Donald Trump has divided Israel...

[kentuck]

and in four years, he will have divided most of the world.
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http://www.jpost.com/US-Elections/Donald-Trump/Likud-MKs-react-to-Trumps-victory-in-US-Presidential-Election-472088

<snip>
Right-wing Israeli politicians competed Wednesday in their praise for US president-elect Donald Trump, expressing hope that America’s policies toward Israel would soon change dramatically.

<snip>
“In past years, diplomatic pressure led to a lack of building in Jerusalem. There will be less pressure from Trump, so we should be building much more in our capital. I will not be surprised if the new president keeps his promise to move the US embassy to Jerusalem.”

<snip>
The Knesset’s Land of Israel caucus held a celebratory meeting in the Knesset in which more than a dozen MKs called upon Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to take advantage of the US election to restore construction throughout the country, abandon the two-state solution, and begin annexing Judea and Samaria.

Likud MK Yehudah Glick even invited Trump to celebrate his victory on the Temple Mount. He invited Trump to “visit Israel and Judea and Samaria to see for himself, as he claimed, that settlement is the way to peace.”

[guillaumeb]

1. So Israel will have every piece of Palestine, and

the Palestinians will have their bantustans. Or open air prisons, if you will.

Now the Israeli politicians can abandon the pretense of ever giving back the stolen land while they complain about not having a negotiating partner.

[oberliner]

2. Weird how the Jewish Quarter of the Old City of Jerusalem is "stolen land" from the Palestinians

Didn't somebody steal it from the Jews first?

Edit to Add:

"... The operations of calculated destruction were set in motion.... I knew that the Jewish Quarter was densely populated with Jews who caused their fighters a good deal of interference and difficulty.... I embarked, therefore, on the shelling of the Quarter with mortars, creating harassment and destruction.... Only four days after our entry into Jerusalem the Jewish Quarter had become their graveyard. Death and destruction reigned over it.... As the dawn of Friday, May 28, 1948, was about to break, the Jewish Quarter emerged convulsed in a black cloud - a cloud of death and agony."

— Yosef Tekoah (Permanent Representative of Israel to the United Nations) quoting Abdullah el-Tal.

The Jordanian commander is reported to have told his superiors: "For the first time in 1,000 years not a single Jew remains in the Jewish Quarter. Not a single building remains intact. This makes the Jews' return here impossible." The Hurva Synagogue, originally built in 1701, was blown up by the Jordanian Arab Legion. During the nineteen years of Jordanian rule, a third of the Jewish Quarter's buildings were demolished. According to a complaint Israel made to the United Nations, all but one of the thirty-five Jewish houses of worship in the Old City were destroyed. The synagogues were razed or pillaged and stripped and their interiors used as hen-houses or stables.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Quarter_(Jerusalem)

[guillaumeb]

3. It is obvious from what Netanyahu said,

as well as what Moishe Dayan said many years ago, that the Israeli State has never had any intention of allowing a viable two state solution.

The only solution that the Israeli State will entertain is one in which the Palestinians are walled off into numerous open air prisons where the water and electricity and access are controlled by the Israeli State.

An interesting movie about Israel and the US perception of Israel is The Occupation of the American mind.

Weird also how, starting in 2012, the Arab parts of Jerusalem are being appropriated by the Israeli State also. Google Beit Hanina if you wish.

[oberliner]

4. I don't disagree with you

I think it is possible for the following two things both to be true:

1. Netanyahu is awful and has every intention of expanding settlements throughout the West Bank and has no intention of ever doing anything to make a Palestinian state a reality.

2. A UN resolution that makes no distinction between the Jewish Quarter in E Jerusalem and the Israeli settlements deep in the West Bank is problematic.

I would encourage you to check out the Geneva Initiative:

http://www.geneva-accord.org/

[guillaumeb]

6. I agree with you. And thank you for the link.

You might also like the movie. We showed it at one of our forum nights in conjunction with JVP. We have co-hosted with them on things before this.

[oberliner]

9. You're welcome

It's good that we have some common ground even if we disagree on some major points.

Just out of curiosity when you say "we" - what organization or group are you talking about?

[guillaumeb]

12. I always feel that our conversations are polite.

I was referring to Southsiders for Peace, a church based social justice group in the Chicago area. We have co-hosted events with Jewish Voices for Peace three times recently.

As to disagreement on major points, my view of the situation is that Israel must withdraw to the 1967 borders and the previous status of Jerusalem as an International City must be honored.

I also feel that a permanent UN presence in Jerusalem is a good idea.

[oberliner]

14. Likewise

Thanks for sharing the info about that group.

Unfortunately, I get the sense that things are going to get worse in the region, not better, in the immediate future.

[malaise]

5. +1,000 n/t

[guillaumeb]

7. It must be said. And repeated.

Happy holidays, malaise. I enjoy your posts and comments.

[malaise]

8. Back at you

Best wishes to you and yours

[HoneyBadger]

10. Israelis and Palestinians want the same land and the more extreme will never share

Ultimately it is them that need to resolve this.

[Initech]

11. The end of humanity will boil down to two words: Donald Trump.

[WilliamH1474]

13. It's hard

I don't like the way the US and Israeli relationship has been going for the past few years. The American Jewish population overwhelmingly backs us and we should not turn our backs on them, but we should also not ignore the problems in Palestine.

It is hard because I personally feel that groups like the PLO and Hamas end up antagonizing a fragile situation. Again this is just my opinion.