Pope Francis is scaring the hell out of conservatives. Here’s the real reason why

[applegrove]

Pope Francis is scaring the hell out of conservatives. Here’s the real reason why

by Edward L. Rubin at Salon

http://www.salon.com/2015/09/26/pope_francis_is_scaring_the_hell_out_of_conservatives_heres_the_real_reason_why/

"SNIP................


Americans have rejected this approach for over 100 years, perhaps since the presidency of Theodore Roosevelt. We insist that the way large business enterprises deal with their employees and their customers must be regulated. More recently, we have insisted that the impact of these enterprises on the environment needs to be regulated as well, and that they cannot be permitted to pour poison into our waters and fumes into our air at will.

Recognizing the reality of climate change will necessarily lead to further forms of regulation. That reality emphasizes what physical and social scientists have come to recognize in recent years: that the most recent geological era (usually called the holocene) has ended, and that we are now in an entirely new situation, often described as the anthropocene – the era of human domination. We now decide whether plant and animal species survive or go extinct, we control the drainage patterns of the lakes and rivers, we determine the extent of the forests and the grasslands. Now it’s become clear that we are decisively affecting the basic climate of the Earth – the temperature of the air and of the seas, the patterns of atmospheric and oceanic currents, the size of the polar ice caps, the frequency of violent storms, and the general habitability our the only place where we will ever live. The indelible image that our conquest of space has given us – that of our planet as a small, blue and white ball turning in a void – carries an important message. Because of our technology, we truly hold the Earth in the palm of our hand.


All this means that conservatives are simply wrong. We’ve gone past the point where the large enterprises that determine the health of the economy, our working people, our environment, and now our planet, can be left to do what they wish. Some types of regulation are undoubtedly better than others. Policy analysts may be correct in their recent enthusiasm for more subtle approaches, which rely on inducement, rather more obvious ones that makes use of threats. But we must regulate, we must exercise control over the awesome powers that modern technology has placed in our hands.

People don’t like to admit that they are wrong, however. Children stamp their feet or burst into tears. Adults concoct bizarre conspiracy theories (tens of thousands of scientists, from all over the world, have joined together to perpetrate a hoax), engage in outright denials in the face of overwhelming evidence (Marsha Blackburn says that someone – she won’t say who — told her that the Earth is getting cooler) and insult anyone who tells them something they don’t want to hear (even if that person is the leader of a religion they’ve been touting as the truth for decades). But the conservatives are wrong — wrong about climate change and wrong about their entire approach to governing our nation. It’s time for everyone else to stop listening to them.


..............SNIP"

[hifiguy]

1. Environmental degradation and predatory capitalism

are the biggest threats to this planet.

That Pope Frank has them as his top priorities is a good thing, and I am an atheist. People who would not otherwise pay much attention to these issues will hear his important words.

[applegrove]

2. And the fact that what humans decide to do now deeply affects the planet means there is no excuse

for regulation to be in the hands of corporations.

[Enthusiast]

26. Right on!

[Rosa Luxemburg]

46. The Pope is a real Christian. The politicians are just using it as they please.

I've been appalled at the comments by Republicans against the Pope.

[hifiguy]

4. Obvious troll is incredibly obvious.

Your pizza will be showing up shortly.

[pnwmom]

5. Yeah, didn't keep the mask on for even one post. nt

[hifiguy]

6. They ain't making trolls like they used to.

[pnwmom]

8. yeah, they're getting dumber and dumber

[applegrove]

14. Actually I think they are getting smarter. And refusing to allow Bernie Sanders supporters to say

they would support Hillary if she is the democratic nominee. Hillary supporters often say they will support Sanders if he wins the nomination. But when you ask Sanders supporters, crickets. Trolls pretending to be democrats started the great DU Feminism War and the great DU race war in the last few years..... all settled issues amongst democrats. They ginned up anger and hatred on those occasions. Why wouldn't they actually gin up hatred during an election?

[applegrove]

7. Dam. I always miss trolls when they respond to my OPs. This one was gone quick.

[pnwmom]

9. Thanks for your OP! I meant to reply right away, but I got distracted

alerting on the creep.

[applegrove]

11. Thank you.

[hifiguy]

10. I alerted and it was - poof! - vaporized instantly.

Only lasted one post.

[applegrove]

12. Thanks.

[Skittles]

13. they can't diss him the way they diss Democrats

no indeed

[hifiguy]

15. They are, though.

Several pukes told him to stop spreading left-wing propaganda. Unbelieveble. He actually has a scientific background.

[Skittles]

16. fans of the Pope are more inclined to listen to the Pope than ignorant repukes

heck, that that goes for all thinking people

[zentrum]

18. I heard today on NPR....

…that 50% of Catholics have left the church over the last couple of decades. The pedophilia.

But still, yes, the fans of the Pope will.

Bet he has more fans at this point than he has Catholics. And that's very new.

[DhhD]

25. And it is the Jesus factor too. Pope Francis is a Jesuit-Society of Jesus. RW and Dominionist

are against the Second Coming of Christ, and the Great Commission of Jesus Christ. People left to go to a church that follows the teachings of Jesus.

http://www.sjweb.info/

[Skittles]

45. people wonder why there is a statue of limitations on sex abuse crimes

as quoted on Law & Order, blame the church lobby

[starroute]

17. If "subtle inducements" means tax breaks for corporations, that won't work either

Somebody needs to lay down the law and make sure that nobody steps out of line.

I'll grant the conservatives this much -- that it isn't ideal to give that power to the same government that already spies on us and lies to us and attempts to control our lives. And international bodies that have their own agendas, or that try to cater to the agendas of their members, aren't any better.

But somebody is going to have to play kindergarten teacher and draw some hard lines -- no bribes, no inducements, just this is the way it's going to be from now on.

[applegrove]

19. People across the country in Canada are evolving on their support of oil as it is suddenly really

seen as a fuel of yesterday. Solar/wind/geothermal has really begun to become popular. Hope that happens in the US too.

[Beartracks]

20. Capitalism is not a form of self-governance.

It's an economic engine which is not, by its nature, democratic.

And like a nuclear chain reaction, it needs to be carefully regulated in order to be sustained without destroying the society in which it operates.

==================

[applegrove]

21. Exactly. That is a good analogy.

[hifiguy]

35. An excellent post! nt

[NonMetro]

22. Here We Go Again?

Conservatives are quaking in their boots, running like scared jackrabbits, and heaving their dinner because the Pope says they're wrong on climate change, and will finally, at long last expose them like the father he is and give them a good spanking!

This naivety and wishful thinking will get us nowhere!

[applegrove]

23. The tide on the environment is turning. And the pope is a part of that. So are thoughtful articles

like this one. Over a thousand people have looked at my OP. I wonder how many more places it has been shared by others who came across it like I did.

[NonMetro]

44. Sure, But...

What I was addressing was the idea that conservatives were quaking in their boots because the Pope was going to set them straight, and show them to the world as liars or something. Nothing could be further from the truth. First, conservatives could care less what the Pope thinks about climate change, and they've already said so hundreds of times. Second, Boehner did not invite the pope to address congress because he thought he would do damage to the Republicans. He was invited to support the Republican agenda of defunding Planned Parenthood, and ultimately getting rid of Roe v Wade - that's the GOP end game, and the Pope did that - and provided critical support for traditional marriage to boot.

So, once women, and I'm not one, end up in back alleys again performing abortions because safe and legal will be gone, the Pope will have been a part of that.

[DaveT]

24. American conservatives

Stopped being conservative with Ronald Reagan and supply side economics. Instead of adhering to skepticism about all the various utopian schemes of dreamers, the GOP became the font of a new Utopian Dream -- the Free Market.

Get the government off America's back and we will have Morning in America forevermore.

Instead of a principled philosophy concerned with Original Sin and the baseness of human nature, today's "conservative" is a radical and a purist.

This change in right wing philosophy came about when clever political specialists realized that the Republicans never won a national election with their bitching about Deficit Spending. So they hoked up what David Stockman called a Trojan Horse -- the "theory" of tax cuts unleashing America from bonds if liberalism.

Bad economics and worse public policy -- but great politics for a generation.

Three decades later they have cut taxes and reduced regulation beyond any rational measure. The result has not been Utopia. More like hell.

The Pope, a spokesperson for getting into heaven himself, can spot a rival religion from a mile off. For whatever reservations one may have with The Papacy, at least the Catholics don't claim that you can live in heaven before you're dead.

[Enthusiast]

27. +1! That is one hell of a post, DaveT.

Conservatism, like liberalism, has mostly lost the original meaning. We are up a creek. The media is entirely under 'their' control. Aside from supporting Bernie Sanders I do not know what to do.

[BuelahWitch]

33. Yes, instead of a Utopia,

they've created a Dystopia. Great post!

[hifiguy]

36. Bravo! Got it in one.

Stockman let the cat out of the bag and called bullshit for what it was decades ago and was erased from history for his troubles.

That a pope is calling the greed heads on the carpet has to be a very nasty shock. Frank seems rather familiar with the social gospel, something repug xtians use for toilet paper.

[oberliner]

28. Salon has to stop with the clickbait headlines

They are supposed to be a legitimate news site, aren't they?

[applegrove]

29. It is a great meme that we humans have so much technology that alters

the planet and thus must start to consider the effect with our every move, and thus not leave it up to corporations who don't have 'taking care of the planet' in their DNA. They were never created to do that.

[restorefreedom]

30. i did not click on it

since i no longer care for salon

what was the bait?

[oberliner]

31. Headline makes you click to find the "real reason" instead of identifying it as climate change

Just a real pet peeve when a source like that one plays that game.

[restorefreedom]

32. just another reason

for me to sty away from salon

thx for the info

[applegrove]

38. It is novel to describe man and technology has having

the future of the whole earth in the palm of man's hand. I'm glad I read the whole article. It is important.

[oberliner]

39. Agreed

I am just suggesting that the headline could have reflected the content rather than making it a "click here to find out" type style.

[pinboy3niner]

34. You know why the Pope scares the bejeezus out of me?

Stanley has risen from the dead!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1018801026



For the youngsters, this is a reference to Stanley of the old-time comic screen duo of Stan Laurel and Oliver Hardy.

[applegrove]

37. Cute.

[47of74]

40. There's a local teabagger here who had some "words of wisdom" on Francis

We have this local loud mouth teabagger where I live. He hates the Pope because Francis is the slightest bit progressive. Check out some of these words of wisdom he decided to grace us with in the comments to this letter;

Nothing nobel or just about this imposter.

The pope is a man and not God; he is not even a representative of God on Earth as no representative of God would associate with the likes of the godless castro brothers who to this day enslave the people of Cuba.

The representative of God here on earth would condemn Islam the religion of death vowed to destroy all infidels (that’s Christians the followers of the teachings of Christ).

The representative of God here on earth would never promote socialism.

Of course this idiot was all about the Papacy when ol' Benny or JPII were in charge. Back then he and his fellow teabaggers loved hitting people over the heads about how we had to obey the Pope on everything.

[mmonk]

41. Well written. This Professor Rubin I'll have to check out.

[stupidicus]

42. that's not the biggie imho

as I've argued it for years now, it's more about the fact that dealing with the human costs (saving lives and reducing misery) will require "socialistic" solutions that they cannot or willnot readily sign off on. Once their minions become "aware" of the costs of their gullibility, well, it's a whole new ball game...

That's why I'd say that AGW will inevitably end rightwingnuttery as we currently know it. I'd also say that the wealth/income inequality we're seeing didn't occur by accident, and that this about AGW was a prominent factor in the monyed interests calculations. It's all been about making their money piles so large that they'll still be calling the shots (assuming no successful efforts to get money outta politics) when the socialists whittle away at it.

If Exxon "knew" what was inevitable, what are the odds that the minds behind the money didn't? It's why Raygun started it, and in recent years, the Pea Party was formed to further impede progress of socialist/taxation/redistribution kind...

[whereisjustice]

43. Scares the hell out of DNC elite as well... a message about inequality and injustice might catch on

and that would make Hillary more of a liability than she already is.