Suburban/urban living

[DemocratSinceBirth]

Suburban/urban living

I live in a suburb. My girlfriend works about 30 miles away, in downtown Los Angeles . We don't have a car so she takes a bus and a subway to work. The commute is about ninety minutes one way . With a car it would take longer because of traffic.

The good thing about the City of Angels is there are a paucity of Republicans. To paraphrase Pauline Kael I live in a rather special world. I only know one person who voted for Trump. Where they are I don’t know. They’re outside my ken. But sometimes when I’m in the sauna at the gym I can feel them

We Californians feel we don't get a lot of love from middle America. We are told our votes are superfluous and that Secretary Clinton's approximately three million vote popular majority win is of no moment because her surplus votes comes from us. The United States needs California more than California needs the United States. We are the sixth largest economy in the world . Our economy is twice as large as that of Trump's pal, Russia. We supply the rest of America with culture, technology, and food. Over one billion dollars worth of goods pass through the Port of Los Angeles every day.

Now here is the big thing. Los Angeles is a majority/minority city and we all get along. Do we hold hands and sing Kumbaya? No. But we all get along.

None of my friends thought Trump could win... In the weekend before the election about five of us were discussing the election in the sauna at the gym. One of the guys was a black guy from South L A who became a counselor at the juvenile detention center in Sylmar. Most of the kids he worked with were gang bangers, many of whom were Bloods and Crips. We talk a lot about his success and failures with those kids. We talk about the balance between collective responsibility and individual responsibility. There are a lot of societal reasons that push kids into gangs but however they got there the gang life usually ends poorly. I digress... There was one other white guy beside myself, and two Asian guys.The theme of our discussion was we are so different but we get along, why are the Trump supporters so afraid of diversity.

Treat people with respect and most of them will treat you with respect. Don't fear people because they are different. Fear leads to hatred.

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

1. Yeah, but I'll bet you urban/suburban folk don't help each other out!

Apparently it's some very extraordinary behavior only practiced by the magical rural tribes.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

2. And we don't work hard !

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

29. Well, face it, if we did work hard, we'd all be millionaires!

Lots of urban people are poor because they're lazy bums. Rural poor? Well, that's the fault of the liberal elite. Amaright?

[Nay]

3. I've read that somewhere before, and remember doing a double-take in my

own head -- I live in a suburb, and we even have our own website. If someone needs help, a hundred people will jump to it. We trade info, sell stuff to each other, meet up at the clubhouse, all that stuff. I have also lived out in the middle of nowhere, and I can say that I was definitely helped out when I needed it (stranded in a blizzard), but not to any greater extent than I would be right here in the burbs.

I tend to like rural areas better for their peace and quiet, nature, gardening opportunities, etc., but I also recognized the ability of a few rural folks to be so nasty that they poisoned the atmosphere and spread rumors, engage in backbiting and petty fights, etc. All it takes is one wannabe despot in the neighborhood for everything to be upended, and there goes your peace and quiet.

[FarCenter]

5. In many suburbs, there is a large percentage with roots in rural America

With the mechanization of agriculture taking hold after WW II, the population on farms declined and rural towns stagnated as their offspring moved to the suburbs. Most of the HS class of my small town who went to college wound up in a suburb.

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

30. I acutally live in a semi-rural area of a suburb, and while I would love

some peace and quiet, there is much disturbance on that front.

I find disturbing the frequent gunshots ringing through the air form the neighbors hunting in our woods (yes, they have our "neighborly" permission, though we don't have guns ourselves or think much of hunting for sport) and the recently established shooting range (miles away, but unbelievably loud even at this distance.

Also, there are the four-wheelers who actually cut down trees on the neighboring woods without permission just so they can have a clear path to loudly vvvrrrrrrrroooooom vvvrrrrrrrroooooom vvvrrrrrrrroooooom for hours at a time.

[lunasun]

8. And us city folk in Chicago would never ever help shovel or plow snow for a neighbor

Last edited Sat Dec 17, 2016, 04:06 PM - Edit history (1)

Only magical rural tribes possess the character to do such ""extraordinary good""
Or talk to each other while waiting in a store line about the weather or the community .

We are just uncaring impatient and grumpy in their rural fantasy compared to their special place ...according to some posts

(Actually we live very close together and so getting along is natural and would never even think of bragging or posting about things that just are fact not extra ordinary)

[eleny]

25. My Williamsburg, Brooklyn mom was composting before composting was cool

What a freak!

[Bettie]

9. Let me tell you about those "magical rural tribes"

I grew up in Wisconsin (Waukesha county, which is now just...ick).

Lived in Madison, WI for 11 years, then 7 in the far Northern 'burbs of Illinois.

Then, we moved to Iowa 15 years ago come January.

What I've learned since moving here is that if you do a favor for someone, they are really nearly psychotic about "paying you back" so "I don't owe you anything". Never before, in any place I've lived has this been a thing.

If someone does you a favor, you accept it and move on, later on, if they need something, you help out.

The other thing I've noted is that small towns suck. I've lived here for 15 years, my kids have never lived anywhere else, yet we're all still "new people" because our grandparents didn't' grow up here.

Of course, the place in Wisconsin I grew up in has changed so much from being a nice small city where people were friendly and decent by and large to a place filled with virulent racist dickheads.

[Silver Gaia]

10. OMG yes!

I was just thinking, as I read this thread, how I had lived in a small town in a rural county in Tennessee for 20 years, and like you, my kids were born there, but I was ALWAYS seen as an outsider. NOT ONCE in that 20 years did anyone born and raised there ever invite me over to their house or to any social gatherings.

My only friends were other outsiders (and thank goodness, there were quite a few of us). Friendly? No. Hospitable? No. They always treated us like we didn't belong, even though we tried to be involved and volunteered for leadership roles in various community organizations. We were never "good enough" to be thought of as friend material.

I did not miss it when I left. I missed the beauty of the hills and the peacefulness, but NOT the people.

So, thank you for verfying that mine was not a singular experience, nor was it a "Southern thing." It was the small-mindedness that thrives in rural, small-town America across this nation.

[Bettie]

18. I think that small-mindedness is what gave us

the orange creature too.

He spoke to the pettiness in these people. To the "not-one-of-us" feelings even though he is as far from being one of them as it is possible to get without being a literal alien from another planet.

He promised them that he would get rid of the not-us people and they believed it. My kids are faced with other kids at school daily who declare that he will remove all non-Christians, non-whites, gays, etc. from their country.

I'm also glad that this experience isn't limited to me.

You'd think in 15 years I'd have made a few friends. Everywhere else I've lived, I have friends who I still am in contact with, who I see and email on a fairly regular basis. Here: nothing. I can't even find someone to go to a movie with.

My kids have few friends, but they are boys who are not interested in sports or church, which are the only things most of the kids around here are interested in.

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

31. Great post.

I especially think this is important:

He spoke to the pettiness in these people. To the "not-one-of-us" feelings even though he is as far from being one of them as it is possible to get without being a literal alien from another planet.

He promised them that he would get rid of the not-us people and they believed it.

Yet we keep hearing how we lost the election because we didn't pander enough to the rural voter. I say we lost because some middle of the road voters went for Trump because the RW propaganda machine has done such an excellent job of selling lies about Democrats.

If most Americans were voting on facts, we'd have won without having to coddle the rural bigots.

[eleny]

24. You reminded me of an experience I had 40 years ago

When I first moved to Colorado in '76 my boyfriend (now my husband) and I rented a small cottage on the property of an elderly woman who lived on the property, too. One day I mentioned to her that I moved here from NYC. She replied, "Yes, I saw your foreign plates."

I hadn't yet gotten Colorado car plates!

God bless her. She was born and raised on western dry land farms and lived through the dust bowl of eastern Colorado while raising four kids during that awful time. They moved to this area west of Denver right before WW2. I don't know what her politics was. We got along great. And when she was too old to care for this property she moved across the street to a house her daughter built for all of them. We were told that it gave her solace to accept our offer on this place.

Looking back I get the feeling that we were a little bit in awe of each other. She was a living piece of history I never thought I'd meet and I was a NYC gal who somehow fit into her life without a hitch. I treasure her memory. And I love to recall my having "foreign plates"! Foreign plates?! Okay, no problem.

[Crash2Parties]

22. Having spent much of my youth in Wisconsin, I feel your loss

I can still remember a time when social and structural traces of a century in Milwaukee that held three socialist mayors still existed...

[Nay]

35. Holy shit! That happened to me! When I lived in a small town in Alabama, I

invited a fellow student over to study for a major microbiology test. We were going to study for about 6 hours in the middle of the day.

Now, to clarify, I had a very clean and orderly house; I had no cats, dogs, or other animals; my fridge was clean, plates were clean, I'm not a hoarder. Just to get that out of the way!

As a decent host, I offered this girl tea or coffee or soda -- and I had planned to fix a sandwich lunch of her choice of fillings. She would have none of it, not even the tea, or even water. She acted the same psychotic way, as if she would now have to have me over to her house, feed me, etc., in exchange. It was so very bizarre.

Years and years later, I have discovered one reason some people are so scared of having to reciprocate -- they themselves have filthy and/or hoarder-type houses and simply cannot stand the idea of being embarrassed by it. I'm sure that the girl in my story had a decent place; she was def one of the ones who couldn't stand to even owe you a cup of tea. Unreal. Like you, I've only seen this in rural areas, never suburbs or cities.

[FarCenter]

4. So CITY OF QUARTZ got it all wrong?

https://www.amazon.com/City-Quartz-Excavating-Future-Angeles/dp/1844675688

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/culturemonster/2011/06/where-to-start-when-it-comes-to-city-of-quartz-mike-daviss-1990-polemic-against-the-rampant-privatization-and-gated-communi.html

[DemocratSinceBirth]

6. The book is nearly thirty years old.

Plenty of time to test his hypothesis that the end was nigh. We are still here.

[Hortensis]

7. "Our economy is twice as large as that of Trump's pal, Russia."

Thanks for the new line. I've enjoyed telling a couple of people who drew ridiculous comparisons between Russia and us, Russia better of course, that its economy was only about the size of Italy's, that its only manufactured export is weaponry, and that if it couldn't pull petroleum out of the ground it'd be desperately poor instead of just poor.

"Half the size of California's economy" should hit just a little harder, though. And I'm definitely in a mood to hit. A young man behind a counter the other day admired Putin but couldn't even name his favorite method of assassination. I enlightened him. Truth to tell, no matter how many exotic poisons we read about, polonium remains mine for its delayed pure viciousness.

Btw, born and raised in California, raised our kids there. I miss it. Especially now. Certain people like to claim bigotry is even more insidious in liberal regions than "honest" bigotry in red states, but minorities in California are, generally speaking, confident and comfortable among whites, people among people, which I only recognized when coming up against the blank, sullen, or passively hostile face too often presented here in the Deep South.

[lambchopp59]

11. Just curious where you are now

My last sojourn to Midwest U.S. to place my Alzheimer's dad in a nursing home turned into a long protracted legal battle to confine him there. I'd originally planned not to be out of California and back to work inside of a month, turned into 4 months. I was appalled at the number of blatantly racist Obama-hate bumperstickers and willful ignorance I encountered casually throughout this.
I even live in one of the largely rural counties in California now (Lake), yet still the county voted blue, a few boisterous Trumpeteers stick out like sore thumbs here.
I don't feel I could ever be comfortable most anywhere in landlocked U.S. exception of a few more "liberal" islands.
BTW, I'm not new here, I'm nightscanner repackaged since the hacking, so thanks but please don't "welcome me to DU".

[Hortensis]

21. Lol. I won't. I'm in Georgia, in one of the most

conservative (as counted on one hand by many measures) districts in the nation. We're only about an hour north of Atlanta, though, and there are others like us here who came from elsewhere.

Native Georgians here have their pluses and minuses, like people anywhere, and some are secretly liberal, but in this rather insane era the bad is overwhelming the good. Most of these people haven't just abandoned their intellect and their morals but the precepts of their religion in immersion in partisan hostility. Not that they are aware at all of it. They do have religious political goals, so with that righteousness framing everything, they examine nothing, including especially their leaders. A real lesson in the power of evil leadership over those susceptible to it.

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

32. Excellent summary:

Most of these people haven't just abandoned their intellect and their morals but the precepts of their religion in immersion in partisan hostility. Not that they are aware at all of it. They do have religious political goals, so with that righteousness framing everything, they examine nothing, including especially their leaders. A real lesson in the power of evil leadership over those susceptible to it.

[Crash2Parties]

23. Lake county, eh? Too bad none of the urban and suburban folk to the south helped after the fire...

'cause you know that stuff only happens within red, rural areas.

< / BIG SARC >

[lambchopp59]

27. There was much devastation. Numerous bay area organizations chipped in.

Last edited Sat Dec 17, 2016, 02:55 PM - Edit history (2)

Sorely needed donations. Lake county is 3rd from the bottom in per capita income, but the bottom of the economic scale of per household incomes at 35,997.00. Living expenses considerably cheaper here than all bay area locations, and except for some peak summertime temperatures, Lake is a far cry more desirable place to live in many ways.
Even though the election results were closer here with 44 percent voting Trump vs. 47 for Clinton, the Trumpeteers I see are a boisterously vocal minority, but largely retirees who fish the lakes here daily. Working age individuals were blown away by the election results as was I.
Yes the "good old boys" attitude amongst the RW'ers makes me cringe. I can tell you most of which were concerned only with their own losses here. Certainly just as the sort who claims to be so charitable... albeit not without a tax deduction, or largely making donations to sham organizations that support their racist, homophobic or xenophobic views, neither would the sort donate a dime if they thought it might go to a muslim family or one with same sex parents.
We've had a few incidents with the few Trumpeteers here at work being called in for disciplinary actions. One who made blatantly homophobic remarks towards a co-worker was forgiven, admonished and told never to pull that shit again. Another... however... truly cut loose with comments towards (anyone who wasn't white, hetero or republican) about their pending deportations was dismissed. Another contract worker who has continually hinted to racist and Christian-supremacist views will soon be leaving.

[Crash2Parties]

36. I was in Santa Rosa & RP that month. Ended up spending much non-work time

sorting & boxing up books & school supplies for one group, clothing for another. Didn't hear a single mention of anyone wondering what kind of people were going to be the recipients. Both groups were well to the left of center.

[treestar]

12. I've seen it

on FB trolls acting like California votes adding to the popular vote total don't matter. They aren't real Amurkans, or something.

The EC, the Senate and the even the House are biased against big populous states. I read a theory the House should have 1000 members for Calfornians/New Yorkers to have equal representation even there!

And I am against that even though I am from a tiny state that has two Senators for not quite one million people while California has two for 32 million or whatever it is now.

[SHRED]

13. We Californians get hate from middle America

"Taxes", "regulations", "land of fruits and nuts", and the list goes on.

You'd think they would not want to bite the hand that feeds them with our Federal tax dollars but they are clueless to this.

[Silver Gaia]

16. Yep. They are clueless indeed.

They would miss us if we left.

[Silver Gaia]

14. What a GREAT thread! I agree with all you wrote.

I've lived in Sacramento for the past 17 years. In (I think it was) 2004, Time magazine called Sacramento the most culturally diverse city in America. What they meant by that was that we are more an example of the "melting pot" ideal without becoming homogenous. This is because we are very diverse ethnically, racially, etc, but we tend to have very mixed neighborhoods, AND we manage to all get along.

In my small neighborhood, we are white, black, Asian, Mexican American, Russian, Middle Eastern, Indian, Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, Hindu, atheist, and probably many other points of diversity, but we smile at each other, we wave and say Hi, we help when needed, we share when we can. No one feels afraid, not that I am aware of. I LOVE THIS! I couldn't live any other way.

So, thank you for this thread. Trump and his minions do not represent the true reality of this great country. WE represent the heart of America, not just Californians, but all of us who love the diverse nature of our country of immigrants, and who value love and respect over hatred and fear.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

28. The only drawback of living in Greater L A is the cost of living.

My gf and i pay $1,300.00 a month for a 500 square foot studio apartment in a 40 year old rent controlled building. On the plus side it has a heated pool and jacuzzi.

It's great...My floor is diverse. There are Russians, African Americans, Persians, Indians, Mexicans, and Greeks among others. I have needed an iron when mine broke, something printed when my printer broke, and laundry detergent when I ran out of it. They were always willing to help.

[alarimer]

15. I'd prefer urban areas to either suburbs or small towns.

Both for living and for visiting.

Suburbs are poorly designed generally and are meant to be traversed on foot; people are often spread too far out and there are no sidewalks or front porches so people hide in their backyards. There are a lot of soulless big-box type stores and dumb stupid houses where the main focus is the garage.

Some small towns are okay, especially if they have a funky or unusual aspect to them. Most do not.

[Bettie]

20. I prefer a small city to a huge one

Or a college town near a larger urban area.

But, mostly, I just would prefer not being in Iowa.

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

33. Wow, this thread. I have found my people!

...dumb stupid houses where the main focus is the garage.

I lived in Media, PA, for a while. Sort of a suburban small town. Lots of cool old houses, some funky, some posh. But the best thing was that the town was walkable.

Where I am now, in a semi-rural suburb, there is no destination I can walk to and still have the stamina to get back home on foot.

[Tikki]

17. I've gone back to sports and organizations and institutions that I read about wanting to..

hold conventions and meetings and exhibitions this coming year or next and written (or you can call) to encourage
them to schedule or reschedule to a Blue state venue.

This kind of thing can work. Cite the reasons why time spent in a Blue State is more
profitable, both financially and socially responsible. Or talk about regressive red state laws and ideas that may
alienate people from participating in the events.

Tikki

[bettyellen]

26. So racism wins? Interesting.

[Humanist_Activist]

34. We have some neighborhoods in our city that have weekly festivals...

Food truck Fridays, Sunday concerts in the nearest public park, an International Festival yearly, and in most of these, the crowds are quite mixed.

In the inner ring suburbs, you might decide to go to the St. Vincent's thrift store to donate some clothing all while in the shadow of a minaret built on an Islamic center.

Contrast this with the more rural festivals(Kimmswick, I'm looking at you) where Confederate flags are on prominent display from many vendors and if you see a black face, its quite unusual.

This is in a blue island in a sea of red, St. Louis, Missouri.