Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer exempts churches from 50+ gatherings ban

[demmiblue]

Source: The Detroit Free Press

Religious houses of worship are now exempt from being penalized if they violate Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer's ban on gatherings of more than 50 people.

On Monday, Whitmer released an executive order in response to coronavirus that said "all assemblages of more than 50 people in a single indoor shared space and all events of more than 50 people are prohibited...."

Later in the week, the order was updated to add a part that reads: “A place of religious worship is not subject to penalty under section 3 of Executive Order 2020-11.” Section three of the original order said that "a willful violation of this order shall constitute a misdemeanor."

That means that churches, synagogues, mosques, and temples will not be penalized with a misdemeanor if they violate the rule to keep assemblies under 50 people.

Read more: https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2020/03/21/coronavirus-whitmer-updates-order-assemblies-exempt-churches-penalty/2885395001/

[Ferrets are Cool]

1. I wish they would be required by law to wear red robes so I could stay 50 feet away from them rather

than the recommended 6 ft. Fucking idiots.

[Traildogbob]

19. As always

Throughout the history of mankind, religion has killed more people than every war, ever, combined. Why change now. Religion is nature’s way of population control. Be Best. God sent trump..........to kill more in his name. (Sarcasm). In case it needs stated.

[lagomorph777]

98. Scarlet "A" for Asshole.

[tulipsandroses]

2. Sorry but this is bullshit. Religion does not make them immune.

We need to have one message to fight this virus. This is not just about them and their gathering. Its about what those 50 people can take back to their families and communities if someone in the church, mosque, synagogue is infected. We all have to do our part, religion included.

[keithbvadu2]

23. a church that claims it's 'in agreement that' #coronavirus won't affect them

a church that claims it's 'in agreement that' #coronavirus won't affect them

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1002131016

Link to tweet

?ref_src=

[Thekaspervote]

35. Karma...coming your way. Like it or not!! You and yours will have a higher incidence of Covid19

[boilinmad]

63. Clearly....

....she hates the fact that she is a lesbian. Always the case with the loudest anti-anythings.

[obamanut2012]

82. Maragret Court isn't a lesbian -- wtf is wrong with you???

Never a whisper she is, never a whisper ever.

We LGBT+ folks are REALLY tired if straight folks trying to force their demographic's bigots into the "self-loathing gayz" box. Guess what? They are straight. Own it.

[lunasun]

103. No it is not

[GoneOffShore]

81. Ms Court became certifiable 20 years ago.

[lunasun]

105. Hmmm which is it ?

“We are praying daily for for you, knowing that we are all protected by the Blood of Jesus.
For your convenience, hand sanitizer readily available at all our sites”

[ramapo]

3. Morons

Do they think the virus will respect a religious exemption?

[customerserviceguy]

87. Yes. They do.

that's the blind part about blind faith.

[still_one]

4. I suspect the people of Michigan will have more sense then the Governor

[Timewas]

30. I would hope so

But they elected her

[lagomorph777]

99. WTAF? She should act a little smarter than Republicans.

Somebody please straighten her out. Very dangerous move - and damaging to our party' reputation.

[onethatcares]

5. nearer my god to thee

I'm all for branding their foreheads so we know where they've been.

[Traildogbob]

21. Their foreheads ARE branded

Just on the red hat they wear. It’s one thing to let snakes bite you and pray. This is waaaay different. Serve Jim Jones Kool Aid as a cure promise at those gathering.

[IronLionZion]

7. Don't shake hands, keep 6 ft distance, no wine from the cup

I wouldn't want communion at this time either.

If enough of their congregation stays home, they can probably keep social distance. Why not just watch any of the televised services from home?

[Canoe52]

8. There goes her shot at VP.

so why have any ban on gatherings of 50 or more then? This would nullify that.

[Hokie]

9. Once again an example of religion being discriminated against - not

[tulipsandroses]

10. Exactly. I am so tired of these people holding the rest of us hostage

Just sick of their religious discrimination excuses that endanger the rest of us.

[paleotn]

14. Ha! So true.

[hlthe2b]

11. This is moronic. Even voiding "religious-based" vaccine exemptions have been upheld by courts

during disease outbreaks. Public health overrules religious dogma.

[GeorgeGist]

12. Freedom of religion ...

has unintended consequences.

[paleotn]

13. Good....

As close as we can get to a controlled setting. Lets see if magical thinking actually works on viruses. My money is on COVID-19. It doesn't give a shit who your god is.

[Yeehah]

32. LOL!

I agree with this post.

[not fooled]

60. Sums it up

perfectly.

I hope there are reporters noting on their calendars to re-visit MI worshippers who continue to congregate, at intervals, to see whether their sky god kept the virus away.

Not that I wish anyone ill but really, people, if there is a god they gave people free will to exercise and this is the perfect example of when it should be used to do the sane thing. Anyway, didn't Jesus say the best prayers were the ones you said in solitude?

[SunSeeker]

61. Unfortunately, they'll clog up hospital beds the rest of us will need. nt nt

[customerserviceguy]

88. We'll leave them

to faith healing only.

[bringthePaine]

15. DIY virus prevention: once they're inside, nail doors shut from outside, and watch the faith spread

time to rename as "Abject Republican Failure Virus Covfefe-45"

[Phoenix61]

16. I'm not sure who is stupider, her or those

showing up for services.

[Firestorm49]

17. Just plain stupid.

You can pray anywhere, any time, and any place. Oh my, will the virus spread even more now? Oh, but it’s for God, so he will cleanse us of the virus. Just pray a little harder.

[Blues Heron]

18. That's the devil speaking through her!

(if there were devils)

This is evil.

[bluestarone]

20. Can't believe it!

What gives them anymore right that spring breakers?? Total dumb thinking here! So they can spread it around BULLSHIT i say!

[Firestorm49]

22. I'd like to know who got her to change her mind.

She’s normally a person who thinks things out well. I don’t get this.

[Tom Rinaldo]

24. I seem to remember that the South Korean pandemic went into overdrive...

...because of a super spreader actively involvied in a christian religious community.

[Shrike47]

28. Wasn't she the notorious Patient 31? Infected over a thousand people or something like that.

[SWBTATTReg]

54. YES!

One idiot, who ignored advice to go get checked out repeatedly, got over 600+ people infected. She should be charged w/ murder. Similar to a HIV positive person going out still anyway, and infecting others w/ their used needles or sex or ... there are laws on the books in the US that deals w/ people who knowingly they have HIV, still spread it. The law should be updated if it needs to be.

There was also a story about where people were placed under a health watch, and still violated the terms of their quarantine (they had stamped the quarantine order onto their wrists so folks could see that these two people were supposed to be under quarantine). I don't know what happened to the two persons, but god. We're going to see this happen too. Like the FL spring break crap going on.

[not fooled]

65. Yeah, and SK

shut down the cult, instead of pandering to it.

Not just the religious nutjobs will suffer but innocent people with whom infected worshippers come in contact.

[old guy]

25. Then, in reality, they don't have a ban.

[customerserviceguy]

89. Yep

it's like a New Jersey speed limit sign.

[Demonaut]

26. fucking idiot!

[PubliusEnigma]

27. Magical thinking will not save us.

[lynintenn]

29. I used to be impressed by her. Her approval rating with me just went down.

[zipplewrath]

77. Cut her some slack

Those churches probably could have successfully sued based upon the First Amendment.

Around here the churches I know about are choosing not to hold services. The Catholic Diocese has chosen to cancel most masses.
There's no order directing them from government, they're just choosing to.

[JudyM]

96. I doubt they could've won. This is a public health emergency.

I’d like to know why she did it...I thought she was smart. This is plain ignorant.
I’d also like to know if her whip-smart attorney general weighed in. So incredibly disappointing.

[jberryhill]

104. Let em sue. They won't win

[onecaliberal]

31. How many people will these so called Christians kill?

[Shrek]

38. Not just Christians

The exemption applies to mosques and synagogues as well.

[CrispyQ]

33. I have three trumpers in my family & the religious one is by far the worst.

I can't even talk to him. When he walks my way at family gatherings I turn and walk the other way.

[iluvtennis]

34. My mom's church in LA is doing sermons over Facebook. FB, Skype, etc are alternatives for 50+. nt

[Shrek]

36. The congregation at my church is fewer than 50

We still aren't doing services in person.

The pastor and the media guy will show up to stream it, and everyone else will watch from home.

[degage]

37. WTF? That's just wrong. Guess she didn't hear about Malaysia

In Malaysia, they allowed this religious gathering and it caused more infections, of course. The God of Abraham doesn't seem to be stopping the virus at the doors of places of worship. Perhaps he sent it on purpose.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-03-19/coronavirus-spread-from-malaysian-event-to-multiple-countries/12066092

[tanyev]

39. If God won't Rapture us, we'll have to do it ourselves!

[Lucky Luciano]

40. Ok Whitmer is now on my shitlist - maybe she should be recalled.

Last edited Sat Mar 21, 2020, 12:32 PM - Edit history (1)

[jb5150]

41. To quote Hawkeye Pierce ...

"If they're were more people like them, there'd be less people like them".

[BlueMTexpat]

42. Excellent! eom

[Cetacea]

43. So much for her. Buh bye

Maybe they'll pray the virus away.

[Lonestarblue]

44. Two types of people are destroying this country.

Religious extremists and racists. And unfortunately they have been acquiring more political power to keep making matters worse. I long for the days when religion is a matter of private, personal beliefs and racists have been sent back under their rocks permanently. I doubt I’ll live long enough to see either, but we can make a start by electing as many Democrats as possible in November.

[SWBTATTReg]

55. I suspect being that these people are ignoring quarantine orders, that they'll get sick and ...

unfortunately die before all of us. Sad, but personal responsibility has to account for something.

Very dangerous to the rest of us. Can still have services over the internet.

[keithbvadu2]

66. Religion and politics use each other to gain power and wealth.

[RockRaven]

45. This is grossly irresponsible. People will die, and not just the people going to church.

Their families and neighbors and co-workers will die. She should be ashamed.

[McKim]

46. The Power of Fundamentalist Relgion in Michigan

Remember, this is the power of fundamentalist whacko religion in Michigan. This is massively irresponsible. Ministers in mainline churches should call a presser and condemn this. UUs, Friends, Methodists, UCC, Episcopalians and Lutherans, rise up!!!!!

[Retrograde]

73. It seems to be the Evangelicals who are defying reason

along with science and evidence. The older mainstream groups are abiding by the guidelines, as far as I can find.

[Brainfodder]

47. Religion, that thing of non-peace, what could go wrong?

TOO SOON?

[Lars39]

48. She's an idiot who will get people killed.

Last edited Sat Mar 21, 2020, 03:00 PM - Edit history (1)

[not_the_one]

49. Sorry, I have no words, and zero fucks left, to give.

Let them infect each other. When they infect others outside the fold, let them reap the scorn and disdain they so richly deserve.

But REMEMBER why they were allowed to kill other, innocent people.

edited to add, FUCK your god, and the ignorance he rode in on...

[hellno45]

50. Separation of church & state, the gray area. nt

[DonaldsRump]

51. She ain't my governor, thankfully

I thought she was good, but not now.

I am typing this as my children are having an ONLINE piano lesson from their formerly in person piano teacher. This is after a full week of online school.

There is ABSOLUTELY no reason why churches can't have a single laptop on the preacher/reverend/whatever and use freely available webinar or videoconferencing software to disseminate the service. If these folks just infected themselves, it would be fine; however, these people are unleashed on everyone else.

Crazy.

[Indykatie]

52. I Wouldn't Mind This if We Could Identify These Church Folks Who Continue to Congregate

Some take every deathly crisis as the Lord's will and see no need to protect themselves. That's fine but they should not be allowed to infect others who don't share their religious or life beliefs.

[Guilded Lilly]

53. This defies any semblance of intelligence. Just...no sane words. n/t

[Dem forever]

56. Get the facts

Before you all jump in get the facts. She said no fines but are the churches going to hold mass ? Someone from Michigan can chime in. I don’t believe she has allowed them to hold their dangerous gatherings. Need more facts. I read that all churches are closed and using on line mass. Bunch of wild pack of wolves on here for Christ sakes.

[LisaM]

78. That's how I read it.

There is still a ban, they won't assess a misdemeanor (which is pretty much the same as everywhere).

[old guy]

83. If there are no consequences, there is no ban.

[LisaM]

86. I don't disagree.

But many jurisdictions are declining to fine at this time. This is not unique.

[Mendocino]

57. Michigan has 549 positive cases

with four deaths. Most started in the Detroit metro area, they are radiating outward. Ohio (I live in the MI/OH border area) has 169 cases with one death. The death there is only about 6 miles away from me.

Governor Whitmer, have you lost your mind? We need to break the chain, not wire it back together.

[Mendocino]

72. Updated Ohio

247 positive cases, 3 deaths. Haven't heard any revised figures for MI.

[Mendocino]

91. Updated Michigan

787 positive 5 deaths

[ahoysrcsm]

58. South Korea initial spread was due to cult members...

cult member not wanting to be found out for being in a cult.

[soryang]

90. They had to be coerced into cooperating as an organization

and individually. They concealed substantial portions their facilities and membership right up to a few days ago, although they claimed they were cooperating fully on March 2. Their infected members failed to disclosed their identities and continued to meet in the hundreds of residences and facilities the Sincheonji maintained outside of public church sites.

As I understand there is at least one lawsuit pending against them now in the amount of approximatley 500,000,000 dollars for the immense damages, sicknesses and death they have caused. They tried to defuse the legal claims against their organization by offering about 10,000,000 dollars to the government to help assist in the public health effort. Korean law barred the government from accepting the offer, as it might be construed as a settlement of outstanding claims, which are likely to be huge.

Church officials and organizations that violate standards of care in a public health emergency should be subject to full legal liability for the injury and death they cause.

[SunSeeker]

59. SO STUPID. It was a church in South Korea that worsened their outbreak.

[Dopers_Greed]

62. What in the literal fuck

This is the kind of behavior we'd expect from the Fundie Pukes

[hatrack]

64. Fuck. This. Shit.

Done, finished, over.

These assholes want to get together and handle rattlesnakes, or drink cyanide fruit punch, or set themselves on fire, that's fine.

They want to get together and boost the chances that one or more of them will infect others, who will in turn, infect others and so on (specifically, infecting those not into handling venomous snakes or self-immolation)- no, not fine.

Screaming like enraged gibbons about how your right to praise the Invisible Sky Fairy trumps the rights of other people to stay alive doesn't cut it any more.

[karynnj]

67. My synagogue is having virtual services in Burlington which is likely less dangerous than Detroit

Even though it is a conservative synagogue. The daily minyon services are by Zoom. In the past, when that possibility was raised for snowy and icy days, it was rejected as not consistent with Jewish law to count anyone not physically present. The over riding need to save lives, was used to approve it now.

[Retrograde]

71. The Archdiocese of Detroit

largest Catholic organization in Michigan, has cancelled all public masses and has limited attendance at weddings and funerals to less than 50 people. As have most other mainstream religious organizations across the country.

[BeyondGeography]

68. Panders to fools, move back ten spaces

[KY_EnviroGuy]

69. Please also exempt all Republican Party social and political events....

especially those held in close quarters. Oh, and buy them plenty of booze and tin foil hats. I suggest margaritas with four straws in each and water pipes for those that toke.

Let them watch videos of Trump and Reagan all night long.

KY.........

[we can do it]

70. Just plain stupid.

[Jake Stern]

74. So what happens if she refused to exempt religious organizations and they sue?

You know Trump's DOJ will back the churches to the hilt and try to get it leapfrogged to SCOTUS as an "emergency" case where a 5-4 vote will overturn her order.

She's back at square one minus a few million bucks in legal fees to the RWNJs who brought the suits and trying to craft an order that will pass muster with the courts.

Unfortunately, with our courts now packed with zealous religious conservatives who are eager to see persecution in every law like this, Whitmer doesn't really stand a chance.

[SharonClark]

92. Nonsense. Governors can declare health emergencies.

Have the religious RWNJs sued the other state governments?

[Politicub]

75. Is one of the Ten Commandments, Thou Shalt be a Moron?

Because that's what it seems like with a lot of religious people. Must be in the version of the Trump bible he leaves in the nightstands of his hotel rooms.

[LiberalFighter]

76. Personally I wish there was no religion.

In reality, being a church member just provides a time for a group of people to socialize.

[cilla4progress]

79. What this signals to me is

Mass desperation.

Last resort.

[GoneOffShore]

80. I see dead people coming from this....

Lots and lots of dead people.

Fines and prison terms are being imposed here in Europe for violating quarantine.

[rpannier]

95. It appears most religious organizations have cancelled services

It's the ones that haven't that worry me
Covid-19 spread uncontrolled around Korea thru one church located in Daegu

[GoneOffShore]

112. I read that on The Guardian - a sort of 'super nexus' of infection.

[sakabatou]

84. WTF?!

[OnlinePoker]

85. As long as she lets them give her a group hug, I'm all for it. n/t

[NickB79]

93. They'll get to meet God a lot faster than they expected. nt

[Tarc]

94. Fine by me

If they want to cull their herd a bit, there's nothing we can do to stop em.

[Lord Ludd]

97. Human eras (from around 500 BCE):

Classical Antiquity
The Dark Ages/Middle Ages
The Renaissance
The Age of Enlightenment
The Dark Ages Part II (with a little science on the side)
?

[Throckmorton]

115. I prefer to call it "The Great Darkness ".

When superstition trumped reason.

[BlueIdaho]

100. Well, that's stupid.

[Beartracks]

101. Bad move. Why would you purposely put a hole in the dike?

[roamer65]

106. Shun anyone who goes to these services.

[Freethinker65]

107. Insanity. The Catholic Church in Illinois suspended in person masses and is live-streaming.

This is obviously a public health issue, but I understand idiots will say they have a constitutional right to assemble and worship, but what church/religion would choose to put its members in danger of contracting COVID-19 when it can be avoided?

[lunasun]

108. Can't the gov and those insisting to still gather at church take a hint from their own book ?

[Rube Icon]

109. Why does the rest of the world think we're stupid?

Exhibit A!!!

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

110. Add one more reason to why I despise all organized religion.

[PufPuf23]

111. Stupid Whitmer pandering to the perceptually challenged.

What would Jesus do?

Don't think Jesus approves of snake handlers in his name and doubt if he is that fond of those taking unnecessary risks for themselves (and others) by their foolish and selfish behavior.

Pass the collection plate. Most of these grifters probably can take plastic now too.

[Paka]

113. That's crazy.

Will their "God" protect them? What about the rest of us that when they start speading more virus?

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

114. For one, Greater Grace Temple in Detroit is conducting services today.

I don't think Gov Whitmer (D) wants to annoy her base, a big part of which is the large predominantly black churches in Detroit. So, the church can stay open, without risk of a fine. The pastor is himself limiting attendance, requiring five or six feet between the worshipers, stopping hand-holding during prayer, etc.

Fines or no fines, the Catholic Diocese of Detroit has stopped all in-church services, going online. I drove by a mosque yesterday (Friday being the big day of attendance), and the parking lot was empty. Usually, on a Friday, it's full and overflowing into the neighborhood.

I'd guess the exemption from a fine is more a church/state separation issue, like taxes, than a governmental attemp to kill the faithful.

[demmiblue]

116. Asked about church services, Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer says...

Asked about church services, Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer says she's discouraging people from gathering at all. But says Republican Legislature asked her for church exemption to 50-person gathering limit, which she granted. #coronavirus

Link to tweet