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packman

(16,296 posts)
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 12:59 PM Sep 2017

Eat those eggs - 2 to 3 per day are now recommended



Eggs were demonized in the past due to their high cholesterol levels. Many doctors suggested that eating eggs is bad due to the cholesterol and may harm your health, but this was a common misconception which has been blown out of proportion. Eggs are one of the few ideal foods for our health – they contain protein, vitamins, minerals and antioxidants and can be used in different ways.

Nowadays, doctors suggest eating 2-3 eggs every day in order to boost your health.

And:

1. Reduce the risk of cancer

2.Reduce the risk of cardiovascular diseases

3.Improve your eyesight

4.Protect the brain

5.Slow down the aging process

6.Reduce the risk of birth defects

7.Support the liver, skin and hair

8.Help you lose weight

9.Keep the bones healthy

But then the article states at the very end:

This is why experts recommend eating 2-3 eggs a day, except in the cases of diabetes or heart problems, when you should eat only 3 eggs a week.

More info at:

http://energyhealthyfood.com/2017/09/12/heres-happens-body-eat-two-eggs-day-never-believed-no-3-awesome/

97 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Eat those eggs - 2 to 3 per day are now recommended (Original Post) packman Sep 2017 OP
I keep chickens. MissB Sep 2017 #1
Same here. cwydro Sep 2017 #12
So Jealous! MurderMittenLiberal Sep 2017 #51
I keep chickens too - but all eggs are not the same womanofthehills Sep 2017 #90
I like eggs. I never did pay any attention to that. MineralMan Sep 2017 #2
MMan, do you eat eggs every morning? kstewart33 Sep 2017 #6
Pretty much, yes. MineralMan Sep 2017 #8
Moderation kills Binkie The Clown Sep 2017 #17
LATELY CatWoman Sep 2017 #31
Check out the egg recipes in this thread! csziggy Sep 2017 #96
Good. KatyMan Sep 2017 #3
There is nothing that is good or bad for an anonymous someone Not Ruth Sep 2017 #4
That is the most sensible and I think correct defacto7 Sep 2017 #63
this is why I never pay attention to what is bad, what is good. eggs, coffee, butter, chocolate niyad Sep 2017 #5
I stay away from grease, fat, sugar that you can see (frosted stuff), and sugary drinks. Iggo Sep 2017 #9
They still say whiskey is bad for you Major Nikon Sep 2017 #34
Two thirds of an egg or two-out-of-three eggs? Iggo Sep 2017 #7
Oh, I hate it when someone points out my mistakes packman Sep 2017 #10
I'm just bein' a dick. Iggo Sep 2017 #11
As a TBI survivor I cannot agree enough Tursiops Sep 2017 #13
Eggs are great and nutritious, but this article is really bad. trotsky Sep 2017 #14
That is you as an individual Not Ruth Sep 2017 #15
No, it's not me as an individual, because I don't have diabetes. trotsky Sep 2017 #20
Do not believe the hype, they are full of crap Not Ruth Sep 2017 #22
OK, random Internet stranger. n/t trotsky Sep 2017 #23
The meta study you referenced doesn't say what you claim Major Nikon Sep 2017 #36
Wait, so the quote from the study doesn't say what the study says? trotsky Sep 2017 #46
No, your claim doesn't match your referenced study Major Nikon Sep 2017 #47
Should definitely not, out of caution. trotsky Sep 2017 #49
I made no mention of the OP whatsoever Major Nikon Sep 2017 #57
You know madokie Sep 2017 #50
Hear hear! defacto7 Sep 2017 #64
So true madokie Sep 2017 #77
Worldwide, the longest lived populations Binkie The Clown Sep 2017 #16
Personally, I have no desire to live to 100 n/t TexasBushwhacker Sep 2017 #18
Well then... Binkie The Clown Sep 2017 #19
Why on Earth not? Codeine Sep 2017 #52
No one lives forever TexasBushwhacker Sep 2017 #59
I hear that a lot lately, confused by it Iwasthere Sep 2017 #79
Okinawa and some little Greek island. But they probably eat fish. WinkyDink Sep 2017 #21
That means they're going to die from radiation defacto7 Sep 2017 #68
Well, my mom lived to 90. cwydro Sep 2017 #39
And my uncle ate the same way and died at 30. Binkie The Clown Sep 2017 #41
I'm not a vegan. cwydro Sep 2017 #44
It's not luck at all. It's many more factors than can be defacto7 Sep 2017 #67
Not true Major Nikon Sep 2017 #88
Hmmm. Sounds like an anecdote to me. nt Binkie The Clown Sep 2017 #93
True, just as was your demonstrably false assertion Major Nikon Sep 2017 #95
Link to "studies show eating one egg a day is as bad for your longevity as smoking a pack a day? Impeach Trump Sep 2017 #40
Some links for you Binkie The Clown Sep 2017 #42
Seems as if those are all before 2014 and prior to current studies? Impeach Trump Sep 2017 #45
One of the sources claims veganism can cure diabetes, CVD, cancer, high blood pressure, and suicide Major Nikon Sep 2017 #58
Yes, it was an oversight, because it DOES cure erectile dysfunction. Binkie The Clown Sep 2017 #65
We also should be looking at the effect the pirate population has had on global warming Major Nikon Sep 2017 #70
Your insults are persuasive, but I choose to go right on being the ignorant fool than I am. Binkie The Clown Sep 2017 #74
Evidently I'm the dumb one because I fail to see the insult Major Nikon Sep 2017 #82
We all want the same thing,... to be adminred by others for our intellect, or Binkie The Clown Sep 2017 #84
Perhaps, but it looks more like passive aggressive patronizing Major Nikon Sep 2017 #85
. Impeach Trump Sep 2017 #86
Some of this is kinda funny Major Nikon Sep 2017 #55
There's also a shitton of other differences Major Nikon Sep 2017 #48
People from regions where they work hard all day and eat a largely vegetarian diet Binkie The Clown Sep 2017 #62
Fad diet salesman Major Nikon Sep 2017 #69
Clearly you already know everything, so by all means, go right on believing what you believe. Binkie The Clown Sep 2017 #75
I'm pretty sure I told you to do whatever works for you Major Nikon Sep 2017 #83
Like the Germans and the French? defacto7 Sep 2017 #66
Eggsactly what is going on here? Historic NY Sep 2017 #24
All I have to say, in the 20 years since I've cut back on eggs Blindingly apparent Sep 2017 #25
Since I started eating more eggs, I found I was getting older at the exact same rate Major Nikon Sep 2017 #37
Pure science underpants Sep 2017 #26
I don't know about the benefits - Ms. Toad Sep 2017 #27
the brain needs cholesterol and KT2000 Sep 2017 #28
Correct.... physioex Sep 2017 #30
True, but your body can synthesize cholesterol so you don't need it from external sources Major Nikon Sep 2017 #61
I love soft boiled eggs NastyRiffraff Sep 2017 #29
I have heart problems DFW Sep 2017 #32
The 50's diet: Kingofalldems Sep 2017 #33
Methane. I don't need to spell it out ... ;) OnDoutside Sep 2017 #35
I'd never be able to leave the house if I ate 2-3 eggs a day BannonsLiver Sep 2017 #71
You're not alone ! Well most of the time ! OnDoutside Sep 2017 #80
... Warren DeMontague Sep 2017 #38
I eat about 1 egg per week on average. nt Blue_true Sep 2017 #43
and low carbs to no carbs. I eat them as a big part of Atkins.. samnsara Sep 2017 #53
I have a problem with egg whites. The yolks do not bother me and I love them. appleannie1943 Sep 2017 #54
Are you aware that some vaccines are bred in eggs packman Sep 2017 #56
For some reason flu shots have never bothered me but they made my mom sick. appleannie1943 Sep 2017 #97
I do better with just the yokes too womanofthehills Sep 2017 #91
Three egg mushroom and cheese omelet every morning Bayard Sep 2017 #60
That site is without attribution altogether.. grain of salt time. . . . n/t annabanana Sep 2017 #72
Love eggs. Except for raw or creamed. Buns_of_Fire Sep 2017 #73
I wish they would make-up their minds. democratisphere Sep 2017 #76
As a heart patient I eat 2 eggs a day... Lostnote Sep 2017 #78
It's irresponsible for anyone to encourage others to consume more animal products. jcmaine72 Sep 2017 #81
All farming "exploit[s] helpless animals" for profit Major Nikon Sep 2017 #87
i hate eggs. pansypoo53219 Sep 2017 #89
Sigh...maybe I'll try again Awsi Dooger Sep 2017 #92
And don't throw out the yolk! gollygee Sep 2017 #94

womanofthehills

(8,703 posts)
90. I keep chickens too - but all eggs are not the same
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 07:08 PM
Sep 2017

Commercial animal feed has higher levels of allowable glyphosate than other foods. But testing our food supply for glyphosate seems to have ended only a short time after it started. Anyway, when glyphosate levels in our foods were being tested, eggs and oatmeal had some of the higher levels.

That is why I keep my own chickens and feed them only organic food. I put two raw egg yokes a day in my smoothie. I would never do this with commercial eggs.

MineralMan

(146,288 posts)
2. I like eggs. I never did pay any attention to that.
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 01:03 PM
Sep 2017

I like coffee, too, with my eggs in the morning. Coffee goes from good for you to bad for you on an almost weekly basis. Moderation appears to be the key to all of this. Who knew?

MineralMan

(146,288 posts)
8. Pretty much, yes.
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 01:12 PM
Sep 2017

I eat what it pleases me to eat, but in moderation. That's the only dietary plan I follow, really.

I'm certainly not a nutrition expert, but I think a varied diet that includes a wide variety of foods is probably the best idea.

Binkie The Clown

(7,911 posts)
17. Moderation kills
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 01:57 PM
Sep 2017
http://www.dresselstyn.com/site/study05/

From famed Cleveland Clinic cardiac surgeon Dr. Caldwell B. Esselstyn, Jr, MD

Even if all Americans kept their total cholesterol below 200 mg/dL, as recommended by the American Heart Association, millions would develop coronary artery disease.

Strong evidence from a wide variety of sources shows that total serum cholesterol levels must be kept below 150 mg/dL to stem America’s epidemic of coronary artery disease. My own experience with heart disease patients shows that cholesterol levels can be kept below this threshold with a diet low in lipids and cholesterol-lowering medications as needed. This low-lipid therapy stops coronary disease from progressing and even reverses it.

Unfortunately, our national health and medical organizations continue to recommend a cholesterol threshold of 200 mg/dL and a diet containing up to 30% fat, despite clear evidence that this threshold is too high to prevent or cure heart disease. It is true that these recommendations have the potential to reduce the incidence of heart disease, but only by a moderate amount. Unfortunately, when it comes to lowering cholesterol, moderation kills. With lower lipid levels, coronary artery disease need never exist. When it does exist, it need never progress.

csziggy

(34,136 posts)
96. Check out the egg recipes in this thread!
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 11:42 PM
Sep 2017

Advice on cooking when few people had obesity problems as today and food tasted great! From 1918
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1018987136

A LOT of different ways to fix eggs, many of which I had never heard of before.

KatyMan

(4,190 posts)
3. Good.
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 01:06 PM
Sep 2017

I could have eggs (fried, scrambled, poached whatever)(except hard boiled for some reason) for nearly every meal.
Eggs and toast = awesome

 

Not Ruth

(3,613 posts)
4. There is nothing that is good or bad for an anonymous someone
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 01:09 PM
Sep 2017

You are an individual, and good or bad has to do with your genetics and health, not the general population's thought on the matter.

So do not believe experts who have never met you.

defacto7

(13,485 posts)
63. That is the most sensible and I think correct
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 12:37 PM
Sep 2017

position on the subject of nutrition. Although there are statstics covering averages over a population they are pretty meaningless when it comes to individuality.
Deciding about ones diet is all about seeing your doc and making decisions that work with your own metabolism and your own mind.
My family's diet historically has been about as far from the recommended diet as you can get. My dad ate bacon and eggs with biscuits butter etc. practically every day of his life. He died in his mid 90's totally acive. Same for his dad who died at 96 from falling off the roof of his barn he was re-shingling.
As for me, I eat literally everything in moderation and my salts, collesteral and BP are excellent for a 29 year old. I'm over 60.

niyad

(113,293 posts)
5. this is why I never pay attention to what is bad, what is good. eggs, coffee, butter, chocolate
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 01:10 PM
Sep 2017

all demonized at one point, all rediscovered to have good properties. have never stopped eating any of them.

but I tend to avoid fast food and convenience foods and fake food (non-dairy, etc) and I seem to do just fine.

Iggo

(47,552 posts)
9. I stay away from grease, fat, sugar that you can see (frosted stuff), and sugary drinks.
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 01:14 PM
Sep 2017

As much as possible, anyway.

The old "Eat Right & Exercise" is still the best way to go.

Tursiops

(89 posts)
13. As a TBI survivor I cannot agree enough
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 01:22 PM
Sep 2017

Eggs are the first thing I recommend to newly injured survivors.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
14. Eggs are great and nutritious, but this article is really bad.
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 01:30 PM
Sep 2017

Poor to terrible citations. "According to one study published in the 'Breast Cancer Research' journal", "research conducted at the Biomedical Research Center of Louisiana", "According to one study from Germany", etc. Just awful.

Outright false information and nonsense, too.

Plus a warning: if you are diabetic, should definitely not eat more than one egg a day because of an increased risk of heart disease.

 

Not Ruth

(3,613 posts)
15. That is you as an individual
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 01:40 PM
Sep 2017

I am pre diabetic due to genetics, but my cholesterol is always under 100, at one point it was a very unhealthy 28 and I had to increase it.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
20. No, it's not me as an individual, because I don't have diabetes.
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 02:10 PM
Sep 2017

It's from actual studies of multiple populations.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/heart-health/are-eggs-risky-for-heart-health
"No more than three eggs per week is wise if you have diabetes..."

http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/early/2013/05/15/ajcn.112.051318.full.pdf+html

Conclusion:
This meta-analysis suggests that egg consumption is not associated with the risk of CVD and cardiac mortality in the general population. However, egg consumption may be associated with an increased incidence of type 2 diabetes among the general population and CVD comorbidity among diabetic patients.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
36. The meta study you referenced doesn't say what you claim
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 06:58 PM
Sep 2017

Didn't read your first link because I ain't gonna create an account to read it. The meta study doesn't make your claim and is much more vague, it also studied subjects that had T2D and an already elevated risk of CVD. A later study in the exact same journal contradicts the results for T2D subjects in general.

http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/101/4/705.short

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
46. Wait, so the quote from the study doesn't say what the study says?
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 10:05 AM
Sep 2017

Please explain.

Conclusion:
This meta-analysis suggests that egg consumption is not associated with the risk of CVD and cardiac mortality in the general population. However, egg consumption may be associated with an increased incidence of type 2 diabetes among the general population and CVD comorbidity among diabetic patients.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
47. No, your claim doesn't match your referenced study
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 10:28 AM
Sep 2017
Plus a warning: if you are diabetic, should definitely not eat more than one egg a day because of an increased risk of heart disease.


"may be associated" does not mean "should definitely not eat". That's not what the study implies nor recommends for a variety of reasons, one of which most obviously being correlation does not imply causation. Another is the study didn't examine the effect of lowering egg consumption on CVD comorbidity. Another is the fact that CVD is not the only thing that prematurely kills diabetics. There are a number of positive health benefits to eating eggs. So while reducing egg consumption may (or may not) increase the risk of CVD in diabetics, it could very well increase the risk of premature death from other causes.

What the study you referenced is saying is that there may be a problem and more studies are needed to determine what, if any, recommendations are needed for diabetics. It's also been noted what the limitations were on your referenced analysis, and subsequent studies have been unable to make causation determinations.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
49. Should definitely not, out of caution.
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 10:53 AM
Sep 2017

I'm fine with what I said but if you want to defend the article in that OP that's your business. It's still full of bad info.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
57. I made no mention of the OP whatsoever
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 11:29 AM
Sep 2017

So it seems strange why you'd claim I'm defending it. Seems like a petty tactic.

madokie

(51,076 posts)
50. You know
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 11:00 AM
Sep 2017

I just had my semi annual blood work and guess what? I'm as healthy as anyone alive except for my COPD, PAD, PVD. According to my blood work my Cholesterol and all the kidney functions, liver functions and on and on are spot on but yet I'm disabled due to these three conditions I mentioned. I ask the doctor why that is and he just shrugs and says, well every one is different. Has never been found a polyp, in fact the last person to do the procedure said I had a Beautiful Colon. I worry about that person, LOL,
Not one thing was even close to being out of range, FWTW

I'm serious as a heart attack here with this. 69 YO too

defacto7

(13,485 posts)
64. Hear hear!
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 12:49 PM
Sep 2017

Stats are fun, stats can give an inducation or trend in the people tested... but it does not reflect a whole population and certainly doesn't represent each individual.
It's all between you, your doc and your own mind.

Binkie The Clown

(7,911 posts)
16. Worldwide, the longest lived populations
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 01:54 PM
Sep 2017

are those that eat the least animal products. That's a simple fact. All the rest is industry B.S. trying to promote confusion and uncertainty just like the tobacco industry did. Some day people will become aware of the real science and we'll look back on the days when people still ate meat, dairy and eggs as the dark ages.

Studies show that eating one egg a day is as bad for your longevity as smoking a pack of cigarettes a day.

But, but..l. my doctor says I SHOULD smoke:



Remember the dark ages?

 

Codeine

(25,586 posts)
52. Why on Earth not?
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 11:08 AM
Sep 2017

I want to watch the world change as long as I can. The future will have wonders to behold, and I want to see as many as possible.

TexasBushwhacker

(20,185 posts)
59. No one lives forever
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 11:37 AM
Sep 2017

You're always going to miss something. While the future has wonders to behold, it also has pain and destruction. I am 60. I am disabled and poor. Do I want to live like this for another 10 years? Sure. 20 years? Maybe. Beyond that, the world would have to change dramatically for the better for me to want to stick around and I'm not optimistic.

Iwasthere

(3,159 posts)
79. I hear that a lot lately, confused by it
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 03:26 PM
Sep 2017

I plan to be scuba diving when I am 100 (61 now). I plan to slide sideways into my grave when I am 120 to 130 years old, like home base.

Binkie The Clown

(7,911 posts)
41. And my uncle ate the same way and died at 30.
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 07:55 PM
Sep 2017

Luck of the draw. The problem is not that eggs will kill you. The problem is that eggs will stack the odds against you. You could eat eggs and still get lucky like your mom. You could also win the lottery.

I'd rather stack the odds in my favor. People with cholesterol below 150 don't get heart disease. People who eat eggs don't have cholesterol below 150. Who has cholesterol below 150? Vegans.

 

cwydro

(51,308 posts)
44. I'm not a vegan.
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 08:23 PM
Sep 2017

My cholesterol is very low. And according to my doc, my "good" cholesterol is off the charts.

I'm an exercise fanatic, so that's probably part of it. Plus I love garlic lol.

Good genes help - maternal great aunt lived to 99.

But you're right; everyone is different and should take care of themselves as they see fit.

defacto7

(13,485 posts)
67. It's not luck at all. It's many more factors than can be
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 01:06 PM
Sep 2017

determined only by diet. Sorry about your uncle but I've known some of the most diet conscious people, even vegetarians, who died relatively young from cardiac disease. They were outside of the statistics but the diet didn't help.
There is no general, overall, correct. The correct diet statistically can be the worst diet individually.
It's all between you, your doc/nutritionist, your tests, your history, your life exposures, your genes and your own head.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
88. Not true
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 06:01 PM
Sep 2017

Cholesterol levels have a lot more to do with whether or not you consume animal fats. My LDL ranges from 40-65 and my total cholesterol has always been well below 150. I eat the hell out of eggs.

Some vegans and non-vegans have very high cholesterol levels for reasons that have nothing to do with their diet. Your body synthesizes cholesterol and some people make more than others regardless of what they eat.

 

Impeach Trump

(93 posts)
40. Link to "studies show eating one egg a day is as bad for your longevity as smoking a pack a day?
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 07:54 PM
Sep 2017

Who said that?

Binkie The Clown

(7,911 posts)
42. Some links for you
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 08:13 PM
Sep 2017
Atherosclerosis Journal October 2012Volume 224, Issue 2, Pages 469–473

S Wu. Meat And Cheese May Be as Bad for You as Smoking. Released by University of Southern California, Published: March 4, 2014.

M E Levine, J A Suarez, S Brandhorst, P Balasubramanian, C W Cheng, F Madia, L Fontana, M G Mirisola, J Guevara-Aguirre, J Wan, G Passarino, B K Kennedy, M Wei, P Cohen, E M Crimmins, V D Longo. Low protein intake is associated with a major reduction in IGF-1, cancer, and overall mortality in the 65 and younger but not older population. Cell Metab. 2014 Mar 4;19(3):407-17.

T T Fung, R M van Dam, S E Hankinson, M Stampfer, W C Willett, F B Hu. Low-carbohydrate diets and all-cause and cause-specific mortality: two cohort studies. Ann Intern Med. 2010 Sep 7;153(5):289-98.

H Noto, A Goto, T Tsujimoto, M Noda. Low-carbohydrate diets and all-cause mortality: a systematic review and meta-analysis of observational studies. PLoS One. 2013;8(1):e55030.

I Sample. Diets high in meat, eggs and dairy could be as harmful to health as smoking. L Partridge, P H Harvey.

JAMA Intern Med. 2016 Oct 1 Association of Animal and Plant Protein Intake With All-Cause and Cause-Specific Mortality. Song M1, Fung TT2, Hu FB3, Willett WC3, Longo VD4, Chan AT5, Giovannucci EL3.

Or this link: (brief extract below)
For decades, “on the basis of concerns from the American Heart Association and consumer groups, the Federal Trade Commission carried out successful legal action—upheld by the Supreme Court—to compel the egg industry to cease and desist from false and misleading advertising that eggs had no harmful effects on health.”

See, “[a]nti-cholesterol attacks on eggs…resulted in severe economic loss…through a reduction in egg consumption.” So, the egg industry created a National Commission on Egg Nutrition “to combat the anti-cholesterol, anti-egg publicity” with ads like this, exclaiming, “There is…no scientific evidence whatsoever that eating eggs in any way increases the risk of heart attack”—which the U.S. Court of Appeals found “patently false and misleading.”


or: Debunking Egg Industry Myths

Many, many more studies available if you are really interested in seeing the evidence.
 

Impeach Trump

(93 posts)
45. Seems as if those are all before 2014 and prior to current studies?
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 08:26 PM
Sep 2017

However, thanks for the links even though a couple were way over my head as I am no sort of bio-scientist.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
58. One of the sources claims veganism can cure diabetes, CVD, cancer, high blood pressure, and suicide
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 11:37 AM
Sep 2017

I'm not sure why he didn't point out veganism cures erectile dysfunction. Probably an oversight.

Binkie The Clown

(7,911 posts)
65. Yes, it was an oversight, because it DOES cure erectile dysfunction.
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 12:54 PM
Sep 2017
Erectile dysfunction and fruit/vegetable consumption among diabetic Canadian men. Urology. 2013 Dec;82(6):1330-5. doi: 10.1016/j.urology.2013.07.061.

Mediterranean diet improves erectile function in subjects with the metabolic syndrome. Int J Impot Res. 2006 Jul-Aug;18(4):405-10. Epub 2006 Jan 5.

Parsons JK. Lifestyle factors, benign prostatic hyperplasia, and lower urinary tract symptoms. Curr Opin Urol. 2011 Jan;21(1):1-4.

Rohrmann S, Giovannucci E, Willett WC, Platz EA. [link:http://|Fruit and vegetable consumption, intake of micronutrients, and benign prostatic hyperplasia in US men.] Am J Clin Nutr. 2007 Feb;85(2):523-9.

Bravi F, Bosetti C, Dal Maso L, Talamini R, Montella M, Negri E, Ramazzotti V, Franceschi S, La Vecchia C. [link:http://|Food groups and risk of benign prostatic hyperplasia.] Urology. 2006 Jan;67(1) 3-9.

B. P. Gupta, M. H. Murad, M. M. Clifton, L. Prokop, A. Nehra, S. L. Kopecky. The effect of lifestyle modification and cardiovascular risk factor reduction on erectile dysfunction: A systematic review and meta-analysis. Arch. Intern. Med. 2011 171(20):1797 - 1803.

K. Esposito, F. Giugliano, M. I. Maiorino, D. Giugliano. [link:http://|Dietary factors, Mediterranean diet and erectile dysfunction.] J Sex Med. 2010 7(7):2338 - 2345.

K. Esposito, D. Giugliano. Lifestyle for erectile dysfunction: A good choice. Arch. Intern. Med. 2012 172(3):295 - 296.

Or simply Google "vegan erectile dysfunction" for loads of popularized summaries of the medical research.


To ridicule is easy. Certainly easier than following the facts wherever they lead. Especially when the facts lead you away from your strongly held beliefs.

Binkie The Clown

(7,911 posts)
74. Your insults are persuasive, but I choose to go right on being the ignorant fool than I am.
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 01:53 PM
Sep 2017

Congratulate yourself for your superior intellect and tell yourself you won the debate.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
82. Evidently I'm the dumb one because I fail to see the insult
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 04:17 PM
Sep 2017

It's merely a demonstration of how a "simply fact" can lead to a flawed conclusion.

Binkie The Clown

(7,911 posts)
84. We all want the same thing,... to be adminred by others for our intellect, or
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 04:30 PM
Sep 2017

athletic skill, or artistic ability. I'm giving you want you want. Admiration for your superior intellect. That's all.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
85. Perhaps, but it looks more like passive aggressive patronizing
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 04:35 PM
Sep 2017

So much for taking the high road on the insults.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
55. Some of this is kinda funny
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 11:25 AM
Sep 2017

Your first link contains a click bait title with exactly zero direct references to anything remotely scientific, and when you start digging you find it comes from a supplement producer (modern equivalent of the snake oil salesman).

Some of what you have referenced that actually includes link studies is predictably published in shitty pay-for-play journals of the most dubious studies that obviously (and no doubt intentionally) fail to control to a plethora of causation factors, and not surprisingly the authors have obvious conflicts of interest.

Many of your links are referencing the exact same study, so while you are providing multiple links, the source material is exactly the same. Your quoted text comes from a very dubious source that makes all sorts of ridiculous claims, which are either completely unsupported or full of non-sequiturs.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
48. There's also a shitton of other differences
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 10:40 AM
Sep 2017

Meat is an expensive source of nutrition and those areas who can afford it also tend to have less active lifestyles for a variety of reasons also associated with higher relative wealth. Genetics also have a significant role to play. If you want to abandon science and promote confusion and uncertainly, conflating correlation and causation is an excellent method.

Speaking of promoting confusion and uncertainty...

Studies show that eating one egg a day is as bad for your longevity as smoking a pack of cigarettes a day.


Binkie The Clown

(7,911 posts)
62. People from regions where they work hard all day and eat a largely vegetarian diet
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 12:35 PM
Sep 2017

move to a western country and their children and grandchildren who adopt our way of eating develop all the same diseases that plague western civilization but do NOT occur in their native populations. It's not genetics, it's diet.

That they "have less active lifestyles" is patently false.

Dr. John McDougall had his early practice in Hawaii, and makes these observations:

From my patients at the Hamakua Sugar Plantation, between 1973 and 1976, I had learned the cause of over 80% of the diseases afflicting people in North America and the rest of the Western world. My elderly patients had immigrated to Hawaii from China, Japan, Korea, and the Philippines, where rice was food. They brought their culture with them. Their children, tempted by Western foods, slowly changed. The third generation, had essentially given up rice and vegetables for meat, dairy, and junk. For all three generations, their health reflected their diet. The first generation immigrants were trim, active, and medication-free into their 90s. They had no diabetes, heart disease, arthritis, or cancers of the breast, prostate, or colon. Their children became a little fatter and sicker, and most of their grandchildren had lost all of their immunity to obesity and common diseases — in every way of appearance and health, they were full-fledged Americans.

My observations contradicted two basic beliefs I had held since childhood. The first was that as we age, we naturally become fatter and sicker. The second was that a well-balanced diet was best. Before my own eyes I saw fully functioning elders thriving on grains and fruits and vegetables. With the inclusion of the two other basic food groups — meat and dairy — the progeny failed.

The most impressive example of the potential for extraordinary health provided by a starch (rice) based diet came from some special Filipinos—specifically, family units consisting of an elderly man, a very young wife, and their children. After saving for years and then retiring, single men traveled to the Philippines in search of a young bride. In my office every day I witnessed what can best be described as “natural Viagra.” Men in their 70s and 80s were starting new families and demonstrating physical functions many American men only fantasize about after their 50s. These Filipino septuagenarians also expected to see their young children grow into adults, and they did. This virility and optimism was from their simple diets.


We all know, however, that when confronted with facts that contradict one's firmly held beliefs, instead of considering the facts, the average person doubles down on their faith. I know I did. For many years my sister kept pointing these facts out to me, and for many years I resisted. Then finally, I gave it a try. The "correlation" I observed in myself was that when I adopted the plant-based diet it cured my high cholesterol, my high blood pressure, my angina, and my acid reflux. There's no way I would ever go back to eating the old way.

So I have not abandoned science. I have embraced it, and abandoned my preconceived prejudices that kept me from letting the truth in.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
69. Fad diet salesman
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 01:20 PM
Sep 2017

Not to mention everything you are pointing out is purely anecdotal which is even less scientific than purely correlative studies published in shit journals. It is commendable you found a source that claims veganism cures ED as I've been looking for one. If nothing else the LOL factor is worth it.

As far as the plant eating societies you mentioned, I've been to many of them and what you find when you go there are people who walk and bike as a primary means of commuting compared to people in developed countries who drive two blocks to the market.

The idea that genes have no role to play in mortality is just ridiculous. There's a mountain of evidence in reputable journals spanning decades, if not thousands of years of data. To throw all of that out the window based on the anecdotal observations of a fad diet salesman is not really something I'd call firmly rooted in science. YMMV. While LDL levels are at some level dependent on diet, that is by no means the only determining factor. Activity level, body fat percentage, and yes genes also have a significant role to play and the evidence for these things is overwhelming.

If a baseball player improves his batting average by scratching his balls 3 times in the batter's box, by all means he should continue doing so. If what you are doing works for you, then by all means you should keep doing it. However, that doesn't necessarily mean those things have a causal relationship. For what anecdotal evidence is worth, I eat animal sources of protein just about every day and generally several times per day. I have extremely low cholesterol, scary low in fact. My doctor said I have the lowest LDL of anyone she's ever seen not taking statin drugs and she's been a practicing physician for over 20 years. I have a normal weight. Normal blood pressure. Zero symptoms or diagnostic evidence of anything remotely resembling cardiovascular disease or chronic gastrointestinal problems. Never had cancer or any serious illness. So to what do I attribute my good health at an advanced age? Almost certainly it's due to maintaining a healthy level of body fat, an active lifestyle, and good genes, and I don't need anecdotal evidence from those who obviously have a conflict of interest to help me make those conclusions.

Binkie The Clown

(7,911 posts)
75. Clearly you already know everything, so by all means, go right on believing what you believe.
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 02:02 PM
Sep 2017

I'll continue to do what actually worked for me. Yes, I know, I'm merely an anecdote. But MY health, and MY well being are the only anecdote that matters to me. The vast improvement in my health convinced me, but it can't convince you. (See my sig) So go right on believing whatever you choose to believe. I'll go right on believing something that changed my life for the better. Your ridicule and insults cannot convince me to ignore my own personal experience. There's no way I would go back to the lifestyle that caused me so many health problems, or to abandon the lifestyle that has allowed me to put ALL of those health problems in the past. I'm better off now at 72 than I was when I was in my 40s. Healthier, happier, more vigorous, more active. Are you really trying to me it would be better for me to go back to living the way I was when I was weak and sickly? Really? You really know that much about nutrition? Well congratulations then. Maybe you should write a book.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
83. I'm pretty sure I told you to do whatever works for you
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 04:20 PM
Sep 2017

So you might want to go back and read what I actually wrote.

defacto7

(13,485 posts)
66. Like the Germans and the French?
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 12:54 PM
Sep 2017

The most meat and fat eating populations I can think of... and they are among those groups with the longer lifespans. Other reasons at play here than simply fat and meat.

25. All I have to say, in the 20 years since I've cut back on eggs
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 03:25 PM
Sep 2017

I have clearly gotten older. In fact, I now find myself in my late 60s. That never happened while I was eating eggs on a regular basis

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
37. Since I started eating more eggs, I found I was getting older at the exact same rate
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 07:01 PM
Sep 2017

...and my farts smell better.

Ms. Toad

(34,069 posts)
27. I don't know about the benefits -
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 03:46 PM
Sep 2017

but the restriction for diabetics is bunk, absent additional contra-indicators, since consumed cholesterol does not directly translate into serum cholesterol.

I am not challenging the general assertion that there is a strong link between diabetes and cardiovascular disease, or that most people with diabetes struggle with elevated cholesterol levels. Both are true. What I am challenging is that consuming eggs is per se contributor to cardiovascular disease for people with diabetes.

I have diabetes. There are times I eat 2-3 eggs a day - and I also eat about 60% of my calories from fats. My cholesterol ratio is well below (i.e. healthier) than the range designated as optimum, and all individual components are within normal ranges. My blood glucose is also normal (106 mg/dl at the moment, and always below 140 mg/dl. I ate less than an hour ago.
The recommended ranges for diabetics is that blood glucose fall to below 180 mg/dl no longer than 2 hours after eating). Both my blood glucose and cholesterol are controlled entirely by limiting carbohydrate consumption. I can, and do, eat as many eggs as I feel like.

KT2000

(20,577 posts)
28. the brain needs cholesterol and
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 04:23 PM
Sep 2017

the myelin sheath needs cholesterol. Also, cholesterol is used by the body to repair abrasions in the blood vessels. Much of the plaques in the body are made of cholesterol to heal abrasions in the vessels caused by excess insulin in the blood.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
61. True, but your body can synthesize cholesterol so you don't need it from external sources
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 12:22 PM
Sep 2017

There's lots of things your body needs that are bad in excess. Animal studies suggest arsenic is an essential nutrient, but shouldn't be supplemented for obvious reasons.

Lots of culinary things are demonized, often with unintended consequences. Best to take dietary recommendations with a grain of salt, or not.

NastyRiffraff

(12,448 posts)
29. I love soft boiled eggs
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 05:08 PM
Sep 2017

I eat them in egg cups, complete with a topper and spoon them out of the cup. It feels almost Downton Abbey-ish.

DFW

(54,370 posts)
32. I have heart problems
Thu Sep 14, 2017, 05:23 PM
Sep 2017

And tend toward high uric acid levels (eggs have that too).

And as for reducing the risk of birth defects--too late. I'm already born.

BannonsLiver

(16,375 posts)
71. I'd never be able to leave the house if I ate 2-3 eggs a day
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 01:40 PM
Sep 2017

Like shit through a goose. That's the effect for me.

appleannie1943

(1,303 posts)
54. I have a problem with egg whites. The yolks do not bother me and I love them.
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 11:13 AM
Sep 2017

The whites make me gag and if I smother them with salsa to get them down, I start feeling queasy in about 15 minutes and it lasts all day. My youngest daughter can't even taste an egg white. If she does, she doubles over with stomach cramps for hours. Like me, she can eat the yolk if it is completely lacking any white so to be safe, even though she loves them, she does not eat eggs at all.

appleannie1943

(1,303 posts)
97. For some reason flu shots have never bothered me but they made my mom sick.
Sun Sep 17, 2017, 04:14 PM
Sep 2017

I think it is some genetic allergy to something in egg whites and it effects each of us a bit differently. My mom could eat the whole egg but could not get flu shots. I can eat the whole egg if I can get the white down but then I feel queasy all day. My daughter can't eat even a tiny taste of even meringue But can eat things like cake that have whole eggs baked in them but she can't eat mayo. She gets violent stomach cramps if she does. I think it might have something to do with how well they are cooked or something.

Bayard

(22,063 posts)
60. Three egg mushroom and cheese omelet every morning
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 11:40 AM
Sep 2017

Courtesy of my little red hens. And a big bowl of real oatmeal (with a little brown sugar and a lot of cinnamon). Powers me thru most of the day.

Buns_of_Fire

(17,175 posts)
73. Love eggs. Except for raw or creamed.
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 01:53 PM
Sep 2017

Scrambled, fried, Benedicted, Orange Juliused, Waffle Housed (with cheese), hard-boiled, McMuffined, or omeleted.

The studies, pro or con, don't bother me, for I have found the secret to a long and happy life:

Lostnote

(75 posts)
78. As a heart patient I eat 2 eggs a day...
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 02:51 PM
Sep 2017

The only noticeable problem is I'm a little more skittish wrt crossing the road...

jcmaine72

(1,773 posts)
81. It's irresponsible for anyone to encourage others to consume more animal products.
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 03:33 PM
Sep 2017

Our focus as human beings right now should be on helping this planet heal. We can't do that when we continually encourage people to financially support those who exploit helpless animals, and their reproductive systems, for profit.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
87. All farming "exploit[s] helpless animals" for profit
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 04:47 PM
Sep 2017

Just because the finished product doesn't contain animal products, doesn't mean the impact to the planet is less. Entire ecosystems are being completely wiped out by banana and soy production, just to name two examples. If you want to be a vegan, be my guest and enjoy your choices in good health, but if you want to be self righteous about it in order to elicit new recruits to the cause I think you're going to find that strategy is counterproductive.

 

Awsi Dooger

(14,565 posts)
92. Sigh...maybe I'll try again
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 07:35 PM
Sep 2017

A month ago I bought 18 extra large eggs and planned to scramble 3 per day. I made it halfway through the container and then stopped.

The taste simply doesn't appeal to me, considering the process to get there.

The clean up sucks also.

gollygee

(22,336 posts)
94. And don't throw out the yolk!
Fri Sep 15, 2017, 09:01 PM
Sep 2017

My pet peeve: people throwing out perfectly good food over an incorrect notion that the best part of it is bad for you.

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