BREAKING:10 dead, 20 injured at shooting at Umpqua Comm.College in Oregon

[Are_grits_groceries]

BREAKING NEWS: At least 10 deceased in a school shooting at Umpqua Community College in Oregon
@BNONews: BREAKING: At least 10 dead, 20 injured in mass shooting at Oregon college - CNN

Edit: CNN says shooter has been detained. Oregon police onfirmed casualies.

No confirmation but ambulances have been seen leaving the school quickly.
Very bad!

[bigdarryl]

1. JESUS!!!!!!!!! help this county

[randome]

2. It's a bit quick to have those statistics already. I question whether CNN is accurate at this stage.

[hr][font color="blue"][center]There is nothing you can't do if you put your mind to it.
Nothing.[/center][/font][hr]

[Are_grits_groceries]

5. CNN says Oregon police have confirmed the numbers. nt

[Cali_Democrat]

3. American exceptionalism. nt

[Tommy_Carcetti]

37. Cue the Lee Greenwood. nt

[mahatmakanejeeves]

4. Active shooting reported at Umpqua Community College

It's not even on Google News yet.

Roseburg. I've been through there.

Active shooting reported at Umpqua Community College

By Casey Parks | The Oregonian/OregonLive
http://twitter.com/caseyparks
on October 01, 2015 at 11:08 AM, updated October 01, 2015 at 11:14 AM

A shooter has been reported at Umpqua Community College, according to the Douglas County Fire District's Twitter account. It's unclear how many wounded or if the shooting is still ongoing at the Roseburg campus.

Sgt. Dwes Hutson, a Douglas County Sheriff's Office spokesman, says officers responded around 10:40 a.m. to reports of a shooting at the College. Huston could not confirm if anyone was injured.

[NuclearDem]

6. FUCK. THIS. SHIT.

[Are_grits_groceries]

7. Hospital reporting they are preparing for unknown number of casualties.

@ColtSTaylor: #UCCShooting "Shooter is down requesting multiple ambulances due to 20+ victims. 15 deceased." Via @Broadcastify 's scanner note.

[villager]

8. Congrats again you sick fucking gun nuts

Last edited Thu Oct 1, 2015, 03:07 PM - Edit history (1)

You must get prouder and prouder each day of your metastasizing cognitive dissonance....

[LAGC]

27. That would be cognitive DISSONANCE, methinks...

And my guns must all be faulty, because they haven't killed anyone.

Just blown up a bunch of watermelons, pumpkins, water bottles, soda pop cans, and other destructible targets on the range.

I'm going to sue the gun manufacturers for selling me a false bill of goods if this keeps up.

[villager]

28. I will amend the copy, thanks

n/t

[whathehell]

55. +10000

Couldn't say it better myself.

[Initech]

64. Gun enthusiasts - the biggest group of terrorists on the planet.

[villager]

69. Death Eaters, all

n/t

[Nevernose]

74. Yep

I wish I had more words to agree with you. At this point, I feel like most of the sane people have run out of words.

[Arugula Latte]

92. Agree. Fuck these gun humpers and their reign of terror over this country.

[abelenkpe]

99. +1000 nt

[ellisonz]

108. Thank you

[Brickbat]

9. Some reports now saying 15 dead.

[blogslut]

10. Live News Stream

http://www.katu.com/news/live

[Are_grits_groceries]

11. They are calling for all agents from law enforcement agencies

to report to the campus to help secure it.

[liberal N proud]

12. Just another school shooting...

Nothing will change, we will morn the loss for a few days pretend to mull over the violence guns cause and then say nothing we can do about it and wait for the next school/theater/church or mall shooting.

The dead keep mounting the changes never happen, the gun nuts just tell us all that more guns are the answer, give everyone guns.

[Are_grits_groceries]

13. No longer active shooting

@AlBoeNEWS: KOIN NEWS: No further active threat after shooting at Umpqua Community College in Oregon. #UCCShooting

[AngryAmish]

14. Another Teabagger driven nuts by Trump

Mark my words.

[840high]

127. Shooter is bi-racial.

[bettyellen]

136. Racists groups all collect token members- as do sexists, etc...

Some people get a form of Stockholm syndrome. Some just are filled with self hatred.
Looks like he left a long note so we shall see.

[romanic]

15. May they RIP. :(

[Tommy_Carcetti]

16. Shit. nt

[Nailzberg]

17. What's the blackout time for ~15 dead?

I mean, I'd hate to call for a discussion on gun violence at a time like this.

[hack89]

19. Now is the perfect time for that discussion. nt

[etherealtruth]

18. WTF ... over and over and over

[Capt. Obvious]

20. Let's get this over with

[Are_grits_groceries]

21. They think the death toll will rise.

Several injured are in critical condition.
They are setting up triage areas on campus.

[YabaDabaNoDinoNo]

22. Good news so far no guns were injured or damaged! A few dead folks is a small price to pay for the

Second amendment!

Yea gunz!

Do I really need to insert the scarsismsaecasm thingy?

[Are_grits_groceries]

23. The local official talking to CNN is very upset.

Apparently he has seen some of the victims. His voice is very shaky and the CNN anchor finally stopped and asked him if he was ok.

[etherealtruth]

31. how could you be OK after that :-( ?

[Are_grits_groceries]

33. True.

But even with all the shootings, I have rarely heard that in the voices. I don't know why more don't break down.

[etherealtruth]

35. Yeah, I suspect some (maybe most) are in a state of shock :-(

[LittleBlue]

24. Horrible

What possesses these men to do this?

[Are_grits_groceries]

25. It broke out in the science building.

Students are being bused to fairgrounds for debriefing and meeting with relatives.

[maryellen99]

26. One of the commenters on Raw Story

Said that the student body at the college was 58% of the student body are women.

[Brickbat]

42. 60 percent of all community college students are women.

[Blue_Tires]

45. Isn't that about the norm?

I thought most colleges enrolled more females; at least a 55/45% split?

[RandySF]

29. Just another day in the land of the Second Amendment

[revmclaren]

30. As the father of a college student

in California, this is my worse fear. Tears and prayers for the victims and a million curses for the shooter.



Change has to come at any cost!!!!!

[etherealtruth]

32. I hear you, as the mother of college students in Michigan

[gopiscrap]

87. Same here as the father of a communty colege sudent

and the husband of a grade school teacher I think about every morning when I see go out the door!!

[etherealtruth]

89. such a horrible commentary on our society that you have to wthink about this

[gopiscrap]

111. I agree we were in Europe for 6 weeks this summer

and during that time there were 3 mass shootings an people would ask us what is wrong with our country!

[AngryOldDem]

40. Same here.

My son is a resident assistant in an off-campus housing facility. It's always in the back of my mind that he could find himself in a dangerous situation, that he may act in his capacity as an RA and someone might go off on him, and it's tragedies like this that just make me sick to my stomach with fear and worry. You just never know anymore. And incidents like this put the damnable lie to the concept of American exceptionalism and greatness. You shouldn't have to worry every single day that you might by chance come across, or enrage, a person who wouldn't think twice to shoot you than to look at you.

They're saying the shooter "has been neutralized." I hope it's permanent.

Nothing will EVER change as it concerns guns in this country. I'm just waiting for all the people to come out of the woodwork saying, "If everybody had only been carrying..." Well, someone WAS and look where we are!

[TwilightGardener]

44. Yup. Both my kids are in classes today at their colleges. I worry about this all the time.

Feel terrible for the parents and families for whom the nightmare came true.

[Initech]

60. *AS* a community college student in California this is my biggest fear.

When I was in elementary school our biggest fear was earthquakes. Now it's mass shootings. Last year they made us watch a safety video on what to do if one occurs. It's so fucked up what the NRA and gun nuts and gun culture has done to us. They need to go.

[revmclaren]

83. When I was in elementery school

we were doing duck-and-cover training waiting for the evil Soviet bomb to drop. Never was there a time I or my mother even imagined someone coming to my school with a gun. I even learned gun safety through my local high school when I was 9. Full evening class of the history of guns and even ended by firing a bolt action rifle in an impromptu gun range set up in a maintenance shed at the high school. I think it was sponsored by the NRA. What the hell has happened? There are more guns than people in this country. That's pure insanity! Yes the NRA needs to go because it now exists purely for the purpose of gun glorification instead of gun education.

[Initech]

91. I go to the largest community college district in Southern California.

At any given minute of the day there's between 7,000 - 10,000 students on the Fullerton campus, and the Cypress campus, there's between 5,000 and 7,000. Even at 10:00 at night. You think about a student population that large and a city and police force that needs to protect it, it would be disturbing to think about the worst case scenario if even one happened. Put a NRA sponsored class like that on campus? Yeah things have changed, but that would definitely not happen now. It would draw protests left and right.

[revmclaren]

97. It was a different world

with a lot less guns in it.

[Initech]

100. I really wonder what happened between then and now.

That caused people to go batshit crazy? Was it Reagan and the Southern Strategy?

[revmclaren]

105. Wish I knew....

[Taitertots]

101. Back then, machine guns and grenade launchers were legal

Different world indeed.

[revmclaren]

103. Not in my area.

California was always a lot more progressive. Not enough but not like the southern states.

[Control-Z]

90. Mother of a college student In So Cal.

My daughter is in class as we speak. I hate this and it scares me.

My daughter was friends with the son of one of the women killed in the Long Beach hair salon massacre a few years ago. She attended her funeral.

I worry about what these events are doing to her emotionally and psychology. She's developed some unreasonable fears over the past few years. It kills me to see her so frightened at times.

My heart breaks for so many lives needlessly lost, for their families and friends.

[geek tragedy]

34. this is the price America is willing to pay in order to indulge its decadent gun culture nt

[Rex]

43. Agree 100%

Insanity imo.

[Are_grits_groceries]

36. Oh Lord!

@BNONews: BREAKING: "Multiple patients in multiple classrooms," fire official tells CNN
Apparently he went from classroom to classroom methodically shooting people.

[Sam_Fields]

38. Sadly these massacres are routine and acceptable to the majority of American People and judges

I guess the constitution has become a suicide pact for the American people. There is at least one family massacre every week in America by another family member also.

[hack89]

46. Unless the purpose of the PLCAA was to get guns banned, I don't see the connection. nt

[aikoaiko]

49. Your post may be a good example of why it is needed.

I admit I'm reading between the lines a bit, but it appears you think that someone should be able to sue a manufacturer for this terrible tragedy without even knowing any of the facts of the case (except that there are dead and injured) that might lead one to think the manufacturers acted negligently.

Fortunately, the law still allows victims to sue manufacturers because they still be held liable for damages resulting from defective products, breach of contract, criminal misconduct, and other actions for which they are directly responsible in much the same manner that any U.S. based manufacturer of consumer products (i.e. automobiles, appliances, power tools, etc.) are held responsible.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protection_of_Lawful_Commerce_in_Arms_Act

[SunSeeker]

95. The PLCAA gives gun manufacturers unique immunities.

Last edited Thu Oct 1, 2015, 09:45 PM - Edit history (1)

The post you are responding to was hidden, so they cannot respond to you. I guess the poster's sin was attempting to shame Bernie supporters for supporting a candidate who voted for the PLCAA. It seems you are only allowed to try to shame Hillary supporters on this site.

The PLCAA absolutely does give gun manufacturers immunity available to no other product manufacturer. It let's them off the hook if the shooting was a criminal act by a third party. Well duh. Most deadly shootings are.

Fearing they would be sued like lawn dart manufacturers were sued when the darts stuck into kids as well as grass, the gun industry lawyers got to work drafting an immunity law and the NRA made sure it was enacted.

What this law does is prevent gun manufacturers from being sued over manufacturing a gun marketed to civilians that is unreasonably dangerous in civilian hands, like say a semiautomatic AR-15 with a 100 round clip, like the Aurora shooter used. And worse, it prevents victims from suing gun dealers who sell online and make no attempt to evaluate the state of mind of their customers. One Aurora victim family tried to sue for that and lost due to those gun mfr immunity laws. To add injury on top of injury, the laws required those plaintiffs to pay the gun manufacturers attorneys' fees. Yup they lost their kid because the gun industry happily let a deranged person buy an arsenal on the internet and THEY had to pay the gun companies' $230,000 attorneys fees.

Now, thanks to the PLCAA, you can only sue if the gun doesn't kill somebody or malfunctions. It would be funny if it were not so murderously sickening.

The PLCAA is an abomination of a law and Sanders should be ashamed he voted for it.

[aikoaiko]

118. You're blending truth with some with some fictions.

Yes, PLCAA gives special protections to gun manufacturers, but the motivation was due to special lawsuits instigated by anti-gun groups that were trying to bankrupt gun manufacturers. It was a kind of tit-for-tat legislation.

Manufacturers and dealers can still be sued under the following exceptions:
There are six exceptions to the blanket civil immunity provided by the PLCAA:
(1) an action brought against someone convicted of “knowingly transfer[ing] a firearm, knowing that such firearm will be used to commit a crime of violence” by someone directly harmed by such unlawful conduct;
(2) an action brought against a seller for negligent entrustment or negligence per se;
(3) an action in which a manufacturer or seller of a qualified product knowingly violated a State or Federal statute applicable to the sale or marketing of the product, and the violation was a proximate cause of the harm for which relief is sought;3
(4) an action for breach of contract or warranty in connection with the purchase of the product;
(5) an action for death, physical injuries or property damage resulting directly from a defect in design or manufacture of the product, when used as intended or in a reasonably foreseeable manner, except that where the discharge of the product was caused by a volitional act that constituted a criminal offense, then such act shall be considered the sole proximate cause of any resulting death, personal injuries or property damage; or
(6) an action commenced by the Attorney General to enforce the Gun Control Act or the National Firearms Act.
http://smartgunlaws.org/gun-industry-immunity-policy-summary/

If you want to ban AR-15s or 100-round mags, then you'll have to find legislators willing to make those votes.

[SunSeeker]

119. What did I say that was fiction? nt

[aikoaiko]

121. I'll quote you.

Now, thanks to the PLCAA, you can only sue if the gun doesn't kill somebody or malfunctions. It would be funny if it were not so murderously sickening.

(emphasis mine)

Manufacturers and dealers can be sued for much more than that, but it is true that PLCAA does provide some unique protections.

[SunSeeker]

122. What can victims sue for other than if a gun malfunctions? nt

[aikoaiko]

123. There are six specific exceptions to PLCAA

A malfunction is just one of the six.

There are six exceptions to the blanket civil immunity provided by the PLCAA:
(1) an action brought against someone convicted of “knowingly transfer a firearm, knowing that such firearm will be used to commit a crime of violence” by someone directly harmed by such unlawful conduct;
(2) an action brought against a seller for negligent entrustment or negligence per se;
(3) an action in which a manufacturer or seller of a qualified product knowingly violated a State or Federal statute applicable to the sale or marketing of the product, and the violation was a proximate cause of the harm for which relief is sought;3
(4) an action for breach of contract or warranty in connection with the purchase of the product;
(5) an action for death, physical injuries or property damage resulting directly from a defect in design or manufacture of the product, when used as intended or in a reasonably foreseeable manner, except that where the discharge of the product was caused by a volitional act that constituted a criminal offense, then such act shall be considered the sole proximate cause of any resulting death, personal injuries or property damage; or
(6) an action commenced by the Attorney General to enforce the Gun Control Act or the National Firearms Act.
http://smartgunlaws.org/gun-industry-immunity-policy-summary/

[SunSeeker]

124. Those six "exceptions" still only allow one type of product liability suit: malfuntion.

1-4 are not product liability but negligent entrustment claims; 4-5 are malfunction; 6 is just that the AG can enforce the law. Duh.

And even then, 5 has a sneaky insert that bars you from suing for a malfunction or design defect "where the discharge of the product was caused by a volitional act that constituted a criminal offense, then such act shall be considered the sole proximate cause of any resulting death, personal injuries or property damage." That is some evil gotcha legalese. Mass shootings are always crimes. So that means we can never sue a gun manufacturer over a mass shooting.

It is not me that is talking fiction, aikoaiko.

[aikoaiko]

125. Read what you wrote. You said that gun manufacturers could only be sued for malfunctions.

That is not true. As you wrote, they can also be sued for negligent entrustment or negligence per se.

If you wish to move the goal posts and say that you were only talking about product liability, then I suggest editing your original posts so that you write what you mean.

[SunSeeker]

126. I (and you) were referring to consumer product liabilty suits against manufacturers.

It is the product liability suits that the PLCAA was designed to blunt in all but gun malfunction situations causing accidental death/injury. I am not moving the goal posts. You are. Of course gun manufacturers are subject to other laws, including tax laws, contracts laws, and yes, negligent entrustment, which would not come up much since a manufacturer rarely "entrusts" guns--it sells them and does not retain ownership.

I entered this thread to dispute your claim that "the law still allows victims to sue manufacturers because they still be held liable for damages resulting from defective products, breach of contract, criminal misconduct, and other actions for which they are directly responsible in much the same manner that any U.S. based manufacturer of consumer products (i.e. automobiles, appliances, power tools, etc.) are held responsible."

No other manufacturer of consumer products is absolved if the injury involved a person acting criminally. A car manufacturer would still be held liable under product liability law if a defective wheel broke off a car driven my a drunk driver going 125 mph, resulting in death or injuries. But if the PLCAA applied to car manufacturers, they would not be. The suggestion that under the PLCAA victims can sue gun manufacturers and they will be held liable "in much the same manner as any U.S. based manufacturer of consumer products" is simply fiction.

[MADem]

144. +1. nt

[Rex]

41. Guns don't kill people, they just make the bullets move really fast enough

to er kill people. But it was not the GUN! Nope never. Gun humpers will be on the scene to declare the gun a zero fault, granted all the lethal bullets came from it's barrel...but that is not important!

Stop picking on the gun!

No doubt the ghoulish NRA will show up to say as much...NOT the gun, don't even blame it! Blame society and children!

[Skittles]

51. gun humpers not only do not blame guns

Last edited Fri Oct 2, 2015, 07:01 PM - Edit history (1)

they think the answer is more guns

sick

[Rex]

52. They are mentally ill.

Their answer just brings about more death and murder. Gun humpers are the worst of the worst and little brother to warmongers which is just another word for mega-gun humper.

I've yet to meet a gun humper that was not a RWing asshole.

[Skittles]

54. they're like addicts

unable to admit there is a problem

yet they get upset over penis analogies

yes, mental issues

[pintobean]

59. What's really weird

is how some people turn the tragedy of a mass shooting into something sexual.

My condolences to the families of the dead, their friends, and classmates, and wishing quick recoveries for the injured.

[bettyellen]

102. weird that the 4chan folks he announced his plan to yesterday assumed this "beta uprising" was

happening because he was another Elliot Rogers type angry at the world because he couldn't "get a girl"....- and suggested he just go after women. And egged him on.

[840high]

128. that was debunked.

[bettyellen]

134. Not the 4chan threats- nope! They debunked the "anon" poster was someone known as "egg man" to that group

But as of yesterday the existence of the the thread was not. And it was not confirmed or denied the tied back to the actual killer.

A different claim was debunked- but thanks!

[Skittles]

145. the point is

it is disgusting and pathetic, what bothers gun humpers what does not

[Rex]

67. I agree they are addicted to the gun/death/prepper culture.

And get violent when you point out how unhealthy that lifestyle is. And don't even question their 'manliness', you see how it makes some here explode in rage. Some here that claim to be progressives. I can't believe we have gun humpers on this site, that is why I will never dive into the gun forum...I see enough crap in GD to drive me to drink.

The NRA is part of that gun/death/prepper culture...whatever part it might have played in hunting is long dead and buried for profit and pimping guns to kids like they are candy.

[aikoaiko]

47. Another terrible tragedy. My condolences to injured and family of the killed.

No one -- not even the NRA -- wants things like this to happen.

[Call Me Wesley]

53. "Tragedy", like in "accident."

And not even the NRA, who wants everyone to have guns, guns, guns. Pew, pew, pew. (Oh, sorry, what a tragedy.)

too bad there wasn't a good guy with a gun who prevented this. Actually, I never heard of a case where a good guy with a gun prevented anything of this. Spare me the links. Your sentiment is noted.

I'm so sick and tired of how you NRA-abiding guys rule this forum, clinging to Skinner's note like Heston was clinging to his old man rifle with his dead cold arthritic hands:

News stories (and related content) from reputable mainstream sources about efforts to strengthen or weaken gun control legislation in any jurisdiction in the United States, national news stories (and related content) from reputable mainstream sources about high-profile gun crimes, and viral political content from social media or blogs that would likely be of interest to a large majority of DU members are permitted under normal circumstances."

And how you interpret the part about "normal circumstances" backwards and forwards.

Will this be locked, too?

[aikoaiko]

58. No, "trajedy", as in a massive suffering caused by multiple killings by a person with a gun.

NRA-abiding guys don't rule this forum. I assure you the vast majority of forum hosts have nothing but disgust for the NRA.

Why don't you take your screed about the SOP to ATA so that Skinner can respond? I'm sure he'll respond.

[Call Me Wesley]

62. So, you're the oppressed minority?

Passive-aggressiveness I can do, too. But it's lame.

[aikoaiko]

63. I do not think of myself as oppressed, do you?

[Call Me Wesley]

68. Nope, I'm Swiss, what do you expect?

Not this many gun nuts here with an agenda, be it the sheer fantasy of 'self-defense,' 'I can has guns,' or 'I go to Walmart, buy what I need and kill people I don't like', I have to say.

Look, we seriously never liked each other. Fine for me.

[aikoaiko]

70. Have we conversed about this before? I don't recall doing so.

I suppose we have or you think I'm someone else.

[Call Me Wesley]

73. Oh yes, we have.

In the now nontransparent Host Forum.

And no, you're not someone else.

Anyway, a good night from afar.

[aikoaiko]

77. Good night.

[mythology]

72. It ceases to be an accident when it keeps happening and people refuse to change

We accept that there will be some number of deaths from car accidents because modern public transportation has benefits that outweigh some number of deaths. We accept deaths in medicine because on average it saves lives. We accept deaths from guns because reasons. What great benefits do guns impart on society as a whole?

There are a number of factors that contribute to mass violence, but guns are one of the most common and make the violence trivially easy to commit in larger quantities.

[Call Me Wesley]

75. We just call it a 'Tragedy.'

And leave it by that. One single nut with a gun, easily to get. One single tragedy, that does not represent the majority gun-owners at all. Unfortunately, this one was a gun-owner as well. We all can snap, and the bigger, the better.

The benefits of guns in a society? Actually none. It has never made it more stable nor safe and secure. But unpredictable.

[aikoaiko]

79. I never said nor intended to imply it was an accident.

[Call Me Wesley]

48. Please repost this

in the Oregon forum or the two gun forums we have. Local story. Nothing to see here. Move on. It's all fine. It's an accident.

[mcar]

50. Oh damn

Again and again and again.

[upaloopa]

56. We have this unconcerned OP just a bit ago

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1172&pid=176740

[Initech]

57. GRRRRRR!!!!!!!

How many more, Congress????

[still_one]

61. CNN is so full of shit. they have a Navy Seal for commenting on this

blaming it on gun free zones. The media really is part of the problem. Why bring a Navy Seal in for comment?

[get the red out]

78. Oh that's sickening!

Why a warrior commenting? Why not a college provost or president?????????

[still_one]

116. Guns sure didn't help Kris Kyle did they

[Enthusiast]

106. CNN has gone clear over to the dark side.

[still_one]

117. At least with that solicitation for comments they sure did

[davidpdx]

129. Did you watch the interview

The reason he was being interviewed is a) he lives in the area and knows about it and b) he has been part of law enforcement.

He was not blaming it on gun free zones, he said (paraphrasing) Oregon law is tricky they can't stop you from bringing a gun onto campus only into a building.

Feel free to actually watch the interview before commenting on it.

[still_one]

131. Assuming it is the same interview, I caught it in the middle, and here is what he said:

Last edited Fri Oct 2, 2015, 10:30 AM - Edit history (1)

"A retired Navy Seal, Jonathan Gilliam, also appearing on CNN, went even further. Blaming the “gun free zone” for the scope of the tragedy and adding “the only thing that’s going to stop a gun is another gun.”

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2015/10/01/3708256/ucc-was-not-a-gun-free-zone-because-public-colleges-in-oregon-cant-ban-guns/

The article also pointed out that the school was NOT a gun free zone.

If you think I misrepresented it, which is possible since I caught it in the middle, however, I am not the only one who made that assumption based on the link I provided.

In addition, just because someone is involved with law enforcement doesn't make that person's assessment right. The Oregon sheriff at the center of the college shooting wrote a letter to Vice President Biden opposing gun control legislation as an example.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/oregon-school-shooting-sheriff-gun-control-article-1.2382390

In the "Think Progress" link, I happen to agree that once the shooting starts, the most likely way to stop it is with a gun.

Of course the resistance to limiting size of gun clips, banning certain types of weapons, longer waiting periods, and more intensive background checks would be helpful, but not eliminate it completely. However, would stop and slow down some of the shootings, which is a positive thing. It isn't going to happen, and this will continue at the same pace, I have no doubt

Also Gilliam is not without controversy. Based on his Facebook page his views seem very libertarian. On that page he was comparing the lack of leadership of Obama compared to Netanyahu, where he is implying that Netanyahu is what one should look for in a leader, based on their speeches at the U.N.

https://www.facebook.com/Jonathangilliamuscs

[davidpdx]

132. He wasn't the one I saw the interview

I was talking about the older guy who was there on campus with the CNN reporter. I thought he was the Navy Seal. They are two different people.

[still_one]

133. Reading your post I expected it was something like that. Thanks for the information. Also

my posting something that I caught in the middle of the commentary without hearing the full context was not a very prudent thing for me to do

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

65. Live feed here:

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/index.ssf/2015/10/active_shooting_reported_at_um.html

[dixiegrrrrl]

94. Did you see the post about someone threatening to do this yesterday?

Anon says he's going to shoot up a school in Oregon.

screen capture of his threat:
https://imgur.com/F90JrJW

and a DU post about it:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027219070

[bettyellen]

104. yes- his pals on the forum assume he is a woman hating "beta male" .... what is this "robot forum"

he chose to post in?

[Are_grits_groceries]

107. That's 4chan.

It's the sub-basement of the interwebs.

[bettyellen]

110. yes- but was it in a particular sub forum? or is being beta and hating humanity just the default

over there? because most assumed that was the motivation- and they'd know better than I.
I guess?

[Are_grits_groceries]

66. AG confirms 13 dead.Nt

[malaise]

86. Remember now is not the time to discuss guns

[DashOneBravo]

71. Sad day. What a terrible loss of life.

[Are_grits_groceries]

76. Several of the bodies don't have ids.

May get profs or others to try to identify.
That is a horrible situation. Having to identify someone would bring the nightmares for sure.

One first responder cannot get in contact with their kid.

[AZ Progressive]

80. When will Americans have the courage to fight Wayne Lapierre?

Wayne Lapierre is seemingly one of the most powerful people in America. He has the power to shut down any legislation on gun control.

You want gun control? Fight and defeat Wayne Lapierre. Just remember that he's basically a cult leader, leader of the cult of guns in America.

[branford]

88. You'll need to fight a lot more than Wayne.

The NRA has about 5 million members. However, there are 80-100+ million lawful gun owners in the USA, with the NRA representing but a very small fraction. Note also that even after Sandy Hook, reputable polling from Pew, Gallup and others clearly indicate that support for gun rights and against gun control is high and still increasing.

Even if you could overcome the tremendous political or electoral issues, you would still hit a brick wall with the judiciary. For the type of gun control implicitly discussed in this thread, you would need to repeal the Second Amendment and its analogs in the vast majority of state constitutions, which is, at best, a herculean task.

[LanternWaste]

109. I doubt the 80-100+ million lawful gun owners attempted to deny the CDC...

I doubt the 80-100+ million lawful gun owners attempted to deny the CDC the funding to study gun violence as a national health issue via the politicians they'd bought off as the NRA and Pierre did; that being one example of why Pierre and the NRA are the valid targets of so much frustration.

A national study on the relation of gun violence and health should not be a herculean task... unless of course there are simply too many idiots who believe a study like that would make an organization look bad.

[Lizzie Poppet]

112. Most don't even belong to the NRA.

The NRA has a little over 5 million members...out of that 80-100 million. That organization doesn't represent the majority of gun owners, even if you acknowledge that a certain percentage of those non-members probably agree with the NRA's extreme positions.

[branford]

114. The government extensively studies gun violence and related concerns.

This is usually done by the USDOJ, National Institute of Justice. I should know, I worked there before attending law school.

All relevant data is normally compiled by the Bureau of Justice Statistics and the FBI, and is readily available.

There's nothing special about CDC research, and they lost most of their funding because they were engaged in transparent gun control advocacy, not research, and Congress' reaction was entirely unsurprising.

It's also inaccurate to state that the CDC does not perform research, as one they sponsored one of the most comprehensive reviews of current firearm-related research containing information widely cited by all sides of the gun control debate.

http://www.nap.edu/read/18319/chapter/1#vii

In any event, it doesn't change the fact that about 1 in 3 Americans legally own firearms, the NRA only represents 5-6% of gun owners, and both the federal Constitution and the vast majority of state constitutions protect a right to keep and bear arms.

The issue of NRA wealth is also disingenuous. The political spending of the NRA-ILA, the lobby arm, is generally available, and not nearly as impressive as many suggest. Turning the NRA into a boogeyman is little more than a political tactic to explain gun control failures. It also doesn't explain how gun control, with ample funding, including a vocal billionaire, and numerous organizations, celebrities, and loyal politicians, still fares so badly. For instance, in the recent CO recall election, the gun control side outspent the recall supports by about 6 to 1 and still lost badly.

The simple fact is that gun rights are a big culture issue, and attempts to impose restrictions reliably manages to energize antagonistic voters. Most politicians are well aware of their constituencies and like their jobs. If the Wayne and NRA didn't exist, another organization would just take its place.

[SunSeeker]

135. Quit peddling that bullshit here. That is simply not true.

That link you keep posting on this site, as I have told you before, is not a study of gun violence, but a paper determining what needs to be studied to determine the causes of gun violence and how to prevent it. Since Congress continues to ban funding for such studies, those suggested studies have not been done.

http://www.mintpressnews.com/congress-quietly-extends-ban-on-cdc-research-on-gun-violence/207237/

[branford]

138. So, you're discounting all the available and ample firearm-related research

from the NIJ, FBI, and BJS, as well as all the information contained the CDC-sponsored report, which has been repeatedly and widely cited by both gun control and gun rights advocates, and are not even bothering to contest my recitation of the obvious gun control fallacies concerning the NRA.

You can tell my anything you like, but when gun control proponents and liberal press like the Huffington Post and Slate are citing the report, your complaints truly ring hollow. Moreover, because a report suggests more research may be required, it not only is quite common, it does not invalidate any of the data contained in the paper.

You're welcome to your apparent belief that the only impediment to your idea of gun control is more CDC funding. I guess you have to believe in something when DOJ research doesn't say what you want, the NRA boogeyman has been exposed as a myth, there's no chance of repealing the Second Amendment, no less the state analogs, and polling from Gallup, Pew and others reveals that support for gun rights and against restrictions continues to increase.

I would also suggest you research WHY Congress cut-off most funding for CDC firearm-related research. The agency has only themselves to blame.

[SunSeeker]

139. No, I'm discounting your lie that the government "studies" (present tense) gun violence.

And no, there is not "ample research." The CDC has not been able to do that sort of research for years, because the GOP banned funding for such research.

The "study" you cite is not a study of gun violence at all but briefly summarizes old studies and suggests what needs study.

Quit lying.

And we don't need to repeal the 2nd Amendment. It just needs to be interpreted properly, as it was before the five conservative Supreme justices' radical departure from precedent in the 2008 Heller decision, another 5-4 abomination of a decision. We just need one conservative justice to be changed out for a progressive one.

[branford]

140. Sigh...

Now you're claiming that the whole government, rather than just the CDC, doesn't presently conduct any research on firearm-related issues. Wow!

I suggest you peruse the websites of the National Institute of Justice, the Bureau of Justice Statistics and the Federal Bureau of Investigation, and then reconsider you absurd contention.

I would also note that the Second Amendment can disappear today, and not much would change.

First, about 44 states have their own equivalent of the Second Amendment, with some being far more expansive. More importantly, most of the recent gun control legislation that's been offered already passes constitutional muster. It fails not because of the Second Amendment, but rather because it cannot garner sufficient popular support, and hence lacks the backing of the necessary elected representatives. You can read the same polls as me, and senators and congressmen certainly know their own states and districts better that you or I.

I also wouldn't hold your breadth waiting for Heller or McDonald to be overturned. Such drastic action, no less so soon, is inconsistent with the entire history and culture of SCOTUS and nature of stare decisis. The same rules and culture that keeps abortion legal with a conservative court will maintain a individual right to keep and bare arms.

The only times the Court seriously considers overturning such important constitutional precedents, no less actually does so, is when there's a tremendous shift in popular opinion (e.g., school desegregation). As support for gun rights and opposition to restrictions is actually increasing, and liberals and conservatives have a sense of mutually assured destruction when politics shift on the court, don't expect any significant changes to Second Amendment jurisprudence for generations.

[SunSeeker]

141. Recording death statistics is not studying gun violence and how to prevent it.

Stop lying.

[branford]

142. I'm well aware of who does what.

Remember, I actually worked at the NIJ in Washington, D.C., and they are the primary research arm for issues relating to gun crime and violence.

Much of the NIJ's original research and sponsored research through grants, besides being available on their own website, is also available through the FBI and BJS, who often collect, correlate and publish such data, along with their own research.

You obviously know little about government research, and less about who studies what for whom concerning firearms.

[SunSeeker]

143. What you said was a lie, regardless of where you purport to have worked.

[SunSeeker]

137. Of course any study would show the relationship. That is why the GOP banned funds for such studies.

http://www.mintpressnews.com/congress-quietly-extends-ban-on-cdc-research-on-gun-violence/207237/

All that the government has been allowed to do is discuss what needs to be studied, which is what that link is gunners disingenuously cite to when they claim the government is always doing studies.

If you actually click on that link, in the Intro of the paper, its purpose is made clear:

...the CDC and the CDC Foundation requested that the Institute of Medicine (IOM), in collaboration with the National Research Council (NRC), identify questions that would define a public health research agenda for firearm violence prevention and intervention.

http://www.nap.edu/read/18319/chapter/3

Yeah, the questions are not hard to identify. But we just can't answer them, because of the NRA, the GOP and the gun fetishists who support them. Fucking disgusting.

[AZ Progressive]

81. And Wayne Lapierre laughs. Another shooting, and no legislation will pass in response.

[get the red out]

82. I haven't been able to muster shock

Ever since I first read about this horrific mass murder, I haven't been able to muster any shock. Just sadness and a feeling of absolute futility.

Companies make money from laws that allow this to happen, not on the mass killings themselves, but the lax gun laws that make them so frequent and easy. Money wins in this world, at least until brainwashed minions start waking up.

[Lint Head]

84. MSNBC says 13 dead.

[valerief]

85. If only they had guns raining from the sky! NRA logic.

This is soooooo disheartening. One after another. I remember the 90s when mass shootings kept happening, especially at schools.

[Punx]

93. My wife teaches at a community college here in Portland

My younger son goes to a community college here as well. There is always a worry in the back of my mind that this will happen here.

This is all so unnecessary. It is sad world that we live in. Thoughts and prayers for the victims and their families.

[maveric]

96. Yahoo reports shooter among dead.

http://news.yahoo.com/shooting-umpqua-community-college-oregon-182211198.html

[colsohlibgal]

98. When Will It Be Enough?

Just more blood on the hands of the NRA, Fox News, and crazy republicans who keep getting crazier. Oh and scaredy cat democrats.

Yes we need better mental health screenings but a crazy person minus a gun can do a lot less damage than a crazy person with one or more firearms.

Australia had a horrible gun incident some years ago and did something about it and it worked. We cannot do the same because of the NRA and the insane mostly right wingers who enable these mass shootings mostly stemming from no understanding of the context and phrasing of the 2nd Amendment.

[riversedge]

113. Oregon college shooting live updates: 13 killed and 20 hurt; shooter is dead LATimes

runner across my computer screen

[mstinamotorcity2]

115. somebody should

address this ramped violence in the suburbs. It's getting out of hand.

[workinclasszero]

120. Ah the thirsty tree of liberty

needed some fresh blood eh?

I'm so sorry for all the families and friends of the innocent murder victims.

This country is insane and guns are big business.

TPTB are all good with people dying as long as the make big money on the deal.

[davidpdx]

130. I grew up just south of Roseburg

It was shocking and sad to hear about the shooting. My heart goes out to the families and victims.