Venezuela plans to buy more Russian and Chinese arms

[brooklynite]

Source: Business Insider

Venezuela has announced plans to increase its total amount of arms imports from Russia and China in the coming years, Russian network Sputnik reports.

Venezuela is already the largest weapons importer in South America.

According to the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute, Venezuela imported $349 million worth of arms from China and $1.96 billion worth of arms from Russia between 2010 and 2014.

In 2013 alone, Caracas imported $1 billion worth of military equipment from Moscow. Between 2012 and 2015, Venezuela is expected to become the world's second largest importer of Russian weapons, Sputnik reports citing the Centre for Analysis of World Arms Trade.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/venezuela-plans-to-buy-more-russian-and-chinese-arms-2015-4

---

As long as they're spending their dwindling resources on the important things.....

[sharp_stick]

1. Shit

you'd think they'd be a little more concerned with feeding their population but I guess they've gotta feed their paymasters first.

[forest444]

3. And who disingenuously declared Venezuela a threat to create a pretext for "intervention"?

Why, the U.S.

The fact is, that Obama still hasn't been able to wrest control over the State Department's Western Hemisphere desk or the Latin America sections in the intelligence services from Miami exile extremists (many with drug trafficking links). To be fair, perhaps no one can - and much to the detriment of our relations with Latin America and our standing with the rest of the world.

Our interference in Latin America is probably second only to our support for Israeli genocide in its occupied territories in its power to motivate anti-American sentiment abroad.

[Hulk]

6. Careful.....any anti-Israeli rhetoric is strickly forbidden on this site

Your points are well taken.

I'm learning, through censorship, that we don't dare criticize the "hold" Israel has on this country. We are "THEIR puppet", not the other way around.

We will continue to support and defend the crimes of the state of Israel until the last day our government is controlled by their loyalists. Call them what you want. I learned you don't refer to them as ...well, I dare not say the nasty word that identifies a citizen of Israel again, or it will be my second censorship in as many days.

[7962]

21. Yes, MUCH better to align ourselves with peaceful states like Iran,

who are about to start a nuclear arms race in the Middle East.
Lets see if the "framework" agreed to the other day looks the same when its due to be signed.

[Comrade Grumpy]

26. I think you're late for the Likudnik convention. Say hello to Senator Cotton for me.

[7962]

35. Iran good, Israel bad. Putin good, US bad. Maduro good, US bad. Got it. I'll tell the Pres.

I'm sure he'd love to know. Lovely team you're building for peace

[Comrade Grumpy]

45. Some of us are able to look at the world and see beyond black and white.

International politics isn't a high school sporting event. But some of you guys just seem like belligerent cheerleaders.

[betterdemsonly]

71. Funny how this line of argument resembles neocon gripes

when they talk of the "blame America first crowd!"

[7962]

84. Research the comments of who I responded to and you'll see what I'm talking about

and he usually does blame America first

[Little Tich]

36. Maybe you shouldn't spice up your anti-Israel rhetoric with antisemism.

I read that other post that got hidden in the I/P forum. I found it pretty offensive.

[Hulk]

39. I can see where it might be to the Israeli apologists on this site.

You found it offensive. I saw it as pretty frank and perhaps not worded quite eloquently so as not to hurt your feelings. The fact that Israel is responsible for the same oppressive crimes that many Jews experienced in the Warsaw ghettos and other places of pain and suffering in the 40's needs to be faced up to.

My intent was not to label people of faith as guilty of the crimes, but certainly the government of Israel has been up to it's eyeballs in the same sort of oppression that they say they must not forget. Hypocritical to me.

My wording may not have been the best, but I think the point was made. This site doesn't want to offend anyone, and that is doing no one any service.

[Little Tich]

40. You were questioning the loyalty of Jewish citizens to their country on the sole basis

that they were Jewish. Try a different approach next time.

It has been noticed by some that there is an increase of antisemitism on DU. Mayhaps you are part of that increase?

[Hulk]

49. Great that you know what I "was trying to say"....

This is problem with most of the readers on this site. They presume to know what one is thinking, and assume that because it doesn't fit with your opinions it's racist, or bigoted, or some other such negative character.

My original post was refering to politicians in OUR government that are more concerned with their allegiance to Israel than is acceptable. When we cover their butts when they should be, at the very least, condemned by the UN; when we fight their battles with OUR blood and treasure, while they sit and shout for more war....that is dead wrong!

You can get the last bark on this one, because I'm done responding to you and your ilk. I won't defend "Jews" anymore than I would defend Christians, Muslims, or any other faith. It just so happens that our federal, and often state governments, are too closely aligned to the wishes of Israel. That's wrong, in my opinion. And we are paying the price for it.

[Little Tich]

55. Last bite, then...

You can bactrack all you want, but your post was interpreted as racist and that's why it got hidden.

There are some persons of Jewish descent that support Israel, and then some that don't. There is no way that you can rationalize a person's support for Israel by identifying them as Jewish. You are conflating the perceived characteristics of a group with an individual. This is logically incorrect, and in this case, offensive.

If you persist in making this mistake, you will continue making the wrong assumptions about some people, and your arguments will be faulty.

[Codeine]

43. Go ahead and say Jews.

We know you're dying to. Have the courage of your nasty little convictions.

[Hulk]

50. Snarky comments are your thing?

Save your ignorant little comments for someone who enjoys your dim sense of humor. I have plenty enough courage to say what is on my mind, and I'm sure I don't need your encouragement at all.

And who is this "we" you refer to? Fool.

[EX500rider]

96. "......our support for Israeli genocide."

Worst genocide ever...

Palestinian population growth rate:
1.99% (2014 est.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_Palestinian_territories#Population_growth_rate

[PersonNumber503602]

10. You're misunderstanding what they mean by arms...

They are purchasing actual arms for the soylent green.

[Comrade Grumpy]

2. Ah, the daily bash Venezuela thread. What would DU be without it?

Would that any other Latin American country received such caring attention here.

[brooklynite]

4. Maybe because Venezuela goes the extra mile to get itself into the news?

[freshwest]

54. The outrage! Over 7 diplomats, NOT the country of VZ, being declared as Security Risks in order

to play to a meme has been duly noted by some of us. The not-so-magnificent 7 were called security risks since they approved of violence. I do not wish to invite them into my home, and Obama did not wam them in the American embassy. It was NOT a declaration of war with Venezuela.

As George Orwell said, and he will be tossed under the bus by those who love to trot out some of his quotes without taking the time to look at him in context:

“The majority of pacifists either belong to obscure religious sects or are simply humanitarians who object to taking life and prefer not to follow their thoughts beyond that point.

But there is a minority of intellectual pacifists, whose real though unacknowledged motive appears to be hatred of western democracy and admiration for totalitarianism.

Pacifist propaganda usually boils down to saying that one side is as bad as the other, but if one looks closely at the writing of the younger intellectual pacifists, one finds that they do not by any means express impartial disapproval but are directed almost entirely against Britain and the United States...”

The reason they did so was not because their government did the unpardonable sin. It was that they did not do well in their place so want to tear it down. As if that would help them. I'm not speaking of the oppressed, but those who constantly call for a revolution, which they can watch at a safe distance and feel justified in their malice.

George Orwell also said this in regards to WW2, specifically:

“Pacifism is objectively pro-fascist. This is elementary common sense. If you hamper the war effort of one side, you automatically help out that of the other. Nor is there any real way of remaining outside such a war as the present one. In practice, 'he that is not with me is against me'.”

Some like myself, are coming to feel WW2 never really ended. The world has been at war at a fast or slow pace forever. The theaters or war zones or the names of the combatants have changed, but wars never end:

Ambrose Bierce defined 'peace':

Peace, n. In international affairs, a period of cheating between two periods of fighting.

We've been fortunate to have a man like Obama who thinks in the long term, as there are no winners, ultimately in wars, or harsh relationships between nations, except for a very few. But dammit, he's not giving some the show they want to see.

I'm less willing to tolerate the 'I'm going to beat you to death with slogans and loaded words' crowd in my dotage. That may be a bad sign, or else a huge improvement, but I've changed the more I've learned.

[Telcontar]

91. Love the Bierce quote

Will have to remember that

[JonLP24]

72. Get itself into the news?

I mean this seriously & honestly but when the US has a "bad guy" the media kinda goes along with it so there is a bit of an information war going on but it is worse when it comes to Latin America particularly when it comes to the mainstream Western press. Take Columbia, you have US, Canada, France, and Britain supporting the Columbian government but I never ever hear the media talk about Columbia except to relay a comment from a President that we are aiding the government in its battle against "Narco-Terrorists" but considering Columbia has had continuous armed conflict that you can trace to the 50s when a populist was assasinated.

This is all about $$ you probably want to question why they are in the news so much, especially when the US allies & supports countries far more corrupt & with poverty but they let Shell, Exxon Mobile, Chevron have free reign which if Venezuela was more willing to do we wouldn't be hearing about any of this shit.

[Adrahil]

7. Hey this sounds like a great idea for Venezuela...

What do you when you can't provide basics for up ue people? Why buy more weapons, of course!

[Judi Lynn]

41. You should spend some of your time trying to get the facts.

If you really expect to be informed regarding Latin America the least you could do is start trying to do your own reading, rather than buying what the corporate media has opted to tell you, or letting Fox "News" do your thinking for you.

From a new article, some very well-established info. people who do even a bit of research already know:

Weekend Edition April 3-5, 2015

Standing Up to the Empire

Why is the US So Frightened of Venezuela?

by MARIA PAEZ VICTOR


Obama is not in Kansas anymore, but he does not seem to know it. Latin America no longer slavishly accepts orders from the USA; it is no longer the USA’s “back yard”.

The mainstream media has downplayed the fact that President Obama has just declared yet another country an enemy of the USA –one in the American Hemisphere. He has issued an Executive Order declaring Venezuela an “extraordinary and unusual threat to the national security of the United States”

How a nation that spends less than 1% of its GDP on military expenditures, has no latest state-of-the-art military weaponry, and an army of merely 120,000 can possibly threaten the security of the mighty United States, is entirely incomprehensible.

And yet, an invasion of Venezuela, before a theoretical possibility, after Obama’s order has become a scenario with real probabilities. The Venezuelan government is not taking this threat lightly having seen what the greed for oil has done to Iraq, Libya, and Syria.

More:
http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/04/03/why-is-the-us-so-frightened-of-venezuela/

[Adrahil]

42. The point stands...

They are not about to be invaded. Their people can't get basic supplies.

I think building up their military is about the last thing they need.

But I know you love the Chavistas, so keep on pretending this isn't their fault.

[Little Tich]

37. Sadly, we will see more of these threads.

Venezuela is deteriorating. Maduro is crazy.

[7962]

5. You must have top-notch military equipment to keep the citizens under control

They know that the train is fast running off the tracks and soon the people will rise up against their enslavers, so they want to be able to smash any uprising fast

[Comrade Grumpy]

16. Well, I guess the rulers of the US can breathe easy.

Because they have more shiny weapons toys than anybody, by far.

What are they so scared of, anyway?

[awoke_in_2003]

23. "You must have top-notch military equipment to keep the citizens under control"

that is why we give our police only the best.

[7962]

24. Ha!

[Yo_Mama]

8. Well, they seem to be running low of money - better to spend it on pharmaceuticals?

Is ANYONE attacking Venezuela, or likely to do so?

http://rt.com/business/211735-venezuela-foreign-reserves-diamonds/

The Central Bank of Venezuela is adding diamonds, gold and other precious stones and metals to its foreign reserves which have fallen to an 11-year low.

The bank said in a statement issued Thursday it intends to use a broader range of assets to increase international reserves, it will also include freely convertible foreign currencies.

Venezuela may also use Chinese loans in yuan to bolster its international reserves. Finance Minister Rodolfo Marco traveled this week to China to discuss potential deals.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/venezuela/11409933/Clashes-in-Venezuela-as-economic-shortages-continue-to-bite.html

[Chakaconcarne]

9. Perhaps they are preparing for US invasion..

We tend to do that with Oil Rich Countries.

[brooklynite]

11. Do we now?

Care to name an invasion during the Obama Administration?

[Comrade Grumpy]

17. Yes, we do. Especially if your memory goes back a bit further than 2009.

One administration hardly erases our history of aggression.

[brooklynite]

18. It does as far as implied future threats....

Provide any evidence that the Obama Administration is considering invading Venezuela.

[Comrade Grumpy]

19. I never claimed the Obama administration is considering invading Venezuela.

But the Obama administration is history in less than two years.

And the Obama interlude doesn't negate the history of US aggression in the region.

What are you going to do when President Rubio starts beating the war drums?

[Comrade Grumpy]

20. Obama did just recently name Venezuela a threat to the national security of the United States.

Which he should be ashamed of doing. I'm sure his mother told him telling lies was wrong.

So, maybe, the Venezuelans have some reason for being a bit jumpy. Well, and that 2002 coup attempt. But that was so long ago it might as well be ancient history, right?

[hack89]

12. They are destroying their own country just fine by themselves

Last edited Fri Apr 3, 2015, 06:08 PM - Edit history (1)

Why would we want to invade and have to run that mess of a country?

[7962]

25. Good point

[7962]

22. Yeah, thats why we never left Iraq. Except we did.

[Comrade Grumpy]

27. Well, somebody is walking around in US military uniforms over there.

You better tell the Pentagon.

[7962]

33. Yeah, and they're there for the OIL. Right. Better tell the President the news.

Ever heard of ISIS? Wait, we want the oil THEY'VE been selling, right?

[former9thward]

32. There are 3000 new troops in Iraq.

http://www.militarytimes.com/story/military/pentagon/2015/02/25/will-us-troops-be-drawn-back-into-iraq-war/24009315/

[7962]

34. See 33

[EX500rider]

102. "Perhaps they are preparing for US invasion..

....We tend to do that with Oil Rich Countries."

Both Canada and Mexico produce more oil then Venezuela.

So Canada and Mexico are in danger of a US invasion you think?

[Zorra]

13. Smart move, may help deter SOA/CIA trained paramilitary guerrillas from attacking

for awhile.

[Marksman_91]

56. You mean the population of which only little more than 20% approve of Maduro?

Or the 7 million + that voted against him?

Keep dreaming your delusional dream.

Just FYI, "zorra" is not exactly something you'd like to be referred to in Venezuelan speech.

[Zorra]

60. You seem upset.

B) ¡Hasta la Victoria Siempre!

[Marksman_91]

62. Not upset for the reasons you think

As for Maduro and his combo, they themselves are digging their own graves. Of course, an ideologically blinded person who has never stepped foot in Venezuela, such as yourself, wouldn't know that.

[Zorra]

65. Do you want global capitalist oligarchs to take over the government

of Venezuela?

[Marksman_91]

66. They already have. They're called "boligarchs"

The only difference is that they use the guise of being "socialist" to fool the masses.

But one only need to take a good hard look at their bank accounts and you'd see they're nothing but.

[Zorra]

67. Would you like everything in Venezuela to go back to the good old days

before Chavez became President?

[Marksman_91]

76. Not the poverty levels, I recognize that under Chavez poverty did get reduced

But it was all through populist policies that would not work in the long-run because as you might imagine, the current government has become ideologically radicalized and insanely corrupt to the point that they're unwilling to implement policies that will restore national production to the pre-Chavez levels (which were better than what they are now.) However, the crime rate before Chavez was certainly not as bad as it is compared to now, so I guess that's one thing I'd like from the "good old days" to come back. But overall, no, I don't want the next government to be a repeat of the ones before Chavez, but I don't want it to be a repeat of Chavismo either, as time has shown its a regime that eventually heads down a spiral due to its militarily populist nature.

I want the next government to actually be a progressive one that actually takes into account the capacity that Venezuela has to be a true economic powerhouse in the region and actually does something about rampant corruption that, at this point, has robbed the Venezuelan people blindly from the oil income that should be used to improve the country's infrastructure and diversify its economy and improve national production and investment confidence, and doesn't focus so much on bullshit propaganda and doesn't blame all its internal problems on external agents, and which certainly doesn't care about buying unnecessary military hardware to fight off against an "enemy" that they so happily keep selling cheap oil to that will never invade it. I'd like to see a government more akin to Costa Rica's, where they don't focus so much on military-led populism and actually more on sustainability and progress. The way that Maduro is running the show now is a self-destructive path that is making the country less sustainable and leaving people even poorer in the long run. You probably don't think so because you blindly buy into the left-leaning propaganda bullshit, but I suggest instead that you take a trip to Venezuela and see the situation with your own eyes. God forbid you get robbed if someone notices you're carrying dollars with you.

[Zorra]

78. I'm a third world traveler, I've been robbed before.

I travel like any other old campesino, and I'm not afraid, we're all going to die someday. I've been in some very bad places and situations.

I haven't been to Venezuela yet though; I was on my way there a few years ago but got sick near the Guatemala border and couldn't make it. I was planning to hang at El Payon, I've heard it's really beautiful. Maybe next year, but I definitely won't be visiting any cities in Venezuela, or anywhere else.

You make an awful lot of a assumptions and insults for a person living in Miami. It makes you appear young, and naive. Are you a college student? Judging from your last post, I can see you are at least not a complete provincial RW idiot. Are you from Chacao, by any chance, maybe El Rosal? I'm guessing you are a dedicated disciple of Leopoldo Lopez.

Just because you (purportedly) once lived in Venezuela doesn't mean you know jack shit about what is really going on there.

There are tens of millions of RWers in the US who don't have the slightest clue about what is going on in this country. Like you, they see only the effects, but never the real cause.

Do you think it is at all possible that global capitalists have been deliberately sabotaging Venezuela's economy? After all, it's a tough gig, being a lonely sovereign socialist nation with a lot of oil, resources, and people, that foreign capitalists desperately want to exploit for their own profit

The global power of the financial centers is so great, that they can afford not to worry about the political tendency of those who hold power in a nation, if the economic program (in other words, the role that nation has in the global economic megaprogram) remains unaltered. The financial disciplines impose themselves upon the different colors of the world political spectrum in regards to the government of any nation. The great world power can tolerate a leftist government in any part of the world, as long as the government does not take measures that go against the needs of the world financial centers. But in no way will it tolerate that an alternative economic, political and social organization consolidate. For the megapolitics, the national politics are dwarfed and submit to the dictates of the financial centers. It will be this way until the dwarfs rebel . .

http://struggle.ws/mexico/ezln/1997/jigsaw.html

The capitalists have already done enough damage to the economy of Venezuela that they will now raise oil prices again, and the economy of Venezuela may improve some, but the capitalists have done enough long term damage to the country that they will still get a RWer, someone like Capriles, Lopez, or Machado, and a maybe even RW majority elected to the AN in 2018 or whenever the next election is.

And once again, the rich will grow richer, and the poor will grow poorer, and Venezuela will grow more corrupt, just like Venezuela was before Chavez.

Buena suerte, joven.

[Judi Lynn]

80. So appreciate your comments regarding the claim just living anywhere makes you an expert on it.

We have too many total idiots right here who don't know anything whatsoever about their own country, any part of its REAL history, its people, or their political parties, and what they represent, and it's not getting better, either.

[Bacchus4.0]

86. You should go to Venezuela to see how bad it is

Oil prices will depend on the market and won't be going up soon. Its bad for Venezuela since they put all their eggs in one basket and haven't saved or invested in a sustainable diverse economy.

They will likely raise gas prices within the country to increase revenue at some point. It really pains the government to do this because this is what the last socialist president did, Andres Perez, and led to extreme violence and began chavismo essentially. Paradoxically, a raise in gas prices would affect the wealthy and middle class most, not the poor, since they don't have cars.

Anyway, lets hope Venezuela returns to the prosperity pre-Chavez instead of the out of control, crime, corruption, $20/month minimum wage, food shortages, and inept government.

[Marksman_91]

87. If by "capitalists" you mean the boligarchs running Chavismo, then you are correct

I seem to have read recently that Rafael Ramirez's cousin is among the chavistas who was caught money laundering in the Bank of Andorra. One only need to take a look at the kind of lifestyle and possessions that the top Chavista leaders have to see just how "socialist" they are.

[denverbill]

14. How hypocritical.

http://www.globaltradelawblog.com/2014/12/04/drop-your-weapons-the-united-states-restricts-military-exports-to-venezuela/

The U.S. Department of Commerce, Bureau of Industry and Security (BIS) has amended the Export Administration Regulations (EAR) to restrict exports to Venezuela of certain items intended for “a military end use or end user.” These changes complement a pre-existing U.S. arms embargo against Venezuela – in place since 2006 – that was imposed because of Venezuela’s failure to cooperate on counterterrorism initiatives.

As stated in the Federal Register notice announcing the new restrictions, since February 2014, the Venezuelan military has been cracking down on anti-government protests through direct violence against protesters and arbitrary detentions. Numerous deaths and injuries have ensued. By undermining democratic processes and institutions, Venezuela’s government constitutes an unusual and extraordinary threat to the national security and foreign policy of the United States.
......

Meanwhile in Egypt...
http://rt.com/usa/245737-us-lifts-egypt-embargo/

President Obama has lifted his arms embargo on Egypt, authorizing the deliveries of US weapons valued at over $1.3 billion, suspended after the 2013 military coup. Egyptian forces have been fighting Islamic militants in Yemen and Libya.

Among the weapons systems released are twelve F-16 aircraft, 20 “Harpoon” anti-ship missiles, and 125 upgrade kits for US-made M1A1 Abrams tanks in Egyptian service. The “executive hold” on weapons deliveries was imposed after the military overthrew the Muslim Brotherhood government of President Mohamed Morsi in October 2013. Egypt is the second-largest recipient of US military aid in the world. ...

------------------
Egypt's government is undeniably in place due to a coup. Venezuela's is democratically elected, as verified by virtually every monitor. Egypt has killed thousands and jailed at least that many. Venezuela has 'killed' maybe a hundred, but many of those deaths are of police or are actually caused by protestors.

So why are we embargoing Venezuela and selling arms to Egypt? Venezuela is a helluva lot more democratic and less repressive than Egypt. Would Egypt allow the Muslim Brotherhood to run non-stop propaganda on national television? Venezuela has Fox News equivalents that do just that. Egypt jails journalists.

Venezuela's only mistake was nationalizing the oil companies. That makes them 'undemocratic', in the eyes of the oligarchs.

[Scrabbleddie]

30. Valid point.

The purpose of empire is to secure resources and wealth.
These constant attacks on democracy are troubling.

[EX500rider]

97. "Venezuela's only mistake was nationalizing the oil companies. That makes them 'undemocratic"

You mean back in the '70's? 'Cause that's when they nationalized their oil. Like practically every other oil producing country.

"According to consulting firm PFC Energy, only 7% of the world's estimated oil and gas reserves are in countries that allow private international companies free rein. Fully 65% are in the hands of state-owned companies."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationalization_of_oil_supplies

[Dreamer Tatum]

15. Maybe they can toss in a few rolls of toilet paper, too. nt

[Jake Stern]

28. Instead of guns maybe VZ should consider ordering Charmin.

They would likely score a kick ass deal by buying in bulk.

[libdem4life]

29. All of this BS coming from the world's greatest superpower who has starving

people, tried to give them government health care...the folly? I am a proud American but I am ashamed at the level of poverty we have right here, right now. And our War/Defense Budget? And our nuclear stockpile? And our being the only nation to ever use it? And...and...and.

Just keep it in perspective please.

[BluegrassDem]

31. Maybe they're preparing to annex Aruba, since it's just off their coastline

like Argentina and the Falklands? Of course, Aruba is a part of The Netherlands, which would then invite a NATO response.

[ripcord]

38. Best way to deal with internal problems

Is to bring people together to battle an exterior enemy.

[FLPanhandle]

44. Arms purchases were probably some of the conditions attached to their Russian and Chinese loans

Those loans weren't given with just a promise to pay it back one day.

[olddad56]

46. hey, wait a minute. I thought that the US was the only country that could arm the world.

[Comrade Grumpy]

47. Hey, all you DUers with such an interest in Latin American affairs!

Here's another thread on the region that dying for comments:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10141058409

Please weigh in. This one involves actual US soldiers.

[Judi Lynn]

61. Same country where soldiers have killed civilians, dressed them in rebel clothes,

and counted them as dead "enemy" Colombians. Happened constantly for years. They were able to get vacations, etc. for their dead bodies of Colombians who were actually farmers, or students, or whoever was available to kill.

We heard ABSOLUTELY NADA from our right-wingers on this story. Not one ####ing peep. What's more, they undoubtedly favor the idea of killing all those Colombian people as part of the country's war on the poor and the indigenous and the African-Colombians who've had the nerve to live on land the multinational corporations want.

Not one peep, not even once, in all these ####ing years.

You hit it right on the head.

[ronnie624]

48. Any country with huge oil reserves, would be wise to invest in their defense,

especially in the coming years and decades. There are dangerous predators lurking.

[FLPanhandle]

51. I'd say they are wasting money

They could spend their entire income on defense and last maybe 2 weeks fighting the US or other major power. Their military is more likely to be used against thier own people.

[pampango]

52. And Ukraine wants to buy more arms to protect against its big neighbor. Its a waste.

Since the big neighbor can overwhelm them militarily no matter how many weapons they buy, money spent on arms rather than social needs is money wasted.

[Larry Engels]

53. Obama has declared Venezuela a threat to the US.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/03/09/us-usa-venezuela-idUSKBN0M51NS20150309

Venezuela would be crazy not to beef up their military.

[Marksman_91]

57. Yes, I'm sure the US is plotting a full-scale invasion of Venezuela like in Iraq

Please do try to use your reasoning.

[Comrade Grumpy]

58. Bush went with the much cheaper coup attempt option. That didn't work out so well.

Hhhmm, maybe Maduro is trying to buy his military's loyalty with shiny new toys.

[Marksman_91]

63. It's likely he's just getting ready for the worst when he decides to increase gas prices

And it baffles me that some think that others believe that the world, or even Latin America, would simply allow the US to openly invade Venezuela. Might've worked with Iraq since it had the precedent of being ruled by a dictator that the U.S. already went to war with a decade earlier. But there's no precedent for that at all in Venezuela. If Maduro was as anti-imperialist as he claims to be, he'd stop selling oil altogether to the U.S., which is essentially the same as aiding your enemy.

[Larry Engels]

74. What do you know about what the US is plotting?

Nothing.

[MADem]

59. With what? More of those oil futures they've handed off to China, or with the money they

BORROWED from China?

Idiots. Or, more to the point--IDIOT, since Maduro has been given extraordinary powers. He's driving the bus of state off a cliff.

Of course, he needs a lot of those arms in case he needs to suppress the dangerous university students with their roadblocks, burning tires and 2 litre bottle home-made gas masks....

[betterdemsonly]

73. Well if borrowing money from China is justification for a coup

than most of the world governments should be overthrown, including our own. Same goes for the existence of protesting students.

[MADem]

77. The coup has already happened--Maduro is "ruling by decree" yet again. nt

[betterdemsonly]

79. Lincoln ruled by decree in a state of emergency too

as did FDR.

[MADem]

82. You're comparing an ignorant blowhard who has squandered his country's wealth to Lincoln and FDR?

[betterdemsonly]

83. He didn't squander his countries wealth

It was stolen by the rich and by foreign investers, particularly Americans Bankers and the Saudies. He is trying to preserve it, for the average Venezuelan. Just admit you want to replace him with a Pinochet type.

[Marksman_91]

88. Wait... I thought Chavez "nationalized" the oil and enjoyed $100 a barrel for over 12 years...

That money sure as hell didn't get stolen by foreign entities. The ones who've always controlled the oil income, especially after 2002, has always been the Chavista government. If there's anyone that's stolen the Venezuelan people's money and left the country broke, it's the chavista leadership.

[betterdemsonly]

89. They have enjoyed prosperity, lowering poverty and illiteracy

rates up until recently when the Saudis dropped the price of oil. You admitted that up thread.

[Marksman_91]

93. Well, too bad for the Chavista regime that they didn't diversify the economy with that oil bonanza

In fact, what they've done is actually ruin national production levels of all kinds of products, especially thanks to that heinous currency control system that no other LatAm country has. Most of them are all doing pretty well now and improving even without a fraction of the oil reserves that Venezuela has thanks mostly to actually managing their economies in the way that anyone with even just some knowledge of economics 101 would, allowing for industries to have access to the dollars they need, and not expropriating private-sector businesses that were doing well and replacing their management with inexperienced and corrupt fanatical military assholes. Tell me again, why aren't any other countries in the region implementing the Chavista model?

[Judi Lynn]

90. You thought Chavez "nationalized" oil which had been nationalized since 1973?

Where were you in primary school?

Venezuela Timeline, BBC:

. . .

1973 - Venezuela benefits from oil boom and its currency peaks against the US dollar; oil and steel industries nationalised.

. . .

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/1229348.stm

[Marksman_91]

92. Ah, so you admit it was nationalized before Chavez came in. n/t

[Judi Lynn]

94. How odd. Never denied it. n/t

[EX500rider]

98. "It was stolen by the rich and by foreign investers, particularly Americans Bankers and the Saudies"

Any examples of "American banker/foreign investors" stealing from Venezuela?

And the price of oil dropping is not anybody "stealing from Venezuela"
It's a common occurrence in all commodities to have price fluctuation.

What IS stealing from Venezuelans is the 60%+ inflation cause by stupid price & monetary controls.

[delrem]

64. k&r!

I, too, hope to see Venezuela prosper, so as to purchase even more Russian and Chinese arms!
There's kind of a satisfaction to it.

[betterdemsonly]

68. Good because it is clear

Last edited Mon Apr 6, 2015, 11:22 AM - Edit history (1)

you neocons are planning another coup against their democratically elected government. The logic that not finding toilet paper in a flop hotel, means the government should be overthown is a dead givaway.

[Judi Lynn]

81. Hooray, betterdemsonly. Good one. Thanks. n/t

[JonLP24]

69. Yes its so important the US gives Venezuela adult supervision

while they're trafficking arms more than anybody.


US confirms $60bn Saudi arms deal
Largest ever US arms sale includes 84 Boeing F-15 fighter jets and more than 100 attack helicopters.

he United States plans to sell up to $60bn worth of military aircraft to Saudi Arabia, the US state department has announced, the largest US arms sale ever.

Andrew Shapiro, the assistant secretary of state for political-military affairs, told a news conference on Wednesday that the US administration did not anticipate any objections to the sale from Israel, traditionally wary of arms sales to nearby Arab countries.

The sale, which had been expected, includes 84 Boeing F-15 fighter jets and 70 upgrades of existing Saudi F-15s.

It also includes 70 of Boeing's Apache attack helicopters and 36 AH-6M Little Birds, lightweight helicopters often used in special operations.

Under the deal, Saudi Arabia also has the option to buy 72 Black Hawk helicopters built by Sikorsky Aircraft, a unit of United Technologies Corp.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2010/10/20101020173353178622.html

Consider both of those 2 countries are in the top 3 at-the-very least top 5 in largest proven oil reserves in the world. It bothers me but it doesn't bother me because its Venezuela when everyone is doing this.

[betterdemsonly]

70. Lets not forget the "peace loving" Saudis

often resell those weapons to Isis, Boko Harem and Al Shabaab.

[EX500rider]

99. "Saudis often resell those weapons to Isis, Boko Harem and Al Shabaab"

Any links of the Saudi government reselling arms to their enemies?

[GGJohn]

100. And you would have proof of your claims? eom.

[Larry Engels]

75. As usual here's a lot of knee-jerk anti-communism in this thread.

This happens every time Venezuela is mentioned on this site. As always, the Hubert Humphrey style red-bating liberals come out from under their rocks and attack anyone that calls himself a socialist. They have a lot in common with Freepers. In fact, I wonder why they don't go over there and post with their political allies.

[Sunlei]

85. haven't they always been russias and chinas customers? China taking all the cheap crude.

don't know how they pay for russias guns? Russia doesn't need the cheap crude, maybe they pay with drugs and meat.

[Judi Lynn]

95. Venezuela slashes military budget by 34%

Venezuela slashes military budget by 34%
Saturday, May 2, 2015

A new report by the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute found Venezuela cut its military budget by 34% last year, leading the region in arms spending cuts.

In contrast, United States political allies Paraguay and Mexico led the region in upping military spending, raising military budgets by 13% and 11%, respectively.

The Americas remains the region with the highest military spending, a fact largely attributable to the US. With an annual military budget of US$610 billion, the US accounts for one-third of global spending, amounting to more than triple the budget of the second highest spender, China.

More:
https://www.greenleft.org.au/node/58911

[libdem4life]

101. Quelle surprise.

[hughee99]

103. Well, if your population is growing increasingly unhappy with your mismanagement,

you better make sure your military is well armed.