So, this is how it ends. Lets face it, barring a massive revolt, this country is finished.

[kydo]

Congress will do nothing. They will not investigate anything unless it involves, destroying Obama or Clinton. If ruling members of Congress were really Americans, orange man's campaign would have been investigated and Congressional hearings held back in April and July at the latest.

We can call, email, ask face to face, show lots of evidence that in a fair world would be addressed. However right now we have done that and Congress has failed to act. They are not going to do anything. The Democrats in Congress can file and demand hearings and investigation all they want. We, the American citizens, can call all we want. The people in control will not pay us any attention.

Our country is broken. If orange man is made ruler on Jan 20, this country is over. orange man and his henchmen will dismantle every aspect of the Constitution so that only rich white men count as citizens.

The Electoral College will not save us. It will do exactly what it is designed to do, keep rich white men in control.

There will be no investigation of this corrupt to the core election.

There will be no election reforms. Oh there will be elections in 2018. They will not be fair or honest elections. More Democrats will vote but more fascist will take office. There will be elections in 2020. But they will resemble the type of elections dictator ruled countries have. You know, current glorious leader gets 99.99% of the vote and there was 99.99% voter turn out.

Ok, so yeah there is this recount going on. Cool great. More road blocks and barriers will happen to stop a real recount and audit from happening. There will probably lots of anomalies and funny stuff. Even maybe Clinton's vote total goes up. Maybe one or two states flip. Maybe not. Won't matter.

None of this matters. The fascist party is not going to look for fraud or rigging of this election. They can't. It's their party that they would have to put on trial and no way they give up finally having complete control.

It's over.

I am making plans to leave. First is get out of the red area I am in and move either west or north east. Probably move to California. Be a big haul from Central Florida, but I can't stay here if orange man is our over lord.

I will hang out in California for a while. Hopefully it will leave the US. Then I can leave this God forsaken country without having to leave.

If California doesn't leave the US, then I will leave.

It is not an easy decision to do this. I am not young. Starting over in a different state and possibly a different country is NOT something I want to do. But this isn't my country any more. I have no faith in it's election process. I have lost faith in Congress to act on the needs of ALL its citizens, not just the white rich ones.

I have completely lost faith in the United States of America and it's Constitution. It has failed 70% of it's citizens.

I hope orange man makes life impossible for those that voted for him. I will enjoy watching the USA crash and burn.

My only hope and wish is that those of us that didn't vote for him can get out of this hell hole or at least to safe blue zones. I will help as many as possible. I don't want to see good people left behind.

Oh I plan on fighting this government take over. But I also have my backup plans to get out. Sadly I think the odds of me having to put into effect my bug out plan are more likely to happen then Congress investigating anything that doesn't involve Obama or Clinton.

We have no voice or rights in our own country.

I don't want to be an American any more.

[Buzz Clik]

1. "I don't want to be an American any more." Okay. That's an option.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

2. I agree with about seventy percent of what you write but I think we can make gains in 018 and 020.

[kydo]

9. How? The new fascist party will be passing more voter suppression laws.

orange man showed them how to win. Pay companies to create fake news. Act like a bully online. And they own the press. So there is no bad reports to counter the glorious versions the mighty orange one proclaims.

The fascists are already in control of most everything now. There will be nothing stopping them once they take over the Presidency.

Oh, they might ditch the orange man and install pense. And there will be no talk of his email problem or any other problems.

All of the checks and balances have been over ridden.

There are no real viable peaceful options left.

Now bugging out is my plan B.

I don't want to leave. I will fight tooth and nail to save this country. I am prepared to, be assaulted, thrown in jail, and even die. That's plan A.

So tell me how to we do plan A. We only got about 50 days. Of course we will have about 100 days after Jan 20, before we start to feel the orange man's new world order.

I plan on staying and fighting until I can't anymore. And I have a plan B for when that happens. It will all be about personal survival in about 200 days.

I wish you all good luck. Because right now that is probably all we got left.

[ananda]

19. How?

Voter suppression will get much worse, and the
courts will all be rightwing.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

51. The "courts" are going to take away our right to vote?

As I said in another post we might as well kill ourselves right now. Death is preferable to serfdom.

[Maru Kitteh]

70. The courts have been largely toothless in the battle against voter suppression

And now a fascist will be appointing "judges."

I wonder which appointment he will give his sister?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

74. Trump blows.

But it will take years to change the composition of the district courts and circuit courts.

[Maru Kitteh]

75. If we are counting on the courts to save us, I predict a continuation of the current trend

towards gerrymandering and other forms of outright suppression of Democratic voices.

[Doreen]

82. I think he is going to

surprise a lot of people in the country. He and his thugs are going to go in very hard and very fast and make changes a lot quicker than you think. We as the people of this country are in grave danger on many levels.

[treestar]

86. they can't take over the courts that fast

there are still many Obama appointees. And a lot of justices will want to follow the law. Not even every conservative is a Scalia type. They have to write an opinion and rationale for their holdings. Mostly they will take some pride in not writing an entirely stupid and illogical opinion.

[Grey Lemercier]

27. in 2018, perhaps a bit in the House, but the Senate is a nightmare

[Demsrule86]

73. There is the Trump factor especially if they take on Social Security and Medicare.

We fight like hell for 18...and consider we don't need that many.

[treestar]

87. If they do that they will have touched the third rail

They can talk but I bet they don't dare.

Weird that older people vote Republicans. I guess they think it will not apply to them, but don't they care about their descendants?

[Demsrule86]

95. I think they might go for it.

They think they can smooth talk voters into buying their shit...our jobs is to make sure they don't.

[Fast Walker 52]

129. why? Because of the particular seats that are in play then?

we would only need to get a couple, and medicare privatization would help us

[BlindTiresias]

137. Odds are very good dems will lose the senate even more

Lots of vulnerable seats, with the possibility to only pick up one assuming a miracle happens.

Democratic party is effectively dead.

[Fast Walker 52]

141. looks like the real problem is a lot of Dem seats don't have an incumbent

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate_elections,_2018

Big issue is whether they have any suitable candidates, although the states are mostly blue. 5 states are not traditionally blue, so could easily be lost.

I'm guessing they don't have good people for most slots?

[MadDAsHell]

33. I thought so until I returned to DU post-election and found 75% of users want to change nothing.

If I saw true self-examination and discussion of new campaign tactics, new types of candidates, etc., I would be very hopeful, as I think the Trump presidency is going to face a backlash at the polls in 18 and 20.

But when the Clinton campaign came out a few days after the election and only had outside scapegoats to blame for the losses (Comey, the media, etc.), and when DU came back online and I saw that 75% of users were thinking the exact same thing (adding in Jill Stein and Bernie Sanders into the mix), I realize we are indeed fairly doomed. There is so much humiliation at the Clinton loss that folks seem more likely to hold onto their pride that "she was screwed" than to admit mistakes and try to fix them.

Until more Democrats start focusing on how we can win, instead of why we should win (we're right, he's unqualified, etc.), I am unfortunately very pessimistic.

[Buckeye_Democrat]

46. I agree.

I'm very cynical about Trump and I will consider us lucky if he doesn't get us in a nuclear war.

In the meantime, I'll keep hoping that the ill-tempered, orange moron doesn't send us back to the stone age and offer ideas on how to win future elections.

Jimmy Carter won working-class white Southerners in 1976. That was after the civil rights bills of the 60's were passed and Nixon's so-called "Southern strategy" in '68. I'd suggest that people examine why that group flipped to Reagan in 1980 as a starting point.

There's already many Democrats calling those people ignorant rednecks. Now the insults are directed at Midwest blue-collar workers as well. That's a LOSING strategy.

[Aristus]

79. Will they vote Democratic again if we just stop calling them names?

I'm not that optimistic.

[GummyBearz]

144. Stop insulting them is step 1

Step 2 is to abandon the pro business strategy and re adopt the pro labor strategy.
Step 3 is profit (in the sense of regaining majorities in government)

[awoke_in_2003]

90. +1000

Too much denial.

[Crunchy Frog]

91. Totally agree with this.

If the Democratic party is incapable of self examination and major change, it's basically a dead party.

This country has been on a trajectory towards this moment for a very long time, and by and large, the Dems have simply sat back and watched it happen, and accommodated it. The party that sat back and allowed this to happen will not be capable of reversing it.

I think a big issue with DU is that a large number of more dissenting and less lockstep voices have gone. I spent a few months mostly away from DU, and the DU that's here now is not the DU that I remember from the past.

[heaven05]

111. "New campaign tactics, new type of candidate"???

okay, you spell it out. Who, what, when, how.

[seaglass]

139. It appears if we don't all agree that Bernie should have been the candidate we are doomed!!!! n/t

[kacekwl]

48. At the end of 4 years everything will

be sold off , privatized , or in corporate control. Trump will finally be worth what he claims. There will be billionaires and peasants . And there will be no more two party system many democrats will jump on board the $$$$ train.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

50. Then we should all kill ourselves. Death is preferable to living like serfs.

[a kennedy]

96. I seriously thought we'd make gains this go around.......and now with Rojo keeping his d*mn

Senate seat instead of Russ, I'm tempted to throw in the towel as well. I still think it's some sort of weird universe.......

[HughBeaumont]

3. Two types of dumbasses are responsible for President Donald Trump:

The people who voted for Donald Trump.
The people who sat this election out.

"Three Branches Bush on Steroids" is going to be a giant wall to climb.

But I can't cede this country to the fascists and the redneck asshole capitulators who seem to be on board with them.

[TrishaJ]

39. Add a third dumbass:

Those who voted 3rd party because they couldn't bring themselves to vote for Trump OR Clinton. Any vote NOT for Clinton was a vote for Trump.

[pipi_k]

42. I was about to

post the same thing myself.

Include all the spoiled brats who decided that if they couldn't have their candidate, they would vote third party or nothing at all.

No party unity. Just all about them.

I've seen people give all sorts of reasons as to why Hillary lost. Well, that's another significant one. This election was too damned important to play childish games.

[sylvanus]

98. Do you know how the electoral college works?

So in all those deep red states, mostly southern, front loaded in the primary process, if all those democrats had
just voted for the anointed one, we could've swept this election huh.

Learned not a one lesson, we are doomed.

[TrishaJ]

114. Yes, I know how the Electoral College works.

What does that have to do with my comment?

[beachbum bob]

4. easy path is to quit and run...dont worry plenty of us will remain to take our country back

in 2018/2020

good luck

[KingCharlemagne]

7. Your post naively assumes there will be free and fair elections. You are

whistling past the graveyard. RIP America. You were a nice idea while you lasted.

[bdamomma]

29. or refer to this quote

http://www.bartleby.com/73/1593.html

Respectfully Quoted: A Dictionary of Quotations. 1989.



NUMBER: 1593
AUTHOR: Benjamin Franklin (1706–90)
QUOTATION: “Well, Doctor, what have we got—a Republic or a Monarchy?”

“A Republic, if you can keep it.”

[Loge23]

5. Can't disagree with the OP

The damage these people (using the term loosely) will affect on this country will take decades to reverse. Couple that with the complete stop to the progress we were making and you have truly a draconian situation.
Look at the people he has already put in place! Education Secretary whom knows nothing about public education, an Attorney General that actively pursued trumped up charges against civilians, a HHS Secretary who is an avowed opponent of providing health care to citizens!!
This is insanity and we can not normalize this by thinking that we can change things through the system - a system that has been taken over effectively by a coup.
I fully sympathize with the OP. I too am too old for another run at restoring not only a working government, but sanity in the process. It's time to go.

[KingCharlemagne]

6. This is what a one-party state looks like. - nt

[cwydro]

8. "I will enjoy watching the USA crash and burn"

Well alrighty then.

[Jake Stern]

107. I agree with the OP in that regard

Sadly many naive but well meaning folks think that Fascism will just magically be voted away. Generally there two ways to rid a country of the fascist parasite: revolution or destruction.

It took bombing Germany nearly into the Stone Age to drive out the fascists and a full scale invasion of Italy to do the same.

Even in instances where fascists give up power it's never completely. Pinochet got a lifetime Senate appointment and control of the military in exchange for "graciously" stepping down after losing the popular vote. Francisco Franco in Spain directed that power go to Prince Juan Carlos upon HIS DEATH. Even then the entrenched fascists in the military and police attempted coups to stop the transition to democracy.

Speaking of Chile and Spain look at the nostalgia that is bubbling up for the old regimes. That wistful backward glance toward's the time when the generalissimo ran things and "when we had good paying jobs, there was no crime and people knew their place."

Ring any bells?

It may take the USA crashing and burning before people wake up to what has happened to them. That hangover ain't gonna be pretty.

[texasmomof3]

10. You know California won't really leave right?

I live in a very red place too and it is hard....daily. I have to be honest man and just get out now if you don't want to be an American. Just leave. We as a party are only as strong as our weakest link and we need all of our people strong to fight what is coming. It is coming and we will have to fight every second of every day to get to 2018 and 2020 and we WILL win but we can't do it with people who really don't want to be here. We can defeat this but we all have to BELIEVE we can and believe that we are right every second of every day.

[global1]

13. One Hope Is That Trump And The Repugs Will Ultimately Piss Off....

their supporters and together with them we can right the wrongs.

[GWC58]

54. Elected "thugs" will blame Democrats

and the Trump idiots will eat that shit up. "Vote the bastards in the "Democrat" party out." Yeah, they really are that stupid!!

[bdamomma]

68. ....................

good post. well we weren't alive for the civil war but another one may be coming.

[Baitball Blogger]

11. You are an American. Never say that you're not.

We're just here at a time when our country needs us the most. So roll up your sleeves and fight for the future of this country.

[Grammy23]

12. But keep in mind that it is extremely difficult

to muster the will to fight when your hopes have been dashed. Going back to 2000 and 2004 we know the sting of defeat. Obama's Election and re-election raised our hopes that the U.S. was evolving into a fairer, better nation. But we've spent the last 8 years watching a good, decent and competent leader be disrespected to his face and stymied at every attempt to move this country forward. Meanwhile, the folks on the opposite side were biding their time and plotting their next move. I don't believe Trump was their candidate of choice but once he was their nominee, they made a conscious decision to work with him and see if they could pull the strings to get some if not all of what they want. And Trump is clearly paying them off handsomely.

So where does that leave those of us who were horrified and terrified of a Trump presidency?? I don't even know where to start to fight. We can get together on this site and in our living rooms with like minded friends, but what do we do? Who will lead us? How do we fight against something so massive as the takeover of our governing bodies? We are out numbered in all branches of the government. Until we get someone who understands what has happened (and no, it didn't happen in just the last 18 months) and how to re-balance the leadership, there will be many like me who want to help but don't even know where to start. And yes, some of us feel hopeless enough that leaving seems more rational and practical than hanging around to engage in a fight that feels like we've already lost.

[Baitball Blogger]

25. We are leaderless, following our own conscience. That much is true.

You need to find your own separate peace. Whether that is family, pets, whatever. Hold onto that to anchor you, but be aware that this country is not the one you were promised, but will never meet its Constitutional contract if you give up.

We are fighting people who do not reason with logic. They rely on prejudices and group-think which leads to the kind of warped world we live in. We will only prevail when we succeed in taking away the privileges that help bolster their way of life. And in this country, there are only two ways to enforce your rights. One is through the courts, and the other is through public shaming.

Threatening to leave this country is exactly what they want to hear. Take a page from their playbook. Stay and help point out everything that is wrong with the Trump presidency. We have the benefit of truth on our side. We don't have to make anything up.

[Aimee in OKC]

92. Small things add up ...

The author posted a couple of useful resources in her article.


" ... I still haven’t formulated a full plan, but last night a piece of it came into focus. It started with reading this series of tweets from a former Congress staffer on How to effectively talk to your member of congress.

A step not mentioned in that link is figuring out what to talk to my representatives about. Specific conversation is much more effective than generalized conversation. If you call and say “Please oppose Bill A because of reason Z” That is concrete and actionable. . . . It is also more effective to talk about specific bills right before they are voted on.

It turns out there is a website dedicated to informing US Citizens when Congress is in session and what they’ll be voting on.
https://www.congress.gov/resources/display/content/Calendars+and+Schedules

* * *
Having found those sites, I’ve realized that if I take a small fraction of the time I spend reading news sites and just scan over upcoming legislation, I will be aware when a bill occurs that I feel strongly about. Then I can take the few minutes necessary to call my representative. ... "


http://www.onecobble.com/2016/11/12/over-time-small-efforts-make-a-big-difference/



Schedule of bills:
http://docs.house.gov/floor/Default.aspx?date=2016-11-28
http://docs.house.gov/floor/Default.aspx?date=2016-12-5

[socdem]

97. Good post.(eom)

[hfojvt]

60. to me it is worse than that

I saw us win in 2008, and then saw that leader not even bother to fight for us.

Of course, I guess that depends on what the definition of "us" is.

When they won, they got the Bush tax cuts - massive tax cuts that favored the rich. When we won, did we undo that? Nope, instead we mostly made it permanent, and that was AFTER the re-election "victory". So now we have tax cuts that favor the rich, which are permanent.

So they took us two steps back and we could not even get one step forward when it was our turn. Instead, we took about 1/10th step forward and then nailed our feet to the floor to keep them from ever going forward again. WE made THEIR policy a permanent one. And that's what happens when WE win.

[Trekologer]

20. We can't give up or give in

We can't let the GOP co-opt what it means to be an American or what it means to be patriotic or take over symbols such as the flag. We have to make sure we use all of those.

At the same time, we need to organize locally, starting with our local and state elections. For far too long, Democrats have not had enough interest to participate in them. This needs to be stopped and turned around.

We need to talk to our friends and neighbors about real everyday issues that affect all of us. We need to get them involved and be a part of the solution. We win when we get more people involved in the process of governing. We get more people involved because our ideas are better.

It is going to take a lot of work but the GOP has been doing this for decades. We need to get to work immediately.

[Baitball Blogger]

30. Exactly.

Soldiers died to protect our American freedoms from foreign incursion. Now we have to fight within our own country to protect them from the Americons. Those are people who wrap themselves in the flag, and use the crucifix to hide behind in order to take the high ground. But they do not have a clue that the Constitution was meant to protect everyone's freedoms.

[lonestarnot]

14. Are you kidding me? Don't want to be an American anymore...

Your voice is needed now more than ever. Unless you are 70 or over, you better get it together. Hitler has invaded.

[kydo]

32. And do what?

I am 50. I am an Air Force brat. My dad was in Air Force 20 years. I married a Navy guy. He retired after 20 years as Lt Commander. He works for the DoD.

I don't want to move. I have been moving all my life.

What is happening to this country is heart breaking.

This election was not an election. From before it started it was being undermined.

Some of the people doing the undermining are from our own country. These people want power at any cost and will do any thing, no matter how unethical and illegal, (so long as they are not caught and even if they are the system is so corrupt they will get off), to win.

Another group wanting to undermine and influence our elections are foreign countries. Russia, stands out as one but I am sure there are other countries and individuals in other countries that always try and undermine and influence our elections.

Then there is the American citizen. We are bombarded with, fake news, negative everything, voter suppression and a whole bunch of other things that there is no way we can make an educated vote. You don't know what the truth is. Most of the eligible Americans don't vote. Politics is full of liars and cheats. It doesn't matter to them because nothing really changes. Or they want to vote, but voting is made near impossible when you have to park way far away, and wait in line for hours. You can't take off work and the early voting is so short you couldn't get off for that if you were even lucky to live where there was early voting. And God forbid if you are black. Its twice as hard to register and stay registered.

Because of this corrupt thing we call elections we are going to give the highest office in the land to a complete loon! And that was his best quality. The people set to take over this country want to destroy it. They have said so and often for the last 20 years or so.

We have no say in the change of power. Our votes did not count. Despite all the bullshit, Hillary won by over 2 million votes!

We have no voice in Congress or the media. We have protested, called, emailed, wrote letters, try to speak to representatives, and signed petitions. All of it to no avail. They are not listening.

So unless we finally realize and accept what is going on, we will cling to the false hope that out Constitution gives us. The false hope is that we will be dealing with sane civil mature educated people. We are not.

[Generator]

85. I was thinking along your lines

Making a big post about. America is like Santa Claus and God you can't stop believing in them even though you have endless proof they don't exist. America is dead baring a miracle. I too am in my 50's and pondering what to do. I don't want to leave I want to fight. But bad knees bad back-am I going to prison or giving my life for this mindless piece of shit Trump? Am I dying or ruining my life for that turd? For who? The people in rural counties that despise Gays and Blacks? For the hicks that despise women? Why? Why should I fight for them? I am sickened by the actual people in this country. So who am I fighting for exactly.I want a separate country, well take the west coast thank you very much. I want fuck all to do with the South. I love NOLA and I enjoyed Florida but if you put up a Berlin wall and I never got to go there again FINE. Leave us alone. Leave the educated people that believe in humanity and compassion here. Goodbye Southern States. Raise your goddamn flag and goodbye. Send us all your gays and poc and everyone else that wants to leave and then ENOUGH. We want to live in the 21st century not the 18th. Thank you. I keep seeing the only end to this as a civil war. Is there another way? Voting is not going to cut it. They cheat and lie. There is no way out without truth. There is no more truth. How is there any way out but a civil war or leaving? How?

[bdamomma]

69. yea, but we know how Hitler ended up

I won't say anymore.

[First Speaker]

104. Yes, we know...but at what a cost...!

...a war that left sixty million dead...and Trump has the nuclear button. God help us.

[nini]

15. Bye

I get your reasons but I also get that previous generations fought for all the things at risk now. Do we fight or roll over and let them do it easily?

The Nazis were defeated before.. and will again. It's not going to fun for a bit but handing it all to them without a fight isn't American in the first place so I guess you should leave.

[Turbineguy]

16. Those who voted for him

are not going to be happy when they finally sort it out. The challenge is for the propaganda ministry to keep them from seeing the obvious. It's worked thus far, but it's going to get more difficult.

[jmg257]

17. Good luck - and God speed.

1) the recounts will change little to nothing
2) (unless he dies 1st) trump will be president Jan 20
3) California ain't leaving
4) enjoy the show from abroad as best you can.

[SHRED]

18. Which country?

It's not that easy to migrate. Especially to first world countries.

[Loge23]

26. Where to go

You're right, it's not easy.
Considerations have to include quality of life, climate, health care, ease of travel, visas, language, etc..
Realistically, some of those factors can be quite favorable for expats, particularly health care which has deteriorated in the US into prescription drug dependence.
Panama is a good alternative that checks most of the boxes. Mexico as well in some locations. Europe is a bit dodgy right now with a similar nationaist, racist movement fermenting in many western European countries. Canada is a long-term standby but they have rather strict immigration standards and it's way too cold for this boy.
Substantial research is required and it's best to rent for a while until you have found a new home.
Point is, it can be done. The US just isn't all that anymore.

[Grey Lemercier]

34. Indeed, the rest on the Anglophone countries (I am in the UK)

are very much non friendly for Americans to come to. The UK, Canada, Ireland, NZ, Australia, and the West Indies are fortresses for USA people to come to, unless you have world class skillsets or are in a shortage profession or marry/partner a native. Even then, it is very hard and expensive, far beyond the means of most.

I encourage all to try, if you truly want to emigrate, but be prepared for a hell of a cold hard reality slap.

[SHRED]

35. We looked at NZ and Canada

Yeah...tough.
Canada makes it impossible and the financial requirements for NZ are complicated and a high bar.

[Grey Lemercier]

45. unless you can qualify under one of the occupational shortage schemes your best shot

is to partner up with a native. If you have any criminal convictions, forget it then too. Just had a friend here in London whose American husband (they got married in Boston) was denied entry for leave to remain due to a drink-drive back in 2008.

[bdamomma]

71. but again, on the other hand

how many people from other countries will want to come to the US I see a decline coming. And those Americans who are in other countries I hope we will not be targeted because we are Americans, thus that saying the "Ugly Americans".

very good post.

[SCVDem]

21. Radical Islamic Terrorists

They use what they have to fight.

What will we do?

tRump has already grabbed America by the pussy!

[Botany]

22. I agree

Anybody with a scentilla of knowledge can tell that Trump stole this election
and he was helped by the Russians, republican control over the mechanisms
of our vote and how that vote is counted, and certain factions of the FBI.

The hack of D.U. should tell all of us that evil is going to take over.

BTW it was and it still is a coup.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10028316425

[BlueCaliDem]

81. Only ONE chance to stop this coup from being successful: Martial Law. But Pres Obama is not

the type to do this. An FDR would have NO problem. Hell, even Cheney threatened Martial Law when the House didn't want to vote for TARP, for chrissakes! But Obama won't touch this. So we'll slowly slide into autocracy and the American Republic will just be a facade for a fascist state.

Only martial law can stop this from happening until an audit of the vote is done. If Trump ascends to the WH, it'll be too late. We'll have lost our Republic and will continue as an autocracy. That's what's in store for us.

[world wide wally]

23. This OP probably states the case better than I could and I am afraid I totally agree.

It's nice to think that what amounts to, a small handful, will rise up and overcome the US military and restore democracy and justice, but it is also fantasy.
A Yoooge problem is that this is what "Americans" wanted. As the rest of the world fights to be free, we vote in fascism and throw our freedoms away.
What could change my mind? To see our "elected leaders" in Washington actually stand up and fight would help. But I am not about to hold my breath waiting for that.
To see our fellow citizens stand up and fight? They just had their chance to do that.
So what is left? You tell me. And make it reality based.
I'm too old for this shit.

[maryellen99]

24. I agree I'm waiting for the inevitable Nuclear War that's coming nt

[sarisataka]

28. .

[AJT]

31. 2018 election

FYI....the Republicans have 8 seats to hold on to, the Democrats have 25.......we have no chance of getting the senate back and more likely we will lose more seats.

[marybourg]

36. Instead of a quixotic move across the whole

country to a state completely unfamiliar to you, why not compromise and move to southeast Florida, to one of the three blue counties there?

[Tommy_Carcetti]

37. Or stay in Central Florida where you're most needed? nt

[PatSeg]

38. I don't want to agree with you,

but I can't see the light at the end of the tunnel. The best I can come up with is some unforeseen event or the hope that there are people working behind the scenes, but that is generally just wishful thinking.

[WhiteTara]

40. Make sure to apply for your passport NOW!

[cilla4progress]

41. Ditto

Sadly

[Javaman]

43. to quote T.S. Elliot

"not with a bang but a whimper"

or as I like to say, the american public just rolled over and wants it's tummy rubbed.

[mikehiggins]

44. End of the road

It has long been a point I have made over the years since Barry Goldwater that there is no guarantee that this nation will survive.

I consider myself truly blessed that I was born on the day that Japan signed the surrender agreement on the decks of the U.S.S Missouri and have lived through the most prosperous and entitled era (for white guys like me) any nation has ever known. At 71 it isn't likely that Ryan's nonsense will have much impact on me before I die and, frankly, when I'm cremated I will have "lucky bastard" inscribed on the urn holding my ashes.

Its been a great run but now its over. So long, and thanks for all the fish.

[Bayard]

47. So....here we are

I had to take a break from DU for awhile back before the general election. What I saw going on here became intolerable. I voted for Hillary in the general because there was no other choice at that point. And like most of the Democratic world, I assumed she was inevitable. Bad mistake.

So now we're stuck with this lunatic for one reason or another. I've been depressed about it ever since. I have no doubt that he's going to destroy most of what I care about. In particular, the environment and wildlife. Even if sanity returns to the office in four years, the damage will already be done.

Californian secede? Dream on. I hear the same thing from my friends in Oregon. And the area of CA where I lived previously was as deplorable as they come. When the rest of the world comes together against the U.S., do you think the nuclear fallout will stop at the CA border? Or the Canadian one? Besides, Rump would never allow such an action from the West coast. Expect troops.

What is darkly amusing, for lack of a better word, is that in the past, America would have been sending in troops or assassins to stop this spread of fascism. Time for us to think about what we're going to do going forward, and come up with a serious plan. My email inbox is clogged every day with petitions to sign. Nobody is going to pay attention to those in this arena. I'm all ears for answers.

[kydo]

59. I have some suggestions. First not one cent to the government.

I am sure most of us want to say what they know needs to happen. But because we live in a civil society and we know we are being watched we don't dare say it.

So, until we have no options left before that actually happens, there are some things we should be doing, while we still have rights.

Civil Disobedience. Protest, protest and protest. Sit ins. Like Occupy Wall Street, but occupy every STREET and just sit.

Do not give the government any money. It does not represent you. We should not fund it. Sure the House of Representatives is supposed to use our money for the greater good of the country. They are not doing that. All they do is vote to repeal the Affordable Care Act. And that's the current House. Come Jan 20, they won't have the office of the President to veto what they want. And the incoming House doesn't just want to get rid of the ACA, they want to get rid of Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security. And that's just for starters.

I don't know about you, but I refuse to fund that. It's our money and they are NOT using it for the greater good.

Since the white people in charge only understand money well let's break it down for them in terms they understand.

1. This is not a normal year. We should not have a normal Christmas. Don't celebrate Christmas or the Holidays like normal. Don't put up lights. Don't buy a tree. If you must get a small one or if you have a small one already for decoration, just use that. Don't buy gifts, except for kids. If you must buy gifts, don't buy from places that support republicans or their ideas.

2. Don't spend money on anything other then what you need to function. This is not the same as boycotting Christmas. It must start two weeks ago and continue until our voice is heard.

3. Take out all your money from the bank. If you can move it over seas. Our banks can not survive a massive run on cash. It will create issues. Maybe they pay attention to what we asked.

4. Do NOT pay taxes. On your paychecks change the with holding so no taxes are being taken out. And if most of the country refuses to pay federal taxes on April 15, well that might get the House's attention. Don't pay state taxes if you live in a red state.

5. Protest! March! Strike! Right now!

There is a number 6, but I don't want the SS knocking on my door. Besides if we the people stop making this normal and not go along with the ruling class to do as we are ordered and accept something the majority of us voted against, we could maybe just maybe stop this peacefully.

I hope everyday we start to wake up and come together to stop this madness. Most of this country doesn't want this. And 99% of the world is against it.

I don't want to become the evil empire.

[Grey Lemercier]

72. "Do NOT pay taxes".... that will end very very badly

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

78. Unless you're a wealthy orange piece of shit.

In that case, it makes you smart!

[Grey Lemercier]

80. touche'

[Marengo]

99. Is this a formal declaration that YOU will not pay taxes?

[hurple]

49. We are

thinking of leaving too. Best to get out before they start rounding up all those that don't think like them and sending us to the ovens.

If the world survives the nuclear war that the orange cheeto starts because some other world ruler says he looks funny.

[mythology]

52. This is utter nonsense

There will be elections in 2018 and 2020. It won't be a dictator's election. This is the same hysteria that some Republicans pushed about Obama in 2008 and some here said about Bush in 2000 about future elections. And yet elections still happened and different people won.

All that stuff about not recognizing the country, have you not read history? Like every other country, we have a long history of poor judgement. But we have grown and push toward progress over time.

In a decade we went from Republicans putting same sex marriage bans on the ballot to drive turnout to voters rejecting those bans to the Supreme Court declaring marriage equality the law of the land.

We've become aware as a society of the impact of police violence on minority communities. We've begun addressing sentencing disparities. Stop and frisk has been found unconstitutional.

We have way more work to do, but there is always more work to do. The path to justice isn't easy and it's not linear.

We went from having two black Senators during Reconstruction and then only two after that through 2005. We've had 4 elected in the last 11 years (and 2 more appointed as interim Senators).

Change is the only constant, even if it is slow.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

55. Plus One

I like the OP as a person but all this "go gently into the good night'" defeatism is deplorable.

[Hoyt]

57. Exactly. I went from the worst funk for months after Kerry was defeated. This time, I felt awful

for a day or two, but then realized we will get through this. Trump will be easy to beat in 4 years unless the economy is humming and he hasn't wrecked Medicare, ACA etc. We won't have dictator, a buffoon maybe, but not a dictator.

In fact, the thing that really disappoints me now is that so many Democrats are sounding exactly like GOPers when Obama was elected -- our country is doomed, etc. It's not doomed unless we just give up.

[sarisataka]

62. HO-LEE Crap

We actually have the same view on something.

Giving up has never been in my nature and a setback makes me more determined for the next time.

[Hoyt]

63. Hope that doesn't mean we are both wrong.

[sarisataka]

66. .

As bad as things look at the moment, we do not have an Enabling Act to allow rule by dictat. Voters will still have a voice no matter how much Repubs will try to game the system.

Historically the Party in power is the more vulnerable in midterm elections. If we can get even a fraction of those who chose not to vote to come out and support Democratic candidates we can begin to turn things back around.

[Generic Brad]

89. This Andrew Jackson redux

We will survive this and eventually come out better for it. I felt the same way for a week but I have shaken it off and am moving forward.

In the mean time it promises to be a very bumpy ride.

[Scruffy1]

53. I'm downsizing.

Moving is going to be a long process. It's more of what I saw in 2010 and 2016 post election than anything else. I remember going to a post disaster event in 2010 with several congressmen and the usual progressive "booksellers" like Thom Hartmann. The theater was full, and good people, but the number of minorities was nearly zero. If I had to describe the audience it would be "retired school teachers". Nothing wrong with that, but this is in an area of the city with a large number of minorities. Expecting them to show up at the polls is not a given. All votes have to be earned. You can bitch about the media, blame voter suppression and all of that, but it won't change things. When you have nearly 40% who don't vote, you have failed and need to learn from failure. Instead is all I see is left bashing and blaming the "rules". Face it, the Democratic Party as it is now sucks. Obama Care was a political mistake because it was a compromise from a party that has had universal healthcare in it's platform since 1948. And from the looks of it they rank and file still believes same old will work, but it's not the same playing field it was 40 years ago.
So here I am sorting through my stuff, getting ready for a big yard sale in the spring and looking for alternative places to live on my social security which might not even be there.

[LanternWaste]

56. I heard this same lament in 2000 as well.

I heard this same lament in 2000 as well. Melodrama is so much fun, but not a rational foundation to build upon, regardless of the alleged and petulant enjoyment you'd receive from witnessing the US "crash and burn."

[Maru Kitteh]

76. I don't understand people who can't see the difference between George Fucking Bush and Trump

But I have noticed those people tend to be white and male.

[bdamomma]

102. one started a war with no convictions

and the other wants to starts a nuke war.

[Cosmocat]

140. What kind of a fucking argument is this?

Bush slept through 9-11, then he and every asshole republican spent the next 7 years fear mongering this country into a shithole.

They blew up a balanced budget for tax cuts to the wealthy, lied the country into Iraq and left the economy in its worst state since the great depression.

It was the worst period in our country history since WWII, possibly Vietnam.

And, that was merely a moron and an administration packed with right wing idealists who had some semblance of a sense of public service.

Trump is a certifiable meglomaniac, and is partnered up with extreme right wing ideologues who on the record wanting to destroy government, with a congress packed with extreme right wing lunatics.

[okieinpain]

58. lol, man you know this was going to happen

sooner or later, democrats weren't going to keep the white house forever. to bad ginsburg didn't retire when we had a chance to fill her seat. but i look forward to the coming train wreak and will see if my sorry ass team (democrats) can pick up the pieces and start righting the ship once again.

[moondust]

61. Maybe.

When a lying scoundrel with no experience in public office is enthusiastically endorsed by a Holocaust denier who is also a former Imperial Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan, as well as other sordid bigots and scoundrels, and still receives enough votes to be elected President of the United States, it would certainly seem to be very late in the game.

[Skittles]

64. fuck that

I will fight these fascist bastards ALWAYS

[jodymarie aimee]

65. This is exactly how we have felt in WI for the last 6 years

whenever I would comment on some blog, the others would always say "What the hell is wrong with you people there... You get what you deserve." Our state is one party rule and crooked as crooked can be. I said Nov 9th at my DEM meeting...."What Walker has done to WI now will be done to the entire country. And FAST. They may not know it is coming, but we do." It is impossible to feel hopeful when the few brave DEMs we have left are shut up at every turn. Bill? Pass. Bill? Pass. That is the way it is. No power.

[Ligyron]

67. If the revolution fails or fails to materialize and freedom begins to fade.

I'll head to Cali with you for starters.

But I'll fight first.

[Initech]

77. To me the scariest thing about this election was how well hate sold.

And the republicans cranked the hate machine way past 11 this year. Hate news like Infowars and Breitbart have officially replaced critical thought. The KKK has become mainstream. In fact after the response this year I'm not expecting things to get better in 2018. I am expecting things to get much much worse.

[Desert grandma]

83. I totally understand

all of the sentiments expressed here. I think for us, (seniors over 65), we are going to be vigilant and observe what happens these next 2 years. If it continually gets worse, then we will move to Panama or Malta. As a retired airline employee, we have access to free flights, and we will use the next 2 years to visit these locations in case we need to leave. During these next 2 years we will do what we can to support those organizations that will resist the move to implement far right policies.

[colsohlibgal]

84. It Will Happen Someday

We are in uncharted waters. He is the first president in my life I refuse to recognize. He is a fraud and an immature con man. Nixon was a creep and crook but he was qualified to be president. This clown is not.

I am renewing my passport ASAP, better safe than sorry. If worse comes to worse I am just over 3 hours drive to Windsor, Ontario.

Entities and people trying to treat this as normal are sadly mistaken.

Strange scary times indeed.

[treestar]

88. No stick with us

The Orange Toxin can be opposed. Can't wait till the criticism starts and he melts down. He is going to end up looking like such a fool and be such a loser. He will get primaried. There will be such a backlash as was never seen and most of his voters will lie and say they never voted for him.

He'll be the butt of jokes, SNL, demonstrations and comments from leaders abroad that will embarrass him to death.

[brooklynite]

93. So, no need to hang around here anymore. See ya...

I'll be staying here to fight for democracy.

[Hamlette]

94. The GOP completely outsmarted us in 2010 in large part because we didn't fight.

one of two things happens under Trump. He turns out not to be as terrible as we anticipate or he is horrible and we take things back in 2018 and 2020.

Remember, 2020 is the important year. We need to start now with governors. This country isn't right wing, it is gerrymandered. Yes, there are monsters out there, 46% of our country. I'll stay and fight. It is not their country, it is mine.

[Cobalt Violet]

100. I think a civil war is coming soon or later.

It's really that bad. It's no sustainable. I think if the cuts to medicare and/or ss happen civil war will happen.

[Loge23]

106. A tinder box

I agree. Things are very tense right now. Imagine if the Electoral College does not ratify trump. If the trump force comes after Medicaid and SS, the FBI starts monitoring computers (yes, this is a thing), and the trickle down doesn't as it never does, things could get very interesting. Add in mass incarceration of immigrants (and "collateral" damage) and a return to draconian drug enforcement including marijuana and the bon fires should be burning. Cap all this off with trump and co.'s relative ignorance and you have a clumsy guy with matches in a fireworks factory. Not good, not good at all.

[Taitertots]

101. The only existential threat is people like you

"I will enjoy watching the USA crash and burn. "
Your fantasy will become a self fulfilling prophecy. And it will be YOUR fault, not Trump's.

[heaven05]

109. It is already

the fault of the potusfuhrer-in-waitng and his fascist, racist, sexist voters. Stay blind, when the end comes because of the New Nazi Party of AmeriKKKa, I want it to be a fearful surprise for you..

[bdamomma]

103. K&R

[jalan48]

105. From what I'm learning voter suppression cost Clinton the election.

I saw a figure of almost 500,000 people who were purged from the roles in Michigan alone, the vast majority being minorities. The ability of Republicans to steal elections has been openly going on for at least 16 years with no end in sight. I'm a Bernie supporter but the reality is he would have been blocked as well. I'm not sure what we can do about the rigging. In 2008 we controlled the government for a short time-I don't know if the issue was addressed then but we have to deal with this big problem when we have the chance. If not, it is over.

[mahina]

108. That's kind of the opposite of what is needed.

We should be moving into red areas, not out of them.

Hope you find some peace.

[heaven05]

110. great OP

The potusfuhrer-in-waiting and his New Nazi Party of America cabinet and advisors/strategists(bannon, anyone) WILL destroy as many PoC, minorities and seniors as they possibly can. We're a drain on white society and a major cause of white fascist, racist pain, dontcha know. Then they will destroy ameriKKKa and their potusfuhrer followers. Guaranteed. History is replete with evil people like the potusfuhrer-in-waiting destroying their own in the name of narcissistic ego driven madness.

[A HERETIC I AM]

112. Politics are like a pendulum

The pendulum swung WAY to the left (at least as far as the right is concerned) when Mr. Obama got elected and the social advances made in the last 8 years.

It swung back. HARD. It happens. It happens all over the world. People get fed up for
One reason or another and push the pendulum hard.

Do not worry. It will swing back. When the other side sees that conservative economic and political ideology does NOTHING for the common man, they'll push the pendulum back.

I've said this before on this board, but
It is going to get worse, perhaps a LOT worse before it gets a shitload better.

You're going to see the religious right and its extremists emboldened and do damage to
education and science. When enough nitwits are created and The foyer of Mar-A-Lago is knee
deep in sea water, the pendulum will swing the other way. Likely (hopefully) long before that

Have a little more faith in your country and fellow Americans.

Remember: This idiot was put in office by around 25% of eligible voters. That's it.

This country isn't going anywhere. Trump however......will be lucky if he makes 4 years

[bdamomma]

115. your post makes me hopeful

especially your last sentence.

I just have this image of long bread lines and the fat cats binging (binge) and purging on the stealing of wealth they have stole from all of us and other entities.

[struggle4progress]

116. Union burying ground

[struggle4progress]

117. Diggers' Song

[struggle4progress]

118. Ain't gonna let nobody turn me around

[struggle4progress]

119. Sons of Molly Maguire

[struggle4progress]

120. Got a lifeline

[struggle4progress]

121. Come Go with Me

[struggle4progress]

122. Song of The Leaders

[struggle4progress]

123. Miner's Lifeguard

[struggle4progress]

124. Sit At The Welcome Table

[struggle4progress]

125. Which Side Are You On?

[struggle4progress]

126. Eye On The Prize

[beachbum bob]

127. Easy to run....so good luck to you and others who think the same

The rest of us will stay and take our country back

[struggle4progress]

128. Song of the Partisan

[struggle4progress]

130. Battle of Blair Mountain

[struggle4progress]

131. Somewhere Over The Rainbow

[struggle4progress]

132. Roll Down the Line

[HassleCat]

133. This is what they did to Obama.

They wanted to see America crash and burn so they could see Obama fail. Just remember, if the country fails, most of the pain will be visited upon those least able to protect themselves.

[struggle4progress]

134. Old man river

[struggle4progress]

135. Death of Harry Simms

[SMC22307]

136. Jesus. We survived Dubya and Dick Fucking Cheney...

"the nation" will survive Trump and his goons. But you don't want that, eh? You want the United States to "crash and burn." Get a grip.

[BlindTiresias]

143. Bush and Cheney did not have nearly the degree of control Trump does.

In every respect the democrats are now a regional rump party who stands to lose even more seats in 2018. For all the predictions of the death of the republicans they are ascendant while the democratic party is bleeding out.

[SMC22307]

145. Oh, I'm well aware of the "bleeding out" factor.

I just seem to be having little tolerance for cry-ins and this flee-the-country nonsense.

[struggle4progress]

138. Little Light of Mine

[Joe941]

142. I hear you...

but please stay in FL as we need the vote in 2020.