Trial not likely for Jared Lee Loughner in 2012
PHOENIX - The mentally ill man charged in the Tucson shooting rampage that killed six people and wounded Rep. Gabrielle Giffords and 12 others isn't expected to go to trial in 2012 as he continues to be forcibly medicated to make him psychologically fit to stand trial.
The case was put on hold indefinitely when psychologists diagnosed suspect Jared Lee Loughner with schizophrenia and a federal judge ruled the 23-year-old wasn't fit to stand trial in the shooting that occurred a year ago Sunday.
Loughner is being treated at a Missouri prison facility, where he has been forcibly medicated for more than five months with psychotropic drugs. Even though psychologists say his condition is improving, his lawyers have vigorously fought the government's efforts to medicate him.
Mike Black, a former federal defender who is now in private practice as a criminal defense attorney in Phoenix, believes it would take Loughner's lawyer a long time to prepare for a trial, if he is ever declared mentally fit.
Read more: http://www.abc15.com/dpp/news/region_central_southern_az/tucson/trial-not-likely-for-jared-lee-loughner-in-2012#ixzz1ijS2Zgxt
PuffedMica
(1,061 posts)Not a mention of his being influenced by the right wing hate media will be made at the trial.
Spider Jerusalem
(21,786 posts)Paranoid schizophrenia pretty much fits any criteria for "insanity"; sure, what he did was terrible, and the nature of his delusions may make him a threat to himself and others, but I'm not sure justice is best served by sentencing him to life in prison or execution rather than indefinitely commiting him to a maximum-security mental facility.
blaze
(6,248 posts)I can only imagine that mental illness is the reason for many atrocities that we read about.
chrisa
(4,524 posts)This is definitely someone that deserves to be in a mental institution.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)not that our lovely media or prosecutors will connect THAT DOT... they might have to prosecute somebody and it is not Loughner, under conspiracy charges. In this country that be a first.
But Mr. Loughner is not well... and insanity is real in this case.
Of couse, this means he should spend the rest of his natural life in a hospital for the criminally insane... that is another story,
treestar
(82,383 posts)but is found not to have murdered due to not having the required mental state.
The question would be did he take any steps to indicate he knew it was wrong - anything he did to avoid getting caught, for example.
onehandle
(51,122 posts)Follow the money.
hack89
(39,171 posts)The Washington Post reported that Loughner bought a 9 mm Glock handgun on Nov. 30 at a Sportsman's Warehouse in Tucson.
Read more: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2011/01/09/20110109jared-lee-loughner-gabrielle-giffords-arizona-shooting.html#ixzz1ijqauO00
hack89
(39,171 posts)onehandle
(51,122 posts)I'm sure Christina Green's family really gives a fuck.
hack89
(39,171 posts)onehandle
(51,122 posts)Kpow! Kpow! Kpow!
Dead. Dead. Dead.
hack89
(39,171 posts)Blandocyte
(1,231 posts)in civilian hands. Limit every civilian to 10-round mags. You'd just have to change the mag while you're shootin' them holes in paper. It doesn't take *that" long, and while you are reloading, if you're shooting folks, it gives sane people a chance to tackle you.
hack89
(39,171 posts)sounds like a round-about-way to ban popular hand guns. The Brady Bunch wouldn't be that duplicitous, would they?
Why 10? Why such an arbitrary number? Explain to me why that 11th round is so deadly?
boppers
(16,588 posts)Maybe that's the reasoning? (Loughner used a Glock 19). It normally has 15 rounds, he used a 30 round mag+1, so he got off 31 shots, and had another 30 round clip, and two 15 round clips... 91 shots total.
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2011/01/robert-farago/giffords-shooter-jared-loughner-used-a-glock-with-extended-clip/
Personally, I'd get rid of all these insane variants of legal patchwork for weapons and just apply the shotgun standard across the board. 3 shots before reloading, regardless of firearm, regardless of caliber, regardless of form factor, regardless of firing speed.... no more spray and pray. If you feel you *must* be able to fire more rounds, in rapid succession, get federally licensed, and be subject to mental health screening and extensive background checks.
"Explain to me why that 11th round is so deadly?"
It's not about the 11th round. It's about a pause before firing it.
hack89
(39,171 posts)Here is something to ponder - as all these guns have proliferated, gun violence has plunged to historic lows. You have never been safer.
The issue in Loughner's case is mental health. If we had a properly funded mental health system in America, do you think this shooting could have been prevented? Lets fix the real problems.
Paladin
(28,173 posts)You're not fooling anybody but yourself, here.
And a special shout-out on this occasion to one of your fellow DU Gun Enthusiasts, the one who posted a gripe about Gabby Gifford's voting record not being sufficiently pro-gun---said criticism being made within 24 hours of the Congresswoman's shooting. Stay classy, gun militants.....
hack89
(39,171 posts)you are the guys that are using a very rare event to advocate for the stripping of Constitutional rights from other Americans. You must have loved the Patriot Act - after all it was to make us all "safer".
Paladin
(28,173 posts)hack89
(39,171 posts)not until gun grabbers stop using tragedy to advance their agenda.
PavePusher
(15,374 posts)The only person fooled here is... you.
And you can cite your claim, yes?
Paladin
(28,173 posts)What proactive measures does the gun rights movement advocate which would prevent even a portion of such bloodbaths in the future? What have you got, besides pie-in-the-sky notions of taking care of the mentally ill (Where's the money coming from? How many years before aid measures get past the Republicans and are implemented?), or everybody arming themselves and embracing full-scale Law Of The Jungle behavior? Gun activists readily accept things like the Arizona massacre as a fair price for (somebody else) to pay, in return for having access to as many and as varied a selection of firearms as possible. Daily proof of this sick attitude is available on the DU Gun Control/RKBA group.....
PavePusher
(15,374 posts)Which you are intently avoiding...
hack89
(39,171 posts)you have never been safer and next year you will be even safer - even you have to admit we are on the right track.
Drahthaardogs
(6,843 posts)in waterfowl hunting. Most pumps and semi-autos hold four in the magazine (assuming a 3-inch 12 guage firing 3-inch shells). You have to plug the gun to make sure the magazine will only hold two rounds.
Most guys I know take their plugs out for turkey hunting.
A gun smith should have known that.
boppers
(16,588 posts)1. Doves are not waterfowl. Hint: Waterfowl isn't relevant. Migrating birds is.
2. Yes, all weapons can be modified to be "non-standard" (long clips, rotating magazines, reciprocal firing systems, etc), I was advocating for a standard.
3. Yes, you can pull a plug. That is, of course, *totally* missing the point I was making.
pipoman
(16,038 posts)Snake Alchemist
(3,318 posts)boppers
(16,588 posts)A ten round clip, in each hand, would be 20 rounds. Loughner emptied 31 rounds in seconds, with one hand, before pausing to reload.
Snake Alchemist
(3,318 posts)10 round magazines would be more common in .45 pistols and compact 9mm.
boppers
(16,588 posts)Not about the average magazine capacity.
Drahthaardogs
(6,843 posts)Let's put governors on all cars so they cannot go over 75 mph.
Let's re-instate prohibition.
Let's outlaw cigarettes and snuff.
As a dog trainer, this argument reminds me of the people who always sneer when I break out the electronic collar and say "You are going to SHOCK my dog?". To which I reply "It is a training device, and a very good one in the right hands. It the wrong hands, it is a torture device, but then again so is a leash, a heeling stick, and even a leather collar. If a person is an idiot, they will find a way to everything bad even it is mostly good. It is why they are idiots".
PavePusher
(15,374 posts)If that works out, we'll look into it.
pipoman
(16,038 posts)how incredibly unconscionable it is to use people you don't know and to use their tragedy for some sort of justification of your own very personal agenda? I'm sure you really don't care.
onehandle
(51,122 posts)Pray tell what that is?
boppers
(16,588 posts)Such deaths facilitated by people who treat weapons as toys to play with, or have fun with, rather than objects of violence to be treated with fear and reverence?
Am I close?
People who have "fun" shooting at targets should be treated the same way as people who have "fun" disemboweling creatures.
I am proficient with quite a few firearms, having grown up with a gunsmith father, *and* I grew up on a farm, so yeah, I can disembowel just about most mammals and avian creatures, and clean and rebuild a wide variety of firearms, as well.
...but anybody who actually enjoys doing either, well, yeah, that's a pretty big signal of something *possibly* being very wrong in their head.
Consider this: A Gun nut vs. a Shovel nut. Both are tools. Both are common (the tool, not the nut).
Do you know shovel nuts who worry about their shovel's finish?
Do you know shovel nuts who obsess about who made their shovels?
Do you know shovel nuts who collect shovels? Do they have more than 10 shovels?
Do you know shovel nuts who argue for a right to attach items to their shovels, in order to "enhance" their shovel?
Do you know shovel nuts who can't wait to go somewhere, and practice shoveling all day?
Do you know shovel nuts who fear the loss, or tracking, of their shovels?
Yeah.
onehandle
(51,122 posts)...and use the metals to build the worlds largest drum circle bandstand for peace.
Living in the deep South, I've never even seen a gun much less fired one.
Now excuse me. I have to go polish my shovel collection.
boppers
(16,588 posts)Hey, have you seen that new shovel handle mod with the tactical carbon fiber thumb grip?
onehandle
(51,122 posts)The 'shovel grabbers' out there just call it an 'assault grip.'
They're just showing their ignorance.
aikoaiko
(34,113 posts)Most schizophrenics are harmless to others, but there is a small percentage of them and others who suffer from mental disorders who need intervention badly to keep them from harming others or themselves.