism and police brutality were quite prevalent on this board.

And how anyone can be truly concerned about "economic justice" but not consider racism to be equally important shows that they don't really give a shit about either.

 

Ramses

(721 posts)
59. well i cant speak for others here and im fairly new
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 10:26 PM
Jan 2015

But you will find many of my posts speaking up about racism and police brutality.

 

DisgustipatedinCA

(12,530 posts)
69. Your analysis is incorrect.
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 12:56 AM
Jan 2015

It doesn't matter--I don't really care one way or another what you want to put out there, but your analysis is wrong on its face. Hint: the same people who hate police brutality are largely the same people who don't want to be hoodwinked into the TPP.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
72. I disagree with that 100%. And I sure as shit ain't the only person that's noticed
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 03:55 AM
Jan 2015

But thanks for playing the "don't trust your lying eyes" game of utter BS.

Hutzpa

(11,461 posts)
57. That shouldn't give anyone the right to write a thread telling him to 'stfu'
Sat Jan 3, 2015, 10:18 PM
Jan 2015

on subject he knows a lot more than majority of the posters here. It defeats the purpose.

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