Catholic Church To Lose Historic Property Tax Exemption In Italy
Source: RT
Published: 13 October, 2012, 11:38
[font color=gray]The Basilica of St. Bartholomew, located on the
island Isola Tiberina in Rome. (AFP/Vincenzo Pinto)[/font]
Italys Catholic Church will be forced to pay taxes starting in 2013 after the EU pressured the countrys government to pass a controversial law stripping the Church of its historic property tax exemption.
The Catholic Church in Italy is excluded from paying taxes on its land if at least a part of a Church property is used non-commercially for instance, a chapel in a bed-and-breakfast.
"The regulatory framework will be definite by January 1, 2013 the start of the fiscal year and will fully respect the [European] Community law," Italian premier Mario Monti's government said in a statement on Tuesday.
The move could net Italy revenues of 500 million to 2 billion euros annually across the country, municipal government associations said. The extra income from previously exempt properties in Rome alone including hotels, restaurants and sports centers could reach 25.5 million euros a year, La Repubblica daily newspaper reported.
Read more: http://rt.com/news/italy-church-tax-exemption-339/
DURHAM D
(32,611 posts)DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)cstanleytech
(26,317 posts)over the rules that say they forfeit their tax free status if they insist on preaching from the pulpit on who to vote for.
merrily
(45,251 posts)Imagine if we tried to take away the tax exemption.
pnwmom
(108,990 posts)from the religious tax exemption. The US does not give the Church a break on commercial properties like the one Italy till now has been giving.
DURHAM D
(32,611 posts)pnwmom
(108,990 posts)adigal
(7,581 posts)You lose tax exemptions.
Never happen here.
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)In the US, such properties are already taxed.
Italy is not taxing churches or convents or any actual church property used as such. It is going to tax COMMERCIAL property owned by the Italian church. The Catholic church owns entire housing developments, for pete's sake!
In other words, it is shifting to US law. In the US, such property is and has always been taxed.
DURHAM D
(32,611 posts)Commercial property is not always on the property tax rolls. It is up to the individual taxing authority.
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)Just wondering.
williesgirl
(4,033 posts)Since they won't follow the law. Recd
DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)...would finally net ''the people'' a community good.
- And only after 2,000 years.
aquart
(69,014 posts)Catholics won't be half as mad as the Mormons and Scientologists.
DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)pnwmom
(108,990 posts)to commercial properties owned by religious entities. They are already taxed in the US.
DURHAM D
(32,611 posts)owned by churches are on the property tax rolls? You are implying that this is a federal law. It is not.
pnwmom
(108,990 posts)Tax Exemptions of Religious Property.Every State and the District of Columbia provide for tax exemptions for religious institutions, and the history of such exemptions goes back to the time of our establishment as a polity. The only expression by a Supreme Court Justice prior to 1970 was by Justice Brennan, who deemed tax exemptions constitutional because the benefit conferred was incidental to the religious character of the institutions concerned.178 Then, in 1970, a nearly unanimous Court sustained a state exemption from real or personal property taxation of property used exclusively for religious, educational or charitable purposes owned by a corporation or association which was conducted exclusively for one or more of these purposes and did not operate for profit.179 The first prong of a two-prong argument saw the Court adopting Justice Brennans rationale. Using the secular purpose and effect test, Chief Justice Burger noted that the purpose of the exemption was not to single out churches for special favor; instead, the exemption applied to a broad category of associations having many common features and all dedicated to social betterment. Thus, churches as well as museums, hospitals, libraries, charitable organizations, professional associations, and the like, all non-profit, and all having a beneficial and stabilizing influence in community life, were to be encouraged by being treated specially in the tax laws. The primary effect of the exemptions was not to aid religion; the primary effect was secular and any assistance to religion was merely incidental.
____________________________
http://atheism.about.com/od/churchestaxexemptions/a/overview.htm
4. No Tax Exemptions for Commercial Activity
Tax exemptions are almost entirely restricted to those affairs which are religious rather than commercial in nature. Thus, there are numerous tax exemptions on property owned by churches and used for religious worship, but exemptions are normally denied on property used for commerce and business. The site of an actual church will be exempt, but the site of a church-owned shoe store will rarely, if ever, be exempt.
Court Cases:
Gibbons v. District of Columbia
Diffenderfer v. Central Baptist Church
The same is true for income from sales. Money a church receives from donations of members and from financial investments are normally treated as tax-exempt. On the other hand, money which a church receives from the sale of goods and services even including goods like religious books and magazines will normally have sales tax applied, though not income tax at the other end.
___________________________________________
Here is an example of the law in my state. The exemption applies to non-profits in general, not just churches, and it doesn't apply to property owned by non-profits but used for commercial purposes.
http://dor.wa.gov/docs/pubs/industspecific/nonprofit.pdf
Nonprofit organizations in the state of Washington may be eligible for an exemption from property tax. In most situations, nonprofit ownership is required to qualify for an exemption. In addition, the organization must conduct an activity specifically identified in the exemption laws.
The use of the property determines the exemption. Not all nonprofit organizations have a purpose and activity that entitles them to an exemption.
DURHAM D
(32,611 posts)owned by the church but used for secular purposes (profits). It is up to the local taxing authority. The local taxing authority is easily influenced (some would say bribed) into leaving the strip centers, the 18 hole golf course, apartment complexes, and the boutique hotels off the property tax rolls.
That ruling also seems to expand the religious tax exemption to a whole new class of organizations. I am glad you posted that as I have always wondered when that whole exemption for property taxes was expanded to include a whole lot of entities that did not have "religious" affiliations. For example - I know of a local real estate business/large property owner who is exempt from property taxes because they are organized as a "not for profit".
pnwmom
(108,990 posts)properties, and it applies to all states.
http://atheism.about.com/od/churchestaxexemptions/a/overview.htm
4. No Tax Exemptions for Commercial Activity
Tax exemptions are almost entirely restricted to those affairs which are religious rather than commercial in nature. Thus, there are numerous tax exemptions on property owned by churches and used for religious worship, but exemptions are normally denied on property used for commerce and business. The site of an actual church will be exempt, but the site of a church-owned shoe store will rarely, if ever, be exempt.
Court Cases:
Gibbons v. District of Columbia
Diffenderfer v. Central Baptist Church
The same is true for income from sales. Money a church receives from donations of members and from financial investments are normally treated as tax-exempt. On the other hand, money which a church receives from the sale of goods and services even including goods like religious books and magazines will normally have sales tax applied, though not income tax at the other end.
Can you, OTOH, show me an examples of states that officially EXEMPT commercially used property owned by religious groups from taxation -- as a matter of law, not error?
DURHAM D
(32,611 posts)Are you ignoring the fact that it leaves it up to the local taxing authority? It does not say they MUST be on the property tax rolls.
Where I live it simply is not. I am going to guess this is standard procedure in most of the country but you are lucky to live somewhere where the for profit/commercial church and charity owned properties are on the tax rolls.
pnwmom
(108,990 posts)owned by churches and other non-profits, even when the properties are used for commercial purposes?
Because the information I gave you says that this is a rare exception. Maybe you should be fighting this in your locality instead of assuming this is the way it's done everywhere.
DURHAM D
(32,611 posts)that property tax decisions are left to the local taxing body. I am not sure what your point is but I am done.
pnwmom
(108,990 posts)that your locality exempts ALL properties owned by religious entities, even if they're used for commercial purposes.
I've asked you to show me the local law that you're referring to and you haven't. Can you show me ANY law in ANY state or locality that exempts all property owned by religious institutions, whether it is used for religious or commercial purposes?
I doubt if there's any city in the US that is doing so well financially it would want to exempt any commercial property (owned by religious institutions) that it wasn't Constitutionally required to. But if you can prove otherwise, go ahead.
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)The law here is pretty well understood and pretty broadly applied.
Local taxing authorities can give exemptions on commercial property, but they normally do so to attract businesses in. In other words, they give an exemption for five or ten years (or a lower tax rate) in order to get a convention center built, or a business complex built, or move in a factory.
That's the use of local tax exemptions with which I am familiar. It's possible that some such arrangement could be made with a non-profit, but they rarely have enough money to make it worthwhile for the locality.
Technically, if a local tax authority were to decide to exempt commercial use property from taxation if it were owned by a church on a wholesale basis, it would be unconstitutional, and a suit would remove the exemption.
pnwmom
(108,990 posts)no matter whether it's owned by a profit-making company or a non-profit, like a Church.
The Supreme Court ruled on this long ago.
freshwest
(53,661 posts)The political advantage of foundations which the rich have hidden their wealth in and the church must end. They are destroying democratic institutions meant to serve everyone.
DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)They're nothing but a net drain on public resources. And it's clear that when they don't pay their bank notes they get foreclosed on. Which means if they don't pay their property taxes we could end up doing the same thing that banks do.
- And everyone knows they can do no wrong......
Proletariatprincess
(718 posts)I would have thought that Italy would be the last, not the first.
This is great news. I hope this idea spreads around the world. It is way past due.
Religious institutions should pay thier fair share in a civil society. NO more free rides for religion.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)defacto7
(13,485 posts)I'm going to buy a pizza to celebrate.
We need this here!!! There is more income in the church business than we can possibly imagine. That industry is hidden and unaccounted since the beginning. It's huge untouched and undocumented.
The only drawback I see is that there could be an unfortunate negotiating point where churches could want a say in government in return. That would be worse.
DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)It has all the virtues I look for in a need-to-buy-a-pizza-excuse:
It's plausible.
It seems a noble gesture.
It's topped with mozzarella cheese.
- I wish you'd thought of it sooner!!!!
Proletariatprincess
(718 posts)canuckledragger
(1,660 posts)It's about time.
& it WILL come to the U.S. eventually.
Engage in all out political warfare using church resources/personal/etc. ?
Tax the shit out their 'religious' scam as a result.
johnlucas
(1,250 posts)Wow.
Didn't see that coming.
When they talk about the world's richest men on Forbes I know it's just the "official" list.
One of the world's richest men is the Pope of the Catholic Church himself.
The Vatican is the Roman Empire's nucleus.
John Lucas
spiderpig
(10,419 posts)I'm sick of any church exploiting people of minimal income for donations and then plastering their sorry asses on brocade cushions while enjoying tax exemptions we can't even dream of.
If you choose to believe, then go ahead and believe. But I have had it with religious scams. Just had it.
I grew up accompanying my grandma to a mainstream church where the first thing they pulled out was the collection plate. Were they there when someone needed help? Well, um..
Hypocrites.
SunSeeker
(51,659 posts)I mean, by excepting a church from taxes, my tax dollars are subsidizing that church. It's bullshit.
HankyDub
(246 posts)Jesus told me to say that.
Overseas
(12,121 posts)condoleeza
(814 posts)how churches here have escaped being taxed here is just beyond understanding.
silvershadow
(10,336 posts)those who don't tithe, which is how my tea party friends are telling me I'm supposed to get my care (through churches). Let the churches get their money back through increased pressure to tithe.
OnlinePoker
(5,725 posts)The Catholic Church, through the Vatican Bank, is the majority shareholder of arms manufacturer Beretta Holdings SPA. It brings new meaning to the phrase "Guns and Bibles".
http://usahitman.com/vbmsipb/
meow2u3
(24,768 posts)"Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition."
dipsydoodle
(42,239 posts)under the same taxation changes. Want that as well ?
These changes have been afoot for 10 months now. The changes don't affect 50,000 cathedrals, churches and chapels : its 11,000 schools, universities and libraries as well as nearly 5,000 hospitals, clinics and other commercial properties which face the tax.
hue
(4,949 posts)UTUSN
(70,725 posts)lonestarnot
(77,097 posts)jhasp
(101 posts)I live in Wisconsin and our church pays $20k per year in property taxes for an empty building that we were given. We are required to pay the $20k until it is developed as a worship center. A Catholic church in the area was assessed property taxes on a gift shop on its property because it was being used for a commercial purpose. Note: the Catholic church was not happy about this and did argue against it.
Also, churches are non-profits and the issue with taxes and political speech is not whether the organization would pay taxes (PACs don't pay taxes because they are also non-profits), but whether the donors would be able to deduct their donations on their taxes because the church has 501c(3) status. I don't think that churches should receive 501c(3) status. However, I do think that they should be able to create 501c(3) organizations that focus purely on charitable works (providing shelter, food, healthcare, etc.).
leftyohiolib
(5,917 posts)valerief
(53,235 posts)NC_Nurse
(11,646 posts)Good for them!
joanbarnes
(1,723 posts)Coyotl
(15,262 posts)Especially the ones with the gold guy on the spire blowing his trumpet
We need to do the same thing here. Tax the churces and their property and business. Hell yeah!!
awake
(3,226 posts)instead of letting it stand as a independent State (which protects child molesters). In WW Two Italy granted the Vatican status as a separate nation it should return to pre war status with out the protection of nationhood.
WilmywoodNCparalegal
(2,654 posts)that established the sovereign nature of Vatican City. That treaty isn't going anywhere. If you study Italian history, you will find out pretty easily that Italians have had historical enmity against the Catholic church for centuries.
WilmywoodNCparalegal
(2,654 posts)Contrary to stereotype - especially here in the U.S., where stereotypes about Italy abound thanks to "Jersey Shore" and old school immigrants in NY, MA and NJ - Italy is not a Catholic nation, in the sense that very few people go to mass or adhere to Catholic principles.
We've had birth control over the counter for 2 decades, abortion on demand (albeit with a conscience clause) and other things. Italians are very secular - though there are weird things like crucifixes in schools - especially in the north.
I didn't have one classmate who was religious (of any kind). Even the weekly one-hour class in catechism had fewer students in it than the alternative class in modern popular music.
Arugula Latte
(50,566 posts)Evil f@#$ers! They've ripped millions off throughout the centuries.
RainDog
(28,784 posts)Odin2005
(53,521 posts)LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)I imagine that should this ever be adopted in the U.S., it would allow the largest and most powerful churches with the most money to more directly involve themselves in politics-- a lot of big-money ads and campaigns would get a lot more views than they already do, and the direct involvement of preaching politics would crest; and many of the smaller churches' community assistance programs would disappear. I can see how that would make a lot of people very happy.