UFOs

[Stinky The Clown]

What's with all the UFO talk all of a sudden?

I believe they exist. To believe we are the only intelligent life form in the universe is pure ignorant arrogance.

But again, why all the UFO talk now?

[MineralMan]

1. SQUIRREL!

That's why.

[Irish_Dem]

2. Is it a soft disclosure pattern. Periodically roll out the UFO info

to prepare us for a hard disclosure?

Or merely distraction from a very messy scene in Washington DC?

[dhill926]

3. Theyre answering our call for help?

[JDC]

7. I think if intelligent life came here and saw how we treated

The earth and other species, it would wipe us out like the virus that we are.

[JackInGreen]

28. ...is it bad I rented transmission time

And sent a broadband distress call?

[MGKrebs]

49. Did you tell them we have cookies?

They won't hurt us if we give them cookies.

[dchill]

80. Man! I thought it was Reese's Pieces!

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

53. Noooo... they're here "To Serve Man." (Hint: think Twilight Zone episode by that name.)

[loyalsister]

84. That one always comes to my mind the topic of UFOs comes up

The Twilight Zone is forever relevant. Imagine what Rod Serling's mind might have done with today's technology and social ills! The "He's Alive" episode is creepy to watch now. But, I recommend it because it was a very clear warning of possibilities. Young Dennis Hopper resembles early pics of Trump.

[bluestarone]

4. not sure why but

i've always been interested in this. It is nice to talk about something else for a change

[stopbush]

5. UFOs are one thing. Could be swamp gas.

UFOs piloted by aliens? The challenge of being able to travel millions of light years in short order would need to have been solved. Kinda doubt it.

[triron]

21. Not "millions" . Could be only a few to several ly.

Lots of planets within 1000 ly. Theoretically there is a way to traverse many ly within a relatively short period of time by warping spacetime around the vehicle.
We just don't have the technical capacity.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

78. Warping spacetime around the vehicle

does not seem feasible, according to my physicist son. He does acknowledge that extremely advanced technologies my be different.

But chances are travelling faster than light speed is probably not ever going to happen, which means actual interstellar travel in any meaningful way is highly unlikely.

My take on things is this: it's highly possible that intelligent life has evolved more than once, but how many of those intelligent life forms have actually gone on to a technological civilization like ours? What if an intelligent species evolves on a planet with a permanent cloud cover, like Venus? Or well within the atmosphere of Jupiter? Or under the ice covering a planet wide ocean like Europa? What if such intelligent life never sees the stars above? Or if they simply develop in a direction that never leads them off their planet?

Another essential problem is that any species lasts at best a million years. There's no reason to think that developing an advanced technological civilization can change that. So a civilization can flower, possibly attain space travel, and then die off long before it can make any meaningful foray into the rest of the galaxy.

I read science fiction and love speculation as much as anyone. Among my favorite s-f first contact movies is "The Arrival" which came out in 1996. If you haven't seen it yet, do so. It's great.

Oh, and here's a way to think about the vastness of interstellar distances. Our galaxy, Milky Way, contains about 300 billion stars, and is on a collision course with Andromeda, which as about a trillion stars. This will happen in about 4 or 5 billion years, so brace yourself. A while back I asked my physicist son how many stars would actually collide. He said that of course they don't know for sure, but the current best guess is no more than ten. Think about that. Ten out of 1.3 trillion stars. Of course, he added, many more will be gravitationally affected. But actual collisions? Deep space is deep indeed.

[ProfessorGAC]

39. Why Would They Come Here?

A race advanced enough to travel thousands of light years comes to earth?
We're amoebae compared to them!

[triron]

43. How do you know that?

How far away are we from this technical accomplishment?
You have no idea. Maybe we are less than a couple or so hundred years away.
Do we think of our founding fathers as amoeba? I think not.

[ProfessorGAC]

50. I'm Not At Liberty To Answer

And, yes I actually do know the answers to those questions. And this technical achievement of which you speak means you watch too much TV.
Finally, I was joking! Lighten up!

[triron]

69. I could not see your face. how would I know?

I think it is highly likely earth has been visited by extraterrestrial intelligence
and for quite some time already. You may find this interesting: http://www.collective-evolution.com/2014/07/11/top-u-s-astronomers-tell-congress-that-extraterrestrial-life-exists-without-question/

[triron]

74. NASA has been looking into it actually (super-luminal travel)

http://www.dailygalaxy.com/my_weblog/2014/01/nasas-star-trek-future-a-warp-drive-solution-for-faster-than-light-space-travel-a-2013-most-popular.html

[ProfessorGAC]

82. Thanks

I saw that back when it came out. Seems like the "controlled fusion is just around the corner" stuff we've been hearing since the late 70's.

Let that sink in: For forty years, controlled fusion is just around the corner.

[Whiskeytide]

46. We study ants. And sometimes squash them for no reason. n/t.

[Vogon_Glory]

51. People study amoebaes

I’d think that studying a not-so-intelligent species and its effects on a planetary ecosystem would be fascinating.

[ProfessorGAC]

63. We Don't Travel A Thousand Light Years For That

Go to a puddle! Done! Not quite the same!

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

54. It's Bernie's fault whatever the reason.

[Archae]

6. The news media likes them.

No matter how discredited the entire concept.

Just a few years ago I was on my bicycle heading home, when I saw a shape-changing UFO.

Had I turned to go down another street or stopped, that's what my memory would have been.

As I got closer, I saw it was a bunch of balloons tethered to a spot on a car dealer's lot near me.

UFO's come from three sources:

1. Mistakes.
"Look! A flying saucer!"
"That's an airliner..."

2. Crazies seeing things the rest of us can't.

3. People who make shit up for money.

[get the red out]

8. Maybe

because so many of us wish one would stop and pick Trump and Pence up?

I agree with you though, I believe there is some weird shit that goes on that we don't know the origin of.

[Moostache]

26. Kang and Kodos won't be helping us on THAT count any time soon....

[Dave Starsky]

9. Cell phones have killed UFOs, Bigfoot, ghosts, etc.

We live in a time where everyone literally carries a camera around in their pocket, as well as the means to distribute those images worldwide, instantly. And, yet... nothing. Imagine that.

[misanthrope]

16. And we have a winner!

Not to mention, the advent and proliferation of photo and video editing software has made people a little more skeptical about visual evidence. It's easier to fake something now but now that we're used to seeing CGI, it's made folks harder to fool.

[USALiberal]

37. +1000, I tell my nutty friends that line. They hate it. n.t.

[doodsaq]

38. Clearly they make a run for it...

...at the first sign of someone about to snap a photo of them.

[ProfessorGAC]

40. Nope!

They vaporize anyone who tries to take a picture.
They're REALLY camera shy.

[shockey80]

10. Aliens travel many light years just to do a fly over?

People have watched to many star trek movies. Call me when they find a flying saucer. Then I will believe it. Maybe the aliens have paid tours you take to come see the planet earth, like a safari, Lol.

[MineralMan]

59. Drones. They Send Drones to our Planet.

Yeah...that's the ticket...

[PJMcK]

11. I don't know the answer to your question but this Dr. Tyson explanation is noteworthy

[Delphinus]

35. I love his wit!

That was fun to listen to - thank you!

[PJMcK]

44. You are welcome!

I enjoy Dr. Tyson's sense of humor and perspective.

I'm also a fan of Lawrence Krauss. His books and lectures are captivating.

[Enoki33]

12. Totally agree it is ignorant arrogance to assume we are the only

‘civilized’ planet. As a species what we have achieved was done within the last 50b years. Imagine what another species conceivably could have achieved in 500b years - things like harvesting the power of the stars or dark matter. Fascinating stuff to think about. As a species we could use some humility in our mad rush to destroy the only home we now have.

[MGKrebs]

13. 'Other intelligent life in the universe' and 'UFO's' aren't the same thing.

One can believe in other intelligent life without buying into UFO's here.
We have to ask- why would they come here? And why would they come here but then hide from us? That's almost worse than being the only intelligent life in the universe: We're a very special experiment being monitored for god knows how long.

Also, they have the technology to traverse interstellar space and hang around here, but they can't quite perfectly conceal themselves?

Nevertheless, as someone else said, there is some weird shit out there. So who knows.

If they come from the nearest known other habitable plant, that is 12 years away if you can fly at the speed of light. Even if you could harness the energy required for that, and find a way to survive the journey, it's still 12 years! Are we worth all that? And what do they do when they get here?

It takes us years to get around in our own solar system.

[NastyRiffraff]

15. Exactly. Thank you.

It makes sense to believe there's other intelligent life in the universe, although we lack evidence right now, common sense tells us that it's unlikely we're the only intelligent life in a universe with many millions of planets.

As for UFO's, personally I need hard evidence; it's not a matter of "belief" because that's something that's observable.

[misanthrope]

17. Completely concur

Thanks

[Enoki33]

19. It might not be very smart of us to apply our own limitations

to other possible civilizations, especially in a universe where physics is constantly evolving.

[MGKrebs]

24. Point taken, but still...

we can discuss anything we can imagine and we can discuss anything we currently know as possible. Either can be interesting.

[Enoki33]

31. Agreed. What is possible today no one 500 years ago would

have realistically though possible. And that was only 500 years. And so it goes.

[Willie Pep]

14. There will always be interest in the paranormal.

People are interested in the mysterious and unknown so whenever UFOs come up in the news it excites people.

Some info on paranormal belief in the United States:

https://blogs.chapman.edu/wilkinson/2017/10/11/paranormal-america-2017/

[misanthrope]

18. One change to their opening sentence

"Currently the most common paranormal belief in the United States is the belief that ancient, advanced civilizations, such as Atlantis once exited with more than half of respondents (55%) agreeing or strongly agreeing with this statement."

No, the most common paranormal belief in the United States are mainstream religions like Christianity.

[LanternWaste]

55. imaginary borders are real and more important than people

"No, the most common paranormal belief in the United States..." is that imaginary borders are real and more important than people.

(since we're both misusing the word to apply an irrelevant sentiment...)

[misanthrope]

75. From Merriam-Webster

paranormal
adjective para·nor·mal ˌper-ə-ˈnȯr-məl , ˌpa-rə- ; ˈper-ə-ˌnȯr- , ˈpa-rə-
Definition of paranormal
: not scientifically explainable : supernatural


supernatural
adjective su·per·nat·u·ral ˌsü-pər-ˈna-chə-rəl , -ˈnach-rəl
Definition of supernatural
1 : of or relating to an order of existence beyond the visible observable universe; especially : of or relating to God or a god, demigod, spirit, or devil
2 a : departing from what is usual or normal especially so as to appear to transcend the laws of nature
b : attributed to an invisible agent (such as a ghost or spirit)

[NCTraveler]

20. "To believe we are the only intelligent life form in the universe is pure ignorant arrogance. "

You just delved into a level of faith normally required for religious fanatics.

[Stinky The Clown]

27. Pardon me?

Science says there are at least a billion planets just in our Milky Way galaxy similar enough to Earth that could support life. There are billions of other galaxies.

That's science. Not faith.

[NCTraveler]

62. Exactly. That's science.

You brought science to the level of faith.

You are calling your claim "science" when it is anything but. It is pure faith on your part. No different than the devoutly religious.

[Stinky The Clown]

64. Please explain yourself and where you think I am like the religious nutters.

Because what you've written thus far makes the claim but doesn't say why.

[NCTraveler]

65. You made your own claim.

You start with science and then move into faith. That is fact. It is one of the more commonly flawed arguments in life. Stating one fact does not mean that which flows off of that fact, is fact.

You make a scientific claim and then move into something that can only be stated as faith. You claimed anyone disagreeing is ignorant even though you didn't make any form of solid case outside of faith itself.

Truly a model for religious fanaticism. So much is based on a cornerstone of fact and then bastardized with faith.

"To believe we are the only intelligent life form in the universe is pure ignorant arrogance." <- Individually faith based. Not fact based.

[Stinky The Clown]

66. The statement is logic based.

Science: there are estimated to be a billion or more planets in just our galaxy similar enough to ours to support carbon based life.

Science: There are many billions of other galaxies, presumably with many billions of planets capable of supporting carbon based life forms.

Inference: How many non-carbon based life forms might be possible?

Logic: With billions upon billions of potential life supporting planets, logic dictates that one cane safely assume there is life elsewhere.

Respectfully, you will not see it differently. I will not see it differently.

Good day to you.

[MLAA]

79. I am with you stinky!

[lunatica]

83. Hey Stinky The Clown

I agree with your statement. Simple logic isn't 'faith'. It's logic. And it IS pure arrogance to ignore the logic of mathematics. No faith needs to be involved, unless someone has faith that no other life exists except on Planet Earth.

[Vogon_Glory]

52. We already share the planet with intelligent life

Last edited Tue Dec 19, 2017, 11:37 AM - Edit history (1)

We already share the planet with a number of intelligent species. Unfortunately for whales and dolphins, we humans are too lazy/stupid to recognize them as fellow sentiments and we haven’t succeeded in cracking their language(s).

[NCTraveler]

61. The poster was clearly talking outside of the scope of earth.

Beyond clearly, actually.

I do agree with you that life on earth, humanly or otherwise, is not appropriately recognized to the point we can fairly call ourselves brutal beings.

[brooklynite]

22. New York Times Story this weekend...

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/16/us/politics/pentagon-program-ufo-harry-reid.html

Glowing Auras and ‘Black Money’: The Pentagon’s Mysterious U.F.O. Program

WASHINGTON — In the $600 billion annual Defense Department budgets, the $22 million spent on the Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program was almost impossible to find.

Which was how the Pentagon wanted it.

For years, the program investigated reports of unidentified flying objects, according to Defense Department officials, interviews with program participants and records obtained by The New York Times. It was run by a military intelligence official, Luis Elizondo, on the fifth floor of the Pentagon’s C Ring, deep within the building’s maze.

The Defense Department has never before acknowledged the existence of the program, which it says it shut down in 2012. But its backers say that, while the Pentagon ended funding for the effort at that time, the program remains in existence. For the past five years, they say, officials with the program have continued to investigate episodes brought to them by service members, while also carrying out their other Defense Department duties.

The shadowy program — parts of it remain classified — began in 2007, and initially it was largely funded at the request of Harry Reid, the Nevada Democrat who was the Senate majority leader at the time and who has long had an interest in space phenomena. Most of the money went to an aerospace research company run by a billionaire entrepreneur and longtime friend of Mr. Reid’s, Robert Bigelow, who is currently working with NASA to produce expandable craft for humans to use in space.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

23. Because "conspiracy theory"

Like GOP/Russia collusion: it's a conspiracy theory.

So, if the UFO stories divert our attention from Russia inquiries, all's good, right?

[Beaverhausen]

25. Hillary and John Podesta supposedly said they would disclose the UFO secrets

that the government is hiding.

The truth is out there.

[tymorial]

29. Don't know but I like to hope we are not alone

I am aware that some people will go out of their way to call me foolish. I don't care. I want to believe that there is more out there undiscovered. The idea of being alone in the galaxy saddens me. Look what we have done to ourselves and this planet. If we are truly alone as the only sentient life in the galaxy or worse, the universe, then we have squandered a precious gift. It doesn't matter our origin, we would be unique and destroying something truly statistically improbable to have come into existence.

I find the thought of living in a world with no mystery, with no new discovery to be completely and utterly boring.

That doesn't mean I believe UFO stories or believe in alien astronaut theories. No, I just hope we aren't alone so that when we do destroy ourselves, sentient life will carry on elsewhere. I must admit that the thought of discovery of life on other planets is exciting to me. Contact with another intelligent species... I cannot think of anything more interesting and exciting.

[mnmoderatedem]

30. I'm not sure, but...

I sure wish trump supporters would climb back aboard them and fly back to wherever the hell they came from.

[AntiFascist]

32. They are checking to see how the Earthling brain-washing experiment is coming along n/t

[Eko]

33. A UFO is just

a unidentified flying object, why people make the jump to aliens is amusing.

[Noodleboy13]

34. Recent story this weekend about a declassified encounter.

In 2004 2 F-18's operating off the coast of San Diego were vectored in to an strange radar contact. The unidentified craft dropped from 80,000 to 20,000 ft extremely rapidly and then parked in the air for awhile. The F-18's were able to give pursuit for awhile (there is cockpit video available) before the craft accelerated away.
I'm not a naval aviation expert, but I believe the F/A- 18 is the Navy's air superiority fighter; not much can out fly it.

peace.
Noodleboy

[bluestarone]

67. NOT SURE but is this the one your talking about???

http://www.jamestownsun.com/news/science-and-nature/4376206-former-navy-pilot-describes-encounter-ufo-studied-secret-pentagon

[Noodleboy13]

68. That would be the one

Interesting video.

peace
Noodleboy

[bluestarone]

70. yea i thought so too (perhaps the best one so far?)

makes a person think for sure!!!!!!!

[JHB]

36. It's just SHADO play...

[hunter]

85. Imagine reading DemocraticUnderground at SHADO teletype speeds.

SHADO can build a base on the moon, but they're still using 300 baud modems and ALL CAPS?

[JHB]

86. Hey, it was 1970 imagining far-off...

...1980.

The computers were probably the tech (and fashion) where they came closest to reality.

[roamer65]

41. Theyre here to address the Repuke Congress.

https://m.

[MatthewG.]

42. Two reasons

Main reason why people are talking about this now was Saturday’s revelation in the New York Times and elsewhere, already cited above, that the Pentagon spent 20 million looking at UFO’s between 2007 and 2012. Senator Harry Reid - former Democratic Majority Leader - was apparently one of the movers behind this.


Other than that, UFO’s, like all occult and esoteric phenomena, make great entertainment, whatever level of reality one ascribes to them. People love sci-fi and fantasy - always have, always will.

[highplainsdem]

45. "Why now?" isn't the relevant question. "What did they see?" is.

[betsuni]

47. Attempt to paint Democrats as spendthrifts. A "shadowy" secret "pet project" of Harry Reid and his

Dem buddies wasting 22 million ("Was it worth it?" ). That was ABC news' reporting I just saw. A poor attempt to take the heat off Republicans for their tax plan by painting Democrats as the real tax 'n' spenders?

I don't think anyone's going to get upset about it, though. UFO's are popular and fun.

[orleans]

48. when i first saw a bit about it on the news

they talked about harry reid and essentially what a jerk he was to piss off 22 MILLION DOLLARS for this stupid investigation.

it was either on local or nightly news on abc, cbs, nbc, or local fox.

[democratisphere]

56. redumbliCONs throwing distractions and diversions at the wall, then go with what sticks.

[rockfordfile]

57. It seems to happen every year at about the same time.

At the end of the year.

[Wounded Bear]

58. Promo for the return of the X-Files...

[bdamomma]

71. Hey Stinky

let's take him to the LEADER!!! maybe they will abduct him!!

[Act_of_Reparation]

72. Because people say things like "I believe UFO's exist"

A UFO is an unidentified flying object. I believe there are flying objects people have been unable to identify. Ergo, I believe in UFO's.

But that's not what people mean when they say "I believe in UFO's". They mean they believe in aliens. Aliens that are visiting the United States under cover of dark for reasons unknown. But UFO's do not mean aliens. Because if a UFO is determined to be alien, it is no longer unidentified. It is just a flying object.

Because the US military has airplanes, and because pilots sometimes see things they can't identify, it stands to reason the US military has files on UFO's. This does not mean the US military has files on aliens. But that's what people tend to think.

[misanthrope]

76. Well said.**

**

[ecstatic]

73. Looks like Kucinich was right! The former pilot's interview was very

compelling.

[Hoyt]

77. Believe there is life elsewhere, but not in flying saucers like in science fiction operating

in our atmosphere, or anywhere close. Could happen one day, or maybe it did explain Stonehenge, Pyramids, etc.

[Lint Head]

81. This has gone viral in the last few days.

US military releases classified footage of UFO tracked by Navy pilots

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/ufo-video-us-navy-tracking-pilots-footage-unidentified-object-a8116356.html