Bernie Sanders: Hillary Clinton has big edge over me with black voters

[George II]

Source: Des Moines Register

Jennifer Jacobs, [e-mail] 2:40 p.m. CDT September 3, 2015

Bernie Sanders says he's at a disadvantage with black voters in the Democratic presidential race because Hillary Clinton has made such in-roads with them.

"I am running against ... a candidate," Sanders told The Des Moines Register's editorial board Thursday, "whose husband, who I will also not mention, but was a former president of the United States, was very popular with the African-American community. Period. And certainly that popularity will benefit Hillary Clinton."

Sanders, a U.S. senator from Vermont, said Clinton as campaigned vigorously for the presidency in 2008, she reached out to African-American leaders around the country.

"That's simply true. She has been doing this for years," he said. "So we're starting kind of way, way back."


Read more: http://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/news/elections/presidential/caucus/2015/09/03/bernie-sanders-hillary-clinton-african-american-voters-iowa-caucuses/71650218/

---

(more....)

Some more interesting quotes in that interview/article.

[arcane1]

1. This is Latest Breaking News?

[George II]

3. It's an article published in the Des Moines Register about 2 hours ago based on an interview with...

.....Senator Sanders.

Yes.

[arcane1]

6. What's the news? GDP would be a more appropriate place.

Since it's about the primary candidates. Maybe that's just me

[Bubzer]

15. I would agree with you.

[pnwmom]

37. Tomorrow that would be true. But today it is a news story. n/t

[MADem]

64. I think it's pretty big news that Sanders acknowledges he has a problem with minority support.

To hear tell here, he has no such problems, and the reason black people don't show up at his rallies is because they're busy or working late, or something.

[Thinkingabout]

65. Totally agree, also he seems to realize the Clintons have worked hard in the AA group.

[MADem]

67. +1. It's most assuredly "new information." nt

[Cha]

89. It should be Huge News to BS supporters that he has a problem with support in the AA community..

not news to me, though.

[MADem]

92. Agreed! nt

[BlueCaliDem]

103. It's odd that it's big news to his supporters. Poll after poll shows that Hillary Clinton

has 70-80% of African-American support and 73% Hispanic/Latino support. Asians will break for her, too, just as they had for President Obama (73%) in last presidential election.

He also has ZERO endorsements from congresisonal Dems and gubernatorial Dems. This won't bode well for his ambitious agenda should he win the White House and try and keep his campaign promises. None of it can happen without Congress.

[Cha]

153. It's called "denial" .. they live in it. They've denied it but now that BS has come out and

admitted it.. there goes one of their talking points.

Same with the "drones". talking point? Gone.

Maybe those Congressional people who have worked with him all these years and aren't endorsing him have a good reason. They'd rather work with Hillary.

[BlueCaliDem]

156. That's the vibe I've been getting, too, Cha.

Same with the "drones". talking point? Gone.

Yes, I've noticed a deafening silence these days. A few weeks back and for years, before it was made known that Bernie Sanders not only voted for the drone program but supports continued use of it, there were many, many OPs condemning the president. Now we don't see any of those kinds of posts from the usual suspects.

Maybe those Congressional people who have worked with him all these years and aren't endorsing him have a good reason.

Yes, Cha, that's the vibe I've been getting these days, too. Most of them have worked with him in the House for a very long time. Now he's in the Senate. Yet he still hasn't received any endorsements from his colleagues. That's mighty strange.

[Cha]

160. These Dems in the Senate and House know how Important it is to win.. and they want someone

as President they can work with.

the BS supporters refer to them as "establishment" but that's just another broad brush label that means nothing in this situation.

We elect them and they're there to do our Democratic business for our Country.

Look how many are coming together for President Obama, SOS Kerry, and VP Biden's Iran Deal!

[Scootaloo]

126. He acknowledges Clinton has an advantage

Subtle difference, but a difference

[Bubzer]

14. It's not... it is a re-hash of older news.

Not sure why it's being presented as new.

[brooklynite]

47. The NEWS is that Sanders recognizes it as an issue...unlike some of his supporters

[randys1]

2. If only Bernie supporters, many of them, would act even remotely similar to Bernie himself.

This is one of the reasons I like Bernie.

He does two things here, recognizes his issue and compliments Hillary, does NOT attack her.

This almost NEVER happens from his supporters on DU.

[jalan48]

4. Can he count on your support in the primary then?

[randys1]

5. Let me ask you a question, how many years, not weeks or months, have you been

a fan of Bernie's?

How many Friday's have you listened to him on Thom's show?

[Bubzer]

16. I remember listening to him back when Air-America was still up and running.

It was good to hear his viewpoints. I found many of his stances were similar to mine.

[jalan48]

24. I've been a fan since the 90's. How about you?

[randys1]

29. Just about, problem is many are new to the party because this party is a way to bash

and oppose Hillary.

If you dont think there is a lot to that, then you havent paid attention to the right and the Clintons or for that matter the right and Obama.

My point simply is, support Bernie all we want and great, but as BOTH Bernie and Thom have made CLEAR do NOT bash Hillary in the process, thus harming her if she is the nominee.

Unlike many here, Bernie knows the difference between any con and her.

ever heard of Crater Lake? kinda that much difference

[jalan48]

34. Oh yes-Crater Lake is about 2 hrs from me, it's beautiful.

I think part of the reason we Bernie supporters are so brash is that we see a big difference between Bernie and Hillary. To go from Bernie to Hillary is a big leap-she's a corporatist. To go from Hillary to Bernie isn't such a big leap. He stands for all the things Hillary does minus the Wall St. influence. We're concerned Hillary will do little to right the economic injustice taking place today in the US. We're concerned that she will work with Republicans to cut back on programs such as Social Security.

She is definitely better than the Republicans but voting in a negative manner isn't the best way to go. I'd like to hear more about what her supporters are excited about. What is it about Hillary that makes them say-"She's great, and here's why".

[randys1]

36. Voting negative, does this mean you wont vote if she is the candidate?

[jalan48]

40. No I've voted every year since 1972.

McGovern was the first Presidential candidate I voted for.

[randys1]

42. but if it is Hillary vs any con , do you vote Hillary or vote 3rd party thus avoid

negative voting as you said?

[jalan48]

44. Well-it's too early to tell.

Let's see how the primaries shape up and who's running. I can say for certain I will not be voting for Republican. I'd like to hear more from Hillary about what she wants to do. I'm a little dismayed that there are no debates until October (it's things like this that get we Bernie supporters up in arms). Like I said above-what is that Hillary believes in that makes her supporters so excited about her. Any ideas?

[randys1]

45. So there is a chance if Hillary is the nominee you might vote 3rd party? Correct me if i am wrong

You see I wont because I want to avoid these

[jalan48]

46. Couple of things

What is the photo of that you want to avoid?

I really would like to hear more about what Hillary stands for.

The Republicans just asked their candidates to agree to a "no third party run". I find that offensive. People should stand up for what they believe in I think.

[randys1]

48. Illegal abortion room pre Roe v Wade.

Enough reason for me to work 24/7 to elect Hillary if that is who the candidate is

I wont have to wait and see about anything


Or if I cared about Black people voting, 24/7 work for Hillary

Environment, 24/7 work for Hillary

[jalan48]

49. That is a big issue for sure.

The sad thing is that the women of the 1% will always have access to abortions. That's what is so hypocritical about the Republican's. Money always talks. That's why I like Bernie-he connects the dots about what is going on in our country. Let's see how the primaries play out and may the best man/woman win!

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

108. I've not yet heard a Sanders supporter say they won't vote for the dem nominee.

And Bernie is running for President of the US. He is smart not to criticize Hillary at this point. But we that are NOT running can say whatever the fuck we want - just like you apparently like to do. So, cut us some slack. Just because nobody can dig up any dirt on Bernie isn't our problem.

Respect!

[CoffeeCat]

58. I do not care for Hillary...

...at all. I despise much of what she stands for. I have disliked her for a long time and if she wins our nomination, I will consider myself politically homeless. As a lifelong Democrat, that's hard to say.

She represents, to me--the devolution of politics in America--as the corporations have taken control of our democracy because politicians like Hillary have sold out. I don't like her warmongering either.

I cringed when she saber rattled for war with Iran when Bush was President. And Hillary--more than anyone--know better. Because when her husband was President, the neocons wrote him a letter. They asked him for war with Iraq. He refused. Then Bush becomes President and the same bastards who asked her husband for an Iraq war were back again, this time using the terror of 9/11 to get their war in Iraq.

Hillary knew better than anyone that those neocon scumbags who penned the letter to her husband in 1996, had been salivating for this war for years. Among those who signed the 1996 letter were Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz, John Bolton and others who were now in the Bush Administration. And she voted for it.

She could have stood on the Senate floor with that 1996 letter and renounced the war and the neocons as bloodthirsty con artists. But she didn't.

Hillary's biggest contributors are Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan and Citibank.

If she is our nominee, I will just assume that we are screwed as a party. These are firmly held beliefs based on years of being plugged into politics and paying attention.

I don't appreciate the shush-ing of those who want us to just fall in line with a corporate sellout war-cheerleader. What she stands for when it comes to fracking, the Keystone pipeline, reigning in the big banks and more war--aren't even Democratic principles! Don't accuse those who point out her obvious and sad policy stances--of ruining her or destroying her. Her behavior and her positions have done that for her.

[PADemD]

61. +1

[FrodosPet]

98. Sorry to see you go

[CoffeeCat]

99. Where am I going?

I hope not anywhere with these guys.

They've got hideous mustaches.

[FrodosPet]

101. Aren't you leaving the Democratic Party if Sec Clinton wins?

Apologies. I thought this was a GBCW post.



I guess I misunderstood.

[The Road Runner]

128. I thought those 'staches looked pretty good!

LOL...Just saying.

[BillH2]

109. Interesting that Bill turned down the neocons' Iraq war plan in '96.

Good for him.

[randys1]

121. AS I told someone else, since my pocketbook isnt all that matters to me, if Hillary is the nom

i will vote for her to prevent this

[BlueCaliDem]

127. That image terrifies me as well as makes me sad.

We can't go back to that. EVER.

As long as the Republican Party caters to the bigoted, misogynist, xenophobic base of their Party, and they make NO attempts to publicly condemn their outrageous even criminal acts and prejudiced attitudes, we must continue to vote straight Democratic Party en masse.

NO MORE REPUBLICANS!!

[randys1]

134. Yes, but you do see the circle we are in that cant be broken, right? By having THESE

choices we have to support a political party that on a true scale is centrist.

WE dont have a liberal political party anymore, we have a rightwing group of zealot religious and economic crazies, and we have the Democratic Party, which is really the conservative party.

But, due to social issues like Women's rights and so on we have to do what we have to do.

[BlueCaliDem]

141. Centrist?? Hardly, especially since the election of President Obama.

DOMA - gone. A liberal value.
DADT - gone. A liberal value.
Universal Affordable Healthcare - law of the land. A liberal value.
Same-Sex Marriage - law of the land. A liberal value.
Lifting sanctions and resuming relations with Cuba - happening. A liberal value.
DREAM Act - happening. A liberal value.
$10.10 for federal contract workers (affecting 70% of workers with federal contractors) - done. A liberal value.
The Lily Ledbetter Fair Pay Act - law. A liberal value.
Stopping Republicans from doing away with Roe v Wade - successful. A liberal value.

These are just a few examples off the top of my head. There are many, many more. And these all originated through the Democratic Party. Is it enough? Of course not. But the majority of Americans aren't liberal. Left of center, yes, but, in their minds, not liberal. Yet. And the American people, although they mostly agree with Bernie Sanders, don't have a clue how our three co-equal branches of gov't make up a whole.

But was Rome built in eight years? Of course not. We need more time, and we need to understand that.

That's why it's important to get as many Democrats elected as possible instead of castigating them to the point that we develop an innate hatred for them and refuse to vote for them. Because the alternative is having Republicans win, and if they do, they'll undo everything we have accomplished so far. Guaranteed.

[randys1]

146. Socially, yes, other than that, no.

I am a huge supporter of Obama, financially, physically, on the internet, etc.


And given unprecedented obstruction, well I call him Superman

But other than social issues, the democratic party is a centrist party.

Bernie is the left of our conscience, I am even further to the left than him.

I would love to move our party to the left on those issues where it needs to be moved.

[Scootaloo]

155. It can be broken by supporting progressive candidates

When the chance is presented, grab it.

[BlueCaliDem]

157. For Congress rather than the presidency, though.

Just electing a very left candidate for president isn't going to change anything.

[Scootaloo]

158. The point is still the same.

[BlueCaliDem]

159. Yes, but details matter IF you really want change. eom

[BlueCaliDem]

129. If she's the Democratic Party nom, will you vote for her? eom

[JDPriestly]

117. This Des Moines Register interview is another example of Bernie's incredibly realistic.view of

himself, of his brilliant. Ability to analyze problems and of his utter honesty.

We have never had a candidate and perhaps never will with Bernie's humility and integrity.

It would be tragic for America should any other candidate be elected.

In my view, it is either Bernie or the continuation of the machine politics and all the ugly corruption that machine politics brings with it if we elect anyone other than Bernie.

Bernie is a once in a lifetime opportunity for our country.

I do not think that a candidate with Hillary's. Ambition and political connections needs to be protected from her critics on DU.

I think we all need to view and discuss each candidate honestly (as Bernie does in that article). We owe that to our children and grandchildren.

We will not get another. Chance like Bernie for a long time.

Honest criticism of Hillary is perfectly in place in this discussion forum.

The fact is that if Hillary is such a wonderful candidate, if she would make a better president than Sanders, we eould read persuasive articles proving that on Du.

We don't read them because not even Howard Dean can write one. That is because Hillary is not the best candidate running.

The only areas in which she is superior to Bernie are money, connections and name recognition.

Other than that Bernie wins, hands down.

Feel the Bern. Because it is real.

[JI7]

7. exactly. what he said was true and respectful

He knows this is a long time relationship. It's not because"they don't know better".

[Ken Burch]

10. What the supporters were reacting to was the false claim that Bernie was weak on black issues.

He was never weak on speaking out against institutional racism and he NEVER said, contrary to the repeated strawman, that economic equality by itself would end racism.

It goes without saying that Bernie doesn't deserve to be behind HRC among black voters if you consider his actual record in office and on the issues.

Some of the supporters reacted intemperately, but much of the Clinton supporters' attacks on Bernie on race were based on total lies. People get tired of seeing their candidate unfairly attacked.

Bernie has put the issues on this to rest now, and his support will grow among all groups in the next few months.

[Bubzer]

18. There's no shortage of people who want to advocate for their candidate.

Some get a little bit wrapped up in the emotional investment and that comes out in less than beneficial ways.

[WHEN CRABS ROAR]

27. Weak on black issues? look at his history

Bernie cut his political teeth on civil rights issues, in 1961 he was a chapter leader at the University of Chicago in the Congress of Racial Equality, the civil rights group that organized the Freedom Rides, he helped to launch a sit-in at the University of Chicago President's Office over housing discrimination in the university owned apartment buildings.
He hasn't been late to black issues, he was way early.

[Ken Burch]

38. I know all that...but the lie was reposted over and over and over again. n/t.

[BlueCaliDem]

107. And yet, civil rights icon, Rep. John Lewis, endorses Hillary Clinton, not Bernie Sanders.

As a student at Fisk University, John Lewis organized sit-in demonstrations at segregated lunch counters in Nashville, Tennessee. In 1961, he volunteered to participate in the Freedom Rides, which challenged segregation at interstate bus terminals across the South. Lewis risked his life on those Rides many times by simply sitting in seats reserved for white patrons. He was also beaten severely by angry mobs and arrested by police for challenging the injustice of Jim Crow segregation in the South.

During the height of the Movement, from 1963 to 1966, Lewis was named Chairman of the Student Nonviolent Coordinating Committee (SNCC), which he helped form. SNCC was largely responsible for organizing student activism in the Movement, including sit-ins and other activities.

While still a young man, John Lewis became a nationally recognized leader. By 1963, he was dubbed one of the Big Six leaders of the Civil Rights Movement. At the age of 23, he was an architect of and a keynote speaker at the historic March on Washington in August 1963.

In 1964, John Lewis coordinated SNCC efforts to organize voter registration drives and community action programs during the Mississippi Freedom Summer. The following year, Lewis helped spearhead one of the most seminal moments of the Civil Rights Movement. Hosea Williams, another notable Civil Rights leader, and John Lewis led over 600 peaceful, orderly protestors across the Edmund Pettus Bridge in Selma, Alabama on March 7, 1965. They intended to march from Selma to Montgomery to demonstrate the need for voting rights in the state. The marchers were attacked by Alabama state troopers in a brutal confrontation that became known as "Bloody Sunday." News broadcasts and photographs revealing the senseless cruelty of the segregated South helped hasten the passage of the Voting Rights Act of 1965.
https://johnlewis.house.gov/john-lewis/biography

[blackspade]

119. Which is definitely his prerogative!

And I think that we all know Lewis' accomplishments (I would hope so anyway!).
His opinion does carry weight, but I don't view his support for Clinton as a slam on Sanders or his accomplishments.
He is merely expressing who he feels will best support his own agenda as the President.
It will be up to Sanders to change his mind and others within the Black community.

[BlueCaliDem]

125. And one he's earned with blood, sweat, and tears, may I add.

And I think that we all know Lewis' accomplishments (I would hope so anyway!).

For those who might know but not in detail, my post serves to help inform and remind.

His opinion does carry weight, but I don't view his support for Clinton as a slam on Sanders or his accomplishments.

Oh no, that's not what I'm saying. And although NO ONE should discredit Senator Sanders' brave actions in favor of civil rights and the civil rights movement, my point was that he, having worked consistently for the progress of civil and equal rights for all, sees something in Hillary Clinton we might not. That's all.

It will be up to Sanders to change his mind and others within the Black community.

Absolutely!

[blackspade]

131. "blood, sweat, and tears"

Literally.

on your response.

[BlueCaliDem]

136. Yes. Absolutely literally.

Thanks, blackspade.

[blackspade]

138. Back at ya!

[AgingAmerican]

11. I don't recall Sanders supporters

Calling Hillary supporters, "White supremacists" or anything even remotely close to that.

The lack of self awareness in some Hillary supporters is puzzling.

[1StrongBlackMan]

57. I DO recall ...

A, as in ONE ... just like the ONE BLM protester, who has not declared who she supports, called (some) Bernie supporters white supremacists ... And I, also, recall a Bernie supporter calling a (IIRC) HRC supporter a RACE-NAGGER.

The projection in some Bernie supporters is puzzling; but, ever presenting.

[AgingAmerican]

59. And it was repeated ad nauseum here on DU!!

By Hillary supporters for two solid weeks after that incident.

It's what they do....

[1StrongBlackMan]

62. DUers called Bernie supporters white supremacists? Link please or acknowledge the lie. n/t

[AgingAmerican]

63. Sure

Here are a few dozen for you to mull over

Several hides because of it too...it's all in the above link *IF you actually dare to look*....

[MADem]

69. Those links don't prove what you claim they are proving--that's a cheap trick, to send people to

Google.

For example, the very top link goes to this thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027058557

The thread was locked because it was OFF TOPIC, no "HIDE" there--and the people being "accused" are BLM activists, not DUers.

The second link is to a SALON article talking about Sanders supporters; not about DUers.

Your link does not support your claims.

[AgingAmerican]

70. Yes they do

I would link to the actual hides, but that would be a TOS violation.

Have a nice evening...GO SEAHAWKS!!

[MADem]

71. The first TWO LINKS at your "source" don't say what you claimed they said.

Don't expect people to do your homework for you.

I dug down two feet, which is more than I should have had to do. You either provide proof of your claims or be regarded as insincere.

Again--your link didn't say what you said it said, and I proved it by providing the top two citations at your source.

So, one more time--NO -- they don't.

[AgingAmerican]

72. And you stopped at two why?

When I posted the proof I did not expect it to be acknowledged.

[1StrongBlackMan]

74. Because your "proof" didn't prove anything. n/t

[MADem]

149. Fool me ONCE, shame on you. Fool me TWICE, shame on me.

I figured at that point you were not sincere.

[1StrongBlackMan]

73. I don't know if he is being dishonest ...

foolish, or thinks I am stupid, or perhaps, intimidated.

Either, way ... he, clearly did not read the links he provided ... even the hidden posts.

[MADem]

76. I know from admired experience that you're neither stupid nor intimidated.

But those links don't say what the poster said they said.

I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt, and allow him to correct his error.... if he can.



I like to cut people some slack. If there's no course correction, well, we'll know...

[1StrongBlackMan]

82. I took the time to review each of those threads ... every single comment ...

while there was plenty of discussion of white supremacy ... the only post that I saw that came close to calling Bernie supporters white supremacists was:

post #18 of the "Sanders Accysed of "White Supremacist Liberalism".??? thread (the first link):

Just read something on a jury that gives me pause ... a little pause, though not much of it.

Apparently Bernie does have pockets of white supremacist supporters, and #BLM folk have been trying to call attention to that.

But I suspect that poster either, knows/knew that, but thought no one would make the effort to check; or, didn't care, and was trying to continue the lie.

You are much more charitable than I, as I suspect the latter.

[MADem]

83. My charitable nature has taken a hell of a beating lately!

When people play games here, and get found out, it only hurts them, at the end of the day.

[Tarheel_Dem]

115. Very interesting slight of hand you got there. What you just tried to pull off is beneath you & DU.

For shame.

[George II]

77. Actually that isn't even true - here is what really happened.....

.....which Sanders supporters refuse to accept.

When she was being booed and heckled, she said that they were "ACTING like white supremacists", referring to their booing and heckling. She NEVER said any of them WERE white supremacists.

There is a HUGE difference between saying someone is "acting like a white supremacist" and saying he is "a white supremacist".

I just wish the Sanders supporters would get over that totally incorrect portrayal of the incident.

[1StrongBlackMan]

85. I know that, and have raised that point several times ...

But I was trying to speak to the second most zombieish of DU myths ... HRC supporters having called Bernie supporters white supremacists. That zombie get just slightly less play than, "PoC/HRC supporters said Bernie was a racist/doesn't care about Black people."

Bith of these myths originated, and exist, in the minds of Bernie supporters, who are trying ... desperately ... to deflect from/dismiss admitting what PoC are actually saying ... that Bernie's economic primacy message misses us because our life experience has us prioritizing social justice over economic justice.

[blackspade]

124. I'm definitely over it.

And so is Sanders.
In fact I'm on the other side of it in fact.
I thought that the BLM press release afterward was right on the money.

[Scootaloo]

139. You've got a few things wrong

It wasn't a statement from her interruption of the Westlake Social Security event.
It had only tangential relation to the booing.
There was no 'acting like" clause.

No, it's from her interview with This week in Blackness. When she was asked by the interviewers about her calling the entire crowd racists (which yeah, she did that - again, no qualifiers) she responded,

I would say that anybody who hears me say that, and thinks about their feelings first, is a white supremacist.

[George II]

142. Where in that statement does she call Sanders supporters white supremacists?

And what was the exact statement she made at the Seattle event? Do you know or did you hear it?

[Scootaloo]

144. Where did I say she did?

As for what she said at the event,

...That I have to get up here in front of a bunch of screaming white racists to say my life fucking matters

[George II]

145. You going to dole out "quotes" one by one and move along as they're discredited?

At least your idol recognizes he has a serious problem with minorities, sad you don't, so I'm outa here.

[Scootaloo]

147. They're actual quotes from Marissa Johnson.

The first from her "This Week in Blackness" interview, the second from the Social Security event she interrupted last month.

My only "idol" is Neil DeGrasse Tyson. And the only minorities he has a problem with is hte minority that thinks the earth is six thousand years old.

Is there a reason for your hostility?

[blackspade]

123. This again?

Listen, we live in a world dominated by white supremacy. That is a fact.
Western 'culture' and capitalism at it's heart is about the supremacy of white Europeans over the rest of the world.
It is an ideology that pervades popular media, culture, business, etc the world over.

What BLM protesters were doing was holding up a mirror to the white liberals that pat themselves on the back for creating a liberal and progressive place to live while at the same time having a police force that is so brutal that they are under Federal oversight.
The fact that white liberal policies have still left Black Americans at the mercy of police brutality and institutionalized discrimination should be a cold reminder of how far we still have to go as liberals, progressives and Democrats.

[noiretextatique]

19. maybe because his supporters aren't running for president?

just a guess

[virtualobserver]

32. it is hard to find an thread that does not include a criticism of Bernie "supporters"

[randys1]

33. Just certain types, groups, on DU etc. I dont know one in real life who bashes Hillary all day long

including myself.

[virtualobserver]

39. give me an example of something that you would consider "bashing"

[randys1]

41. Endless stories, links about email, the non issue email. Playing right into gop hands.

Enthusiasm gap.

Ties to wall street, either you dont see these and there are hundreds over the past weeks or you dont see that as bashing.

You see I do because it is IDENTICAL to what the TEAPARTY is doing, it is THEIR PLAYBOOK

[virtualobserver]

53. I'll tell you how I feel about it

I see posts about the email issue as being in the same category as Hillary supporters talking about a "socialist" being unelectable

These are political judgments- the problem with the email isn't that Hillary has committed a horrific crime
the criticism is that she made a political misjudgment in setting up that server, and hasn't handled it well politically.
I feel that this is a heavy weight on her candidacy and could doom it, and Hillary supporters feel that it is having minimal effect.

Hillary supporters say that a "socialist" is unelectable, doomed from the start, whereas I feel that when people are exposed to the reality of Bernie,
the label won't mean any more to the average voter than it does now with the incorrect application of that term to President Obama.

As for her ties to Wall Street and the banks and other types of corporations......they exist......she isn't alone, but that constant infusion of money broadly from rich donors
to her campaign, and the much larger donations to her SuperPACS have the same straitjacket effect on her as they do on every other politician
in the United States. I believe that we have reached a point of no return....if this isn't reversed now, people will lose total control of the government.
I also believe that you can turn their money into a political disadvantage by attacking it in the way that Bernie does.

The flip side of this argument is made by the Hillary supporters.....that you can't win without this money, and that we will lose it all
if we don't get big donors of our own.....and the less radical solutions that Hillary proposed are far better than the doomsday scenario
where we lose by a landslide with our underfunded campaign and the Republicans then destroy what is left of planet earth.

I don't see any of these things as bashing......to me they are just evidence of serious philosophical differences, even if it gets a little heated.

[Thinkingabout]

66. Good post randy.

[merrily]

132. Very few threads in the Bernie Group criticize Bernie's supporters.

And we serve yummy cookies. (not the creepy kind that follow you around the net.)

[GitRDun]

51. +1

It's why I like him too.

And what's wrong with recognizing the issue...it is what it is.

The only debate should be can he and should he be able to make some inroads.

[840high]

87. Vote for Bernie not his supporters.

[Marrah_G]

111. I have never attacked Hillary

And there are many others who never have either. You are viewing this through tinted glasses. I think some Sanders supporters would say the same thing about Hillary supporters.

[randys1]

113. Holy cow, this board is full of rightwing nonsense about HIllary, someone sure is attacking her

Wow

This is the kind of response that makes me wonder who is who and what is what. I am tired of trying to figure out who is here for what reason because I thought this place was exclusive for liberals.

This board is down to almost EXCLUSIVELY bashing Hillary over emails and Benghazi and lack of enthusiasm, but some of you appear to not see that.

As a Bernie supporter for longer than most here have known who he is, that disappoints me.

[Marrah_G]

116. I am a Sanders supporter, have been for a very long time

I also see posts bashing him here also. It is like this EVERY primary. Small groups from opposite camps of the front runners bash the other candidate and then people on both sides complain about the bashing, each side seeing mostly just their own being bashed.

Nothing really changes.

[randys1]

120. No, stop. The bashing of Hillary is UNPRECEDENTED other than that of Obama, it is rightwing memes

and lies and nonstories being used, on DU by Sanders supporters.

And that infuriates me, as a Sanders supporter.

Sorry, this is anything but SOP campaign stuff.

[Marrah_G]

122. Well, I can see this won't go anywhere

You are dug in deep. Have a nice day Randy. Best advice I can leave you with is to relax a bit, because if you let this get to you, your health will be affected by the stress.

[Scootaloo]

140. Maybe you'd do better to address the poroblem where it occurs

Instead of smearing all bernie supporters about it in an unrelated thread.

[azurnoir]

8. True enough but then again Hillary's been politicking on the national stage for nearly 24 years

and she's good at stuff like this too

Hillary Clinton stops in Detroit on way to fundraiser

http://detroit.suntimes.com/det-news/7/77/266067/hillary-clinton-stops-detroit

[Thinkingabout]

68. Actually, with Bernie's time in Congress, he has been on the national stage

Since his election in 1990, Bill Clinton was not elected president until 1992 so Bernie has had more time on the national stage.

[azurnoir]

75. ah ya being a Congressman from Vermont puts one on the national stage like being the FLOTUS or SoS

[Thinkingabout]

79. This is something Bernie could have made himself known, Ted Kennedy was known,

Pat Leahy is well known, Elizabeth has only been in Congress for a short time and she is known, Chuck Schumer is known, There are many many more who are known, known for the work they do. It was on Bernie to become well known.

[azurnoir]

81. for those that have paying attention Bernie was known too , he's been doing a good job of becoming

more so of late

[Thinkingabout]

150. Yes it was late, opinions had already formed.

[Tarheel_Dem]

9. BS must understand that his standing is not going to change significantly. He's peaked in much of...

the country, and we're still not "Feeling the Bern". Quite honestly, much of the blame lies with BS, and there's a reason for this. Blame it on "name recognition", "the DNC/DLC/DSCC" or whatever the conspiracy du jour is, but the distrust, resentment and anger run deep for many of us. He & his more strident advocates have spent much of the past seven years attacking the POTUS who has maintained 90%+ approval with the party's most loyal constituency. Gee, that couldn't possibly have an effect, right?

As a person of color, he was never an option for me, and I've made no bones about it. And his libertarian following has made that possibility a non-starter. So far, the only candidate who might provide real competition to HRC's path to the nomination might be my 2nd choice, and he hasn't even announced.

I will say, however, that it's good that even if his supporters can't see the problem, he can.

[AgingAmerican]

13. Every month we hear how 'he peaked'

Yet the next month he gains on her again. Just wait til the Debates begin.

[Tarheel_Dem]

20. 9% support from people of color is not "gaining", it's a death rattle. Debates won't change that.

[AgingAmerican]

23. Doesn't matter

He will steamroll her once the debates begin. There is no POC 'hive mind', sorry. Once reasonable people understand who the best candidate is, they will vote for him irregardless of your threats and fantasies.

[Tarheel_Dem]

25. Dream on! Much like Ben Carson can't help the GOP with POC, BS can't help himself.

[AgingAmerican]

26. Bookmarking

nt

[Tarheel_Dem]

28. Me too.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/us/2016_democratic_presidential_nomination-3824.html

[HomerRamone]

17. Did he criticize Obama because Obama was African-American?

Dis his followers? And some of Hillary's followers are centrist, so should that leave no possibility that I will listen to HER?

[Tarheel_Dem]

22. BS recognizes a problem. Why don't you?

[HomerRamone]

30. The problem he recognizes is that Hillary has a head start with African Americans

Whether she really is such a good choice, in light of her and her husband's positions with NAFTA and so forth, is another matter

[Tarheel_Dem]

35. Too many of you confuse Democrats with liberals. Liberals can be Greens, Socialists, etc. who have

no particular party or party loyalty, which explains how we end up with divided government. There aren't enough liberals in the country to mount a credible national campaign, so they dip in & out of the Democratic party at will. The Democratic party is center left, it is not a liberal oasis, and I don't think it even purports to be.

Liberals make lots of noise on the interwebs, but they are not the majority of Democrats, or we'd probably be saying President Kucinich right about now.

[noiretextatique]

50. you are right about the party, but wrong about the voters

a majority of democrats self-identify as liberal, at least on social issues. maybe it is time for the party to catch up.

[Tarheel_Dem]

55. Pew: "The Liberal Elite Is Liberal, But the Democrats are not"

Pew Research’s ideological consistency classifications among self-identified Democratic-leaners, by demographic group.

[Bluenorthwest]

78. Yes, you should be proud of conservative Democrats like Kim Davis.

Conservative Democrats and what they stand for are in the news and in the jail cells. They are now called Kim Davis Democrats.

[Bluenorthwest]

80. Are you a Kim Davis Democrat? She's the jailed clerk in Kentucky who is in fact a Democrat

and since she's conservative you are claiming she's the actual Party, not the liberals she's discriminating against. I mean, you get that don't you?

[Bubzer]

31. "He's peaked in much of..." feels a bit like trying to set the narative.

We've heard that statement over and over, and each time it gets said, Bernie Sanders (not "BS", which is borderline insulting) goes on to have yet another massive gathering at a convention. We've got this cycle where someone (usually a Hillary supporter) makes this claim, and then he gets even more popular. Polls have shown a steady rise in Bernie's popularity, and a steady decline in Hillary's. Its fairly hard to make a reasonable argument against those numbers.

[Tarheel_Dem]

43. NYT: Bernie Sanders’s Support: Even More Unequal Than U.S. Incomes

Bernie Sanders’s Support: Even More Unequal Than U.S. Incomes
Nate Cohn | AUG. 27, 2015


The supporters of Bernie Sanders keep telling me that I’m wrong about their coalition, which I’ve written is too narrow to succeed. At this rate, Mr. Sanders doesn’t have nearly enough support among moderate, nonwhite and Southern voters to win the Democratic presidential nomination.

So here’s a different framework for thinking about Mr. Sanders’s challenge, perhaps one that will resonate with his supporters: inequality.

It is tempting to look at Mr. Sanders’s huge crowds and assume that he has a good chance. To me, that’s as convincing as saying the Connecticut economy is booming because the houses in Greenwich are so big and pretty.

.....It’s the same thing for the Sanders campaign. In places like Seattle; Portland, Ore.; and Burlington, Vt., more than a thousand people showed up to house parties. But in 12 congressional districts, there were no Sanders events at all.

The public opinion polls show the problem. While Mr. Sanders is in striking distance of Hillary Rodham Clinton in Oregon and Wisconsin — and a second New Hampshire poll shows him leading — there are vast swaths of the country where Mr. Sanders has little support at all. He’s down by 68 points in Alabama, 78 to 10. He has 11 percent support in Georgia. In rural Georgia, he has 6 percent. Many surveys show him struggling to get out of the single digits among black voters, who represent around 20 percent of the Democratic primary electorate.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/28/upshot/the-inequality-of-support-in-bernie-sanderss-campaign.html?_r=0

The "crowd" narrative has been put into perspective. Basically, BS & DT are appealing to flipsides of the same coin.

[1StrongBlackMan]

104. Good Article. n/t

[blackspade]

130. "Basically, BS & DT are appealing to flipsides of the same coin."

Um, no. That is patently false.
You were making a great point that should be at the forefront of Sanders' ongoing strategy and then......

[Tarheel_Dem]

133. White folks itching to get another white man back in the Oval Office. I think that sums it up.

The fact that you disagree is of absolutely no concern to me.

[blackspade]

135. Your summation is incorrect.

But, like you said, that is of absolutely no concern to yours and you are entitled to your opinion.

[Scootaloo]

148. Real quick, is there a non-white candidate running for Democratic nomination?

I know there's a Jewish candidate...

[Tarheel_Dem]

152. Nope, but there's someone running who isn't "another white man". We've had 43 of them. Get it?

[Scootaloo]

154. Well, your stress on the "white folks" kinda throws it off

'cause... all the candidates are white, at least on the democratic side.

One is a woman. The one right behind her is Jewish. Either way we're not looking at "demographics as usual," are we?

[noiretextatique]

54. i am a black Sanders supporter, and i have none of this so-called mistrust

or resentment or anger, nor would i allow random internet posters to influence my vote. obama deserves some criticism, and i am not mad a people who criticize him, constructively, at least. i do think Clinton has a huge advantage with the black vote, but not because of the resentment, anger, etc. it is because: 1) her husband was popular with black voters and so is she; and 2) black people are just as conventional as most voters.

[Tarheel_Dem]

56. He has "black support". There just aren't enough of you. Oh, and he's got this guy.

Should do wonders for BS' AA outreach, and good luck with that!

[Cha]

84. Yeah, BS has Dr West.. but, I say Go for it Bernie.. see how far his racist diatribes against

President Obama get you with the African American Community.

Tarheel

[Tarheel_Dem]

86. After the umpteenth debate, and BS is still hovering in the single digits, what will be the....

excuse then? BS & his supporters haven't endeared themselves to our community, and the BLM aftermath didn't help at all.

[Cha]

93. Dunno, but BS needs to make up his mind.. he says Hill has more support bc of "her husband".. and

then he says .. "she's reached out to them for years".. Which is it, Bernie? Because of Bill or did she do it on her own?

Not impressed with this at all.. and, yes, the way he reacted to #BlackLivesMatter wasn't helping his case.

[1StrongBlackMan]

106. What will be the excuse? ... that's easy to predict ...

1) The system is rigged ... the oligarchs shut down the media.

2) The system is rigged ... the Democratic establishment closed him out.

3) The system is rigged ... and full of ignorant sheep.

[Tarheel_Dem]

114. 1SBM, you old soothsayer, you. That's sound exactly right. The CT's surrounding BS would make Alex

Jones blush.

[blackspade]

137. 1 & 2 are correct currently....

#3 not so much.
Sanders can run a solid campaign and still loose. There are a lot of things against him at this point, the deficit in the AA vote being one of them.
If he did make inroads into Clinton's huge lead with minority voters he could still loose because of a system controlled by big money and corporate interests.
It will be an uphill battle for him, but he is a good campaigner with a solid message and staff.
I guess we will find out in the next 6 months!

[Truprogressive85]

12. What has Clinton done for AA?

Here some good news Sen. Sanders this African- American is not one of her supporters

I'm looking for the alternate to Clinton as I did in 08' whether is Sanders or O'malley , Chaffe depends on how they address issues that are important to the communities people like me and my friends live in

[noiretextatique]

21. likewise...not a Hillary supporter

i will be voting for the alternative in the primary.

[qwlauren35]

102. My recollection

Is that Clinton put a lot of black people on his staff.

It was during Clinton's time that the anti-AFDC/welfare queen people got him to put the three year moratorium on AFDC at the end of his term. This was major. But it was the end of his term.

[HassleCat]

52. Can't be true

A candidate who doesn't spin the truth to make things look better for himself? This "Bernie Sanders" guy sounds like some character in a movie, maybe Jimmie Stewart in Mr. Smith Goes to Washington. I plan to vote for him, but now I'm not sure he's a real politician.

[Gregorian]

60. I know! I love it. He just speaks the truth. It will only help.

I love this guy. No bullshit.

[840high]

88. ....x10+

[freshwest]

90. She's worked with POC for a long, long time. Thanks for posting this. A little more:

Former ACORN chief backs Hillary Clinton



By Carl Campanile - April 20, 2015

Bertha Lewis — the former head of ACORN and a longtime powerful voice of progressivism in New York City - says she’s “ready for Hillary...”

And Lewis says Clinton long ago proved her progressive bona fides. Clinton earned Lewis’ “admiration and respect” for the beating she took when the health-care expansion plan she helped craft with her husband, then-President Bill Clinton, was rejected.

“Hillary recovered from that. Absolutely, Hillary is a progressive. Her core is still there,” Lewis said.

“There’s no one who can hold a candle to her. She’ll be a great president. She’s a fierce fighter. No one is more qualified,” said Lewis, who now is executive director of The Black Institute.

http://nypost.com/2015/04/20/former-acorn-chief-backs-hillary-clinton/

Right-wing heads explode...

[Cha]

91. BS himself said Hillary has reached out to AA for years.. his supporters need to trust him.

[phleshdef]

94. Bernie continues to be the honest, respectful Statesman that he is, we all should follow suit.

Again, I'm begging, can we NOT tear each other apart?

[ericson00]

95. Bernie, drop out already

and let us get on with the election. No one outside the far-left in the GE is voting for an avowed socialist. You can help unite the party by endorsing Hillary.

[Lucky Luciano]

100. Is Sanders really __that__ far left?

Sanders seems just like FDR minus the internment camps...and Sanders is more modern and progressive on issues of race even if the AA community has not warmed up to him...yet.

If FDR himself were running, would you say he is too far left?

[Marrah_G]

112. Sorry, we have a primary for a reason.

The people get to CHOOSE. The party officials do not get to pick the nominee.

[eridani]

96. Doubtless because nothing says that black lives matter like supporting the death penalty n/t

[Cha]

97. Sanders: "Hillary Clinton has big edge over me with black voters" that's right.. a big edge bc

"she has been reaching out to them for years".

[Octafish]

105. Going by Detroit...

...Bernie's largely unknown, ignored by Corporate McPravda.

Once people hear him talk about the issues, I bet his popularity will soar among all voters.

[Marrah_G]

110. Sanders needs to go into largely african american areas and tell them his platform

He should reach out and explain why his view on issues would be good for them and their communities. Once he does that, I believe he will become a favorite there as well.

And not just African American communities, but also Hispanic and Asian communities.

[Tarheel_Dem]

118. "Once he does that, I believe he will become a favorite there as well."

Good luck with that. The only candidate who could possibly pose a threat to HRC's standing with minority voters is Joe Biden, and it's not clear that he'll run.

Let me be blunt for a moment, after Barack Obama, we're just not all that jazzed about another old white man in the Oval Office. Time to change things up. There's history to be made.

[George II]

143. I don't know that we'll ever see a sincere effort to do that in any of those communitie.

[CreekDog]

161. although let's face it...the primary calendar is unfair to these communities

because it pretty much forces our candidates to stay in Iowa and New Hampshire and woo those mostly white populations in order to gain or keep the momentum needed to win the nomination.

yes. is this yet another thing somehow unfair to minorities in this country?

yes, of course it is.

do people think that undoing racial advantage would be easy or that it wouldn't take rooting that advantage out of every corner of the country and its institutions? if they don't think that, they must not think racial advantages are very deep in this country.

[Marrah_G]

162. I hate how our primaries are run

I also think the electoral votes is a crappy system

[CreekDog]

163. Yes, the Electoral College is ridiculous

[FloridaBlues]

151. Is his campaign just figuring this out.

Hate to tell him it's much more than a "edge" over him more like grand cannon edge!