General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsOn MSNBC just now,Mike Rowe and Chuck Todd blamed unemployment on people not being willing to travel
to look for work.
As if you can travel to find work when you DON'T FREAKING HAVE ANY MONEY.
orangecrush
(19,546 posts)ornotna
(10,800 posts)I'm looking forward to living in a Hooverville.
orangecrush
(19,546 posts)We call them "tent cities."
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)Those new enclosed boxcars and oil tankers can be a problem though. I guess I need to practice hanging on while slobbering like a Saint Bernard. It all should make interviews go smashingly well. Now, I wake up.
orangecrush
(19,546 posts)So I guess I just walk the tracks and starve until my teeth fall out and I drop dead.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)orangecrush
(19,546 posts)dembotoz
(16,802 posts)orangecrush
(19,546 posts)Not a manual.
Phoenix61
(17,003 posts)Where are they supposed to live without a job? What are their children supposed to do? They'll bring people here from overseas to work and give them a place to live but won't do that for US citizens. Argh!
LeftyMom
(49,212 posts)I used to manage rentals and the property owner would have flayed me alive if I rented a place to somebody who wasn't securely employed locally.
johnsonsnap
(56 posts)like they usually do. Of course, we have a lot of open positions and not enough applicants, so I hate myself for sorta agreeing with them.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)You can't just walk across the country seeking jobs.
You have to be able to acquire food and places to sleep while you travel, and you need a train, bus, or plane ticket or a functional car.
It's insulting and out-of-touch for these guys to act like people just aren't trying hard enough to get work.
haveahart
(905 posts)some jobs.
Also, what happened to corporations paying relocation expenses for certain specialty jobs? The government does this all the time or they used to do it for EU immigrants coming into the country to work in biomedical research. It seems to me that infrastructure is fast becoming a specialty job especially for solid waste disposal, building, healthcare.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)I'm glad HRC's plan included this.
Adrahil
(13,340 posts)rather than being like Cnut and trying to order the tide not to come in.
Good paying blue-collar manufacturing jobs will not be coming back in the long term.
Lochloosa
(16,063 posts)johnsonsnap
(56 posts)I know many companies don't offer that, but mine does.
Adrahil
(13,340 posts)Anyone we hire can qualify for a relocation bonus and can take a zero interest loan up to 1/4 first year salary for relocation expenses. That's from the most junior apprentice wireman to the most qualified engineer.
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)that there is more to your story...and I don't 'agree ' with them.
Caliman73
(11,736 posts)They are saying that people aren't willing to uproot themselves and their families to look for jobs. That is a backdoor way of saying that people are willing to do what it takes to work. It is easy to criticize when you have stable employment and are just looking for a different job than what you have.
Stargazer99
(2,585 posts)they don't think beyond that...they have not experienced it....good reason why they should not be in charge of our political system
jodymarie aimee
(3,975 posts)each time I turned over to it...wait until Rachel and Lawrence for any decent coverage. Deny them the ratings in the daytime.
TexasTowelie
(112,157 posts)I was expecting another episode of their prison shows.
jodymarie aimee
(3,975 posts)tune in !!!
lostnfound
(16,177 posts)stopbush
(24,396 posts)First of all, if you're looking for a McJob, they are available everywhere at the same shit wages. No need to travel.
If you're looking for an upper management job, most are listed on job boards or are handled by recruiters. No need to travel until you've made it past the first couple of rounds of the interview process. Many early-in-the-process interviews are done via Skype these days.
Middle management jobs? You might find something on a job board, but most of the time you need to know the hiring agent. The majority of these jobs are already pegged as promotions for internal candidates. HR only sees outside candidates to fulfill EOE rules. No need to travel to play the patsy who allows HR to check their EOE box at your expense.
JDC
(10,127 posts)I didn't see the show, but I ve seen his push to get Americans to do more Blue Collar jobs before.
haele
(12,650 posts)Mostly because of the decline in unions that protect skilled labor and trades.
Also, even Plumbers and HVAC workers are feeling the affects of improved technology and "higher production" measures; where once two workers might be sent out because there was welding or electrical work, I've noticed that only one tends to go out now.
Haele
lunasun
(21,646 posts)once I got there, that they had no interest in interviewing me and I was a needed token for a big corporation. They pretty much said it but sly enough not to be used as discrimination and I left feeling used
The problem was it was not through a recruiter.
I found the opening on my own through a career fair I attended and it was about 2 hrs travel to another city
So I was young and learned my lesson of how recruiters cut through corporate bullshit enough to get commission placing workers for real openings and not by playing the corporation games and why I needed an agent of sorts for placement.
democratisphere
(17,235 posts)Millionaires and Billionaires running the show don't even begin to understand the struggles of the masses.
Xipe Totec
(43,890 posts)WhiskeyGrinder
(22,329 posts)Lanius
(599 posts)Wellstone ruled
(34,661 posts)Guy. Multi-Millionaire Reality TV Star. Hummmmm,who else do we know that fills this same picture.
Dipstick Donnie and Family is just a hint.
Lotusflower70
(3,077 posts)The stupidity of some. If a person has no money to travel, it makes it difficult to do so.
a kennedy
(29,655 posts)THEY HAVE NO MONEY TO MOVE. It's that simple.....ugh.......
kacekwl
(7,016 posts)to get to work let alone get to another state to maybe find a job.
tymorial
(3,433 posts)Such as here in the Boston area where corporations are relocating due to tax advantage. Yet the cost of living is extremely high and the housing market is extremely competitive and prohibitively expensive do to availability and location. The average house in Massachusetts goes for roughly 340k. In the Boston area that would be a small home or something with problems.
My wife was just promoted at her employer and she is doing very well now. It would make no sense for her to move but we want to buy a house. Though we make a decent living we have never been in the market, we rent. With a baby in the cost-of-living the way it is it is difficult for us to save the amount of money to afford a downpayment on a nice home or even a home like I cited above. As a result we are looking in northern Rhode Island because the housing is far more reasonable even though it means a long commute.
If I was working for GE Healthcare for example I'm not sure I would want to relocate to Boston when the move takes place.
To put it into perspective,. We rent a raised ranch. My wife has lived here for almost 17 years with roommates until I moved in. This is a nice home but it needs a lot of work. It is your average raised range with a garage. 3 bedrooms 2 bath. This house would easily sell for 700k. It is preposterous thankfully the landlord has never raised our rent so it's not cost prohibitive. If we moved to another rental we would downsize. We fee very much stuck.
underpants
(182,788 posts)I get his point, there are plenty of jobs in South Dakota. Pick up and move there and the wire money back to your house.
kstewart33
(6,551 posts)There are jobs but the problem is that many if not most of them are not in small rural communities. So many of those communities are dying. I saw them in rural Alabama, Mississippi, and now in western Colorado. Very small communities.
But these communities are their residents' lives. The residents are very close knit, and support each other. If your mom is sick, people bring dinners until she is well. There is a sense of security and community there that you do not find in larger towns and cities.
So people are afraid to leave and for good reason. But if they are unemployed, leaving is the only way they will find work. And there is work if they will go and look for it. And that will not change.
So they must assume some responsibility for their predicament.
DBoon
(22,363 posts)People with modest means rely on social networks to hep them get by
Moving for a new job means shredding those networks. Someone with the means to buy everything they have does not have this problem.
The commentators come from a class where moving across country is just a tax deductible investment. They don't depend on family, friends and neighbors to help out.
kstewart33
(6,551 posts)Leaving their towns exacts a tremendous price.
Ultimately, it comes to a making choice. Make $$$ by leaving your home and cherished community, or staying and living with the significant costs that come with an inadequate income.
Terrible options, but the facts. I wish there were better options but doubt that there will be.
CozyMystery
(652 posts)kstewart33
(6,551 posts)But it's also true that in many of those cases, looking for work beyond their community is still possible. Very, very difficult but possible.
meadowlander
(4,395 posts)for the lack of a social support network in the new area.
If you have kids and live in the neighbourhood where you grew up with family and friends you potentially have a pool of free rent (crash with relatives for a while), free babysitting from the grandparents, free transport carpooling with people you know, free secondhand shit when your richer relatives upgrade their TVs, cars, clothes, etc., free food at family dinners.
If you take a minimum wage job too far away from that social support network you have to pay for your own babysitting (which costs more than your salary), if you can't pay rent, you're out on the street, you have to pay for transport and miss out on freebies and communal meals.
Lee-Lee
(6,324 posts)My first "real" job out of college. Got an offer but had to start in 4 days. At the time my mom was battling cancer and my dad has his hands full with caring for her and the expenses so I didn't want to ask them so I told them I had a place to stay.
I stayed in a state park campground 2 weeks until I maxed out the time allowed, then paid to rent camp at a campground. Ate breakfast at the Waffle House, lunch I made in the break room, I made dinner in the break room or cooked on a camp stove.
It was October into November so getting cold, but I made it. Got two paychecks in and combined with what savings I had moved into my first solo apartment.
ChubbyStar
(3,191 posts)Cool story!!!
Demit
(11,238 posts)Blue_true
(31,261 posts)Lee-Lee
(6,324 posts)Last edited Tue Sep 5, 2017, 08:57 AM - Edit history (1)
She got a chance at a great job that would pay well over what she made, but had to start ASAP. The new job was about 300 miles away but would pay $40,000 vs her current job that was just under $30,000.
It was a few weeks before the end of the school year, so she went and had family friends watch the kids. I watched them for a week and her sister did 2 weeks. Then she got the kids and they packed everything and took it there into storage and they tent camped another 2-3 weeks as a family. Talking to her she said while it would have been a pain she would have moved the kids right away had it been necessary, the schools there were on a one week shorter schedule so it would have just meant about 10 days in the new one.
She snagged a great house to rent in the meantime and they got in it and a few years later she actually bought the home from her landlord. Still works for that agency and I bet with her promotions is pushing $55,000+ a year now.
No, not everybody can do it. But is more doable and feasible than most people think. You can make excuses and not try or you can rush forward and just get it done. For more people than you realize it is probably doable. A lot of people I went to school with told me "just forget about it no job is worth that" when I told them my plan, or said there was no way they would do what I did. They all were every bit as capable of it as me, they just didn't want to.
If moving means finding better employment and a better prospect for the future people should do everything they can to make that work, and we should be trying to find every way to help them instead of making every excuse for them.
I'm not saying every can, or should move to get a better job. What I am saying is that there are a lot of people who could do it who are unwilling to for whatever reason. You may hate him or what he has to say, but what he said is a valid statement for a lot of people. Not everyone can, for sure, but not everyone has a valid reason to not move when opportunity presents itself either.
I know I guy who 3 years ago saved up his money, bought an older camper trailer for about $1800, spent about $1200 more fixing it up, adding solar panels, etc. Once it was done he hooked to his truck and took off for oilfield work in SD leaving his family in NC. He works 60-80 hours a week, flys home to see his family every other month. But he is making well over $100,000 a year where he was making $35,000 doing the same work here as a heavy truck mechanic. His wife told me that in another 6 months they will have the home and land they own fully paid off, a shop building for him on the property and he will be back and will be running his own shop back here, with the home paid and a comfortable amount in savings he will be able to work 4 days a week doing fleet maintenance and they will be very comfortable.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)The point is, in a land with THIS much massive wealth, no one should have to go through all that just to work.
Parents with small kids or people who have to take care of sick or elderly relatives can't be expected to subject themselves and their family to what you went through.
Those on top shouldn't be putting those with nothing through that kind of experience. Re-employment after the system puts you out of work should not be punishment for being out of work.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)I was a degreed engineer so my starting salary was decent. The mover moved just one box for me. The company that I worked for was decent, I stayed in a hotel it paid for for a month until I found a one bedroom apartment. I slept on the floor until I had enough to buy furniture, I was hired in May and had saved enough by October to have furniture and look for a used car.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)Creative, though irrelevant anecdotal data which supports no particular premise as it cowers coyly behind the Horatio Alger myth.
theaocp
(4,236 posts)Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)tblue37
(65,340 posts)w job, you have to come up with significant deposits for rent and utilities. People without jobs, or with jobs that pay poorly, won't have the large sums necessary to cover all those expenses.
lunasun
(21,646 posts)did this with a wife and child put down the deposit , signed a lease , moved in and went in the first day of a 12- 18 month estimated contract job in another city and was told he wouldn't be needed past the week as the the project was off, and yes since it was short notice, they paid him for a few weeks, maybe a month of pay but all of it went to coming to and leaving a town he did not have a job in as it turned out.
raccoon
(31,110 posts)Ilsa
(61,695 posts)easy and cheap as filling out a voter registration card or your NCAA Basketball tournament bracket.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)Sensationalist headline much?
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)They clearly said that most people could get jobs if only they traveled to where the jobs supposedly were. Mike Rowe followed that up with a deeply insulting remark about how "sedentary" this country has become.
And the problem is, if you are having to travel and keep travelling just to get any work, you effectively lose the right to vote(and therefore any real say in anything) and end up living large chunks of your life as a rootless, powerless internal economic migrant-essentially as a bracero in your own country.
What kind of life can THAT be?
Why should anyone have to roam for days or weeks or in some cases months just to find low-paid work with no job security, no benefits, no chance for advancement?
Don't all of us deserve a little more than that?
Shouldn't there be some dignity to it all?
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)lunasun
(21,646 posts)I dunno but I think a read an older version of what they propose
It was called the Grapes Of Wrath
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)n/t.
WhiskeyGrinder
(22,329 posts)Is that what these jobs are?
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)If people like Chuck and Mike get their way, there won't be pensions or Medicare or Medicaid anymore and we'll all basically have to go back to life in the 19th Century-working until we die while taking care of our aged parents in their homes 'til THEY die.
No happiness. No hope. Nothing to live for.
The only consolation some of us will have is that those were the conditions that created the labor movement and the Left in the first place. Once again, people will have nothing to lose but their chains.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)IS FACT??
Rowe runs a Foundation promoting skills training. Now, I respect the trades, but it kills me when a rich guy doesn't think college is for everyone.
The nation is run by the Ivy League, so who's kidding whom?
Demit
(11,238 posts)Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)...and in too many cases, a college education is the difference between the chance to do what you truly want to do with your life or drudgery-unto-death.
We need to bring all the drawbridges back down again.
lunasun
(21,646 posts)force workers to college
and btw many local community colleges offer trade skill classes BUT to those with paid tuition
He didn't get that when he called Sanders a knucklehead for talking about opening up college to more people who wanted access
https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=9553537
EllieBC
(3,014 posts)BA degrees unless that BA is in business accounting or is a BS in nursing and sciences.
On top of this not everyone wants to go to college. My husband would rather eat a bag of broken glass and wash it down with Drano than take classes he finds absolutely dull (which would be anything in English Lit, History, Humanities, etc.). This is why he trained as a mechanic.
There's a stinky elitism on the left and right that still assumes the poor blue collar worker really is a lesser being for not going to college or that she or he secretly desire to do so.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)Arts, perhaps. Do I think we need more "hedge-fund managers" than we do electricians? No.
Different Drummer
(7,614 posts)Last edited Tue Sep 5, 2017, 10:05 AM - Edit history (1)
He is a righty. Oh...I forgot...Andy Lack...
Sailor65x1
(554 posts)A rightie or a leftie.
NotASurfer
(2,149 posts)In my day, we didn't have two nickels to run together. So we hopped boxcars when we wanted to travel...
Sure, sometimes we slipped, and fell, and got gravel embedded in our derrières. And sometimes if we fell too close to the tracks - WHAM! there went your arm. But it didn't cost a penny!
And sure, the railroads hired goons to keep you off the train, and if they caught you they'd bust your skull, knock your teeth out, and throw you out while the train was rolling.
So, yeah, we were a bunch of toothless, concussion-addled idiots, with gravel lodged in our derrières, missing limbs and screaming in terror while railroad goons threw us off moving trains - AND WE LOVED IT! Couldn't get enough!
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)lunasun
(21,646 posts)like in grumpy old man's day of open yards.
Really though I assume they envision what you posted as possible nowadays and people should get off thier butt and just aimlessly go out seeking work.
neeksgeek
(1,214 posts)Explaining my income situation, trying to get a forbearance.
"Why don't you get another job?"
Gee. Never thought of that.
"Why don't you relocate?"
Sure! I'll just borrow money from my rich parents.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)That makes perfect sense in a Chuck Todd world, where a lucky few, including Chuck Todd, are rewarded far beyond what is necessary or logical.
snooper2
(30,151 posts)Got via LinkedIn just the other day...
https://www.linkedin.com/jobs/search/
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)I believe that Texas also has the largest number of minimum wage workers.
lunasun
(21,646 posts)a small business to create thier own job either . Yep Romney pointed out that solution and couldn't understand why people unemployed weren't doing that .
Thomas Hurt
(13,903 posts)who took jobs away from home. Both of these men were lucky enough that they could afford to travel not only to find work but to actually go to work.
I worked with one and and the other was a long time friend. They both lived in RVs and drove home on weekends two or three hours so they could see their wives and kids on the weekends.
The have both moved on to new jobs since, but this was a multi year gig in two different states.
Somehow I think that is not as rare as we might think.
I have also heard of traveling pharmacists and contract nurses who travel for temp gigs or move from town to town every few years to different gigs.
lunasun
(21,646 posts)Of course you can't just ' go to pharmacy school'.
Prospective pharmacy school students must first complete 2-3 years of college level pre-pharmacy studies in math and science. That's not coming free either
Competition for admission is tough, so about half of the applicants already have a bachelor's degree or higher.
I guess then you could be a traveling pharmacist
Thomas Hurt
(13,903 posts)beachbum bob
(10,437 posts)who have no job, no money and doubly worse when non-white....
benld74
(9,904 posts)Hell he needed a freaking show to find him work
trc
(823 posts)at the point where Mike said Texas would have a hard time rebuilding because of low skilled labor. This was a dead on assessment. Texas is a right to work state and as such has little to no regulation on who can do what in the construction bidness. He suggested it would take more skilled labor from out of state to help get the rebuilding process completed. I live in Texas and work as a residential remodeling contractor...skilled labor is in short supply, cheap labor is not.
Sailor65x1
(554 posts)To the things he has said over the years, and to the work his foundation does, you'd see that he espouses paid relocation, not travel. One of his biggest areas of focus has been that companies are prepared to pay to relocate skilled labor (A very true claim) He doesn't advocate forcing people to travel on their own dime.
SharonClark
(10,014 posts)He and Todd bemoaned that people are not willing to move to where the jobs are.
When people do move (at great expense and often family separation) to where the jobs are, those jobs often disappear.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)He made it sound like anybody out of work could find work if only they'd just "hit the road" or hop a freight train or something.
lostnfound
(16,177 posts)There are downsides.
But at least in my case it was financially beneficial.
Adrahil
(13,340 posts)It's that good-paying blue collar jobs are drying up. Automation is largely going to eliminate the need unskilled and semi-skilled blue collar workers. That is a reality that no protectionist trade policy can change, and we aren't going to legislate it away either.
Skilled tradespeople will still be needed, however. TBH, I'm not sure what the long-term answer is. It's not pretty 50 year down the road....
TeamPooka
(24,223 posts)HAB911
(8,890 posts)Now there is an expert to voice his opinion, like when he supported Romney
HughBeaumont
(24,461 posts)bluedigger
(17,086 posts)Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)interviews and usually is flown out on the company's dime...but for lesser paying jobs that is unfair...Todd is so privileged.