China wants to give all of its citizens a score

[Lithos]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/china-surveillance-big-data-score-censorship-a7375221.html

Overt way, though a similar pattern is happening here with credit scores and background checks prior to hiring.

L-

[shenmue]

1. Hmmm

[dixiegrrrrl]

2. I read a fascinating article about China's "ghost people"

Because Chinese citizens are already so tightly tracked and controlled, they cannot move from one place to another without paperwork approval, cannot get or change jobs, or even ride public transportation without showing their papers.School requires paper ID and tracking.

But...in defiance of the one child birth policy, thousands of parents kept a 2nd birth a secret, so that child has no legal existence, no legal papers.
The only way they can become "real" is if the family pays something like 5 years worth of wages as a fine, and few families can afford that.
Thus a whole underground has developed of "ghost " workers, who are exploited by employers, and who have a very precarious future.

[Feeling the Bern]

4. I need to question a few of these statements

Because Chinese citizens are already so tightly tracked and controlled, they cannot move from one place to another without paperwork approval - Really? All people here in China need to go from one place to another is the national ID to buy tickets on long distance buses, trains and planes. . .similar to us with photo IDs. As for moving, all they need to do is register a Hukou, similar to the back of our driver's licenses that says to register a change of address within ten days.

cannot get or change jobs - Ummm, no. . .the chinese can change and get jobs without it, except they need to show proper picture ID to verify who they are, similar to us with the I-9 form.

even ride public transportation without showing their papers - Really? In the four Chinese cities I've lived in, as well as my wife and her family (who are Chinese), all they need to do it get in a bus, on a subway or in a cab, is to pay the fare. If you want a mass transit card, in certain cities, you need to produce a picture ID in order to report a card stolen or lost.

School requires paper ID and tracking. - Since when? No Chinese person I've known being here requires paper ID. A picture ID, yes, to register, as well as immunization reports. We require the same documents.

But...in defiance of the one child birth policy, thousands of parents kept a 2nd birth a secret, so that child has no legal existence, no legal papers. The only way they can become "real" is if the family pays something like 5 years worth of wages as a fine, and few families can afford that. - The one child policy does not exist anymore. It was done away with about five years ago.

Thus a whole underground has developed of "ghost " workers, who are exploited by employers, and who have a very precarious future. - Those are the migrant workers. But the US shouldn't hold its nose too high. We've done the same thing in the past. . .otherwise why would Cesar Chavez been around or our attitudes towards Wal-mart doing that the undocumented workers.

[Marengo]

5. Where do they get this nonsense? I just returned from my annual visit with family in China...

The wife and I ride mass transit all over her home city. Buses, the subway, taxis and not once did any one ask to see "papers" for myself, my wife, my Chinese relatives and friends, or any of the other Chinese passengers that were near to me. Nor did that occur any other time that I am aware of, and I've lived and travelled in that country 12 years now. It's just the same as here: step on the bus, pay your fare, and if you're lucky find a seat.

As another poster noted, the one child policy has been abandoned. Even when in force, there were exceptions made and as time passed enforcement became less severe and even non-existent in some areas. In addition, when a person born during the one child policy period married another of same generation, they had the legal right to request permission to have a second child. In the cases I'm personally aware of, this request was little more than a formality as permission was always granted.

[Xipe Totec]

3. Confess quickly! If you hold out too long you could jeopardize your credit rating.