What does god(s) have to do with it

[angrychair]

I was just watching MSNBC (I think the one with Velshi and Ruhle) and she was talking to a survivor that helped some people and at the end invoked god: “I thank god you were there and that you helped those people” and the person said “I thank god for the people in front of me and behind me god...” I turned it off.

The knee jerk reflex to “thank god” in these type of situations is irritating. Where was this “god” you are thanking when he let 59 people get killed and 500+ people injured? Do you thank this “god” for that?

People ”thank god” for all the efforts to save people in the Caribbean but where was this god before the hurricanes that destroyed millions of lives and caused unparalleled destruction?

People are sure quick to thank a being that, according to their beliefs, though it is within their ability to stop it, has made the choice to allow them to die and even worse in some cases, to suffer for the rest of their lives trying to recover.

These events are naturally occurring and the heroic efforts of individuals and organizations to help people is completely their actions and their valor and efforts should not be diminished by attributing even some of it to a fairytale being that, even if true, has proven themselves, time and again, completely indifferent to the suffering of their followers.
Despite the lie to the contrary, there is no “personal growth” or “better understanding” through suffering or pain, there is only suffering and pain.

[NightWatcher]

1. Completely baffling isn't it?

It's weird to be so advanced on so many levels but also have such a huge percentage of people still falling for fairy tales and mysticism.

[get the red out]

2. That kind of talk

Doesn’t make a damn bit of sense to me and only serves to diminish the horror of so many lives being lost.

[genxlib]

3. If you were to actually ask them that question

You would likely get some form of ..."the Lord works in mysterious ways"

I really hate that one.

[pintobean]

4. Thank god there are people like you

to question other people's faith in a time of crisis!

[trotsky]

6. Geez, took until the 4th post to bash the OP.

Must be slipping.

[SamKnause]

11. ...

[snooper2]

8. If it's the right time to talk about gun control then the right time to talk about mythical creature

You can at least try to answer the OP's question...


Why is the deity that the majority of people worship in this country such a fucking asshole?

[angrychair]

9. With all due respect

It’s in a time of crisis that you should.
If someone “thanks god” for their survival in these situations, it’s shorthand for “glad it wasn’t me”. Because no one is “thanking god” that the Las Vegas tragedy happened or that millions of lives that were uprooted and people killed and injured from the hurricanes in the Caribbean. The untold suffering by many of the survivors of these horrific events will likely last their entire lives.

Love, understanding and help from fellow human beings will makes things better, not fairytales of a supposed omnipotent but indifferent being.

[pintobean]

21. The only thing it hurts

is your feelings.

[GeorgeGist]

5. Amen

[SamKnause]

7. It is totally illogical.

Something good happens, praise god.

Something bad happens, it was god's will or god had nothing to do with it.

If your prayers are answered, praise god.

If your prayers are unanswered, god works in mysterious ways.

God has a plan.

Why are you praying and interfering with god's plans ???

Completely and totally illogical !!!!

[Towlie]

10. The Problem of Evil and Religions Double Standard

The Problem of Evil and Religion’s Double Standard

One of the striking differences between modern, “organized” religion and tribal or folk religions–religions without seminaries and theologians and official books–is that in tribal religions they have no double standard! They thank their gods for the good stuff that happens and blame them for the bad. The idea that God is a worthy recipient of our gratitude for the blessings of life but should not be held accountable for the disasters is a transparently disingenuous innovation of the theologians. And of course it doesn’t work all that well. The Problem of Evil, capital letters and all, is the central enigma confronting theists. There is no solution. Isn’t that obvious? All the holy texts and interpretations that contrive ways of getting around the problem read like the fine print in a fraudulent contract–and for the same reason: they are desperate attempts to conceal the implications of the double standard they have invented.

— Daniel Dennett

[SamKnause]

13. Thanks for your post.

[angrychair]

12. My favorite is heaven and hell

If I’m good and ask for forgiveness I get to go to “heaven” but if I’m bad and/or don’t ask for forgiveness than I go to “hell”.

So, if I make mistakes, poor decisions or make poor choices based on the conditions of my life of approximately 70 years, I get to suffer in pain and agony for all eternity.

ETERNITY.

No forgiveness after death.

The omnipotent “god” of love and forgiveness somehow can’t or won’t forgive me after death (see bible)

So, mistakes, shortcomings or conditioning in a approximately 70 year life equals untold billions of years of suffering and pain?

Even if you get to go to “heaven” why would you want to? It’s no better. There are only two primary accounts of “heaven” in the Bible. One from Jesus: “in my Father’s house there are many rooms...” what rooms? What kind of room? Do I have to stay in this room? If everyone gets a room are we not allowed to be together? Is it a cell? Am I in prison? The other is from John in Revelations, in which he describes a situation in which you reside forever in a giant throne room laying on your stomach, facing a great throne with god on it and Jesus at his right side, and you praise and glorify him for all eternity.
One, this sounds awful and two, why does an omnipotent being need me to praise and glorify him for all eternity?
Again, since this relationship is always in the context of father and children, should we here on earth expect our children to endlessly praise and glorify our fathers like “god” expects us to do to him?
The whole premise is ridiculous.

[SamKnause]

15. Agree.

The whole premise is ridiculous.

Heaven doesn't sound like any place I would want any part of.

[angrychair]

19. I know right

I didn’t even address the point that the “god” and “Jesus” sitting on that throne are the same person and that “Jesus” and for that matter the “Holy Ghost” are actually just avatars of “god”.
Despite Xians having a thing against the supernatural I guess the “holy” version of a ghost is ok, especially if it gets someone pregnant with another version of you.

If you really get into the weeds of it all, it is both fascinating and disturbing at the same time.

[SamKnause]

20. Indeed it is very disturbing.

[Mariana]

22. It's actually much worse than what you say.

Your behavior during this life has little or nothing to do with whether you avoid eternal torture. According to many (most?) varieties of Christianity, it's more like this:

If you're bad and you ask for forgiveness you get to go to heaven, because you get forgiven no matter what you've done. If you're good and you don't ask for forgiveness then you go to hell, because your best isn't good enough.

[Iggo]

14. Absolutely nothing.

[LanternWaste]

16. It's as odd and useless as wishing someone luck

It's as odd and useless as thanking providence, wishing someone luck, or sending someone good thoughts.

Then again, so is critiquing the variable sentiment behind it.

[Voltaire2]

17. It gets the survivors off the hook.

Survivor guilt is real. One way to resolve the question of why some died and some didn’t is to invoke a divine intervention on your behalf. It is a mind numbingly thoughtless answer, but the plain fact that it was more or less random chance that you survived is incomprehensible to many people.

I get that. I also think that those of us who have thought about this need to speak up every time these events happen. We have a responsibility to try to break through the fog most people live in. That fog, this reality framework most people are functioning in, is why shit is really fucked up.

[Orsino]

18. Thank the people who budgeted for first responders...

...or thank the neighbors who step up to help.

Not a mythical deity who sends hurricanes.