Military vows Maduro support in deepening Venezuela crisis

[Zorro]

Source: AFP

Venezuela's military pledged loyalty to President Nicolas Maduro on Thursday, ramping up a high-stakes standoff between his socialist government and a center-right opposition that has vowed to use its new legislative powers to oust him.

The opposition laid claim to a big majority in the National Assembly, which could empower it to force out Maduro. He has rejected the assembly as illegal and formed a new hardline leftist cabinet to fight it, in a deepening political crisis.

Venezuela's defense minister and armed forces chief, General Vladimir Padrino, weighed in, saying the military was unwavering in its backing for Maduro -- who has vowed to resist "with an iron hand."

"The president is the highest authority of the state and we reiterate our absolute loyalty and unconditional support for him," said Padrino, after the under-pressure government sued to stop the emboldened opposition using its newfound powers to kick out Maduro.

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/military-vows-maduro-support-deepening-venezuela-crisis-020045191.html

[GGJohn]

1. Gee, who didn't see this coming?

Now, it remains to be seen if the front line troops will actually follow the lead and oppress the people.

Maduro is just another tin pot dictator who will do anything to cling to power despite the wishes and votes of the people.

[Joe Chi Minh]

2. Poor center right. Just as they thought they wouldn't have to rely on food banks, I expect.

[GGJohn]

5. Awww, what's the matter?

Your boy, Maduro, is turning into a dictator and you don't quite know how to defend him?

[nyabingi]

9. Let me guess

I'm guessing you supported the US-led overthrow of Allende in Chile in favor of Pinochet? The way you're talking it seems you would have, and that's problematic. The US has been trying to do the same thing in Venezuela for a while.

[GGJohn]

10. Then you would be guessing wrong.

The US has not been trying to do the same thing for quite a while now, the Chavista's have been doing quite a job of fucking up the country all on their own.
What about the overwhelmingly defeat of the Chavistas on Dec. 6? Was that US inspired also? Because if you believe that, then there's a problem with your perception.

[nyabingi]

14. If you don't understand that the US government

has been hostile towards Venezuela since the Bush regime then you simply aren't paying attention to what's been going on, GGJohn.

The US immediately gave its blessing to the coup that removed Chavez briefly and the Bush regime was criticized for it. We backpeddled when Chavez was returned to power and ended up showing our truly undemocratic ways to the rest of Latin America and the world.

Do you not remember this event or are you just not aware of it?

[GGJohn]

15. Which has nothing to do with the overwhelming defeat of the Chavistas on Dec. 6th.

Maduro is attempting to thwart the will of the people by threatening to crush the opposition using the military, that's what tin pot dictators do.

[Adrahil]

29. Errr.... the Chavistas lost BIG in the election.

This is called being accountable to the people.

Can the Chavistas be held accountable for their colossal failure?

[elias49]

38. The poster in question has already been told

he has no sense of Central and South American history.
Don't bother.

[GGJohn]

58. You assume far too much of what sense of history I have,

but arguing with a Chavista fanatic is useless, so, on that note, buh bye.

[Joe Chi Minh]

16. '...there's a problem with your perception.' Ha! Ha! The best joke of the day. Don't argue

with him nyabingi. It will only make two fools. He thinks in strip-cartoon bubbles.

[GGJohn]

18. Insults, insults, insults, the sure sign that one has lost the debate and that's all that's left.

That's ok, carry on.

[iandhr]

22. Do you have problem with democracy?

[geek tragedy]

24. no one who describes Vladimir Putin as a "global hero" respects democracy.

Looks like we have ourselves an honest-to-goodness unreconstructed Stalinist in our midst

[Renew Deal]

40. Nice to see that you don't respect elections

[nyabingi]

7. The people whom the military

would potentially suppress are traitors who have long been working with the US to overthrow their own government (and they did briefly in 2002, something people like you don't want to acknowledge).

If the street violence starts again, I hope Maduro has all of these people locked away or deported to Miami so they can live with the rich people who fled Cuba long ago.

[GGJohn]

8. Really?

Then why did the opposition win such a huge victory in the elections?

[nyabingi]

12. Engineered shortages of commonly-used goods

in order to create misery among the public and the fall of global oil prices.

The supporters of socialism in Venezuela are still there and they have stated their intent to become more committed to seeing that the problems the country has recently experienced are fixed and socialism expanded upon.

If Maduro was the caricature-like dictator you want to make him out to be, he wouldn't have recognized the results of the election and simply jailed or killed anyone opposing him. That hasn't happened.

[GGJohn]

13. Ok, you just go with that if it makes you sleep better at night. eom.

[Joe Chi Minh]

19. You should try it. You get no prizes for insomnia. Sort out your immortal soul, before

it's too late.

[GGJohn]

20. Uh huh.

[nyabingi]

28. Since you aren't aware that the US is hostile towards Venezuela

here is one recent article highlighting some of the more recent efforts on the American behalf to destroy populist/leftist movements in Latin America.

http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/01/08/neoliberalism-raises-its-ugly-head-in-south-america/

Perhaps you'd like to see the return of US-backed paramilitary death squads and compliant Latin American dictators willing to brutalize their people in order to serve our interests?

It's really hard to tell many of today's Democrats from Republicans on some issues...

[Judi Lynn]

45. Your link is exceptional. Could you cross-post it in Good Reads, and/or Latin America forum?

Here is a vital section of information everyone should read, and choose to believe it or not. Information is essential. Things you have read in the past sometimes don't jive with your information until you learn more, for those who've not taken the time to do their homework enough to recognize the patterns.

From your tremendous link:

Venezuela: Case Example of Destabilization

Economic destabilization in its most recent phase has been underway in Venezuela since 2013. The collapse of world oil and commodity prices, a consequence in part of the United States vs. Saudi fight that erupted in 2014 over who controls the global price of oil, has caused the Venezuela currency, the Bolivar, to collapse. The United States raising its long term interest rates the past year has intensified that currency collapse. But U.S. government and banking forces have further fanned the flames of currency collapse by encouraging speculators, operating out of Colombia and the ‘DollarToday’ website, to ‘short’ the Bolivar and depress it still further. U.S. based media, in particular the arch-conservative CATO institute in Washington, has joined in the effort by consistently reporting exaggerated claims of currency decline, as high as 700 percent, to panic Venezuelans to further dump Bolivars for dollars, thus causing even more currency collapse. Meanwhile, multinational corporations in Venezuela continue to hoard more than US$11 billion in dollars, causing the dollar to rise and the Bolivar to fall even more. The consequence of all these forces contributing to collapse of the currency is a growing black market for dollars and shortages of key consumer and producer goods.

But all that’s just the beginning. Currency collapse in turn means escalating cost of imports and domestic inflation, and thus falling real incomes for small businesses and workers. The black market and dollar shortage due means inability to import critical goods like medicines and food. Rising cost of imports means lack of critical materials needed to continue production, which results in falling production, plant and business closures, and rising unemployment.

Currency collapse, inflation, and recession together result in capital flight from the country, which in turn exacerbates all the above again. A vicious cycle of general economic collapse thus ensues, for which the popular government is blamed but which it has fundamentally not caused.

As this scenario in Venezuela since 2014 has worsened, the United States has targeted Venezuela’s state owned oil company, Petroleos de Venezuela, with legal suits. The Obama government in March 2015 also issued executive orders freezing assets of Venezuelan government and military representatives charged with alleged ‘human rights’ abuses. The United States then recently arrested Venezuelan businessmen in the United States, holding them without bail, no doubt to send a message to those who might still support the government. The U.S. government has also indicted Venezuelan government and military officials recently with charges of alleged drug conspiracy, including National Guard generals who have supported the Maduro government. This all raises impressions of government corruption with the public, while giving second thoughts to other would-be military and government supporters to ‘think twice’ about their continuing support and perhaps to consider ‘going over’ to the opposition in exchange for a ‘deal’ to drop the legal charges. The popular impression grows that the economic crisis, the inflation, the shortages, the layoffs must all be associated with the corruption, which is associated with the government. It is all classic U.S. destabilization strategy.

As all the above economic dislocation has occurred in Venezuela, money has flowed through countless unofficial channels to the opposition parties and their politicians, enabling them to capture earlier this month control of the national assembly. The leaders of the new assembly, according to media leaks, now have plans to reconstitute the Venezuelan Supreme Court to support their policies and to legally endorse their coming direct attack the Maduro government in 2016. It is clear the goal is to either remove Maduro and his government or to render it impossible to govern.

As Julio Borges, a possible next president of the national assembly, has declared publicly in recent days: if the Maduro government does not go along with the new policies of the Assembly, “it will have to be changed.” No doubt impeachment proceedings, to try to remove Maduro, will be soon on the agenda in Venezuela – just as it now is in Brazil. But for that, the Venezuelan Supreme Court must be changed, which makes it the immediate next front in the battle.

Thank you for your comments in this thread, along with a couple of other sane progressives.

[nyabingi]

46. Thanks for your comments

I really think that many people don't read any other information or opinions or world events that don't fit the "official" interpretation or what our leaders want us to believe. Many of us have learned that we can't really take what we hear in our mainstream media at face value because while there is always some truth, it has an angle and often times omits info that will undermine that angle. I try to read as many "unofficial" versions as possible and decide what sounds most reasonable.

The Maduro government has made mistakes, but if it is dismantled completely its ultimately the poor and working class people who are going to suffer for it (the people Democrats used to be known for defending).

[Judi Lynn]

57. Democrats have always been connected with the working class, making life possible for the poor.

It's trolls who go berserk at the thought of life without constant suffering and no hope for the poor. They are determined to work as hard as they can against changing the world to help those living in despair.

They pretend to be democrats in order to post here. It's a matter of character. Those without it can't hide their lack of it. They try to throw people off their tracks with vicious attacks to displace their attention.

[iandhr]

23. Yes it has.

They are trying exclude legislators who won from taking their seats in the assembly.

[nyabingi]

25. We are talking about 3 or 4 people

who were having some legal issues blocking them from taking their seats (and from what I've recently read, the right-wing National Assembly members had them seated anyway).

All of the conservatives are in place and working feverishly to get rid of Maduro as we speak.

[iandhr]

27. That would deny the super majority.

Maduro and his party control all aspects of the government and they are claiming fraud which is a joke.

And to dismiss the opposition as purely right wing is factually incorrect.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_Unity_Roundtable

It a big tent coalition that includes the left and center left as well as the center-right

[nyabingi]

32. This "big tent coalition" I'm sure is backed fully

by the US and I noticed the wiki page mentioned nothing about their funding and the connections of the person who started.

One good indicator that this "democratic" group is working to achieve not only the interests of Venezuela's aggrieved wealthy but those of the US is the participation of Maria Corina Machado, a woman who was a participant in the 2002 US-sponsored coup which briefly removed Chavez from power and who has big involved in very treasonous activities in order to undermine democracy in her own country.

These are not honorable people, they don't have the best interests of Venezualans at heart, and they all most likely have the financial and strategic guidance of people working with the US government and NGO's.

The State Department is known to set up these benign-sounding "democracy" groups in many countries we've targeted for destabilization.

[iandhr]

37. The current government seems to doing a pretty good job of destabilizing the country...

... without our help.

And when we are on the subject of coups Chavez himself tried to lead a coup when he was in the military. But I assume you have an explanation to why it is ok.


People like you are the left-wing version of the tea party. Immune to facts.

[nyabingi]

47. I'm aware that Chavez attempted a coup

and I wouldn't have supported a coup by him or any other person, left or right wing. If a country commits itself to democracy and upholding the will of the people, then everyone should abide by the result whether they like it or not. Organize, share your policies with the people and win at the ballot box. The Tea Party is indeed "immune to facts", but you're not dealing with a Tea Party person.

The US government and supporters of Venezuela's right-wing don't respect democracy in the least and have never accepted the many electoral victories of the left in that country.

[Judi Lynn]

61. Not only does this she-beast get handed money by the US government for her hard-right poitics

against the administration, she has been invited various times to Washington, D.C. for close-up yapfests with the fascists in our own government.

[center]

Hugging a fellow Washington DC sniffer in Caracas.





[/center]

[Adrahil]

30. Is there any evidence that these shortages were engineered?

No.

This is the result of economic incompetence by the bus-driver-in-chief who thinks that ordering a thing makes it happen.

[nyabingi]

34. Maduro's policies didn't cause this corporations

to horde their product to create shortages of goods, the owners of the companies did.

You'll dismiss any evidence of this because it won't fit your predetermined narrative.

[Adrahil]

36. I could reply the same.

At what point would acknowledge that the Chavista government is a miserable failure? I'd say it is you and your ilk that have a pre-determined approved outcome. Me? I'm in favor of what works. We have examples of successful social democracies. Venezuela is not one of them.

[nyabingi]

48. Obviously what they are doing now is not

working, but it would be a lot easier for me to say that it's been "a miserable failure" if there hadn't been constant and relentless interference in their internal affairs aimed at destabilizing the country - as much as you'd want to say that hasn't been the case, their is a wealth of information to say otherwise. Their are successful social democracies in Scandinavia but they don't have the US working to undermine their governments 24/7 either - big difference.

The drop in crude oil prices has hurt every major oil producer, and it has hurt Venezuela just as much as any. If you want me to say that the intentions and goals of the Bolivarian movement are/have been a failure, you're not going to hear me say that. I'll never be in favor of oligarchy, feudalism, monarchies and other forms of government that leave the majority of the people barely making it while the very few live the good life.

The danger posed by a successful Venezuela is its success and the example of it success. In the eyes of the US, these types of governments succeeding in regions of the world we want to dominate is something we will not see happen, and this is why the onslaught has been relentless and merciless. If too many in the Global South start thinking socialism or any form of government that leads them in a direction away from western neoliberalism is viable, our dominance will wane.

If we approached the Venezuelans with respect toward their choice of leaders and committed to working with them for our common benefit, things would be entirely different.

[EX500rider]

68. "The danger posed by a successful Venezuela is its success and the example of it success."

Well sure, 100%+ inflation and one 2nd highest murder rate on the planet plus a rising poverty rate and scarcity of consumer goods, who wouldn't be jealous of that?

Venezuela’s poverty rate rose to 32 percent at the end of last year..

http://www.ticotimes.net/2014/08/02/venezuelas-increasing-inflation-shortages-leave-poor-doubting-maduro


I'll go over this one more time......rigid price controls during a time of high inflation causes scarcity, you can't sell under cost, it's a terrible business model....so you either horde, blackmarket it or sell it across the border.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

31. The only thing that engineered shortages was the hubris of socialists thinking they can

centrally plan entire economies and their penchant to promote people based on political loyalty rather than technical competence.

[elias49]

51. Kind of like the way things work in our USA democracy, right? nt

[Zorro]

3. Venezuela government steps up fight with opposition-led congress

Venezuela's government upped the ante against the new opposition-led Congress on Thursday with a protest against the removal of images of venerated late socialist leader Hugo Chavez and a legal appeal against the swearing-in of three legislators.

Irked by this week's unceremonious removal of the giant Chavez photos from Congress, his successor President Nicolas Maduro had them displayed in a Caracas plaza under military guard and officials vowed to plaster the country with more.

"I've given the order that in the coming hours all the streets of Caracas, all the poles, all the fences, have the image of our liberator Simon Bolivar and the image of our Father Chavez," said Socialist Party heavyweight Jorge Rodriguez, with hundreds of government supporters at a Caracas square.

http://news.yahoo.com/venezuela-government-steps-fight-opposition-led-congress-200131326.html

The new Venezuelan Congress came to bury Chavez, not to praise him.

[GGJohn]

6. Hmmm, isn't this what the former Soviet Union, Cuba, N. Korea, etc. did?

Nice company he keeps there.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

33. "government steps up fight with...congress"

I wish someone would ask Yahoo news why congress is suddenly not government. This makes them sound like shills for autocracy.

[juxtaposed]

55. I think the Head Line should read, Venezuela gov. steps up fight with US opposition led GOV.

Truth in advertising..

[GGJohn]

60. Got any proof of your Truth in advertising meme? eom.

[nyabingi]

4. What kind of opposition wins a majority

and immediately announces their intention to oust the elected president? These are obviously not people who intend on having a working relationship with anyone on the socialist side of aisle.

The right-wing and their US backers will soon instigate more street violence (called "protests" by the American media) in order to justify more US sanctions. These people are not going to stop until they've returned the country fully to oligarchic rule and I don't many of the the country's citizens aren't going to sit back and let it happen without a fight.

[Joe Chi Minh]

21. 'What kind of opposition wins a majority

and immediately announces their intention to oust the elected president? These are obviously not people who intend on having a working relationship with anyone on the socialist side of aisle.'

A devastating point, nyabingi. They started it; made their bed. Now they'll have to lie in it.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

35. The kind where the majority wants the president ousted.

These are obviously not people who intend on having a working relationship with anyone on the socialist side of aisle.

Socialists would live in glass houses were it not for the fact they shortages of glass.

[Yupster]

17. He should have never allowed free elections

He should have studied the Cuban model.

Now he has a problem. Better to use the Iranian - Cuban model. We have elections, but only certain people can run. Then he wouldn't be in this trouble.

[nyabingi]

26. I tend to agree with you

I think Maduro (and Chavez) were trying to respect democracy, and both did, but when you have a segment of your population so hostile and rebellious to the democratic wishes of the voters that they are willing to work with a foreign government to take power undemocratically, you're talking serious threats to national stability and security.

Maduro would have been better off, in my opinion, ridding his country of all US-based NGO's, severed diplomatic ties with the US and encouraging those who can't respect democracy to leave the country. I hope the majority of the people there will see what's going on and realize that they are going to be the losers ultimately and be willing to fight for the gains they made since Chavez.

Democracy is difficult when you're trying to respect it and your opponents could care less about it.

[Ace Rothstein]

39. This post reads like an article from The Onion.

I find myself saying that at an increasing pace around here.

[nyabingi]

49. What do you find "Onionish" about what I said, Ace? (nt)

[Ace Rothstein]

56. It seems very sarcastic.

Maduro doesn't care about or respect democracy, he cares about Maduro. Nobody is trying to take power undemocratically. The rest sounds like a tinfoil hat conspiracy.

[nyabingi]

59. I'm not sure how you can say the Maduro

doesn't care about democracy when he and his party have fully accepted the election results. They are face, however, with a very hostile opposition that is hellbent on dismantling the good they've have accomplished for Venezuela's poor and working class people, the same people who voted over the last decade and a half to bring about the changes they've wanted. If he didn't care about democracy, he would have cancelled the elections and imposed his will by force - that simply didn't happen this year nor in any of the years that Chavez was elected time and time again.

To someone who has only had exposure to the Western media's perspective of events in Venezuela, I'm sure what I'm saying sounds like "tinfoil" subject matter, conspiratorial, like something from the pages of The Onion, and just plain unbelievable. Our media has immense power in shaping the American public's perspective on foreign affairs, and that power was a lot greater before the Internet age and the public's access to media that doesn't present one narrow narrative of world events. Our media has been 100% negative in regards to Chavez, Maduro and what they've tried to accomplish in Venezuela, and that negativity fits the historical American pattern of waging war against efforts to establish governments and institutions not dominated from Washington. It is a long, sad story of our interaction with Latin America from the days of colonialism, and we haven't stopped trying to exert that dominance.

I didn't mean anything I said as sarcasm or hyperbole.

[snooper2]

42. "ncouraging those who can't respect democracy to leave the country" ROFLMAO

As poster noted, this does read like the onion

[FLPanhandle]

43. I swear I thought these two were being sarcastic.

[nyabingi]

50. Save your comment

since you obviously have nothing to add to the conversation.

Good back over the Sports forum and leave the serious stuff to the adults.

[Marksman_91]

67. "Respect democacy?" So is that why they're trying to nullify the opposition natl assembly now?

If there is anyone here who is in denial of the last elections, it's Maduro and the rest of the Chavista leadership.

[Reter]

41. Is this Democratic Underground or Communist Underground?

Should we do that here too?

[nyabingi]

53. It is Neoliberal Underground for many people around here (nt)

[Judi Lynn]

62. Venezuela always gets a code blue for the troll brigade.

They're also available for Cuba duty.

[GGJohn]

63. Now here's a clear case of the pot calling the kettle black.

[mwrguy]

44. Chavistas even helped take care of US citizens who couldn't heat their homes

[nyabingi]

52. Chavez definitely cared more about the American poor

than George W. Bush did and some people recognized and appreciated that.

[elias49]

54. Some people refuse to educate themselves beyond Cold-War bullshit.

The Cold War is over. Joe McCarthy was discredited.
"socialism..Ooooo...is really not scary.

[GGJohn]

64. And some people, (hint, hint) refuse to believe that the Maduro govt is a corrupt govt

determined to hang on to power any way he can, up to and including using the military against his opponents.

[elias49]

65. Ha! You came back!

[GGJohn]

66. As did you.