Texas Officials to Force Burial, Cremation of Fetal Remains
Source: rewire.news
Nov 29, 2016, 2:13pm Teddy Wilson
These new restrictions reveal the callous indifference that Texas politicians have toward women, said David Brown, senior staff attorney at the Center for Reproductive Rights.
Despite criticism from funeral homes, abortion providers, and reproductive rights advocates, Texas health officials on Monday filed the final version of proposed rules requiring the remains of aborted or miscarried fetuses to be buried or cremated.
Texas health officials on Monday filed the final version of proposed rules requiring the remains of aborted or miscarried fetuses to be buried or cremated, despite criticism from funeral homes, abortion providers, and reproductive rights advocates.
The regulations will apply to all fetal remains, regardless of the period of gestation when the miscarriage or abortion occurred. Under the proposed rules, any other tissueincluding the placenta, umbilical cord and gestational saccan still be disposed of through other methods, like incineration or grinding up and discharging to a sewer system.
The regulations are set to take effect on December 19. The Center for Reproductive Rights has promised to challenge the new rules in court..............................................
Read more: https://rewire.news/article/2016/11/29/texas-officials-force-burial-cremation-fetal-remains/
The difference of merely lively in a red state vs a blue become more stark each day.
DesertRat
(27,995 posts)radical noodle
(7,997 posts)riversedge
(70,044 posts)jmowreader
(50,527 posts)I can think of a LOT of really horrifying scenarios where a wanted child is miscarried, and the fucking Texas government forces the parents into holding a funeral for the still-born fetus.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)humiliation is the least of legally regarding early fetuses as people.
The minority woman Pence tried to keep in prison didn't have anyone except the government trying to persecute her. How about a nice white, Christian woman whose husband joins her hostile in-laws in blaming her for a miscarriage and claiming that she tried to kill her baby?
Btw, let's see a Texas woman go to court to demand that her insurance company pay to save the life of the 5-month unborn gestational-stage person being miscarried. It's inevitable, and who's going to pay the enormous costs? Conservative taxpayers? Yes, I know. No conflict at all. Mom to prison if can be blamed, "baby" properly buried with crocodile tears.
lark
(23,059 posts)It was so horrible, she got hysterical and screamed and fell to the ground weeping for a long time. She later said she'd made an awful decision to have an open casket funeral and would never recommend that to anyone.
awoke_in_2003
(34,582 posts)Even cremations aren't cheap. I am (wonderfully) surprised that the funeral industry is against it. I figured they would lobby for it.
kimbutgar
(21,039 posts)awoke_in_2003
(34,582 posts)cheaper than a funeral with burial, but still costly.
Solly Mack
(90,758 posts)50 Shades Of Blue
(9,916 posts)perdita9
(1,144 posts)Unless the regulations apply to polluters or businesses that blow up towns by inappropriately storing their explosive chemicals.
I don't get it, but it seems to be what they like.
Liberalagogo
(1,770 posts)are not welcome. As is geographic bigotry.
Yes my state is full of the stupid, but we are all not cut of the same cloth.
hamsterjill
(15,220 posts)Some of us are working hard down here to keep some sanity in this state. And trust me, it's an uphill battle. We don't need to be lumped in with the herd of idiots!
Dustlawyer
(10,494 posts)You would think that all Democrats would know better than to generalize about a group of people as all holding the same traits or beliefs.
perdita9
(1,144 posts)I know Team Blue is working hard in Texas. I just don't understand why the majority of voters there keep voting against their own interests.
progressoid
(49,929 posts)It's not limited to Texas.
edhopper
(33,465 posts)once they outlaw abortion.
Which will happen soon.
radical noodle
(7,997 posts)aka miscarriages. I can see a group of women starting Periods for Texas soon.
sarcasmo
(23,968 posts)radical noodle
(7,997 posts)yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)What methods were used to stop a fourth and so on. Would love to hear his hypocritical answer.
HAB911
(8,867 posts)We will put Iran to shame!
Miscarriages happen a lot more than you think and are subject to this law.
In a recent study, the majority of people surveyed thought miscarriages occurred in 5 percent of less of pregnancies. In reality, the share is about 20 percent
Welcome to Christian Sharia Law
alfredo
(60,071 posts)HAB911
(8,867 posts)alfredo
(60,071 posts)greymattermom
(5,751 posts)Women will avoid prenatal care until the second trimester, just in case.
arithia
(455 posts)"all fetal remains, regardless of the period of gestation when the miscarriage or abortion occurred"
Most miscarriages occur in the first few weeks of pregnancy, where a woman can mistake the bleeding for her normally scheduled period. The only way to enforce such a law would be to bury or cremate used sanitary items.
This sh*t is bananas.
Paladin
(28,243 posts)He's a big-mouthed, theocratic douchebag, and he's a prime mover of sick Christian Taliban measures like this one.
alfredo
(60,071 posts)arithia
(455 posts)they specifically mentioned miscarriages as requiring burial/cremation services, regardless of the period of gestation.
alfredo
(60,071 posts)Justice
(7,185 posts)alfredo
(60,071 posts)rzemanfl
(29,554 posts)That's what I recommend.
Scalded Nun
(1,235 posts)There are way too many politicians here on the wrong side of the grass.
Hekate
(90,526 posts)AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)hamsterjill
(15,220 posts)That younger women will have this to contend with.
I do not want to learn of young women dying in back alleys. Women my age have already lived through that shit.
RKP5637
(67,083 posts)abortion clinics.
hamsterjill
(15,220 posts)They want to punish women for being women. I don't care what other reasons they cite. We all know the real impetus behind this. It's a religious thing dating back to Eve. (And I'm a Christian, but I'm not an idiot.)
I live in Texas and I encounter these fundies on a daily basis. I've started to ask them if they understand that when they say that abortion is murder, that they are calling women who have had abortions murderers. They just look at me like I'm nuts, but THAT is the inference. I've lost several friendships over this, particularly recently. I will not tolerate that kind of stupidity and sexism in my life.
RKP5637
(67,083 posts)Buckeye_Democrat
(14,852 posts)Forcing a woman to pay for a burial after she ends a pregnancy or experiences a miscarriage is not just absurdit is an unnecessary burden and an intrusion on her personal beliefs.
They are seriously screwed up! Fetuses don't even have human-like brainwaves for over 20 weeks!
Let's not let evidence get in the way! Let's instead rely on FAITH that convinces some fools that fetuses have souls imparted to them from an invisible entity.
LeftInTX
(25,093 posts)Funeral home, cremation services, urn, burial plot, coffin, limo. It will cost at least $8,000 out of pocket.
Lithos
(26,403 posts)You can skip the burial plot, coffin and limo. The cremains are sent back to you in a box which you can dispose of as you wish. Even so, that is a huge piece of crap pushed down on the woman.
However, to your point, it is an expense which will be incurred.
Thinking, today when your pet dies, you can opt for a mass cremation as part of disposal. (i.e., when you do not want to have the ashes sent back to you). This is nominal. Wonder if this can be done and can be done in a way which does not charge the woman. Create some sort of "Neptune" like society to handle this.
L-
LeftInTX
(25,093 posts)Because then the embryo/fetus would be treated as "medical waste", and the rule says they can't be treated as medical waste.
Also when your pet dies, you can legally bury it in your backyard. It has never been legal to take a dead fetus home and bury it in your backyard.
Cremation has gotten just as expensive as burials because the demand for them has increased.
Still wondering if a non-profit can be setup to handle this and the disposal (ala burial at sea which the Neptune Society does) in a way which makes this nothing more than a checkbox and signature for the woman.
I'm hoping the courts will step in and stop this nonsense. However, I'm trying to think ahead on the off chance... I'm not up for assuming anything these days, especially with these jokers in charge.
L-
hamsterjill
(15,220 posts)I read an article about this recently, but haven't tried to find the link. It was like a forest environment. Is it a body farm???
Bodies are not buried, not embalmed - just allowed the decompose as nature takes its toll.
That's a donation to science...
http://www.txstate.edu/anthropology/facts/labs/farf.html
That might be an interesting legal alternative as well, though they would make a law forbidding the acceptance by a State University. Still, might there be a lab which can be setup to study fetal tissue?
L-
csziggy
(34,131 posts)We believe that the deathcare industry needs to embrace a new ethic for a new era. Our education and advocacy is helping organizations and individuals within this industry understand the environmental, societal and economic benefits of green burial. We hope to make green or natural burial the new standard within industry.
What is Green Burial?:
We believe burial is green only when it furthers legitimate environmental and societal aims such as protecting worker health, reducing carbon emissions, conserving natural resources, and preserving habitat.
http://greenburialcouncil.org/
I've thought about having our farm certified as a green burial site since I want to preserve the natural state of this place. Having human burials would give an additional barrier to anyone who might want to disrupt this location once I am no longer around!
womanofthehills
(8,657 posts)bodies lying here and there. It is a body farm run by the Univ of Tenn for research on how the body decomposes.
cannabis_flower
(3,764 posts)a law that says you can leave a baby at a hospital or fire station, perhaps you can just leave the fetus there for them to bury!
barbtries
(28,756 posts)really. what is the supposed point of this?
RKP5637
(67,083 posts)barbtries
(28,756 posts)but do they give a supposedly reasonable reason?
RKP5637
(67,083 posts)alfredo
(60,071 posts)miscarriage is a spontanious abortion.
womanofthehills
(8,657 posts)Pence passed the same law in Indiana and it also included miscarriages but it was knocked down by a Federal judge. Great site started by the women of Indiana - used to be Periods of Pence now Periods for Politicians.
https://www.facebook.com/REALP4P/
alfredo
(60,071 posts)Justice
(7,185 posts)Demit
(11,238 posts)"Following criticism from medical providers, the states Health and Human Services Commission clarified that the requirement does not apply to miscarriages or abortions that take place at home. It also does not require birth or death certificates to be filed, to maintain confidentiality."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/11/29/despite-months-of-outcry-texas-will-require-aborted-fetustes-to-be-cremated-or-buried/
alfredo
(60,071 posts)HAB911
(8,867 posts)alfredo
(60,071 posts)RKP5637
(67,083 posts)separate countries. I have a list of states I will never travel to, visit, vacation or anything. I won't even stay over in them if I can avoid it when traveling.
friggin' list of states and companies keeps getting longer and longer, might as well stay at home, lol
RKP5637
(67,083 posts)kimbutgar
(21,039 posts)I hoped someday to drive across the country coast to coast. Looks like that dream is over. I guess I'll be going to Europe more if I travel. I refuse to go to those blood red states ever again.
RKP5637
(67,083 posts)strangeness about them, sometimes cities too.
bucolic_frolic
(43,027 posts)the women, the fetuses, themselves, for public example, or their desire to control?
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)I love to mess with their tiny little minds.
Lotusflower70
(3,077 posts)Texas is a special kind of fucked up.
ananda
(28,831 posts)This just adds to the already great shame I feel for my state.
azureblue
(2,144 posts)Texas just set the stage for a religious showdown. It goes like this:
"I refuse to bury the fetus because of religious reasons. Exodus 21:22 very clearly says that causing the death of a fetus is a property crime. A fetus is "property" not human. A cemetery is a place for burying human bodies only, not property. If it were, I could dispose of my old couch there. I believe in the Bible, so that settles it."
Of course some Texas idiot would take it to court and this is where the fun begins. Some pharmacists don't want to sell the pill because of religious reasons, and they can get out of it under that aegis, to use the same reasoning. No doubt a savvy attorney will get a anti abortionist on the stand and get them to admit that their belief is based upon their religion, and Bingo! The judge will then be forced to rule what is a "True Christian" - now they are defining what is religion and what is not and worse, whose interpretation of the Bible is "Correct"..
Somebody in Texas, please take this stupid law to court. This could be very interesting....
KT2000
(20,567 posts)to determine whether there has been abortion or miscarriage, and then fault finding and punishment for women who have failed to complete every pregnancy?
Warpy
(111,120 posts)so it's already being cremated.
I guess these morons want some preacher to get a cut for mumbling over it.
HassleCat
(6,409 posts)Requirements to give it a name, mark the grave, file something resembling a birth certificate, declare its religion, and so on.
OldRedneck
(1,397 posts)Funeral homes should refuse to cooperate. Hospitals should refuse to turn over remains.
Let the goddam attorney general jail a few funeral home owners and hospital directors and watch what happens.
Botany
(70,440 posts)n/t
Sunlei
(22,651 posts)State and Local laws never would allow grinding up any medical waste or stuff like slaughterhouse waste and "discharging to a sewer system"
lark
(23,059 posts)It's just a way to punish women and claim they care about the deceased fetus, but it's a total lie. I had a miscarriage at 17, at 2 months into the pregnancy. my parents didn't know I was pregnant and would have sent me away to a "home for wayward (pregnant) girls" which was really a religious prison. I was home alone, cramped really bad all day then finally passed it in the toilet. It was really like just a very heavy period with clots. Do you think I was about to go fishing in the blood soup, oh hell no. Did I cry, hell yes. I didn't want the baby, but was sad to see the life ended before it really began, sad to see all I had left of my first love gone. There is no way in the world any woman should have to deal with that. It's just totally barbaric and cruel. Most miscarriages occur between 2-3 months so the young women would have to go fishing through the bloody mess to see if there was a fetus in there or just big clots. Sorry to be graphic, but I've faced this and it was so awful. I did wonder if I had really been pregnant, but by that time, it didn't matter because I wasn't anymore. Now, if the baby is 6 months old when it passed, this law wouldn't be so bad, but with no lower age limit, it's damn heinous and repulsive.
keithbvadu2
(36,640 posts)A miscarriage is an abortion.
Will conservative women want their names in the news for such a sad event?
The Jungle 1
(4,552 posts)We do nothing but whine.
Nothing the republican party is doing will reduce abortion!!!!!! Also consider that outlawing abortion will NOT stop or reduce abortion. I am old and I remember when abortion was illegal.
The things Democrats have done DO reduce abortion.
Free birth control for all Americans would radically reduce abortion!!
Obama care has reduced abortion.
Texas took funding away from PP. Maternal death rate in Texas has skyrocketed. Is that the plan. Republicans are killing mothers. Go ahead and say it out loud. Please say it!!! I demand you say it out loud.
If we all sit around doing nothing and letting republicans rule the conversation we will lose.
We have the high ground. Open your pie holes and scream.
I am a 60 year old fat old white guy and I am outraged that Democrats do not rule this conversation.
Me I want to reduce abortion. What do republicans want???
Equinox Moon
(6,344 posts)They want to, so let them.
kimbutgar
(21,039 posts)Will they prosecute her for murder?
Solly Mack
(90,758 posts)Texas House of Representatives
P.O. Box 2910
Austin, Texas 78768-2910
Texas Senate
1200 Congress Ave
Austin, TX 78701
Send them your used tampons and kotex.
Fuck these people and everyone that supports them.
BlueProgressive
(229 posts)of those legislative chambers.
Solly Mack
(90,758 posts)doc03
(35,293 posts)Dark n Stormy Knight
(9,760 posts)Sorry, that was the most civilized thing I could think of to say about this. Un-fking-believeable.
jpak
(41,756 posts)yup
Megahurtz
(7,046 posts)I can't even believe they're trying to pull this shit already. They must be stopped.
Hugin
(33,032 posts)Nice choice of effective dates, too. It's the official beginning of the Trumpmare. It is truly sad when personal rights become political.
HAB911
(8,867 posts)The law exempts women who abort or miscarry at home, after all. If a woman starts to miscarry at home, but knows she may be forced to pay for funeral services if she goes to a hospital for help, she might stay at home and hope that the failing pregnancy works itself out on its own.
Theres already significant evidence that a large number of Texas women are turning to DIY abortion methods rather than going to a doctor. The most popular method is using misoprostol, a drug that can induce miscarriage, either bought over the counter in neighboring Mexico or bought from a black-market dealer who buys in bulk and brings it over the border. While misoprostol is relatively safe and effective, women who take it still run the danger of an incomplete miscarriage and infection, which is why doctors would prefer it be taken under medical supervision.
But if going to a doctor means you need to hire funeral services for what looks, to the naked eye, exactly like the tissue from a heavy menstrual period, many women may be tempted to go the black-market route.
It appears theres no limit on how bizarre Texas conservatives are willing to go, if it means making abortion more fraught or miserable for women. Now the anti-abortion crusaders are willing to punish women who suffer unwanted miscarriages, if it gets the zealots closer to their goal.
BlueProgressive
(229 posts)those facilities which provide abortion services-- since they can't constitutionally make it outright illegal.
greymattermom
(5,751 posts)for these remains. Once a year, just like the do for the bodies willed to medical schools.
HAB911
(8,867 posts)The Satanic Temple is responding by using a tactic we usually only see with the Christian Right. Theyre arguing that the new funeral rule goes against their religious belief in the inviolability of ones body.
Texas health officials are baldly imposing the view that the fetal tissue is elevated to personhood a religious opinion that conflicts with our own. If Texas is going to treat the disposal of fetal tissue differently from the disposal of any other biological material, in contradiction to our own religious beliefs, they need to present a compelling state interest for doing so. Of course, there is no such state interest, and it is obvious to everyone that the demand for fetal tissue burial is a punitive measure imposed by sadistic theocrats. said TST spokesperson, Lucien Greaves. These officials deem harassment an acceptable form of pushing their misguided religious agendas.
The Satanists are essentially using the Religious Freedom Restoration Act (RFRA) law to say that the state cant compel them to do anything that violates their religious beliefs unless theres a really good reason for it. (Its the same argument Hobby Lobby owners successfully used to get out of providing comprehensive health insurance including birth control for their employees.)
The Satanic Temple used the same argument last year when fighting a Missouri law that said women had to wait 72 (unnecessary) hours between her initial appointment with a doctor to have an abortion and getting the procedure done. That lawsuit was thrown out in August, on grounds of standing, because the plaintiff was no longer pregnant.
This time, if the Satanists can finding someone who has proper standing, theyll sue the state. Lets hope Lucifer is on their side.
Paladin
(28,243 posts)Fuck you, Dan Patrick. Fuck you, Greg Abbott. And fuck anybody else who backs these odious new regulations.