In what parallel universe does a Jewish, self-described Socialist who

[PCIntern]

doesn't run a comb through his hair on a weekly basis, become President of these United States of America?

Yeah...I knocked myself out for McGovern, for Mondale, for Gore. My family sat shiva in 1952 and 1956 through about 2003 for Stevenson...

Who the Hell are you kidding? I went home while canvassing in Rochester, NY on Election Night, 1972 because a guy in a working-class neighborhood pulled out a gun and told me to leave his doorstep, because I was a Commie Hippie Bastard. And those are the words I care to type...

Go ahead: if you want Jeb, or Marco, or Ted, or Carly, then castigate Mrs. Clinton and vilify her for arising in the morning, and stay home on Election Night. At least you'll be able to chronicle the rapid rise of fascism in this country on DU - until it's shut down as being a subversive site.

[el_bryanto]

1. I suppose people might compare his history and stance on the issues

and conclude that he is closer to what they want in a presidential candidate.

Bryant

[PCIntern]

3. Well you're right about that...

and, as traditional Democrats, they'll lose in an election which would make the Reagan-Mondale contest look like Reagan squeaked out a victory. Again, what country are we living in? The one where BLACK MALES ARE SHOT IN THE BACK and the system covers for them...unless there's a video.

[libdem4life]

20. ...and even then ... toss-up between a paid vacation at home and a desk job for a while.

[JonLP24]

149. The economic situation exploded under Jimmy Carter

which explains the Reagan popularity, the recession cost Bush II his job. All people remembered was the long lines & the oil embargo, times are different and on the issues which most Americans support Bernie is in favor of. You think SS chained-CPI cuts floating by the Obama administration did him any favors? The mandate?

[Ken Burch]

155. We don't stop black males from getting shot

By nominating bland, passionless corporate centrists.

And this isn't about refusing to back HRC in the fall is she actually gets nominated.

We don't have to be defeatist and deferential to win the White House.

[elleng]

9. SOME people might do so;

MOST people won't.

[VanillaRhapsody]

28. They might....but what will you say if they decide noo....Hillary is?

[el_bryanto]

41. Well I'll say "Looks like I'm voting for Hillary in the General Election."

I won't be as happy about as I would be voting for Bernie - but I'll do it.

Bryant

[VanillaRhapsody]

44. Good....that means YOU are a Democrat...unlike some around here...

meaning the ones who WON'T say that!

As it stands ....currently she has a 50 point lead on the entire pack..

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/us/2016_democratic_presidential_nomination-3824.html

[el_bryanto]

47. Well what i would do is gloat and insult those who aren't excited about Hillary Clinton

That's sure to win them over to your side.

Bryant

[VanillaRhapsody]

49. they were never on my side...thats the point!

I do not for a minute believe they were...

[el_bryanto]

53. Nods - perhaps they would rather be on the people's side

Than the side of another mainstream pro-wall street candidate. Hillary will be better than any Republican, and her stands on some issues are admirable, but when it comes to the economy or war or the surveillance state - it's unclear she'll be any better than Obama.

Bryant

[VanillaRhapsody]

55. and perhaps they weren't that either...

the "people" seem to be supporting Clinton! Haven't you noticed her ratings?

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/us/2016_democratic_presidential_nomination-3824.html

[el_bryanto]

71. Lots of people vote for Republicans - i live in a state that just relected Rick Scott

Do you think that Rick Scott is on the side of the people?

Bryant

[VanillaRhapsody]

78. And that proves what? Apparently Republicans think he is on the side of the people...

but I am not a Republican...so I don't!

[DisgustipatedinCA]

119. Yes, but you're a paranoid who believes EVERYONE is a secret troll.

Or at least you've burned about 800 posts making that accusation in one form or another.

[VanillaRhapsody]

120. Did I call you one?

[DisgustipatedinCA]

121. You didn't specifically call me a troll, but yes, you've questioned my allegiance to the party.

I don't do purity tests or loyalty oaths, and if you try to make me, I'll skew your numbers every time.

[VanillaRhapsody]

122. Yes....and???

are you voting for Hillary Clinton if she wins the Primary? If the answer is no....I rest my case...

[DisgustipatedinCA]

126. No, I'm voting for Ted Cruz in 8 different states. Write that down in your little narc book.

If you're capable, you should really try reading Catch-22 one of these days. I don't imagine it would get through to you, but it's the best chance we have.

[Chan790]

171. I'm not...but only to spite the likes of you. :) n/t

[Chan790]

170. It's alright...

they're just reinforcing why I shouldn't bury the hatchet and vote for the nominee if Hillary wins the primary.

Fact is, I don't hate Hilary half as much at this point as I hate many of her supporters. I don't really want to share a party or a website with most of them.

[choie]

134. who the hell died and made you

the arbiter of who is a Democrat and who is not? Your posts in every thread makes it clear that you are threatened by Bernie's candidacy.

[mimi85]

169. Yeah and the Billboard music awards gave

Taylor Swift (ugh) awards for Top Artist, Top Female Artist, Top Billboard 200 Album, and the fan-voted Billboard Chart Achievement Award. To quote Jefferson Airplane, it doesn't mean "shit to a tree". Oh, I'll def vote for her if she's the nominee, but not with any enthusiasm.

Um, I obviously don't mean TS.

[madokie]

118. Thats the deal with me

I'd like to see Hillary be the first woman President but right now I think we need to get our house in order and Bernie is the only one talking about doing exactly that. I just feel like the world will be a much better place after a Sanders Presidency than any we've had in my lifetime. I think very highly of My President today too so keep that in mind as you read this

[Adrahil]

150. In the generals? Yeah.... Good luck with that. n/t

[steve2470]

2. oh you done it now....

[PCIntern]

6. Told the truth...?

I know..it's gonna hurt.

Oh, and BTW, I thought Obama's candidacy was brilliant and I voted for him in the PA primary, so it's not like I'm a big Hillary fan.

[cali]

21. the truth? it's an opinion

And it's a bit more complex. And how on earth is Bernie running in the primary going to hurt HRC? Not a big fan of a vigorous debate, are you? Not to mention the irony of you seeing bernie's ethnicity as a negative.

[appalachiablue]

139. +1 His running will help the country & Hillary if she's smart. Populism is rising, for good reason.

-Appa

[steve2470]

66. my points

1- God bless Bernie, he would be a great President. I love the guy.
2- Everyone should vote for who they want, in the primaries and in the general! I sure will.
3- I'm not going to debate this whole Hillary vs. Bernie vs. Jeb vs. et al thing.
4- I'm not convinced he can get elected. The socialism label is going to be a tough thing to explain and sell.
5- If Bernie wins the general election, everyone has my encouragement to rub this post in my face.
6- May the best male or female Democrat win!

[djean111]

4. Is there someone keeping count of how many times someone mentions Bernie being

Jewish - and meant as a bad thing?

Not agreeing with HRC on things like war and H-1B visas and Wall Street is not really "vilifying" her.
But your concern is noted.

[PCIntern]

10. I'm Jewish and I'm gonna tell you

that when Lieberman ran, many Jews were REALLY NERVOUS about it and didn't want to vote for him so they wouldn't be the lightning rod. So your narrow vision of things is also noted.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

79. I'm Jewish; I couldn't give a fuck what the ethnicity/religion is of the individual I'm voting for.

And you shouldn't, either.

[karynnj]

164. I'm Jewish and remember the huge excitement when Lieberman

was named to the Gore ticket. I never saw as much excitement for any election as for that one after he was named. This was in New Jersey.

In 2004, when he ran for President, I don't remember ANYONE speaking of not voting for him in the primary due to religion. (NJ's primary was too late for actually impacting the race. Lieberman never gained any traction. He opted not to contest Iowa and declared he came in tied three ways for third in NH -- even though the other two he was "tied" with had substantially more votes. He was fifth and, for all intents and purposes, his campaign was over -- the Lieberman wing of the Democratic party was almost non-existent. He then worked as a very lame counterproductive "surrogate" for the Democrats -- praising Bush's actions in Iraq.)

Not to mention, Sanders - unlike Lieberman - is not running as an AIPAC approved Jew -- he was the first Senator to say he was not going to hear Netanyahu.

[Hekate]

15. The part where PCIntern's family sat shiva for lost Dems is probably a big clue...

...as to where PC's concerns lie.

[elleng]

23. I'M Jewish, and I mention it 'often' because I think it's relevant

to the issues we discuss here. For MANY, it IS a bad thing.

[PCIntern]

27. elleng:

look at this place alone...

[elleng]

37. Not at all raising it for this place alone,

but for the 'wide' world of U.S. politics, PC. I ASSUME DUers don't mind that Bernie (and I, and others) are Jewish. (I hope I'm right. )

[BlueJazz]

84. I never "got" the whole Jewish thing. (regarding some non-Jewish people)

Perhaps my lack of spirituality had something to do with it. 4 of my good 7 friends are Jewish.
There's been some conversations in the last 3 years with other people that set-it-up for me to say "Most of my best friends are Jewish...really, most of them are Jewish.

The whole thing is just weird to me. ...the judging of people by what brand of God they like.

[elleng]

88. I'm with you, it IS weird.

My 'brand' of God happens to be 'I'll believe it when I see it,' that is, athiest, with Jewish upbringing.

[leftofcool]

102. I don't have a problem with your being Jewish.............

if you don't care that I am a pagan. I don't care if Bernie Sanders is Jewish.

[elleng]

104. No problems.

[MannyGoldstein]

59. Not bad for Manny at all

The secret cave from which we control the Media is fun to visit.

[elleng]

62. Well, Manny, I'm glad I've avoided that cave!

[winter is coming]

67. Or describes him as "Socialist" instead of a "Democratic Socialist", while failing

to note that anyone we run will be called a socialist by the RW?

[okaawhatever]

86. + 10,000 very relevant point. One of my concerns as well. nt

[Adrahil]

151. I didn't actually know he's Jewish. Doesn't matter to me.

But it WILL matter to a whole bunch of people who will TELL you they aren't racists, but wouldn't vote for a Jew.

[Maedhros]

5. I've searched your post for some kind of point, and couldn't find one. [n/t]

[PCIntern]

14. then you better keep looking... nt

[Maedhros]

16. Nah, better to just put you on ignore.

I've had enough of defeatist rhetoric.

[PCIntern]

30. Please do that...

[cali]

7. lol. my, aren't you an issue oriented voter

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251405411

[PCIntern]

22. My...aren't you principled...

it won't work here with him. And you know that...you really do. this whole thing is ridiculous. The guy says he's a SOCIALIST. It's his PARTY. Have you bothered to see what's going on here? This is a national electorate which is NOT GOING to elect a socialist. Ever. It's a wet dream for us Progressives.

The nightmare is Marco Rubio, or Jeb, or worse. and it can be worse.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

112. There are actually several different socialist parties.

Bernie specifically calls himself a Democratic Socialist, which isn't the same as either 'Democratic' or 'Socialist' when it comes to specific party. You can go to www.dsausa.org to check out the Democratic Socialists of America website.

[appalachiablue]

136. +1

[Adrahil]

153. I actually like that post you made cali...

And if more Bernie supporters had your wide awake attitude, it'd be great.

But those Bernie supporters who think the voters are gonna flock to Bernie in the generals are every bit as delusional as those wingnuts who think Ted Cruz would win by huge numbers.

[livetohike]

8. Well said. My fears too. The 1972 Presidential election was my first one able to vote. I was a

a Junior in college and worked to get out the vote for McGovern. Could not believe the result on election night!

[PCIntern]

11. Ex-actly. nt

[1939]

165. Note also

The Nixon landslide over McGovern hardly moved the needle in the House and Senate. Democrats there were elected and re-elected by substantial margins. White's book "The making of the President, 1972" covers the reasons why the differential. It wasn't a vote for the GOP, it was a vote against "the dirty hippies".

[livetohike]

168. Good point. I'll have to read that book. Hippies are still derided.

Can't have all that peace and love going on.

[Starry Messenger]

12. I know. I *am* a Socialist, and I think people are vastly overestimating his appeal.

I am also a labor organizer, and while down in Orange Co., some of us union thugs got called Communists. By professors. In California.

Over 30% of the country prefers socialism to capitalism, which is great. But I don't see how that gets us over the finish line.

The right wing is not done stomping the life out of the labor movement, which, right now, has an over 40% *disapproval* rate. We've made some progress, but the chickens are still voting for McNuggets out there.

[Adrahil]

152. Very well said! n/t

[hifiguy]

13. That's what they told Harry Truman and Paul Wellstone, too.

[PCIntern]

17. Ummmmm......

Harry Truman was a sitting President of the United States. And it was considered the greatest upset in the history of national politics. You want to bet the house on Bernie? I guess you do. You will lose...GUARANTEED. And I like him and his positions...tremendously. I would love to see this guy there...but it ain't gonna happen.

[jwirr]

50. A question: You like his positions. Are you against him entering the primary? At least those ideas

will be heard.

[Hekate]

18. Truman was Jewish? Wellstone didn't die in a small plane crash?

Oh yeah, that parallel universe.

[PCIntern]

25. Hekate:

logic does not apply. You can't even try...

It's like falling in love with the most beautiful person you've ever seen in high school and dreaming that you get to go to the prom with them, then a motel, and then live happily ever after. Well, the prom date isn't showing up at your house in this instance either, much less the rest of this.

[hifiguy]

29. Wellstone was Jewish. :)

And the point is that the "conventional wisdom" gave Truman no chance to win in '48 and nobody in their right mind thought Wellstone could unseat a wealthy and financially flush Raygun lapdog in 1990.

[Hekate]

39. There's only so many character spaces in a subject line. Oy vey

[JonLP24]

156. Truman was pushing Civil Rights legislation way before it was politically safe to do so

In fact, he did it during an election year.

Not surprising, a month later Gallup conducts a poll and this is where it really does become shocking for a politician--82% of those polled by Gallup opposed Harry Truman’s civil rights proposal, 82%. And I have to read you Harry Truman on polls, because it really says it all, that more politicians felt this way. These are his words, not mine. “I wonder how far Moses would have gone if he had taken a poll in Egypt. What would Jesus Christ have preached if he had taken a poll in Israel. Where would the Reformation have gone if Martin Luther had taken a poll? It isn’t polls or public opinion of the moment that counts. It’s right and wrong and leadership. Men with fortitude, honesty and a belief in right,” and by the way, at that point, obviously House member Lyndon Baines Johnson was taking polls because a month after all this happens he launches his campaign for Senate, his second and ultimately successful campaign and who is public enemy no. 1? Harry Truman’s civil rights proposal. He calls it a sham and a farce. So it was widespread political opposition to Harry Truman. This is an election year. Harry Truman is unflinching. He has no intention of backing down.

At this point, Harry Truman’s popularity is not increasing at all, I can assure you. The Republicans on June 24 hold their convention in Philadelphia. Come up with a dream ticket. The dream ticket for ‘48--Thomas Dewey, Governor of New York; on the other coast of the country, Earl Warren, Governor of California. There was so much concern in the Democratic leadership that Harry Truman could not be elected largely because of civil rights that a number of leading Democrats tried to recruit Dwight Eisenhower to be the nominee for the party. That finally collapsed. It’s only on July 15th a week before the Democrat convention. That convention takes place in Philadelphia like the Republican convention. It’s a free-for-all. Why? Harry Truman’s civil rights proposal. There’s a fight over the plank that is legendary. Harry Truman puts forward a plank that is constitutionally anchored and calls for legislation. The state rights Democrats respond with a regressive proposal and Mayor Hubert Humphrey from Minneapolis comes in with a very explicit plank that tracks Truman’s February 2nd proposal to Congress. It’s a fight that would shatter the party. The more explicit plank prevails by 69 votes.

The next night Harry Truman finally is the nominee of his Party, but it’s not a happy party; 947 delegates vote for Truman, 263 vote for racist Georgia Senator Richard Russell. Only 13 of the southern delegates vote for Truman and importantly, a statistic that stunned me because of the make up of the Party today, of the 1,234 delegates in Philadelphia at that convention, only 17 were African Americans. Imagine that the black leadership in the Party was so nascent and so de minimus at that point.

Harry Truman makes a great speech. He wasn’t a great orator but he outdid himself this night and he blamed all the ills of the country on the do-nothing Republican-controlled Congress. He also said Republican Congress, you want to make the country right. I’ll give you a chance. Come back to Washington. I’m calling a special session, the Turnip Day Session. Be back in un-air-conditioned Washington on July 26th. We’ll meet for two weeks and we’ll see if you can deliver on your plank. No reason you can’t. You’ve got the leadership. Before that session started, however, the party really fragmented. July 17th then South Carolina Governor Strom Thurmond creates the Dixiecrat Party. Two days later Henry Wallace who had been FDR’s vice president creates the Progressive Party. Essentially the Party is shattered. Two of the three prongs that Democrats had relied on, that FDR had relied on for his four victories are gone, the Progressives, the Southern Democrats.

http://www.virginia.edu/uvanewsmakers/newsmakers/gardner.html

[Aerows]

35. Yep and as a Democrat

I'll vote for who I damn well please to vote for in the Primary. Bernie has my support.

[hifiguy]

36. Damn tootin'!!

[Aerows]

38. Absolutely, my friend!

[Zorra]

19. In the universe where Bernie's candidacy is not all and only about Secretary Clinton.

[cali]

26. +1

I actually think the opposite is a riot.

[Zorra]

34. ...

[Pooka Fey]

68. +1

[Dragonfli]

130. But you don't UNDERSTAND 1!11!!! It's all about Hilary!!!1

Always has been,it is HER TURN DAMNIT!!!

[rurallib]

24. I think we are already chronicling the rapid rise of fascism in this country

[appalachiablue]

135. +1. Country is very, very far right. Worst in 100+ years. My parents & grands were

tolerant, educated, patriotic and liberal compared to now, seriously. Something that would have never entered my mind 10-20 years ago. And my father fought fascism in Nazi Germany.
The rapid rise of fascism in the US yes, and unopposed, largely. Look at this thread- fear.

:thumbsdown

-Appa

[seabeyond]

137. this is such a failed alert. what is it about? not that i necessarily agree with you, but still.

On Wed Apr 29, 2015, 10:31 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

I think we are already chronicling the rapid rise of fascism in this country
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6591488

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Straight off a RW web site. Let's not start this shit here. Unbelievable.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Wed Apr 29, 2015, 10:40 PM, and the Jury voted 0-7 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: If you aren't noticing the creeping fascism in the US, you aren't paying attention
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: This poster took it off the OP. I do not get why anyone would alert. A lot of people have made the statement we are walking in facism today. Believe it or not, but not a reason to alert.

[spanone]

31. k&r...

[Aerows]

32. Anywhere they choose to run

and have support while doing so.

This is still the USA, isn't it? I'll vote for the man in the primary. He is putting himself out there as a candidate, and I like him.

The rest is just nonsense.

[Scootaloo]

33. Same universe where a biracial liberal junior senator whose father was from Kenya does

But by all means, PCIntern. Keep telling us how Jeb Bush is amazing and unbeatable.

[peacebird]

43. +1

[PCIntern]

45. Oh...it's YOU!

Bwahaha.

Nice try...trivial post, but appropriately so.

[hifiguy]

46. Well played.

Octavia approves

[woo me with science]

48. [phone]

[PCIntern]

54. I see you have a fan club here, Scooty...

Good luck to you on this tack...

[Scootaloo]

70. I don't think they're fans of me, per se

Rather I think we're all people who recognize Sen. Sanders has a strong chance, and all your panic-mongering about his hairdo and faith isn't going to change that.

[PCIntern]

96. You're gonna love his stance on Israel, Scooter...

can't wait!

[Scootaloo]

98. I already know it.

You're starting to remind me of a fishing trip I went on once.

[PCIntern]

100. Oh yeah…he called you and told you all about the

secret agreements we have with Israel, Egypt, and Jordan.

[Scootaloo]

101. Bernie's positions regarding israel aren't secret, dude

Seriously, take your bait and go somewhere else, will ya?

[karynnj]

166. Please provide details -- beyond that he said out Netanyahu's address

From everything I have heard from Sanders, who is my Senator, there is very little difference between him and Obama or Kerry on Israel. The same could also be said of Hillary Clinton.

As a Jew active in a Burlington synagogue, I have heard NOTHING to suggest that there is a problem with him on this -- and many people, including our rabbi, were in Burlington when he was mayor.

[Pooka Fey]

58. What Scootaloo said

[Aerows]

107. Bernie is running

he has every right to run, and I have every right to vote for him. And I will!

[Warren DeMontague]

123. And whose name rhymes with "Osama"

Dude doesn't have a chance in hell!

[appalachiablue]

138. +1

[magical thyme]

147. you left out "socialist, muslin"

right now, with 2 official primary candidates, Sanders gets my vote.

[GoneOffShore]

40. I'll be voting for Bernie in the primary here in Philadelphia.

And if he gets the nomination in the General Election.

I'm hoping he pulls Clinton further to the left so that she's not just a shoo in and able to show her further allegiance to her corporate donors.

[lumberjack_jeff]

42. Shorter: A vote for the poorly groomed socialist Jew is a vote for Hitler. n/t

[PCIntern]

51. "There you go again."

Nice try...

I am one of the few outspoken, unrepentant Zionists on DU, and your attempt at deflection is, well, is amusing. I'll leave it at that.

[lumberjack_jeff]

63. If he's unelectable, then why are you worried about the trivial few of us who will vote for him?

I'm not going to hold my nose and vote for the lesser of two evils until there's no alternative.

[Cheese Sandwich]

81. LOL exactly

[Joe Turner]

52. The lesser of 2 evils have produced nothing but Status Quo Candidates in both parties

The time is now to go for broke for Bernie. There is little downside in a Hillary vs Bush affair.

[PCIntern]

56. Yeah...Bush v Gore reprise, right?

Wouldn't matter which one was President, right?

Wow.

[Comrade Grumpy]

57. In what parallel universe does America elect a black guy president?

[PCIntern]

61. Against Sara Palin....

and G.W. Bush, and Dick Cheney, and John McCain. That one.

You think it's the same?

[tridim]

157. He beat the "Inevitable" Hillary as well. nt

[Gothmog]

60. I would love to see a Jewish President in my lifetime

However for now I will settle for the first female POTUS

[PCIntern]

65. I'm with you 100%.

Kerry had that Jewish lineage...it was close. Perhaps soon with a mainstream candidate who will appropriately support the military-industrial complex like they all do. I'm not happy about it...but that's how it's gonna be. Like it or not.

[nadinbrzezinski]

64. I will go there

the same actual universe where I really do not think it truly matters who gets actually nominated or ultimately elected. The power behind the Presidency will make sure that whoever gets elected continues with the program. Call me a cynic. I have been called far worst, and this week alone, in this place no less... but in an oligarchy it really does not matter.

I will vote, for whom, my own damn business, but truly, to remain in practice.

And on a very short line... those who are the powers behind this will not let a Jew who does not comb his hair get even close to winning the primary. Mostly, they probably fear that man will not listen, for his own good mostly. Killing presidents can get messy after all.

It has none to do with socialist, or his personal views either. It is just business.

And you speak of fascism in the future tense... we are there my friend, it is here. It is not the old form that we are all so familiar with though, but what the PRI did in Mexico is what has been achieved here.

This will be some grand theater though.

[PCIntern]

69. I know this nadin...

but yo and I also both know what's going on here with some of his biggest fans.

Fascism has been here to some degree for generations...it's just rearing its head more due to the nature of communication and the wider knowledge base due to the Internet and Cable and iPhones.

Ike, almost unwittingly, was a greater hero and prognosticator than anyone in our lifetimes. Strange to say from someone who came from a home, as I said, where Stevenson was considered even greater than FDR.

[nadinbrzezinski]

72. I am one of his fans

but I get to vote in a state where the primary is too late to matter. And I am a member of the media, so I don't play the partisan shit. I really do not.

I know he will not win the nomination, and has none to do with his views, or appeal or anything like that. It has to do with the reality of the former american republic. RIP, 1787-2000.

[Aerows]

108. I'll give him my vote, Nadin

He's a good man and would make a fine President.

[nadinbrzezinski]

110. I will vote, I am reserving who I will vote for

[99Forever]

73. Is someone upset?

Oh noez!

[n2doc]

74. Funny, I didn't know that he had won the primary

Congratulations are in order!

Frankly if her royal inevitable-ness can't beat such a 'terrible' challenger, then what hope does she have in the general election? Let's see how the process goes first.

[ucrdem]

75. Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory is always a great idea.

I don't get it either.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

76. Oh, please ...

Give it a rest.

[1StrongBlackMan]

77. That parallel universe called DU. n/t

[steve2470]

95. +1 nt

[1StrongBlackMan]

113. But I should add ...

Bernie's being Jewish would/is not a draw back ... The 2 time election of the Black guy shows that. The same folks that wouldn't vote for him because he is Jewish, didn't vote for President Obama because he is Black.

Now that avowed socialist thing might give a bunch of Americans, pause ... cuz "that's communism!!!!"

[steve2470]

129. yep I totally agree on all counts! nt

[freshwest]

114. It's not only parallel, but nonpareil in that regard... n/t

[Cheese Sandwich]

80. Got it. We shouldn't back Bernie because he is a Commie Jew with bad hygiene. Thanks.

[hrmjustin]

82. Hey at least he is trying.

[BainsBane]

83. Electability is made evident through the course of the campaign

In Cold War America, a socialist wouldn't have stood a chance. Times have changed, however. Let's see how it goes. I see no reason to write Sanders off a priori.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

85. I'll be willing to take a chance on a parallel universe with Bernie ratther than

vote for Hillary.

[LittleBlue]

87. Funny how you act so pro-Jewish until a Jewish man needs your support to run for president

Then the cape comes off and you're using the word "Jew" as a euphemistic slur for "unelectable". The same way certain people said a black man whose name rhymes with Osama being president is a "fairy tale".

I see what you're doing. And it's disgusting.

[Jesus Malverde]

124. Nailed it

Jesus

[Renew Deal]

89. I don't make the connection of Sanders in the primary to General Election defeat

Your post is about reasons to not nominate Sanders. But the chances of that happening are very low. I don't think him running in the primary affects our GE prospects unless he wins.

[cali]

90. c'mon, tell us: how does a primary challenge hurt the invincible HRC?

[Jamastiene]

91. You sound so cheerful.

Did you like Einstein's hairstyle any better?

[Mnpaul]

92. They have been saying Bernie can't win since the 90's

and he has been proving them wrong since 1990. He was the first independent in 40 years to win a House seat. The Republicans and the Democrats even teamed up in an effort to defeat him. They failed. Republicans threw piles of money at him and it failed badly(he shut them out).

[cherokeeprogressive]

94. I only know one thing... I'm casting five votes for Bernie in the CA primary.

Who's with me?

[LWolf]

97. In the universe I wish to live in.

So I think I'll be the change I wish to see.

[smokey nj]

127. Well said, LWolf!!

[tiredtoo]

99. interesting opinions here

I am voting for Bernie. Every time I can.

[PCIntern]

103. …and well that you should

Look, I'm not saying he shouldn't bun - I'm not saying that I don't agree with him 98% of the time - I'm saying that he cannot win a general election in the USA next year. I would vote for him if he were on the ticket of course, but I voted for McGovern too. And Mondale. And Carter both times.

I'm just saying that a self-proclaimed Socialist, a landsman as we say, cannot win a GE here. Period.

[GummyBearz]

105. Talk about a total non-issue.. We've never had a jewish president, also never had a female president

what parallel universe would a female get elected? HAHAHA geez, talk about a total non-issue. Vote for the banks if you want, I'll vote for the middle/lower classes

[PowerToThePeople]

106. McCarthyist antisemite

Your op is worth pizza imho.

[Jesus Malverde]

125. Yep..nt

[hatrack]

109. Trying, really trying to give a fuck about your post . . . trying, so close . . .

Nope. No fucks to give.

Have a nice day!

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

111. If you're in a universe in which George W Bush was president for 8 years,

you're already in a parallel universe. Anything can happen in a universe in which that can happen.

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

115. Wow! I mean, are you wiggying out over Bernie?

Those of you who lose your minds are simply convinced Bernie will beat Hillary. I know that, because the rational Hillary supporters don't flip their shit and babble about DEFCON 1 if people support Bernie.

Tedious

[DisgustipatedinCA]

116. Get onboard with Hillary because of Sanders' hair and your prior hippie experience?

Makes about as much sense as some of the other stuff I read here. Still, no thank you.

[Stuart G]

117. Perhaps someone should define, "socialst" for the crowd in a way all will understand.

Remember, socialism is not the same for everyone that thinks about it.

[Purveyor]

128. .

[Autumn]

131. In my universe

[Dragonfli]

132. I get it, no one would elect a Jew or a black guy or a woman.

We need to run a WASP if we want to win!!!

[WillyT]

133. God... I Do Love Satire.

[liberal_at_heart]

140. and another person goes on my ignore list. Thanks for playing the blame game. I'm done

listening to this crap.

[jberryhill]

141. A long haired Jewish socialist?

[LeftyMom]

142. I'm sure this seems like insight to people hopped up on gas.

You should stick to your day job, punditry doesn't suit you.

[Blue_In_AK]

143. Here we go again with the "stay home on election night" crap.

Who at DU doesn't vote? Please...

[AgingAmerican]

144. Hair on fire strawman OP

[Behind the Aegis]

145. Anything is possible.

I don't know how "electable" he will or won't be, any more than I did with Obama. I do, however, have concerns he will be pilloried for being a socialist, a term not even understood by some on the left, and for being Jewish. Hell, look at this thread where you have been chastised for "not supporting the Jew" and being an anti-Semite, IN THE SAME THREAD!! The right, despite their "love" for Israel, do not have that same love for Jews. Then, there is the left...again, just look at this thread or the scads of others where "Democrats are bad. Jewish Democrats are the worst." or the very mention of Jewish politicians brings out the long knives. We get 'lists of dual citizens" (all Jews, of course) and the predictable hand-wringing about "such a small group of individuals running the country." Or how the Congress is run by "The Likud", can imagine the response about a Jewish president?! The recent threads about the gay couple who sponsored Cruz? "Jewish first, gay second." Yeah, Sanders will have a tough road to face, but so will Hillary, which is also just as evident, even more so at this point.

Personally, I don't care about his hair anymore than I do Hillary's, but I suppose that was just a joke.

[Adrahil]

154. Well said. But about the hair...

If you think personal appearance doesn't matter in a Presidential election, then I suggest you read up on the subject. It WILL matter in a big way. Presidential elections are least as much about perception as they are about any kind of substance.

[GeorgeGist]

146. Always entertaining.

[JonLP24]

148. Oh jesus, it is different place now

Young people & most people are no longer afraid of USSR style socialism & now we know a little more than the media has kept from us. Who knows what kind of dirty tricks Republicans will be up to but certainly they have ammo when it comes to Hillary Clinton. Even if it is a fake scandal or whatever, nothing remotely resembling such a thing can be tied plus she is very polarizing with high unfavorability ratings (she has a higher favorability but about 46% unfavor her)

America voted for an African American with a middle name of Hussein and a last name that rhymes with Osama while also with a "radical preacher&quot chickens came home to roost following 9/11 was used quite heavily) & any associates they can throw such as Louis Farrakhan. The kind of people America wouldn't vote for before but you see you have the unprecedent turnouts, grassroots movements, the "Change" which many took as a real change to the political system rather than a change from Bush. He wasn't playing the middle during the campaign. Didn't follow the 2008 but Romney was so easy with his flip flops before the primary, flip flops for Governor, flip flops for President -- guy obviously had no convictions.

[stone space]

158. Well, this is a "Christian Nation", I suppose. No Jews allowed. (nt)

[Orrex]

159. I'm copying/pasting this from another thread where it was also relevant:

The accusation is repeatedly made that people who doubt Sanders' chances are "afraid" of him. That's a petty and short-sighted criticism. There are solid reasons to question his odds of winning.

And the answer once again is "he truly seems to stand very little chance of success."

Don't get me wrong--I would LOVE to see Sanders take the Whitehouse, and I would vote for him in a heartbeat. I just don't think that it's realistic to expect him to win, and my assessment isn't based on defensiveness or fear.


His commendable history as a "democratic socialist" will be used as a pile-driver to bludgeon his campaign every minute of every hour between winning the primary and the general election. He will be decried as a communist with "foreign" ideas, and he will be attacked for not being a real American. His brother's former candidacy for the Green Party in the UK will be offered as proof of this, as will Bernie's own praise of Scandinavian-style socialism.

His age will be a factor. The same pundits who adore "maverick" John McCain will claim that Sanders is too old, and they'll claim it constantly. They'll imply that his health is questionable, and they'll suggest that he's not fit to serve as President.

His heritage will be a factor, especially as it pertains to his less than cozy relationship with Bibi and Likud. In addition to supposed problems involving "our greatest ally," he'll have to face the idiocy of anti-Semitism. Not a major factor in Vermont, perhaps, but the nation as a whole has a large population of haters.

His politics will be a major factor. For most Americans, self-identifying as a "democratic socialist" is tantamount to growing a Stalin mustache and instituting a pogrom. Bernie's unparalleled record of social responsibility notwithstanding, he would be identified as "the Socialist Candidate" in every media outlet until Nov 2016, probably by saying "74 year old Socialist Bernie Sanders spoke in Poughkeepsie, and..."

They will also claim that his career spent representing the tiny state of Vermont hasn't prepared him for the Whitehouse, and he'll be slammed for being out of touch with the values of mainstream America.

And that's all before we even get into the reality of Hillary's massive warchest and support structure already built.


I admire everything about Sanders, and I've never disagreed with a single political statement I've heard from him, but I simply don't think it's realistic to expect him to win.

[Scuba]

160. Lame.

[OilemFirchen]

161. I'm enjoying the fuck out of this thread.

It's a great peek under the tent - a preview of the inevitable onslaught of "Goyishim Tells The Joos How They Should Think" threads.

I welcome them, if, at the least, they give our AA friends a well-deserved break.

[karynnj]

162. You are ignoring that IF Sanders got the nomination, many things would have had to happen

The main one would be that he would have to take back the word "Democratic socialism" to what it really is. Many in America hear "socialism" and thing Communist Russia -- not Scandinavia. It would be a huge (maybe not doable) step to get people to instead see that he is speaking of Scandinavia. The fact is that Scandinavian counties have among the highest average income and regularly rate very high on any scale that attempts to score "happiness".

Then look at the acceptance of programs - like Social Security and Medicare - that come closest to democratic socialism. These are the Gold Standard for government programs.

Consider also that the President can only lead, he or she can not unilaterally change the government. The President has more latitude on foreign policy.

I don't think Sanders will win the primary, but if he does it is because he has been able to sell his values in terms that will resonate with Americans. Consider that, while it took a very divided election, with two Democratic candidates, for him to win the first time as mayor of Burlington, VT -- he won his last term in a landslide against a person who had BOTH the Republican and Democratic line. He will then start with the 40 or so percent of the Democratic vote that any Democrat will get -- because the alternative is the Republican.

Lastly, what's with the obnoxious attack that he does not comb his hair? That is as ridiculous as if I pointed out that Condi Rice (or John Kerry for that matter) as Secretary of State was more consistently well groomed - with her hair always neat and attractive - and more physically fit than Hillary was. However, just like Bernie's hair, how well groomed the Secretaries were was not important to how they did their job. I assume you would agree with me that no matter how well dressed or coiffed Dr Rice was, HRC was the better Secretary of State.

[sendero]

163. I've been saying this for years..

..... lots of people, even people who in their past used Socialist as an epithet, are going to be praying for a little socialism as things continue to deteriorate.

It might not be the right time for Sanders this instant, but that time is coming.

[Orsino]

167. In what parallel universe does a primary challenge throw an election to Republicans?

2/10 would not be trolled again.