Lost a good friend and a BIL to Rx drugs taken as prescribed

[Holly_Hobby]

My friend had back surgery and took Percocet (has Tylenol in it) for 3 months, fought liver disease from the Tylenol for 4 months and died last week before she could go through the protocol to get her a new liver. She was 54.

My BIL died 2 weeks ago from Eliquis and Ibuprofen taken to prevent a stroke from a-fib. He had colon polyps that bled due to the Elliquis, he bled to death in his sleep. He had a colonoscopy last year to remove polyps, more grew after. He was also prescribed Rx doses of Ibuprofen for arthritis. Didn't his heart doctor know about the Ibuprofen prescribed by his PCP? Everything is computerized, and both doctors belong to the same network. He was 62.

Both of them had autopsies performed, both deaths were blamed on prescription doses of Rx drugs. Tylenol caused the liver failure and Elliquis taken with Ibuprofen caused the massive hemorrhage.

In 2009, the FDA limited the sales of Percocet due to deaths from liver failure. Why was she given this drug?

Why was the fact that Eliquis and Ibuprofen shouldn't be taken together, missed? Why didn't the Pharmacist catch this, they were both filled at the same pharmacy.

Please do your research before taking Rx drugs, your life depends on it.

On edit, I don't know if either of them read the information that came with the prescription. Read it!

[SamKnause]

1. K&R

My condolences.

[Holly_Hobby]

10. Thank you. I'm in the Anger phase of grief at the moment. n/t

[hobbit709]

2. The only reason painkillers come loaded with Tylenol is the DEA.

[Holly_Hobby]

11. I asked my pharmacist about this...

he said Tylenol makes the narcotic work better and longer. But your explanation makes more sense.

[CAG]

51. Your pharmacist is correct. It allows for better pain relief with less narcotic burden.

[SusanCalvin]

40. a) I bet you're right

b) That's disgusting.

[Jesus Malverde]

42. And Johnson and Johnson ...nt

[Hoyt]

3. My experience is that very few docs read prior notes. If they do, it's a quick glance.

Supposedly some systems have flags for some drug contraindications, but good luck with that.

You are right that you have to research for yourself.

[lark]

26. I don't understand this.

I live in Fl where medical practice is about 10=15 years behind that in CA. Yet, when my dr. prescribed me the wrong rx, my pharmacist alerted me. the first time it was just an assistant asking if the dr. knew about all the drugs I was taking. Since they were all prescribed at the same office, I said yes. I had a horrible month, thought I was losing my mind. The the 2nd time I went to get a refill, a different person said this is "red-flagged". I asked what that meant. She said Elavil and Hismanol were flagged not to be taken together. I asked if they would make me so groggy I couldn't get up in the am, but after I took the Hismanol I started feeling like I was rocketing to the moon and got more nervous and twitchy as the day went on until I could hardly think and my heart was pounding really hard when I took the Elavil. Yes, she said this was the interaction and could cause a heart attack, since it was already affecting my heart. OMG!!

So, in these days of electronic medical records, sounds like we can still easily be killed by docs not paying attention. Great.

[Holly_Hobby]

29. Not only doctors, but pharmacists.

If my BIL's pharmacist had been paying attention, he might still be alive today.

[mnhtnbb]

4. I am so sorry for the loss of your friend and BIL.

Both seemingly preventable and unnecessary deaths at young ages. How sad for you and the families.

Big Pharma has gone nuts with promoting drugs. I hate all the commercials on TV. I don't see it
ending any time soon.

[Holly_Hobby]

12. It seems ads for drugs have replaced ads for cigarettes and alcohol.

Drugs are every bit as dangerous as smoking and drinking. It seems we know this, but trust the doctors not to cause harm. Ads sell. Period.

[Heidi]

5. Kick, kick, kick!

[underahedgerow]

6. This is what happens when you have a profession that people get into for the money instead of for

the passion and dedication.

In the USA the medical profession is motivated by the money. People pay huge, huge money to go through many years of education. They choose lucrative professions, which they're entitled to do of course.

In other countries doctors make far, far less money, so the motivation really is to heal and care for people, not to buy a bigger boat. In these countries however, their education is paid for by the government. I believe this makes a huge difference in the type of care and consideration that patients receive.

I am hearing stories of doctors who are now really battling the Obama Care system because they don't like the prices being pre-set. Well you know what? If a doctor is in practice so he can get rich, then he cares more about himself than his patients. I'd rather see a doctor driving a VW than a BMW.

Personally, I don't trust most male doctors, especially OB/GYNs, they just cannot be empathetic towards women. I have found them condescending and just in one case, downright rude and mean. (I switched to a female Dr. when I was 7 months pregnant because he was so nasty, that man had no right checking out my private parts!)

I think women tend to make better doctors and health care professionals, and of course there are exceptions to the rule, but I have always found myself having a lot more confidence in female doctors and practitioners.

In addition, I check every single prescription I am ever given. Read, read, read the efficacy statements!!! These things will save your life, literally. So many drugs are pushed by drs because of the pretty sales girl or well funded lunches paid for by the Pharm Cos. Make no mistake, doctors rarely do the real research on the efficacy and potential side effects for new drugs coming to market. It's your job to be your own advocate, do the research and question everything being prescribed for you.

I remember reading about the efficacy for a (now banned!!!!) pain reliever, where it was effective for just 11% of the people in the study, with massive side effects that the dr didn't even bother telling me about.

You must be your own advocate, absolutely!

[Holly_Hobby]

14. I do my best to stay off drugs.

I rehabbed my health 4 years ago to get off Rx drugs. I lost weight by changing my diet. No more high blood sugars, no more high blood pressure.

[underahedgerow]

23. Exactly! These drs love to 'give a pill' for everything that ails you! But we can admit that a lot

of people would rather have a pill to fix something instead of doing the hard work like you did to turn things around.

I find it amazing how good nutrition and lifestyle choices can cure nearly everything that ails us. Some things are absolutely genetic, that's for sure, but we can still make better choices to treat even those things, most of the time.

I just had surgery for enormous varicose veins in one leg. I'm not overweight, make good food choices, etc, but it is just a genetic thing. I was taking a medication to alleviate the symptoms, which helped a little bit, but I am rather shocked at how much better I feel in general having that nasty thing stripped out.

I hate doctors and hospitals, lol.

[Holly_Hobby]

28. Glad you're feeling better...

Doctors and hospitals do save lives every day, but they kill way too many too. Doctors are generally great at diagnostics, but they don't go far enough to find the root cause in some cases. They treat symptoms. My dogs' vet looks for a root cause, but my doctor doesn't. I do and I'm usually on the right track and demand tests. Doctors get offended because I question everything and I'm arrogant enough to ask for tests. Tough! I'm paying the bills and it's my health, not theirs.

Something will kill me sooner or later, but it won't be Diabetes complications if I can help it. Or Rx drugs!

I don't dislike my doctors, it's more of a lack of respect and trust. Talk to a pharmacist about your prescriptions, they're not tainted by drug rep baloney, lunches, trips, golf, etc.

I'm so angry about my friend and my BIL. Senseless deaths that could have been prevented.

[still_one]

7. Sorry for your loss. Not all computer systems are linked. That is why every doctor you see should

go through a medication reconciliation with the patient before the exam. Usually the Medical assistant or nurse does this. They compare it with what is in their Medical Record, and update accordingly.

No proper Medical visit should occur without a medication reconciliation.

Even OTC tylenol should be taken cautiously. Many people believe falsely that it is simply a mild anagesic with very little side-effects. It is well known that Tylenol can cause liver damage by itself, yet alone combined with other drugs, percocet in this case.

It is also that when a colonoscopy is performed, to stop any anticoagulants for a week prior to the procedure to reduce the risk of bleeding.

The information of any prescription drug must be provided with any filled prescription. It includes drug interactions, and side-effects. The problem is that many patients just rely on what their physician tells them in regard how to take a medicine.

The other problem with Elliquis, is that it cannot just be stopped. It needs to be tapered off or serious issues can occur. A lot of doctors are NOT aware of this. There are other drugs like beta-blockers that should not just be stopped. They need to be slowly tapered off or serious issues can occur.

The most important thing people should do is be informed and ask their doctor questions if they see a contradiction. The internet is a valuable resource for that, and most important if they find contradictory information, and do not get a satisfactory answer from their physician, seek out a second opinion.

Very sorry for loss

[Holly_Hobby]

15. All true. Thank you. n/t

[tridim]

8. Drug dealers don't care about anything but money.

I have also lost a close friend to painkillers, I feel for your loss.

[Holly_Hobby]

17. Thank you, I'm sorry for your loss too (hug) n/t

[femmocrat]

9. That is just tragic.

I am so sorry about your friends.

I know someone who suffered kidney failure from ibuprofen. Some of those OTC drugs are poison.

[Holly_Hobby]

16. I'm diabetic, and Ibuprofen is on the list of

Do Not Take due to possible kidney complications.

I think Ibuprofen does have it's benefits, but keep the dose low and take for the least time possible, if you're not diabetic or already have kidney disease.

Drugs have hurt others in my family, so I'm really careful. One of my family members has been bed ridden in a nursing home going on 8 years now because her psychiatric med gave her severe Parkinson's - that drug was Risperdol.

[REP]

35. Do not take ANY NSAID with kidney disease

There is no safe over-the-counter NSAID (Aleve, ibuprofen, etc) that can be taken by anyone with kidney disease. There is one prescription NSAID, Clinoril, that can be used by some with early kidney disease under a doctor's care but even that one can be problematic. Under no circumstances should a person with kidney disease be administered Toradol. This class of drug is nephrotoxic and can cause anything from worsening proteinuria to dangerous edema to death.

[Holly_Hobby]

44. Thank you, Toradol is going on my list n/t

[REP]

53. Toradol is exceptionally dangerous

All NSAIDs have black box warnings but Toradol is the most dangerous one for kidney patients.

[Warpy]

13. There has been a push to eliminate the combination pain pills

in the last two years. The DEA loved them because junkies who took enough for a good buzz would burn out their livers and die. Unfortunately, they tended to kill a lot of other people who had undiagnosed liver and kidney disease.

Last week when I was in the hospital, the oxycodone was given by itself. The DEA doesn't like seeing oxycodone prescribed, hillbillies are buying it from pill mills and getting a buzz so it's got to be withheld from everybody else, you see.

I'm so sorry about your BIL. There might be a lawsuit there, one doctor or another completely missed the additive effect of the Eliquis plus an NSAID. I honestly expect to see Eliquis with a black box warning very soon, telling people not to take Aspirin or other NSAIDs with it.

[Holly_Hobby]

18. Good old oxy...

My husband had a knee replacement in March, he also has Hep C. I demanded that Tylenol be added to his list of allergies - one way to get around it! This was before my friend died, but I knew Hep C patients shouldn't be taking Tylenol, in any amount for any time. If my friend's doctor would have checked her liver enzymes with a simple blood test, he could have saved her life.

They prescribed Oxy without Tylenol for my husband - it's called Roxycodone. Drug killers are available plain. Demand it! He had refills for 8 weeks, but only took them for 3 weeks at a reduced dose. He doesn't like the way narcotics make him feel. His surgeon said, "Tylenol is safe for short times with Hep C patients." I asked him how to determine the safe time? Is it a blood test or a guess? He prescribed the Roxy and didn't say another word.

I do hope both of these families talk to an attorney. It might save someone else's life.

[Thespian2]

19. Unnecessary death is a tagedy.

We must know as much about ourselves as possible before going to a doctor. I have been in the care of my doctor for 15 years, but I still keep my records concerning what medications I can take and what medications I refuse. Tylenol is at the top of my refuse list, followed closely by Percocet and Percodan. I take as few medications as possible...three...and carefully examine the side-effects of any suggested medication. I still worry that I have to have back surgery soon...and there is no way to know the outcome. I live with pain because I do not take ineffective medications. I will provide the surgeon with my list of medications I do not want to take.

I am sorry for your losses.

[Holly_Hobby]

30. Thank you.

Roxycodone is additive-free and it worked well for my husband's knee replacement. But be sure you take a laxative with it, my husband used Miralax with great success. No cramps or explosions.

Good luck with your back surgery, I know it's painful too. Be well.

[1monster]

20. Use the same pharmacy for ALL Rx purchases, and if on Rx drugs, ask you pharmacist before taking

any over the counter drugs.

Almost all pharmacies now have computerized programs that will send up an alert if a patient is taking two or more drugs that will harmfully interact with each other.

Also, ask your pharmacist if any foods can or will triger serious interactions with Rx drugs.

Be an informed consumer, especially where your health is involved.

[Holly_Hobby]

31. I don't understand how the Ibuprofen

got under the radar for my BIL. The pharmacy he uses is a small, independent pharmacy that's computerized, and he's been using them for over 30 years. They know him well and know what he takes, probably off the top of their heads.

My BIL was old-school and not computer literate, so I'm sure he didn't do any research. He was a good guy and I miss him!

[1monster]

36. I'm really sorry for your losses. Pharmacies make mistakes. My pharmacy includes a description

of what the prescription should look like, and other information. So many drugs out there have very similar names and yet they are used for totally different conditions. One drug that was meant to help with inflamation had a name that was just a letter or two off from another which was meant to treat depression. Those got mixed up with some really serious consequenses.

It is always wise to double check before swallowing what you pick up at the pharmacy.

[Holly_Hobby]

45. Agreed, we're all human n/t

[Hoppy]

21. Read the notice that comes with the stuff? Good luck with that.

Average of 1,000 words at 10 point type.

[Ms. Toad]

24. And your life is not worth the trouble?

On the off hand chance that it isn't worth the trouble, do a google search on side effects for the drugs you are taking. That will turn up most of the significant side effects.

[Phentex]

41. This is what I try to do...

even for medicines I give my dog. The info with the scripts are pages and pages long with tiny type. But online you can usually find good summaries plus everyday interactions that you want to avoid. It's definitely worth it!

[marym625]

22. I'm so sorry for your loss

[Holly_Hobby]

32. Thank you n/t

[Ms. Toad]

25. Taken as prescribed,

the tylenol in pain meds is within the safe range (absent an underlying liver condition). There are many other meds which contain tylenol - and people who do not understand that tylenol is a potent liver toxin sometimes combine prescribed pain meds containing tylenol with OTC meds which contain tylenol and result in a fatal overdose.

[Holly_Hobby]

33. My friend's husband said

she didn't take anything except the oxy, and she wasn't a drinker. I hope he gets an attorney so they can look at her records before the surgery. It won't bring her back, but it might answer those kind of questions.

[Ms. Toad]

49. She could have had a pre-existing liver condition,

Which will be hard to prove, since liver function tests are not part of a routine physical. My daughter (taking a liver toxin since she was 3) was not even getting regular liver screening. I had to stand on my head and scream to get her tested when she started showing functions of liver disease (unrelated to the toxins, but not unrelated to the disease for which she was taking the toxins). Post mortem, the cause of the liver damage may not be distinguishable. Suggest they look for signs of PSC. People often aren't aware they have it until it is extremely advanced - diagnosis occurs in one of 3 ways: IBD associated screening (my daughter's case), life insurance tests, and a dramatic increase in symptoms often related to one of the multiple associated cancers.

Your friend also may not have understood the limitations. Sometimes there are two - how frequently you can take the meds, and how many you can take in a 24 hour period. Taking them with the maximum frequency often exceeds the maximum 24 hour dosage.

[blondie58]

27. I am so sorry for your Lösses

And you are absolutely right. I don't Trust Big Pharma.
Personally, i have multiple sclerosis and I honestly don't believe that they will ever find a Cure. Why would they? They would lose too much money. I have in The Past, tried Some of The Newer amd riskier drugs, at the Suggestion of my doctor. One of them had the Risk of either permanently disabling me or outright killing me! I would Say a little prayer and Say-?please God- my bucket list is nowhere done being completed.
I am on a drug now that they think acts as a decoy so that when your body goes on attack mode and attacks the drug instead of your myelin.
I have Also cleaned up my Diet a lot and Try to eat organically. I do believe in 'let food be thy medicine and thy medicine food.
I also agree with you about the ads. I don't pay for cable and the number of commercials advertising is alarming and annoying. I do remember a time When These ads weren't allowed on Television.
Your friend and BIL were
way too Young. What a preventable tragedy.

[Holly_Hobby]

34. Thank you,

I have a neighbor with MS, she's gotten some relief from MS from CBD oil, illegally of course. She's only 31. They need to find not only a cure, but the CAUSE.

I hope you find a treatment to help you. I see every day the tragedy that is MS. (hug)

[blondie58]

43. Thank YOU! Holly_Hobby!

My personal opinion is that stress was the catalyst. i was DX 3 months before my 40th birthday.had been divorced the year before- which was a good thing- he was a type A person, always full of rage and blame.
I worked 50+ hours at the post office, had 2 Girls to Get up for School and Day Care, them Get to work On time.
I remember thinking- I guess I am am optimist!- that at least it is not fatal. It was the last time I cried myself to sleep. I feel like I am slowly going downhill. It started out sensory, but now it is more ambulatory. I can't walk for long and I am so slow.
But!! I live in Colorado, where we voted to legalize it for everyone! I am not a smoker, but I will do a tincture or edibles.
Life is interesting. You never know what it is going to throw at you!

[Holly_Hobby]

46. Stress is my problem too

I've evolved into the caretaker of everyone I know or are related to. I didn't ask for it, it just happened. It got to the point of making everyone take responsibility - they can read and comprehend as well as I can, so it was time for them to do it themselves. At this point, my husband and my dogs are my only "clients". My stress level is better, but not perfect.

I wish you well. I find meditation helpful. I meditate when I'm going to sleep and it lets me fall asleep without my mind going 100 miles a minute.

I considered CBD as well, but it makes my blood sugar go dangerously low.

[blondie58]

55. Actually, i am learning Meditation

I Discovered a Guy WHO Has ms in New Zealand WHO Started http://www.overcomingmultiplesclerosis.com
He believes that it is really good for you, Along with a plant Based Diet. My Problem is i have a monkey Brain, slways Moving from one Branch to another, and i have a hard Time keeping on Subject. I have to Really work On it.

I am very open to alternative methods. I don't Trust Big Pharma- i think it is up to me to Get better however i can.

[Faux pas]

38. I read that tylenol was a liver killer

about 15 yrs ago. I'm so sorry for your losses Holly_Hobby and I hope you keep spreading the word to help others.

I found this newer article on it:
http://guardianlv.com/2014/01/acetaminophen-the-liver-killer-you-take-for-pain/

[Holly_Hobby]

47. Thank you...

The article explains it in plain English.

If you need pain killers, demand the ones without Tylenol. They're A LOT cheaper too, since most of them are available in generic form.

[SusanCalvin]

39. I am so sorry for your loss.

The medical professionals should look out for you, but unfortunately you gotta look out for yourself.

I bet the two things you mention are very commonly overlooked.

I was recently given industrial-strength pain reliever plus Tylenol after surgery, even though a) I hadn't told them I was in any pain (I wasn't) and b) I had told them before the surgery that I didn't take Tylenol and why (way too easy to get an overdose, effect of overdose too dire). I foolishly (and somewhat groggily) just took what was in the cup.

And just the other day my surgeon casually told me to take Advil for a slight side effect of the surgery, even though she knew my cardiologist might put me on blood thinners.

Yep, you gotta look out for yourself.

[Holly_Hobby]

48. Thanks. Next time, tell them it's an allergy

Sometimes, you gotta do what you gotta do to protect yourself. Anything that threatens their liability will do it. If they give you Tylenol and your throat closes up and you die, it's a big lawsuit. It's the only thing that stops them.

[SusanCalvin]

52. That's great advice, thanks!

I need all the advice I can get on medical matters - never been hospitalized before in 62 years, so I'm pretty naive.

[Liberal_in_LA]

50. kick

[cui bono]

54. So sorry to hear that. That's terrible.

Thank you for posting the information.