How do you feel about BLM protesters chanting "black power"?

[BlueNoMatterWho]

This discussion thread was locked by Skinner (a host of the General Discussion forum).

I don't have a problem with it. I do know some people may have a problem with whites gathering and chanting "white power". I think as long a its peaceful its freedom of speech.

[upaloopa]

1. I have no problem with it. I don't think it is a threat. You need power to solve problems.

[gollygee]

2. White people already have power

I'd be worried about what they want when they already have almost all the power.

Black people wanting some of the power seems reasonable.

[BlueNoMatterWho]

3. I understand your position. I do believe black people do have at least some power when you look at

leadership. An African American President. An African American Attorney General. An African American leading Homeland Security...

[gollygee]

4. As a whole in this country

the vast majority of wealth and power are in white hands. There are a few people who have defied the odds, but that does not diminish the overwhelming dominance of white people in positions of power and wealth (which is related to power) in the US.

[BlueNoMatterWho]

5. Agreed. I just wish our current leadership could have made a bit more difference for

the black community while they had a chance.

[gollygee]

7. Unfortunately

that isn't how it works. People aren't willing to listen to people of color in powerful positions talk about racism. They face a huge amount of backlash for even slightly bringing it up.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

10. They did! It was called the Republican obstruction vis-a-vis the filibuster! Don't blame the people

not responsible for this division.

[blm]

99. The spin is ALWAYS against Obama and the Dems. Always tossed in for good measure.

It's becoming more obvious.

[blm]

47. Does everything get spun AGAINST the Dems and the

left? It certainly seems so. Curious why you tend to do that so often.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

49. I am curious as well.

[morningfog]

51. And against African-Americans in particular.

They are threading a needle here.

[Kingofalldems]

54. No question about it.

[blm]

56. Seems that anything that can be said against BLM deserves to be reposted

and trusted, as well as any narrative painting the Dems and left policies in a poor light.

The smell of disingenuousness is thick.

[Igel]

30. There's a nice Russian word.

Yabednichat'.

It means to try to say and convince others that you're poorer than you are because, well, then you can either complain more or deflect suspicion. It's from the phrase "ya beden" "I'm poor."

It fits with their traditional culture quite well. It's a word that should have been retired because it has no use long ago. And yet, it's still there and still finds widespread application.

A lot of people have more power than they realize. But, like many do, they misuse it or don't use it and so wind up with no advantage because of it.

[jack_krass]

106. The notion that powerheld held by a race is ridiculous

Power is held by the rich and powerful, and is generational. Powerful people can be of any race.

[gollygee]

108. Of course people of any race are capable of holding power

However we live in a country where the vast majority of power and money are held by white people. And the fact that it is generational is a big part of that. It hasn't been that long that people of color were given any real opportunity at all. Power being generational is what has kept it white, and what is unfortunately likely to keep it that way.

[bettyellen]

64. You forgot Beyoncé and whatever black athlete is big these days....

Have seen them trotted out to try to make some sort of a point here too. Lol. Transparent.

[blm]

80. Can't believe this is being allowed at this site. We've seen posts like this before

and the 'technique' is common.

[BlueNoMatterWho]

91. Be careful.

"Ascribing ugly ulterior motives" is a violation of forum rules and the Terms Of Service.

[blm]

95. Posting RW sources smearing Dems and their voters is a violation of forum rules and

TOS, yet you have done exactly that many times over the course of your 2 months here.

Be careful. I wouldn't want to think that your warning to me is actually meant as a threat now, eh?

[BlueNoMatterWho]

117. Not a threat at all. Thankfully this has been settled. Not a RW source.

[blm]

125. breaking911 is a RWsource and you use it often, as often as you warn members not buying

into your explanations that they should 'be careful'.

Drop the all 'settled' act.

[BlueCaliDem]

128. K&R! ^^^This!^^^ Spot ON. eom

[jack_krass]

100. Don't let them get to you. They're bullying and threatening you because

You've beaten them in debate and raised questions that they're uncomfortable with and can't deal with. Please continue doing so.

[tenderfoot]

102. Posting lies and misrepresenting facts is hardly beating anyone or raising questions...

it's simple trolling.

[blm]

103. LOL - the use of RW sites is an effective form of debate to you, eh?

OK. The poster didn't RAISE a question - he said he's OK with the use of 'black power' shouts just as he is OK with the use of 'white power' shouts.

Claiming no difference isn't debate, and certainly isn't the basis for a debate VICTORY.

[BlueNoMatterWho]

120. It's cringeworthy, isn't it?

I've been bullied in life before, amazing that it would happen here on a Democratic message board of all places. Among adults, no less. Sad.

[blm]

126. Couldn't possibly be you and your posts using RW links, eh?

.

[heaven05]

132. awwww

are you a victim? Not hardly. RW sites as proof of ones intellectual superiority is counter productive. My condolences to you

[puffy socks]

6. I think its s bad idea

for any race to chant whatever their race is "power!"

I think its destructive, divisive and plays into the hands of racists.

[gwheezie]

8. I have no problem with it nt

[seabeckind]

9. Some white people think giving black people power takes away their power.

It doesn't.

I was proud when I saw this image. Me. A white guy.

[alphafemale]

22. I understand that fellow arhelete fully supported them doing that.

They were in touch throughout life.He died rather young and they were both pall-bearers.

[JEB]

25. That action was one of the things that began

my own personal political awakening. Along with Kent State and Vietnam in general.

[seabeckind]

28. Kent State was my straw.

Thanks.

[alcibiades_mystery]

11. ...

[HereSince1628]

12. People united have power. I consider "Black Power" a call to unite in action

and a declaration that unity of cause exists.

[roody]

13. I'm white and I like it.

[BlueNoMatterWho]

14. I think this is more potentially destructive. And disturbing.

https://twitter.com/breaking911/status/752639873341849601

[Kingofalldems]

16. You seem to be on a crusade against BLM.

Looks like you agree totally with the conservatives.

[Kingofalldems]

19. Was this whole thread you started a setup for posting that tweet?

[cheapdate]

110. Good call!

[bettyellen]

81. The link is to disturbing destructive RW garbage.

[BlueNoMatterWho]

85. The link is not a right wing source. It's a breaking news feed.

[tenderfoot]

87. here's the source to the newsfeed

https://twitter.com/PrisonPlanet

[BlueNoMatterWho]

92. I did not post that trash, you did. Be careful. I posted a link to a breaking news feed.

[tenderfoot]

93. And that was the twitter account that provided the link to the equally rw source you cited

eom

[BlueNoMatterWho]

96. Below is a breaking tweet within the hour from the same news organization. Is it RW? Get a life.

https://twitter.com/breaking911/status/753333615564587008

[zappaman]

105. nice try.

[blm]

98. You linked to breaking911, a RW site catering to RW reactionaries.

.

[bettyellen]

107. Just because it posts a few fires along with racist propaganda

Doesn't mean it's not crappy RW propaganda.

[blm]

101. Of COURSE you do and linking to breaking911, RW site, yet again.

.

[SidDithers]

123. Paul Joseph Watson? Did you fucking just post a tweet from Paul Joseph Watson?...

Dude. You just outed yourself.

Sid

[liberal N proud]

15. I am not threatened by it in the least

Although, in the same regards as violence against violence does nothing to advance the cause, pushing the message isn't going to change things and will incite the racist amongst us.

The hate groups are good at twisting the message and driving the hate within their own ranks. It will not expand the hate groups ranks, but serve as an internal driver.

The problem is these people who are driving the hate and their followers don't recognize others freedom of speech. Only their own views matter.

[m-lekktor]

17. I have ZERO problem with it! nt

[Marr]

18. I think it's much more likely to inspire opposition than make allies, but

making allies seems to be a non-priority for BLM.

[AntiBank]

60. agreed

[heaven05]

134. not liked by people

such as you and the following response, because our "allies" have not been numerous enough to turn back the racist hordes that have grown over the last 7+ years. In fact not much has been said in our ranks both in forums such as this, except in AA forum, thank god and even in the halls of congress about how racist whites in congress have been toward our POTUS. This non speak against racism has been absolutely cowardly and submissive to the RW mob that has been growing for the last 7+ years. They are now the base of the trump campaign who stand at the gates of power and are calling for blood which is being spilled in the streets from unarmed black people. Any call for black unity which is power strikes fear in those where that unity spells a potential end to 'white power'.

[BlueNoMatterWho]

27. It is apparent in this thread which member stalks and ascribes ugly altering motives to me

which are both violations of the Terms Of Service.
This member continues to do the same even after I've asked them to discontinue doing so and has been doing so for weeks if not longer . I wouldn't be surprised if this member yet again has alerted my thread. Does anyone else find a problem in the thread or any of my responses within it? Does any of it violate TOS the way this member continues to do so?

[blm]

82. You've been here 2 months and people are noticing a pattern - if it bothers you

that an increasing number of members see your posts as baiting and disingenuous, then perhaps you should reconsider your style of postings that most often presume fault and blame against the left and its various groupings.

It doesn't help that you also back up your postings with links to RW propaganda sites.

I've asked you before why you do that - and will continue to wait for an answer.

[BlueNoMatterWho]

94. If you read the OP you would notice that my position is in concert with most responses here.

And the link I posted was at the request of a member and included a breaking news feed. Not RW.

[blm]

97. No - most DUers DON'T think shouting 'black power' is same as groups shouting 'white power'

the way you do.

[metroins]

127. I think it is

And I think they're both wrong.

[blm]

136. A few individual DUers may, but, most of us do NOT - we understand the context

which the protestors shouting 'black power' and those shouting 'white power' are using when they assemble.

I have no control over those who claim there is no difference, but, I will use the opportunity to point out that the claim is disingenuous at best and, more likely, a deliberately destructive lie.

[cheapdate]

111. Well then, stop whining and state your views

in clear and direct terms so that no one can have any doubts about where you stand. It's very simple.

[BlueNoMatterWho]

35. Thanks for the heads up. Subsequently I've alerted on both of this members posts.

The stalking has continued for weeks, as have the ascribing of ugly ulterior motives. Both violations of the TOS. This is simply one small example of what's been happening with the majority of my posts for a long time now. It has to end.

personal attacks or flaming
Do not personally attack, insult, flame, threaten, bully, harass, stalk, negatively call-out, ascribe ugly ulterior motives to, or make baseless claims about any member of this community. Do not post in a manner that is hostile, abusive, or aggressive toward any member of this community.

[zappaman]

59. It was a nice try.

So is this.

[VOX]

21. I heard it in 1968, and I'm relieved to hear it again...

It's tragic that this country hasn't learned to overcome the corrosive effects of racism, poverty, ignorance and isolation. The American Civil War is still being fought, and it could be lost.

I fully support the African American community in defending themselves from right-wing predators who suck the life out of those who only wish to share in the common dream of a peaceful existence. If that means adopting a vocal/visual display of strength and solidarity ("Black Power&quot , then so be it.

[JEB]

23. When communities of color and other poor folk

are reduced to mini police states there aren't many choices left.

[AngryAmish]

24. It merely states the obvious.

[REP]

26. I feel fine about it.

[BlueNoMatterWho]

29. As do I, as stated in the OP.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

31. This is a false equivalence. The powerless demanding power

Is not the same.

[uponit7771]

121. +1

[Stellar]

32. Black power...was a saying to make AA feel encouraged instead of beaten down...

James Brown's: "Say It Loud It Loud ~ I'm Black & I'm Proud"

Or...

Fist raised in the air (The Black Power sign.) Chi-lites: You've got to give more power to the people

[Jim Beard]

36. I agree with you 100%

[nomorenomore08]

43. +2

[giftedgirl77]

33. White people chant white power with the intent of continuing to suppress others.

Black people chant black power with the hopes of unifying people with the common cause of gaining equal footing with white oppressors. It's really quite obvious if you've ever been to a rally where these types of statements are made.

[Jim Beard]

37. They fear losing what little power they have. Lets face it, the 1% has us all by the balls.

[peace13]

34. WTF they have had a black president for eight years and haven't improved their position one bit!

I would say they have been more than patient! White power, Black power, Woman power...!! Let's have some! Let's get it together as a country. It's not just gonna happen unless we make it! Every body needs to feel powerful.

[NobodyHere]

38. It's racist

Just like screaming white power

[JustinL]

40. I have no problem with it

There's nothing wrong with oppressed people working together to fight for equality. "White power" simply does not mean the same thing.

[ellie]

41. It is great

The institutional racism in this country is astonishing. I just read this article on the resurgence of black farmers who were nearly driven into extinction by the fucking USDA. The USDA! Jesus Christ.

http://www.yesmagazine.org/people-power/the-resurgence-of-black-farmers-20160708

[Scootaloo]

42. Doesn't bother me

"White Power" always means power over others. This is because in the US, white people are not an oppressed group.

"Black power" (and Red power, chicano power, etc) mean taking power over yourself. Denyong the oppressor the ability to have power over you.

The two are not equal statements.

[nomorenomore08]

44. No problem with it at all. Because I reject RW false equivalencies. n/t

[Lint Head]

45. Maybe because black folks have very little power. Just because we have a black president doesn't

mean black people have power. The fact that we Do have a black president and there has been very little progress, because asshat Republicans block every attempt to make progress, demonstrates the reason they don't have power. You show me a racist and I'll show you a Republican.

[Starry Messenger]

46. Uh huh.

[Matrosov]

48. White power = enslavement; Black power = empowerement

Most of the power structure in this country is geared toward white people. The ones that talk about 'white power' and 'white pride' are typically white people who either want to preserve this power structure or are even afraid that African Americans already have too much power.. I guess for not knowing their 'proper place' on the plantations, having the right to vote, being able to drink from the same water fountains as whites, etc

'Black power' is the opposite. The ones that talk about 'black power' and 'black pride' aren't looking to enslave white people or even to tip the power structure in favor of African Americans, they're simply demanding to be treated with the same dignity and respect as white people. You know, like not getting shot dead for having a toy gun and not dropping it within 0.357 seconds after a cop yelled at you from the window of a fast-approaching police car

Of course the racists typically make the predictable excuse of 'Well, if blacks wanna be treated equally, why do they get to talk about black power and I don't get to talk about white power?'

[Act_of_Reparation]

133. The nuance gets lost in the context.

White people aren't listening to black people as it is. They're not sitting down in rapt attention as black leaders explain the particulars of their philosophy. They hear "black power" and automatically think "white power means racism, so black power must mean the same thing."

On the other hand, white people are so averse to discussing race, they'd probably take offense to pretty much anything BLM would say.

[zappaman]

50. Nice try.

[cyberswede]

52. I think they can chant whatever they want

[tenderfoot]

53. Where were people shouting this?

Please post video or else I'll assume that you're making this up.

[BlueNoMatterWho]

55. Not making it up.

Here is a breaking news source since you requested video. Here you go:

https://twitter.com/breaking911/status/752617693921021952

[tenderfoot]

61. "Black Love is Black Power" is what they're saying. Why are you truncating the slogan?

To create a negative light?

That is sad.

[bettyellen]

67. Wow, what a disgusting way to misrepresent that chant.

I am Shocked!

[tenderfoot]

69. nothing to be shocked about

it's intentional

[BlueNoMatterWho]

83. I quoted the news headline from breaking news source.

The video was posted at the request of a fellow member.

[tenderfoot]

84. You intentionally truncated they're statements

you're intentionally being dishonest.

[BlueNoMatterWho]

88. Click on the breaking news feed link. That is their headline, not mine. You are incorrect.

I changed nothing.

[tenderfoot]

90. You intentionally posted their racebaiting bullshit

and now you're been called on it.

[blm]

89. breaking911 is a RW site known for false headlines smearing Dems and the left.

Fits right in with all the other RW links you post here.

[Rex]

57. I don't think they should be treated any differently under the 1st amendment then any other group.

nt

[BlueNoMatterWho]

58. Agreed.

[Xithras]

62. I think it depends. Some older people probably have an issue with its original intentions.

The phrase was originally coined by the SNCC as a way to differentiate itself from King and the rest of the civil rights movement. Black Power adherents weren't looking to achieve justice or racial equality, but were part of a (now largely dead) black nationalist movement that preached black separatism, black self determination and an anti-white philosophy. The saying was born out of the African concept of nation building and liberation which was sweeping that continent as decolonization took hold. The original intent of the black power movement was simple: Kick the whites out of power, and put blacks in power. We don't want equality, we want control. It went as far as giving rise to the Republic of New Afrika movement in the late 1960's, which wanted to form a new black nation out of several southern states, secede from the union, and expel all whites. That particular movement lead to a number of violent confrontations and deaths before it faded away.

It wasn't a phrase that promoted equality, but division and conflict. Some people still associate it with those origins.

Over the last 40 years, the term Black Power has been watered down quite a bit, so most younger people now simply associate it with the African American civil rights movement and don't take any offense to it at all. It's simply seen as a sign of black solidarity and the fight for equality.

Whether someone finds it offensive is largely dependent on the era they became familiar with it. Many older people have serious problems with it, while most younger don't.

I'm not offended by it, but I do think there are better terms that could be used.


On edit: I just remembered a comment that a friend once made to me. He said that "Black Power" is the symbolic equivalent of the Dixie flag. The supporters of both will tell you that it represents pride and unity nowadays, and has no negative intentions. The opponents of both will tell you that the modern intentions are irrelevant, and that it's offensive because it was created to perpetuate racial hatred and conflict. They're very different symbols, but there are a lot of similarities in how the two are percieved and the reactions they receive.

[metroins]

129. Good post nt

[tenderfoot]

63. The protestors weren't shouting "Black Power" the OP is intentionally misrepresenting them.

They're shouting "Black love is Black power"

The OP is lying.

This racial arsonism.

Check out the source and don't forget to read the comments: https://twitter.com/breaking911/status/752617693921021952

[Kingofalldems]

68. Boom. You got it.

[Rex]

71. Thanks. The OP needs to self-delete then.

IMO.

[tenderfoot]

72. Good luck with that

eom

[Rex]

76. Nah, not my battle. If they want to knowingly let misinformation stay then that is on them.

And people can ask why.

[AgadorSparticus]

65. When you HAVE the power and are screaming it, It is oppressive.

When you don't have the power, then it is a rallying cry to establish EQUALITY. Because, ultimately, everyone wants a sense of empowerment. And in a democracy, everyone SHOULD have an EQUAL sense of empowerment.

That is what "black power" is about. EQUALITY. Not that it is better than white. It is the same as the Black Lives Matter vs. All lives matter.

I find that the vast majority of poc I talk to understand this without my having to explain it. But most caucasians I know do not understand this. And, I write this not as a slight in any way. Just my observations. But they don't understand because they go by their experiences and they wouldn't experience racism. They live in a different strata of the same community where things have been tipped in their favor. They don't see that because they can't see a negative.

The only time I see where Caucasians see the racial disparity is when they have mixed kids or have adopted kids of a different race. Then they see it through their kids.

[bravenak]

66. How do you feel about women chanting 'Girl power!' Or 'You go girl!' Or 'I am woman, hear me roar!'

I don't have a problem with it. I do know many people have a problem with men gathering chanting 'MRA MRA MRA! MALE POWER NOW!'. I think as long as it's peaceful, it's freedom of speech.

[tenderfoot]

70. Check out the source for the OP.

They are NOT shouting 'Black Power' - They are shouting 'Black LOVE = Black Power" - a much different message than the op hopes to imply. Here's the tweet: https://twitter.com/breaking911/status/752617693921021952. Take notice to the responses.

[bravenak]

73. Glad too see most of us were not fooled by this bullshit

I would have deleted it but that's just me

[tenderfoot]

74. but you don't have ulterior motives

like some here.

[bravenak]

75. They do their duty for their cause

Their cause is simply diametrically opposed to OURS

[1StrongBlackMan]

104. I was going to provide the context of the quote; but, you beat me to it ...

But even if the quote were just "Black Power" ... given the phrase's history I would have no problem with it ... in fact, I would be proud that the young'ins were connecting with our/their history.

It means the same thing today as it meant 50 years ago ... and neither usage is a call to, or threat of, violence.

[rbrnmw]

113. OP is missing something

[bravenak]

116. Thank you

[Adrahil]

77. Mixed feelings.

I have no problem with it, but I fear it will be spun to delegitimize the movement. Unforced error.

[tenderfoot]

78. How would you feel if the OP was lying and that "Black Power" wasn't what was being said?

The protestors were stating "Black Love is Black Power" - do find that threatening?

[Adrahil]

79. I don't find either threatening. NT

[Cali_Democrat]

86. I like it. nt

[dembotoz]

109. good lordy like we don't have enuf stuff going on to worry about this shit

black folks are getting shot they should chat what ever damn thing they want

[Doodley]

112. Good question. I have a problem if a group shouts "white power," but not "black power."

"White power" would likely be about white supremacy. "Black power" would likely be about black equality.

[TheDebbieDee]

114. Back in the late 60s, James Brown had a hit song called, "Say it loud!"

The chorus of the song was, "Say it loud!" and the chorus would answer: "I'm black and I'm proud!" It caused a big stink back in the day (Imagine that - black people being proud of the fact!), but I only remember hearing the song being played on one station...

[rbrnmw]

115. Black Communities have no POWER

so hell yeah I am down with saying Black Power

[John Poet]

118. I would like to put a 'Black Lives Matter' bumpersticker on my car, but

I'm afraid it would lead to being pulled over by the police more often, for no good reason, especially at night.



I am white...

[John Poet]

119. Chanting "white power" suggests the desire to keep minorities down,

who have never had much power.... (to put it mildly)


Whites have always had the power. We have no need to chant for it.

[SidDithers]

122. Welcome to DU...

Sid

[Hekate]

124. Yeah, I'm getting that feeling.

Individual posts appear innocuous enough, but taken as a whole this thread is causing me to wonder about the pattern noted by another poster.

[heaven05]

135. whereas the RW racists

generally have been under their rocks and have let the Tea Party racists state their desires. Now that, with trump, they are emboldened and agitated to full blown screaming for PoC's blood, our 'progressive and liberal' movement as observed by me over the last 7+ years has for the most part been very quiet in the face of the RW onslasught against minority and women's rights. We've had some here pointing out this fact for years and even had them banned here because white sensibilites got offended by word usage that was true.

It also seems to me that we have grown an anti-minority(PoC) cadre here over the last 7+ years. Am I wrong?

[heaven05]

130. very good

thank you. Got to have that to defeat racist 'white power' advocates, both trump supporters and protect and serve people. Got to let people know, ain't no slave no more.

[seabeyond]

131. Apples and oranges trying to insist black and whites are beholden to same rules. Minorities do not

get the same rules as whites, so to argue in some areas there should be the same perspective/expectation is intellectually lazy.

[blm]

137. 'intellectually lazy' is the kinder view. I think it is being deliberately destructive to post the

claim here that there is no difference. But then, most here tend to be kinder than me. ; )

[seabeyond]

138. Ya, well. I get lots of hides. I am trying to figure out how to make the point I see, without

getting the hide. I am not all that successful.

[blm]

139. heheh

especially when engaging with someone who likes to warn us to 'be careful' in our replies.