Republican voters feel their taxes pay for "freeloaders"

[SHRED]

This is a very common thread among them.
They believe their taxes are high and that the cause are "lazy people" that "don't want to work".
Not sure if they will ever get to the truth.

Notice I said "feel" instead of "think".

[octoberlib]

1. And blue state taxes pay for the

freeloadin' red states.

[SHRED]

3. That is one of the big ironies

[smirkymonkey]

13. +1000

This right here! Mooching red states!

[Blue_true]

28. I read an article earlier today that instead of raising gas

taxes to pay for road repair, South Carolina asked Trump for $5 billion from the federal government. Red states want to keep their taxes low and handout freebies to corporations, but want blue states to pay for their government functions. If republicans in South Carolina believe in the free market so much, why don't they get rich fat cats to build and repair roads and put a toll on their motorists to pay fatcats back? Don't ask New York State and California to bigly foot the bill for South Carolina roads.

[octoberlib]

38. +1

[Vinca]

2. These are the same folks who want government to stay out of their Medicare.

[duncang]

4. And I pay for the roads that have been built just for the convenience of big companies. nt

[shockey80]

5. Hypocrites.

Millions of white working class americans are on medicaid, disability, etc.

[maryellen99]

6. They think also they are paying triple health insurance premiums

For "free loaders who have pre existing conditions who don't have to pay for their bad choices".

[Sculpin Beauregard]

7. Taxes, and they should strive to be fair, are the price of living in a civilized society.

You want a country with unfettered market, no laws and no taxes? Ask post-collapse Soviet Russia how that worked out. Oh wait...the oligarchs made out like bandits while the population suffered.

Sound familiar?

[CrispyQ]

8. Next up: Ask post-collapse USA how that worked out.

I can't believe Comey said he was 'mildly nauseous' at the thought of influencing the election. I interpret that as he isn't alarmed by the changes Trump & Co are making/advocating. If the IC can't take Trump down, I don't think we'll get rid of him.

[tblue37]

17. I hope our allies' ICs will pressure our ICs with leaks if that happens. nt

[KT2000]

9. RW media has been

telling them this over and over. "Not happy with your life? Here is some resentment so you can blame others for your unhappiness. Getting angry will make you feel better too!" Brainwashing over decades now.

[dmosh42]

10. And I went in the military so these bloodsuckers could avoid the draft!

Notice all the way back to Korean war, none of rich boys were serving anything.

[Ligyron]

23. and most of the people I knew in the military?

Republicans and voting for them.

[Averagegrunt]

58. Runs a bit deeper

I've noticed a lot more liberals recently but meh. Service members are much like any other voter. Republicans tend to fund military more. More training that's more worthwhile which is always better then sitting around waiting on the word. Also there tends to be higher annual pay raises with a republican president.

[phylny]

67. Can you prove the statement that raises are higher under

Republican presidents? Thank you.

[Averagegrunt]

73. The great oracle that is google!

http://www.defenseone.com/business/2014/09/heres-chart-showing-30-years-military-pay-raises/94124/

[phylny]

75. Thank you! By reading the link you provided, I can easily see that the reasons for pay increases

are much more complicated than who is in office.

Do I recall correctly that Obama wanted to give the military a raise, but that the Republican Congress didn't quite agree?

http://www.ifyouonlynews.com/politics/president-obama-raises-pay-for-our-soldiers-republicans-support-our-troops-by-staying-quiet/

www.military.com/daily-news/2016/05/10/bigger-pay-raise-for-troops-hits-opposition-in-senate.html

www.military.com/daily-news/2016/05/10/bigger-pay-raise-for-troops-hits-opposition-in-senate.html

(P.S. I use Duck Duck Go)

[Averagegrunt]

76. I'm not arguing just

Offering up a possible explanation as to why the military may lean to the right. At face value the president is the easiest to blame. Every time. When it comes to military affairs things seem to get convoluted. I've only served under the Obama administration so what life was like under a republican is all told to me second hand.

[phylny]

77. No problem :) n/t

[Ligyron]

68. I should have said that career soldiers were more likely to be Republican.

Some shorter term EM can definitely be liberal. I know my friends and I were but I'd bet many of them are now Fox-bots.

[Averagegrunt]

74. I think

Maybe it depends on your MOS? I don't know but I do know most in my career field don't really care what anyone else really believes politically, some crazy good conversations though.

[randr]

11. The lsos is the greatest freeloader of all time

Losing money on a casino, that takes some kinda lazy

[beachbum bob]

12. its been drummed into their tiny brains for decades and always in reference to the lazy "minorities"

and why racism and conservatism runs hand in hand

[smirkymonkey]

14. Yes, and those "freeloaders" are the corporations and the rich.

It amazes me how stupid and ill informed these people are.

[roamer65]

15. I get sick of those RW shitbags who draw SSDI and SS retirement benefits on my nickel...

and yet bitch there are "freeloaders". It is EXTREMELY hypocritical. When I hear their BS, I wish I had the power to cut off their benefits for a month or two.

[dalton99a]

20. +1

[Blue_true]

30. People pay into SS Retirement.

If that is why they say they deserve it, then I agree. But I also know that some did not pay in as much as they are getting back from the system.

[roamer65]

41. On the average, it takes a person about a year or two to draw out what they paid into it.

After that they are the responsibility of the current taxpayers.

[ProfessorGAC]

57. Really?

That seems low. I haven't researched it, so you may be spot on. But a year or two sounds awfully low. My numbers come up to around $190k from me, (not counting employer half) and i'm looking at $27k per year at age 65. (I'm 60 right now.) That's more like 7 years.

[exboyfil]

60. That is how social insurance works

and that fact probably only applies to the lowest earners (if even then).

Also you have to adjust contributions by the long term Treasury yield on bonds (the investment vehicle for SS). Those contributions over the years have allowed the SS Trust Fund to grow to nearly $3T.

The workers making $70K to $127K (current year) or its equivalent are what keeps SS afloat. They do more than their share (especially families with two earners making $118.5K). You got to think those folks would be telling the high earners to grab a shovel and help out (lift the cap).

SS is a means tested program in a sense. Here is the formula for calculating benefits.

The highest 35 years salary adjusted for inflation is averaged. Using the 2016 table

The first worker at annual earnings of $10,620.

At 65 (or 67) under SS this individual would get $9558/yr. This individual would have paid $24,161 into the system. His employer would have paid $24,161. How the employer contribution would have been split in an open market for the labor is another question. Some of that $24,161 would have definitely come from the employee's share.

Payback after 2.5 years. Note there is a minimum floor on payment even without contribution of $8,830/yr through SSI. The fact that the couples amount is lower than 2X this is an abomination.

Another earner at $64,032.


At 65 (or 67) under SS this individual would get $26,650/yr after paying in $145,673 over 35 years.
Payback after 5.5 years.

A final earner at $118,500

At 65 (or 67) under SS this individual would get $34,820 after paying in $269,588. Payback after 7.7 years.

Here is a link on how to calculate benefits. There are three levels at 90%, 32%, 15%. This is why I propose a fourth level of 5% for all income over the $118,500. You still get something for those contributions to the system, but between the smaller percentage and the tax code on benefits over a certain amount of income - a good chunk of the lifted cap amount goes to the system.


https://www.ssa.gov/pubs/EN-05-10070.pdf

[Blue_true]

70. At this point, it will take me more than a decade to draw out what I am putting

in.

[fleabiscuit]

79. Don't forget medical coverage you'll be eligible for also.

A few years old but still good for comparison, from POLITIFACT.

Medicare and Social Security: What you paid compared with what you get
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2013/feb/01/medicare-and-social-security-what-you-paid-what-yo/

[Blue_true]

80. Good point. I forgot that. nt

[Skidmore]

16. These are the same people who refuse to recognize

that lower income people regularly pay payroll taxes, sale tax, use taxes, etc .

[ThoughtCriminal]

18. Several times on Facebook I've seen this ridiculous claim...

That the Government spends "$900 BILLION on illegal aliens PER YEAR"

It should take less than a second to realize that this figure is impossible and almost an order of magnitude higher than even the most extreme and biased estimates. It might as well have read a gazillion-kajillion dollars and been closer to being accurate.

But sure enough, Republicans readily accept this as a real statistic and are outraged. And needless to say, pointing this out and pointing them to any kind of reality based statistics is futile. It confirms their ideology, so to them it has to true.

[lpbk2713]

19. They want death panels in every community.

That's what makes rethugs rethugs. They want their piece of the pie and yours too.


A CEO, a rethug, and a Union worker are all sitting at a table when a plate with
a dozen freshly baked cookies arrives. Before anyone else can make a move, the CEO
reaches out to rake in eleven of the cookies. When his other two companions look at
him in speechless surprise, the CEO locks eyes with the rethug. “You'd better watch
that guy,” the executive grumbles with a scornful nod toward the Union worker. “He
wants a piece of your cookie.”

[Sculpin Beauregard]

21. Great analogy!

[Mariana]

22. They also tend to vastly overestimate how much they pay

in taxes, particularly federal income tax. A quick look at their 1040's would put that idea to rest, but most of them won't take the time.

[Blue_true]

32. Even some people on DU accept the stated claim that Trump

Supporters had higher income than Hillary supporters, EVEN knowing that people that support republicans lie about many things, in particular their wealth and influence and study after study that showed people that tend to vote blue often having better education and better paying jobs.

[Mariana]

40. Income level doesn't seem to matter.

Low and middle income Republicans whine about their high income taxes just as much as high income Republicans, even when they're paying very little or nothing. I don't think they're lying, they honestly believe it.

[Jim Beard]

45. The majority of what you said is true but there was a large percentage of Trump

voters who have union jobs and voted for Trump will make $75,000 a year. They make more that some of us believed.

[KingCharlemagne]

24. They can NEVER offer a single SPECIFIC EXAMPLE that can

be independently verified. So its really just their prejudice masquerading as opinion.

[Zorro]

25. I think many of them may have a family member who is a "freeloader"

and that's what drives that attitude. It may not be strictly race-based.

[Mariana]

44. I always say

"You personally know people who are cheating the system? You know it for a fact? Report their asses, then. Hold on while I look up the number, you can use my phone."

That's when it becomes clear they are full of shit.

[yardwork]

54. In my experience, the white family freeloader is overlooked.

All the rage and resentment is directed at mythical "other people" while the bigots ignore the problems in their own family.

This is a bigger issue than ever. The opioid epidemic sweeping the country affects a disproportionate number of poor whites. Entire communities in the Midwest are sinking. Propaganda encouraged all those people to vote for Trump because he promised to get rid of Obamacare.

How irrational is that.

[Blue_true]

26. Yet, "blue" areas contribute more to federal tax revenue.

We need to aggressively attack the bull crap they spread with facts that are not drowned out by flowery wording and charts that they don't have the capacity to understand.

[oasis]

27. Voters from Dumbfuckistan need to put their taxes towards "book learnin'".

:

[Dem2]

29. A hundred percent accurate

And these same people, they break about buying equipment for their businesses, then use it, then return it to Home Depot and think it's all good. Obviously a single example - there are so many things that they do that shows that are ridiculously hypocritical.

[nikibatts]

31. If they understood the "freeloaders" RW corporations and CEO they would be correct.

[pampango]

33. In Ireland now, other European countries in the past. People have enough to be middle class but

don't have the fear that too many of us live with. Fear of losing a job, sickness or injury that could devastate one's life without a safety net to protect you.

Of course everyone, particularly the rich, pay more in taxes, with some inevitable grumbling no doubt, but the "republican" fear of 'freeloaders' is overwhelmed by a "Democratic" desire to protect everyone.

[GeorgeGist]

34. But yet the still voted for Trump.

[mitch96]

35. A culture of Old White male victimization

"see what these people have done to poor old me?"
I have too many conservative friends who sing this song a lot. I've known these people since I was a kid so we have a lot of history. If I met them today I would not give them the time of day. One of them, who has more money than god, wanted to get a disability because his ship carried agent orange. He never was near the stuff.. No symptoms, but he tried anyway and failed.. Talk about a Freeloader!!! grrrrrrrrrr And yes we gave him shit about it..
m

[Voltaire2]

36. And by "freeloaders" they mean non white people.

[JI7]

37. And we know who they mean by "freeloaders"

[Bengus81]

39. I've paid a higher % rate than GE and Verizon COMBINED over the last 15 years....

All that bullshit crying about how Corporate Murika is taxed to death. My ass they are...............

"In fact, over the past 15 years, Verizon has paid a federal tax rate averaging just 12.4 percent on $121 billion in U.S. profits, meaning that the company has found a way to shelter about two-thirds of its U.S. profits from federal taxes over this period. In five of the last 15 years, the company paid zero in federal taxes."

http://www.taxjusticeblog.org/archive/2016/04/just_plain_wrong_ge_and_verizo.php#.WQ-Sjca1uUk

[SharonAnn]

63. Me too. i point that out to my friends every time the "over taxing" issue comes up.

I say "We must all be doing OK because we each paid more in taxes than GE did."

[BainsBane]

42. Black and brown freeloaders

Race is central to that idea. They prefer to see the programs that benefit them gutted than see them benefit people of color.

[GoCubsGo]

43. The are right, but the don't understand who are the real freeloaders.

They don't understand that the real freeloaders are the wealthy and corporations, who are getting all sorts of tax breaks. Many, like their hero, Don the Con, don't pay any taxes at all in most years.

[LastLiberal in PalmSprings]

46. Federal flood insurance allows Republicans to live on the beach with premiums

that are subsidized by the U.S. taxpayer. I believe my taxes are high to support their lifestyle. If they want to live near the ocean, let them bear the entire risk of a hurricane.

[lostnfound]

47. I agree. But part of problem is that working two jobs not enough to get ahead anymore

Used to be if you kept a job you could survive and if you worked a second (part time) job you could get ahead.
Many motivated blue collar people who do this now are still just scraping by. Instead of feeling content and generous, instead of feeling that they are getting ahead, they resent people who either aren't working or not working as hard.

I met a trump supporter on a plane recently who works 80 hour weeks as skilled labor. He grew up on a farm, sounded like he works hard as hell. Hard for them to relate to people not working, hard for them to understand that it's the screwed up economy hurting them.

[yardwork]

55. The Republicans he keeps voting for created this situation.

I don't want this system. The Democrats don't want this system. The Republicans created it.

[VOX]

48. When RWers ask, "Why should I pay for someone else's health care?" you know...

That the "someone else" in that rhetorical query is a person of color.

[Xolodno]

49. And the funny thing is...how the GOP, RW Media, etc. portrays it....

They get ONE freeloader and whore him/her out as to how they are abusing the system. Then imply "many others" are doing the same. And for fuck's sake, there is a chance they paid the person to say the bullshit via around the "loop"....

...and of course, they bite it hook, line and sinker.

Stalin was right. Going to revise his statement; "One person abusing the system is an outrage, thousands is a statistic".

[maxrandb]

50. Gee Media!

I wonder where in the fuck they get that idea

[sharedvalues]

51. Because Fox and conserva-hate radio say this.

[sharedvalues]

53. ...because GOP PR like Luntz tell Fox/radio to say it

Because Luntz and his GOP strategist brethren test which lies work and then give them to Limbaugh and Fox.

[yardwork]

52. That's their main, foundational belief.

Decades of propaganda have convinced at least half the country that "other people" are taking what's theirs. These "other people" are lazy, shiftless, criminal, illegal, etc.

The really infuriating part is that the Republicans are the thieves. The red states are subsidized by blue states. Most immigrants work harder than anybody else.

Trump is a typical Republican. Born to wealth and privilege, spent his entire life cheating everybody else, but he is praised and looked up to simply because he's a rich white male.

[Freddie]

56. "Unlike you liberals I work for a living"

AND I DON'T??? I see that one all the time and it infuriates me more than any other RWNJ meme. That was Romney's insinuation with the 47% and it got enough people pissed off. Shame Dolt 45 couldn't say anything quite that offensive to working people.

[VOX]

66. Gets my hackles up, too. RWers have a cartoon view of the world.

With their specialized, spoon-fed crap-media, they must think all liberals are dirty heathens who sit around all day drawing flies, just counting our welfare checks with our black and brown friends (all of whom are allergic to work, of course). We smoke cannabis hourly, and while "hopped up on dope," the flag-burning parties begin. Soon, the feminist/LBTQ/Muslim vanpools will arrive and then things will *really* be hopping.

[Blue_Tires]

59. But that's nothing new... That mindset has been around at least as long as I've been living...

[Initech]

61. The real freeloaders are their employers.

They get billions upon billions in free, untaxed income in the form of government subsidies, and that's in addition to the billions they rake in quarterly. The Trumpers don't realize this.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

62. I live among wingnuts. This is 100% true. It is their main thrust - they care zero about

the less fortunate because they think they are all bilking the system

P.S. My sister was an analyst for CT welfare and she said that the percentage
of fraud/bilkers is extremely low.

[Zing Zing Zingbah]

64. Freeloaders like children, the sick and the elderly n/t

[DiverDave]

65. Whenever I hear anyone say this I

Point out that the richest corporations in the history of the world get about 12 times
more tax money then hungry people.
I got more then one to tell me that "I don't have a problem with that "
You can't talk to these people.

[Thrill]

69. Well now their taxes will take care of millionaires

[NickB79]

71. Sounds like my rich uncles on their mega-farms

Bitching every Xmas about the "welfare queens, wetbacks and niggers" who their hard-earned tax dollars go to support.

All the while taking in hundreds of thousands in government crop subsidies, buying new trucks and tractors, building new houses, etc.

But don't you DARE call that money welfare! It's COMPLETELY different when the government gives them money, you see.

[jack69]

72. When in fact, most farmers could not survive without gvt help with farming, sales, etc.

They are the true freeloaders as well as most corporate entities.

[avebury]

78. And Trump and his family are the biggest freeloaders

in this country.

[AgadorSparticus]

81. You mean the corporate freeloaders? OH yeaaa, THEM!