How long until Americans start emigrating to other countries?

[milestogo]

And will they be willing to take us?

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

1. I think there will be at least a brain drain

when American scientists and researchers lose all their research grants and start looking elsewhere to do their work.

[exboyfil]

4. Will start at the graduate level

Right now lots of foreign nationals are here on grants from NIH etc working on their PhDs. Most are not of European descent.

[Alice11111]

6. I know of two going now, PhD physicists They have already lost some of their

Lost grant money, with uncertainty at best for the future.
They are exhausted of the bs. They are ashamed to be associated with it. Canada and other countries are welcoming them! Why not.
I would go to Canada if I could.

DT has pretty much shot our role as one of the leaders in science. You can't revive that after four years of his aggressive pace, particularly as fast as sciece is moving forward. It had been challenging anyway because of the Repubs. Steve Jobs had Obama to his house for dinner to discuss it in Obama's election.

Those salaries and their next generation would have contributed a lot to the GDP and funding retirements (at a crisis, which is one of the reasons Merkel took in new workers.) Plus, their brains are desparately needed.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

14. Huge cuts to budgets for medical research are proposed, too.

http://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2017/03/16/520390147/trump-administration-proposes-big-cuts-in-medical-research?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_term=nprnews&utm_content=20170316

The budget isn't a done deal, of course, so some of these cuts won't happen - but it shows what this maladministration's priorities are. Even if the final budget isn't as draconian I am sure a lot of scientists won't want to deal with the uncertainties and lack of support and will find work in more welcoming countries. I sure would.

[Alice11111]

25. Yes, and we are already behind on med research by years.

We are better in some forms of cancer, but the RW has suppressed research for religious reasons?&%$!!!!??

[sarcasmo]

31. If I was young, Canada, Australia or New Zealand.

I'M almost 50, Canada won't take old folks.

[Alice11111]

34. In the Maritimes they will. They need people as no one wants to live there.

Yeah, they want people bringing kids and peak wage earners for years to come. They also need medical. They will of course take refugees, but we don't count as that yet. There used to be a link on the Canadian website of people who would marry Americans...Bush years...we never thought it would come to ashamed to be Americans. Some people who bought property when it was affordable, and have good money to retire, are fine.

The problem most of us have is healthcare, assuming we have it. You can only get treatment in a foreign country once a year in an emergency. Not supposed to leave the country...maybe a few awkward ways around that. Living on the border and coming in for annuals and catastrophic might work, but as you age your care becomes intensive.
The costs of living in Vancouver, which would be an easy border cross, is very, very high. Getting worse as Silicon Valley types are setting up dual offices...more brain drain. Dual offices will eventually turn to main offices in Canada.

If anyone has any ideas, please share.

[Ilsa]

29. That's what I was going to say.

American citizens with advanced degrees will leave and foreigners may decide not to study here if research grants are trashed.

[maveric]

2. Will anyone take us?

[Alice11111]

11. Let me know! I had been looking at Mexico and I speak

Spanish not too badly, but now that we keep trying to start a war w them, I don't blame them for being hostile. I subscribe to a couple of their newspapers. The Mexicans are pissed, long nuanced discussions. They ask if they should be pissed at all Americans? The consensus is yes, since we didn't stop him from winning, go into the rustbelt, bring holy hell down on Comey, blah, blah. They get the Russian interference, but considering our history of being cheated out, don't understand why we weren't prepared. Lots of reasons and different opinions, but it boils down to you let him be elected. You get him now.

Maybe Mexico will claim us back or Canada will let the blue states succeed and join. I can have wistful dreams, fading.

[Ilsa]

30. I think it would be great if Mexico tried

to annex the area south of the Nueces River in Texas. Many families in that region that have been there farming and ranching for the last 130 years are both Anglo and Hispanic from political/economic marriages.

[Alice11111]

33. I'm in New Mexico wth relatives around here and Texas. NM may fight w Mexico.The border sheriffs

Are against the wall, and they resent DT building this wall between their families and friends. It has drastically hurt trade, and people are afraid to move about. Recipe for disaster.

Ignorant, vindictive, mean asshole! What did Mexico ever do to him? Oh yeah, nothing.
This was just a big play on bigotry to his deplorables for votes. Now, they are pissed that they can't find housekeepers, gardeners, caretakers for their elderly parents,cooks, roofers, drivers, workers for their busineses.... TS Rule.

[Ilsa]

35. I-35 in central Tx

from Laredo to San Antonio used to be a big route for Mexican shoppers to come to SA, stay a couple of days, shop, dine out, etc. I wonder if it is doing the same? I can't imagine anyone wanting to subject themselves to border harassment.

[Alice11111]

50. I lived along there years ago. Love it. Now, the wall.

I remember the days we could just walk over the border for a nice Mexican evening. Now, there are machine guns on both sides. I was flying from Mexico out to the US in a private plane. We cleared security. We were walking to the tarmac, waiting to get in the plane. The pilot had taken a bag with my aunt's meds and put it in the luggage compartment, in spite of my telling him not to. Anyway, I said, I have to get it, which was about a 1 minute procedure, open the small door, take out the bag.

About 10 young guys w automatic weapons came walking to the plane. They pointed at the bag I had taken and I gave it to them. Then, they proceeded to go through all of the luggage on the plane. Clearly, harassment. The pilot was nervous.

Another time, at a pool, we didn’t get served drinks or snacks after an hour, and asking. We were the only gringos. My bro said, for the first time in my life, I feel discriminated against. I said, it's the wall. Being the good Repub, he argued, it's not the wall, their economy is doing great. I said, they are a proud people, and they don't like getting kicked in the teeth. (I didnt dare say, and rapists, muderer comments, etc. After another 20 minutes of no service, he said, maybe you are right, but he was pissed at me for pointing out the obvious. I talked to the management in Spanish, very nicely, and we started getting service. Then, my bro steams for a while, and takes the car, tells his daughter we are leaving, and leaves us there.
Not the wall?

It used to be so much fun to talk and visit with the Mexican people. Really, warm and fun people. It felt like, strickly business, this time.

[KingCharlemagne]

42. Continuing our grand tradition of land theft, we stole the land

from Mexico in 1848 anyway.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

15. I think many countries would be happy to take some of our scientists.

Japan, Germany and France are among the countries that do a lot of scientific R&D.

[exboyfil]

3. I have already been thinking about my daughter

and their options.

My oldest is an engineer married to an engineer and working in Iowa. Some difficultly in mobility, but Canada's point system might welcome them. Australia?/New Zealand?

My younger daughter probably has more mobility, but less income potential. She will be graduating as a nurse in August (BSN-RN). Your prospects look pretty dim going forward given that their will be no money for healthcare even though the need exists. Maybe supporting medical tourism in a Carribean or South American country?

[OldEurope]

5. Perhaps your daughter should learn some German.

She could be needed here. Salary for nurses is not making you rich, but decent healthcare is available.

Actually I think America will get rid of this orange pain. Quickly.

[Vogon_Glory]

9. Does Germany have a preferred immigrant category for people of German stock?

I don't qualify and I don't plan to leave, but I can't help but wonder if Americans of German stock decide to emigrate and rediscover their German roots.

[Jake Stern]

21. They do but from a person I've talked to who did it's a long bureaucratic process.

And it's only up to grandparents unless you are descended from a German Holocaust victim/survivor.

Italy has a pretty liberal ancestry citizenship program.

Hungary's program, on paper, is quite simple: prove you have Hungarian ancestors and can speak the language at a minimal level and you're in. In practice the sheer amount of documents, translations and apostilles needed can take a sizable chunk out of your time and bank account and Hungarian ranks in the top 5 hardest languages to learn.

Greece has one but don't know the specifics of it.

Ireland also has one.

[Alice11111]

7. On the Canadian website, they give points for medical

people, at least the last time I looked.

[NotThisTime]

45. Engineering is surprisingly not a strong pull from AU, Nursing on the other hand is

especially if she doesn't mind being a temp rural nurse for a few years while she's young, some big income potential in that case. If your oldest can go back to school for business (perhaps even in AU), Then that would be a stronger pull, but you will pay foreign tuition. If they want to become a divemaster, study in Thailand then apply in Cairns, knew a German who did that!!!! Heck, met an Irish girl who was a barrista, came to AU, on her second day found a job in Cairns and they sponsored her!!! When we talked to her, she was two weeks from getting permanent residency! She made enough to live comfortably in cairns... there are options.

[Vinca]

8. My husband is a Canadian/American and just this morning we were reminiscing about when we were

first married (1973) and how we came very close to moving to Canada to start our lives. I'd gone through the procedure and we were good to go and for some reason neither of us can remember, we stayed here. Sad.

[Nay]

54. I got Canadian citizenship through my mother -- but I didn't know I could do that when I

was a mother with a young child. Now, my kid is all grown up, married, and has a child. I can't leave them even though I yearn to live in Canada. I made the same mistake you did, and I have very painful regret over it.

[OnDoutside]

10. Maybe building the wall is designed to keep you in !!!

[Jake Stern]

16. Actually that may not be as much of a joke as some people think

Have a feeling it will soon become much harder and much more expensive to get a passport. Then perhaps you will have to submit your international travel plans in advance to Homeland Security for approval.

With the increasingly fascist character of this regime I wouldn't be surprised.

[Alice11111]

17. Actually, that may not turn out to be a joke eventually.

The net movement is TO Mexico, so why the fucking wall? The tunnels of drug dealers? Really, I saw a Mexican clip, laughing about the wall, and all of the problems about that...one was saying we fly in. One was saying the druggies just have to get one tunnel deep enough, but DT has to get 600-2000 miles of wall deep enough, deeper than the Englisg channel. Besides the connections and laundrying of money are already set up here. Thete are much better solutions to that.

I still think in 20 years, Germany, likely to be the leader of the free world again (thanks to DT) will be saying, "Mr. Prez, tear down your wall."

[OnDoutside]

23. If they do build the wall, I wonder who'll get the contracts for the supply of concrete and

reinforced steel ?

[Alice11111]

27. Normally, Cemex, a Mexican company, for concrete.

A lighting company in Mexico has applied. DT has said, only American.
For the pipelines, it's all American, except for Russian steel, of course.

[MedusaX]

19. Dual purpose for sure!

If we ever do reach the point that the proposed structure becomes an approved, fully allocated budget item..... I intend to relocate to the southern side before construction.....

IMHO, the only thing worse than being locked-out is being locked-in.....

[OnDoutside]

24. You could be at a lock-in at an Irish pub ;)

[hunter]

20. That's it exactly.

The Trump states are already suffering brain drain.

[Demsrule86]

12. Both Hubs parents were born in Ireland...so he

has the right of return...the day that the Gop or the courts pass a bill that people can refuse to 'serve' gays which would include nurses and Doctors...is the day my family packs up a leaves. i have a gay daughter. I will not allow evil GOP to kill her with their faux so called religious beliefs.

[monmouth4]

36. Grandmother born in England,raised in Ireland and my grandfather born and raised in Ireland. I

would certainly go if I could.

[Demsrule86]

49. You may be able to I would check on it.

[Nay]

55. Unless the rules have changed, I do believe you are eligible and should apply.

[Jake Stern]

13. Many of us have been looking into it

The Dutch keeping Geert Wilders and PVV away from majority gives me hope that Europeans can resist the siren song of nationalistic populism and maybe turn it around in places where it has power (Hungary, etc.).

As much as we would like to believe that Trump voters will open their eyes and see what an utter buffoon he is the truth is that, from what's been seen of them, they'll double down and defend their messiah even harder. It's so personal like his failure will be their failure. Actually I fear what might come if Trump is voted out in 2020. The lid on the racist, misogynistic Pandora's Box has been lifted unleashing such raw rage and hate that it's hard to believe that Trumpanzees will go back into the box without a fight.

Honestly, I'd rather that my partner, son and I not be here when that happens.

[Alice11111]

18. Ditto

[Lurks Often]

22. Never, at least not in significant numbers

[Aristus]

26. Mrs. Aristus and I are thinking seriously of Canada.

The border is not too far away. And we're both trained professionals with sought-after skills. I'd love to emigrate to someplace like New Zealand, but that's too far away for Mrs. Aristus. She wants to be close to our grandkids.

If things get much worse, we're going to go for it.

[FSogol]

28. I know 2 people who resigned from positions in the Pentagon since they didn't want to deal with

Trumpy's mess and moved out of the DC area.

[Runningdawg]

32. Many Americans are too poor or too old to qualify

If I had a do-over my college money would have been better spent getting the hell out while the getting was good. I now recommend that approach to all young people in the US.

[KingCharlemagne]

44. We need young peopel to remain here to staff the resistance. Time

for all good men and women to come to the defense of their country.

[adigal]

37. My brightest students are looking at going to school in Canada, but I think secession

is a much better idea. And I'm serious.

[KingCharlemagne]

46. Secession has such a treasonous ring to it, harkening back to

1860 and all.

Myself, I prefer "partition."

[Dave Starsky]

38. I love this country. Still.

I'm not going anywhere. This country's not perfect. It never has been. But it always had potential. It's not this country's fault that it's been taken over by complete shitheads. Someone has to stick around to kick all those fuckers out.

Imagine you had terminal cancer. Think how crestfallen you'd be if your immune system said, "Fuck it. I'm not going to fight this. I'm leaving." We'll, I'm not leaving.

[Jake Stern]

39. That's wonderful and I wish you luck

As for me, I have a blind partner and a year old son and don't really want to stick around long enough to see just how "great" Trump and his demons are going to make America for them.

Those complete shitheads as you call them are growing louder and meaner. They are now out of the box and will not go back without a fight. Not saying there's going to be civil war but the possibility looks more real every day.

[Dave Starsky]

43. They are cowards. They count on compliance.

Don't be compliant. Fight back. That's all it takes. Just resist them.

I don't have the luxury to leave. I don't have the means to fly to another country. You don't know what my situation is, but I may be more desperate than you. I may be to the point where the ONLY choice I have is to fight back; literally, the ONLY choice. And so I will fight back, to the last.

The best of luck to you in your new world.

[NotThisTime]

40. My daughter working on her PhD and research has already left. I have a friend with a Canadian visa

for his family to come, he's also established. Neither of them plan to return. My daughter saw the writing on the wall (voted from overseas) but she left in August and has no plans to return. With her PhD and medical research, she shouldn't have a problem staying on for good in Australia. She's also contemplating med school in addition to her PhD. This country lost a talent.

The medical and Tech centers in this country will be destroyed before long IMHO.

[KingCharlemagne]

41. All able-bodied adult Americans need to remain here to

staff the resistance.

Children and the infirm should be the first to leave.

[lunatica]

47. As long as other countries keep progress going I'm OK

Not being the World Leader doesn't bother me as long as science, education, humanitarianism and the stopping of world hunger is pursued by somebody.

[madokie]

48. Hell I'm packing now

Well I wish I was and I wouldn't care as long as it was in a not warring country. I'd really like to move to somewhere in the Caribbean Where the people are cool and inviting to old codgers like myself and I'd still be close enough to visit my family.

13 kids to begin with, 8 of us still living. Oldest is my awesome good Democrat Sis and youngest just turned is my younger brother at 65, another good democrat, btw. Only two are questionable, political wise. One of those two is the most awesomeness dude in the world and up until the last few years a good democrat but faux noise got to him somewhere along the line and the other has way too much money and tighter than the bark on a tree, so naturally hes a 'CON

F.U.C.K.

[Jonny Appleseed]

51. I'm looking at New Zealand since it has trade winds that'll protect it from nuclear fallout

[OliverQ]

52. I would be gone already if I could

Unless you're highly skilled, it's nearly impossible for an American to move to another Western country.

[OregonBlue]

53. We were just discussing that today, We are raising our grandkids so it would have to be a country

that has good international schools but, it's very tempting. We just don't know if we can sell everything we own and have enough to spend the rest of our lives somewhere else.