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(16,286 posts)We all know the man is living just like Jesus did
He wears simple robes, wears sandals and, when he isn't walking from town to town, rides donkeys
He lives a truly simple life
piratefish08
(3,133 posts)he scammed right out of their checking accounts.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)Yes friends, there's a big difference between kneeling down and bending over..."
- Frank Zappa, "Heavenly Bank Account" 1981
abakan
(1,819 posts)All we gotta do is label him "not a real Christian" & move right along.
Problem solved!
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)the only real anger he ever displayed according to what Christians, real Christians believe. He is a deceiver, a moneyman, Christ them out of the Temple. Pat would have been among those Jesus chased out of the Temple and he would have called Jesus a 'liberal, hippy, blasphemer'.
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)He is just another twisted nut job falsley laying claim to memvership fpr the purposes of profit.
Christians are not bearers of hate and bigotry.
"I love Christianity but I am not fond of some of your Christians."
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)cali
(114,904 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)he preached. And that is a fact. Some facts are just facts, and this is one of them, Right Wing Fundies are just that, their god is MONEY. It's like saying that Alexander the Great was a follower of Gandhi.
cali
(114,904 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)for those less fortunate, promotes holy wars and adheres to what WAS the thinking before Jesus came along to talk bring enlightenment to the world, by any stretch of the imagination entitled to be believed when he slaps a title on his Commercial Opperation claiming to be a follower of Christ?
Like I said, that would be like the world's worst warmonger claiming to be a follower of Gandhi.
But go ahead, show us what entitles Robertson and his ilk to call himself a Christian.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)And religion is all about belief, faith. People have faith in Pat Robertson and those people call themselves Christians, in fact I suspect most of them would say that you aren't a real Christian.
If millions of people believe something how can they be wrong? I've heard that argument lately on DU.
In America "Christian" hasn't meant someone who tries to follow the teachings of Christ for a long time if ever, a great many American Christians would far more accurately be called Paulists or Leviticans.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)I knew some of Robertsons followers. They were really nice people. He got lots of money out of them using THEIR genuine faith to do so.
It took a few years, but they finally saw through him. Too late to save the money could not afford.
Most of his followers are Right Wing Old Testament believers. These people were also Republicans.
Millions of Americans thought George Bush was a great 'war president and leader'. They even believed he was a War Hero.
I guess they too were right. More than half this country believed that. If millions of people believe something, how can they be wrong?
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)Religion is a giant Rorschach test, you get out of it what you bring to it. Bring a kind and gentle heart and you will find scripture to support that, bring an angry judgmental attitude and well you can find plenty of scripture to support that attitude too.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)where there is plenty off violence and killing and revenge for an angry god. Those with kinder hearts find the New Testament, where they find Jesus bringing a message of tolerance, forgiveness, peace and generosity. Christians are followers of Chrit's teachings. Pat Robertson doesn't follow Christ. He prefers the Old Testament.
My point was that taking the name of a man whose teachings they actually oppose, see how they feel about Liberals in general, and Jesus was a Liberal, is a deception. Sadly it works, many people, at vulnerable times in their lives, are easily persuaded that these snake oil salesmen actually care about them.
Manifestor_of_Light
(21,046 posts)Which all Christians I've ever met simply ignore. Unless it justifies their cruelty. Yes, it is in the New Testament and alleged to have been said by Jesus. He said he approves of the law and the prophets of the Old Testament. "I come not in peace but with a sword...I have come to set families apart(basically)".
I could list more but then I get accused of cutting and pasting from an anti-bible site, when it is THE CHRISTIAN BIBLE. Their LITERAL words that are part of their holy scriptures and there is no doubt that a lot of what Jesus said was quite mean and cruel.
He really enjoyed telling people they were going to hell for various reasons, like not listening to him preach.
Another example:Cussing out a fig tree for acting like a fig tree, and not fruiting out of season.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)'beloved' real leaders today. Why are all our Presidents expected to be Christians btw? If you feel that way about religion in general, and Christians in particular, you must not vote in the Presidential election then?
Kerry was attacked from the Right for his stand on abortion, he is a Catholic. They accused him of committing a sin. From the Left he was criticized for BEING a Catholic.
I personally don't care what people believe, it's none of my business. I wonder why it matters so much to some people?
Manifestor_of_Light
(21,046 posts)I wasn't talking about politicians. Voting and religion are not the same thing. Spiritual leaders and politicians are not in the same profession.
I've voted in every Presidential election since Jimmy Carter ran in 1976.
I was talking about Jesus. It matters to me because every Christian I've ever met says that Jesus was all about goodness and light and helping the poor, the sick, the hungry and the jailed. They are completely obsessed with Jesus and talking about him, at least where I live. They don't understand people who don't go to their church, and think other people are going to hell for not believing what they do. They are terrified of nonconformists. They love to tell me what I should do with my life spiritually but they never want to hear about my beliefs. And they control things.
They refuse to deal with the fact that the bible is a huge mess of contradictions. It was clumsily rewritten, edited, and compiled under the orders of the Emperor Constantine. I learned about that at a religious college in my religion courses, by the way.
Jesus did say some good things, like in The Sermon on the Mount, but there is an overwhelming amount of hateful and irrational quotes you can glean from the alleged words of Jesus in the New Testament.
And they will be happy to tell me about how much I need Jesus in my life, although I see no evidence that he exists in the present tense, like they talk about, when they say you need a "personal relationship with Jesus". There is also no historical evidence that he existed at all, and that he is a synthesis of various other ancient gods with the same properties--Mithra, Osiris, and Apollo, among several others.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)like that also, but where I live no one talks about religion at all, not even Republicans. Most people in the world go about their business and if they are religious, go to church, work for the homeless etc and don't feel the need to discuss it.
Manifestor_of_Light
(21,046 posts)The United States is far more religious than Europe and in some parts of the country there are churches on every corner. The flavor may be different, as with Mormons all over the West, or Baptists in the South, or no-fun Lutherans in the North, but it's in a lot of places.
I see women with cross earrings, cross necklaces, cross charm bracelets, and purses with a six inch tall cross on the side in rhinestones, T-shirts with stuff about Jesus or a bible verse, and I think, "Vampire problem?"
And they assume that you think just like they do, because they are indoctrinated and can't imagine any other way to be, or are afraid of nonconformists. It would never occur to them to question their beliefs and arrive at a spirituality that is right for them, instead of accepting what they've been told. I've already been told I'm going to hell for "worshiping Buddha". I had to explain to this person that Buddha was not a god, he was an enlightened man and he is NOT worshiped like Jesus. He is revered as a wise person. This guy thought he knew what he was talking about, but he didn't. His reaction to my explanation: "Ohhhhhhhhh".
These people don't want to learn about other religions because if it's not about Jesus, it's bad. My neighbor told me that "Buddhism is like voodoo" and crossed her forearms in front of her like she was holding up a cross to ward off the bad juju. No shit, lady. Completely ignorant and stupid and proud of it.
They don't want to know about where I get my spirituality from. All they know is what some uneducated preacher tells them. They don't read their bibles either. I know more about what's in it than they do. And I graduated from a Presbyterian liberal arts university and had to take some extremely deep religion courses along the lines of anthropology and sociology of religion.
We don't go to church and there are no other social outlets in town. I learned to avoid the book club because they talked about God and Christianity all the time. I thought that was what church was for. So they make up crap about us.
You still haven't addressed my statements taken verbatim from the four canonical gospels of the New Testament, where Jesus says cruel and hateful stuff. There are quite a few examples.
riderinthestorm
(23,272 posts)he may not adhere to any of Christ's teachings but even Jesus said that all who believe shall enter the Kingdom of heaven
You don't get to decide who is a Christian. If someone self-labels, I will take them at their word.
I'm an atheist who grew up as a fundy. Even now, decades later it's not uncommon for prayers to run through my head and sometimes even out loud. One of my favorite songs is Amazing Grace, which I sang as a lullaby to my daughters.
So it's a contradiction. But I'm still an atheist because that's how I self-label.
Pat Robertson is indeed a Christian.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)cali
(114,904 posts)2 + 2 = 4 is a fact. Now how hard was that?
SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Since the interpretation of the Bible is purely subjective, who's to say that Robertson hasn't got it right, and you've got it wrong?
Sid
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)would let people die rather than provide Health Care. Told the disabled to just go pull themselves up by their bootstraps. Right, that's what Christ was all about.
You can interpret anything any way you want, you could interpret Gandhi that way too. And then USE his teachings to make money.
And the facts still wouldn't change. You would not be a follower of Gandhi or of Christ.
I don't believe in the word heretic. Scam artist is what Pat Robertson is..
FiveGoodMen
(20,018 posts)1) Someone who follows the teachings of Jesus, or
2) Someone who self-identifies as a Christian?
Either way, what do we do about group #2?
(The "Christians" who influence our government are from group 2)
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)I don't know what can be done about group 2. They latched on to the word and it worked for them.
Maybe if we gave them a title more descriptive of their beliefs, it would catch on?
FiveGoodMen
(20,018 posts)But churches across America and around the world are recognized as Christian and treated as such whether they teach goodness or mean-spiritedness, greed, etc.
They have tax-exempt status, connections with other churches, influence upon their members -- and on their members VOTES.
They will continue to be called and recognized as Christian whether they have any respect for the words of Jesus or not.
Furthermore, their members really believe the most essential doctrine of Christianity, which is that Jesus was God-come-to-earth to save humanity and that belief in that story is what gets one into heaven.
So, while it's fair to point out that they are not acting in the way that followers of Jesus should, it's not really meaningful to claim they aren't actually Christians.
They are what Christians (in many cases) are. Even if not what they should be.
Manifestor_of_Light
(21,046 posts)The guy who said this stuff, which is only from ONE of the gospels, Matthew???
MATTHEW
Those who bear bad fruit will be cut down and burned "with unquenchable fire." 3:10, 12
Jesus strongly approves of the law and the prophets. He hasn't the slightest objection to the cruelties of the Old Testament. 5:17
Jesus recommends that to avoid sin we cut off our hands and pluck out our eyes. This advice is given immediately after he says that anyone who looks with lust at any women commits adultery. 5:29-30
Jesus says that most people will go to hell. 7:13-14
Those who fail to bear "good fruit" will be "hewn down, and cast into the fire." 7:19
"The children of the kingdom [the Jews] shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." 8:12
Jesus tells a man who had just lost his father: "Let the dead bury the dead." 8:21
Jesus sends some devils into a herd of pigs, causing them to run off a cliff and drown in the waters below. 8:32
Cities that neither "receive" the disciples nor "hear" their words will be destroyed by God. It will be worse for them than for Sodom and Gomorrah. And you know what God supposedly did to those poor folks (see Gen 19:24). 10:14-15
Families will be torn apart because of Jesus (this is one of the few "prophecies" in the Bible that has actually come true). "Brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death." 10:21
Jesus says that we should fear God who is willing and "able to destroy both soul and body in hell." 10:28
Jesus says that he has come to destroy families by making family members hate each other. He has "come not to send peace, but a sword." 10:34-36
Jesus condemns entire cities to dreadful deaths and to the eternal torment of hell because they didn't care for his preaching. 11:20-24
Jesus will send his angels to gather up "all that offend" and they "shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth." 13:41-42, 50
Jesus is criticized by the Pharisees for not washing his hands before eating. He defends himself by attacking them for not killing disobedient children according to the commandment: "He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death." (See Ex 21:15, Lev 20: 9, Dt 21:18-21) So, does Jesus think that children who curse their parents should be killed? It sure sounds like it. 15:4-7
"Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up." 15:13
Jesus advises his followers to mutilate themselves by cutting off their hands and plucking out their eyes. He says it's better to be "maimed" than to suffer "everlasting fire." 18:8-9
In the parable of the unforgiving servant, the king threatens to enslave a man and his entire family to pay for a debt. This practice, which was common at the time, seems not to have bothered Jesus very much. The parable ends with this: "So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you." If you are cruel to others, God will be cruel to you. 18:23-35
"And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors." 18:34
God is like a rich man who owns a vineyard and rents it to poor farmers. When he sends servants to collect the rent, the tenants beat or kill them. So he sent his son to collect the rent, and they kill him too. Then the owner comes and kills the farmers and rents the vineyard to others. 21:33-41
"Whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder." Whoever falls on "this stone" (Jesus) will be broken, and whomever the stone falls on will be ground into powder. 21:44
In the parable of the marriage feast, the king sends his servants to gather everyone they can find, both bad and good, to come to the wedding feast. One guest didn't have on his wedding garment, so the king tied him up and "cast him into the outer darkness" where "there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." 22:1-14
The end of the world will be signaled by wars, famines, disease, and earthquakes (6-7). And that's just "the beginning of sorrows" (8). Next believers will be hated and killed by unbelievers (9), believers will hate and betray each other (10), false prophets will fool people (11), iniquity will abound and love wax cold (12). But hey, if you make through all that, you'll be saved (13).
Only one more thing will happen before the end comes: the gospel will be preached throughout the world (14). Well, that and the abomination of desolations will stand in the holy place (15), many false Christs and false prophets will show great signs and wonders (24), the sun and moon will be darkened and the stars will fall (29), the sign of the son of Man will appear in the sky, everyone on earth will mourn, and then, finally, the great and powerful son of Man will come in all his glory (30).
Oh, and all these things will happen within the lifespan of Jesus' contemporaries (34).
Or maybe not. Jesus was talking about things he knew nothing about (36). (See Mark 13:32.) 24:3-51
Jesus had no problem with the idea of drowning everyone on earth in the flood. It'll be just like that when he returns. 24:37
God will come when people least expect him and then he'll "cut them asunder." And "there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." 24:50-51
The parable of the cruel and unjust master
The kingdom of heaven is like a rich man who distributed his wealth to his servants while he traveled. He gave five talents (a talent was a unit of money, worth about 20 years of a worker's wages) to one servant, two to another, and one to a third. When he returned, the servant with five talents had made five more, the servant with two made two more, but the servant with one talent only had the talent his master entrusted to him. The master rewarded the servants that invested his money (without his permission -- what would have happened if the stock market went down during their master's travels?) and took the talent from the single-talent servant and gave it to the one with ten talents. "For unto every one that hath shall be given .. but from him that hath not shall be taken away even that which he hath." Then the cruel and unjust master cast the servant who carefully protected his master's talent into the "outer darkness: [where] there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." 25:14-30
The servant who kept and returned his master's talent was cast into the "outer darkness" where there will be "weeping and gnashing of teeth." 25:30
Jesus judges the nations. 25:31-46
Jesus tells us what he has planned for those that he dislikes. They will be cast into an "everlasting fire." 25:41
Jesus says the damned will be tormented forever. 25:46
---------------------------------
That's only one of the four gospels.
FiveGoodMen
(20,018 posts)(or the waters get AWFULLY muddy)
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)really, for those who actually are Christians and not fundamentalists, there is no real dispute about it.
By the logic you just offered, all I have to do is say I am Hindu, don't even have to do adhere to any Hindu tenets. Who is to say I am not?
FiveGoodMen
(20,018 posts)I'm discussing who will be picking our leaders, making our laws, deciding on what's acceptable in society and what they can persecute people for.
Christianity is an organized force with political power, great sway over the population, and MEMBERS.
It has members. Many of those may be in for an enormous disappointment on "judgment day", but right now they -- as a group, with a name -- wield great power.
If there is a god, he can sort out who he likes and who he doesn't whenever he wants to.
Meanwhile, back on earth, we have to deal with the name, the reputation, the overwhelming size of the group, and the tax-exempt status (meaning the rest of us pay more).
And yes, if you claim to be Hindu, most of the world will treat you accordingly whether you adhere to any tenets or not. Those who don't will be accused of being judgmental.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)be, the less likely people who have been fooled by them, will support them. By giving them legitimacy all we are doing is making them stronger.
And no matter what the reaction to my claim of being Hindu, the fact is, I am not. And those saying so would be correct, not judgemental, just stating a fact.
Manifestor_of_Light
(21,046 posts)How many people do you see doing that, especially since there is no physical Jesus walking around to be followed at present?
Read up on the No True Scotsman Fallacy. Christians are self-identifying. Jesus also said he was fine with the Levitical law of the Old Testament. All that mass murder by God was just fine and dandy with him. And killing your children for being disobedient--no problem.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)abandon their families and goods, he asked for a few to do so at that time.
You can self identify all you want, it doesn't make your claim right. As I said, I can claim to be a Hindu, who is going to tell me I'm not, other than actual Hindus who will recognize my lack of creds to make such a claim. No doubt YOU would support my self-identification.
randys1
(16,286 posts)But then there are a few million well meaning types..
As to rightwing alleged Christians, they are just murderous terrorists
Manifestor_of_Light
(21,046 posts)No True Scotsman Fallacy invoked in Post Number 69 by randys1.
Logical Fallacy. No True Scotsman would put sugar on his oatmeal.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)by the "all religions are equally bad" brigade. Almost like more recent examples are kind of few and far between.
And I'm not sure how setting fire to the most revered symbol of a religion (as the KKK did) is a sign of adhering to that religion. The IRA was much more about getting the British out (they would not have been welcomed being ruled by the British even if the British had happened to be Catholic, and the Pope was not exactly egging them on).
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)Both these assholes have horrible trigger discipline.
cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)in it.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)I found that all four of her fingers are wrapped around the pistol grip.
Nice try though.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)Give it a try.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)e.
My money is on booger hook. I cannot discern four full fingers on the grip. There's pale fleshy where no pale fleshy should be.
People who make 'statements' like that photo are generally not the brightest folks.
cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)Not.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)Or not.
Keep it up.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)Not.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)But how many people has he murdered in the name of Christianity?
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)He has had business dealings with killers and profited mightily from them.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2010/01/14/825050/-Pat-Robertson-Freedom-Gold-and-Blood-Diamonds#
Douglas Carpenter
(20,226 posts)more than those terrorist in Paris
Nuclear Unicorn
(19,497 posts)Douglas Carpenter
(20,226 posts)payload guided by computers, lasers and satellites. Versus the soldier with a bayonet stabbing his enemy and watching him die. Murder is so much more gentlemanly from a distance.
Nuclear Unicorn
(19,497 posts)If you do you bought the computer, the pilot, his plane and the missile he dropped.
Then again, every RWer that gleefully pays into the MIC is also paying for schools, lunches, welfare, food stamps, medicine, housing, etc. Somehow I doubt the karma-by-abstraction argument will count to their benefit.
Douglas Carpenter
(20,226 posts)creating the rightwing of the Republican Party and the modern religious right whose polices have led to the death of countless numbers of people.
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)abortion providers and the women who did not get proper abortion medical procedures.
(Edited)
cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)wtf
Dustlawyer
(10,497 posts)I listened to a lady read a question for Pat from a man who made a pact with God to leave his health care to the deity and not see a doctor. He has been getting pressure from family and friends to see a doctor about a serious health issue and wants Pat to tell him if he should stick to his promise to God and not go to a doctor or hospital, or should he seek treatment? Pat told him God would take care of him and that he should not break his promise to God, God would heal him.
How many elderly people are influenced by his lies to their detriment?
The man has zero shame!!!
YoungDemCA
(5,714 posts)Especially in certain regions.
Yet curiously, we are lectured on this board by many individuals (who are largely, comfortable middle-class white Americans-not that it matters! ) that the real threat to America or "the West" is the world's nearly 2 billion Muslims-the vast majority of whom have no power or influence over the United States' affairs, or the affairs of other "Western" countries (or even their own, in many cases).
You will forgive me if I think that that smells like ethno-centric, chauvinistic bullshit.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)Not much of it bleeds into GD but it's definitely on the Religion group.
YoungDemCA
(5,714 posts)But thanks anyway.
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)in fact the criticism is aimed at religious nutbags of all faiths and denominations, you "don't really care".
OK.
ProfessorGAC
(65,168 posts)Happens all the time.
MNBrewer
(8,462 posts)Lobo27
(753 posts)To me it simply points out that it easier to bash Christians on this forum then others.
Nuclear Unicorn
(19,497 posts)Easier or safer?
840high
(17,196 posts)Douglas Carpenter
(20,226 posts)here on DU. In American society at large there always has been. I have never been into Christian bashing either. I denounce Islamic extremist. What is the big deal about not wanting to denounce rightwing Christian extremist. I don't defend those monsters in Paris. But I am not going to defend a monster like Pat Robertson either.
Lobo27
(753 posts)But if we bash one religion all others are fair game. Christians here in the state might be easier simply because that is who we deal with on a constant basis.
Rex
(65,616 posts)beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Rex
(65,616 posts)Drink the blood of your savior, worship an idol...really don't see the big difference. You and I just cannot see what those televangelarchangels fathom with their eyes closed.
Gothmog
(145,553 posts)kpete
(72,014 posts)I thought so too.
peace, love and tolerance,
kp
ChosenUnWisely
(588 posts)of Christians, just like the Pope is a leader and spoke person for millions of Christians.
Dont like it then do something about it.
lame54
(35,321 posts)Regent University is a private coeducational interdenominational Christian university located in Virginia Beach, Virginia, United States. The university was founded by Pat Robertson in 1978 as Christian Broadcasting Network University, and changed its name to Regent University in 1989
a lot of christians voted for bush because he is a christian
Bush the christian hired a bunch of these guys to write and enforce the laws that WE All HAVE TO FOLLOW
According to Regent University, more than 150 of its graduates had been hired by the federal government during the George W. Bush presidency[41] including dozens in Bush's administration.[57] As it was previously rare for alumni to go into government, Boston Globe journalist Charlie Savage suggested that the appointment of Office of Personnel Management director Kay Coles James, the former dean of Regent's government school, caused this sharp increase in Regent alumni employed in the government.[41] An article about a Regent graduate who interviewed for a government position and Regent's low school rankings were cited as an example of the Bush administration hiring applicants with strong conservative credentials but weaker academic qualifications and less civil rights law experience than past candidates in the Civil Rights Division.[41] In addition to Savage, several other commentators made similar assertions.[42][58][59][60] The Washington Post contrasted the employment of Regent employees by Bush to the hiring practices of his successor Barack Obama who tended to select from higher secular colleges.[
Paladin
(28,272 posts)dembotoz
(16,832 posts)for nutjobs like him and those like him
from priest perverts to snake charming fundies to homophobic uganda
yes we built it
so lay your blame on others carefully less we are force to wear the same shoes
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)I am a gay person and not religious. I spend my life trying to upturn the religious attack on LGBT people. Uganda? 80% Christian, 43 % Francis the Pope Brand Catholics, 42% Anglican, and yes in fact I do think that Francis and his followers do need to account for what their own dang Church is saying and doing. They are harming others.
So you built that maybe. But I sure as fuck did not. The religious are responsible for religion, does that not make sense? Religion is not a creature, it is made up of human actions.
But this thing where you religious folks want to blame the people you attack is unacceptable.
Cleita
(75,480 posts)in well in Eighteenth Century England, however, you probably would have been drawn and quartered for being gay as well.
HappyMe
(20,277 posts)The broad brush can be applied to any group you choose. It's never the right thing to do.
samsingh
(17,601 posts)the false equivalencies are stupid.
MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)Where's the profiling of white corpulent shysters driving Corvettes fast, anyway?