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ffr

(22,670 posts)
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 06:02 PM Aug 2021

Leaded petrol era 'officially over' as Algeria ends pump sales

Source: The Guardian

UN experts have called the use of the fuel, which began in 1922, a “catastrophe for the environment and public health”. By the 1970s, nearly all petrol produced around the world contained lead. Now the last country to use it, Algeria, has finally stopped selling it in petrol stations.
-snip-

Lead is extremely poisonous and there is no safe level of exposure.

The fuel has contaminated air, dust, soil, drinking water and food crops for the better part of a century, causing heart disease, stroke and cancer. It is of particular concern for children, as it damages their developing brains and ability to learn.



Read more: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/aug/30/leaded-petrol-era-officially-over-as-algeria-ends-pump-sales



Childhood Lead Exposure Tied to Mental Health Issues in Later Life

Lead exposure in childhood may lead to increased psychiatric symptoms in adulthood, according to a longitudinal study across nearly 3 decades.

In a sample of over 1,000 children in the Dunedin Study, those with blood lead levels >10 μg/dL at age 11 years (the historical level of concern) had more mental health problems in adulthood, scoring 2.52 points higher in general psychopathology.
-snip-

"We know lead is a neurotoxin and we know neurotoxins generally have pretty broad effects on brain health, rather than affecting a particular area of the brain or a particular cognitive function," co-author Jonathan Schaefer, MA, also of Duke, told MedPage Today. "So if you're exposed to something that's capable of affecting all kinds of cognitive abilities, it stands to reason that it might also affect your emotional functioning or the way you behave as well."

The researchers previously reported that higher blood lead levels were linked to lower IQ - MedPageToday


Classic cars that run on LEADed fuel, NRA members that shoot LEAD from guns that produce LEAD aerosols, and plumbers are all examples of people who may have heightened levels of lead in their blood and stored in their bodies.



Lower IQs, higher psychopathology scores, and significant neuropsychological and functional decline.
23 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Leaded petrol era 'officially over' as Algeria ends pump sales (Original Post) ffr Aug 2021 OP
Most ammo melm00se Aug 2021 #1
Interesting. I've seen where shooters will use D-lead after shooting their guns ffr Aug 2021 #4
I forgot about piston engine aircraft gay texan Aug 2021 #17
Point by point melm00se Aug 2021 #18
The Most Important Scientist You've Never Heard Of Swede Aug 2021 #2
Cosmos had an entire episode dedicated to the Clean Room ffr Aug 2021 #6
Long article, but worth the time. Thanks. NT mahatmakanejeeves Aug 2021 #16
When I was a kid in high school, our history class 2Gingersnaps Aug 2021 #3
An interesting theory, but the Eastern Roman Empire used lead too. The Mouth Aug 2021 #10
Well, damage due to lead poisoning would certainly explain people supporting Trump. cstanleytech Aug 2021 #5
I'd like to see some blind studies on it. ffr Aug 2021 #8
It's hard to tell what year Cadillac that is in the picture. It could be a '76. mahatmakanejeeves Aug 2021 #7
It was more a representative example of anecdotal evidence connecting the two ffr Aug 2021 #9
I don't think any classic cars are burning lead fuel anymore EX500rider Aug 2021 #11
A lot of liberals own a lot of classic cars gay texan Aug 2021 #15
Here in the USA, classic cars run on unleaded. NullTuples Aug 2021 #12
I drove a 1969 chevy for a few years in college dsc Aug 2021 #13
You can still buy it in the form of race fuel gay texan Aug 2021 #14
Also Av-Gas Mopar151 Aug 2021 #19
The banning of leaded gas is cited as one of the reasons for the decline in violent crime Aristus Aug 2021 #20
Lead from gasoline is one of the markers being considered for the start of the Anthropocene Epoch muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #21
After putting lead into the atmosphere, Thomas Midgley went on to introduce CFCs for refrigeration muriel_volestrangler Aug 2021 #22
The younger generation won't believe this FakeNoose Aug 2021 #23

melm00se

(4,992 posts)
1. Most ammo
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 06:16 PM
Aug 2021

for handguns and rifles is copper jacketed and when shot into a softer material, they pose little risk for airborne release of lead.

The biggest risk is if a shooter shoots indoors with poor ventilation which is why most ranges have ventilation systems that suck from the firing line.

ffr

(22,670 posts)
4. Interesting. I've seen where shooters will use D-lead after shooting their guns
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 06:41 PM
Aug 2021

going as far as changing their clothes, down to their shoes before entering their homes, so that they do not contaminate those places as well. One mentioned lead styphnate, an ignitor component of copper and copper-lined leaded bullets. Also, the copper lined bullets, like those in .22 rifle rounds, have a tendency to vaporize and splinter while the projectile passes through the weapon after being fired?

And given that there is no safe level of lead exposure, it would appear then that shooters would have higher blood lead levels than non-shooters. Probably the same way that single engine civil aviation pilots would have a higher level of blood lead than say someone who wasn't a single engine private pilot.

melm00se

(4,992 posts)
18. Point by point
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 10:06 PM
Aug 2021

Yes, lead styphnate is in some primers (approximately 40% IIRC) but the majority of rounds do not use it. While I can't speak for all shooters I go with lead free primers (the primer compound is called "catalyst" used by Federal) when at all possible just like I go with steel shot for my shotgun when I shoot clays.

.22 rounds: the answer is "it depends". There are levels of jacketing. Copper washed rounds have the thinnest coating but most have sufficient copper to withstand passing thru the barrel. Rounds, as they exit the barrel are ~500F which is well under the melting point of Cu (~2000F) and under the melting point of Pb (~621F).

D-lead is kind of overkill as plain old soap is perfectly fine for removing lead from the skin and any left on the clothes.




ffr

(22,670 posts)
6. Cosmos had an entire episode dedicated to the Clean Room
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 06:44 PM
Aug 2021

Simply because tetra-ethyl lead was everywhere, contaminating everything.

2Gingersnaps

(1,000 posts)
3. When I was a kid in high school, our history class
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 06:34 PM
Aug 2021

presented the theory that lead poisoning was the root cause for the decline and fall of the Roman Empire. There was lead in their cosmetics and in the clay demijohns/wine jugs or olive oil jugs. Nixon created the EPA when the Cuyahoga River burned and the air was so pollute with lead from gasoline it was dangerous. Just as Reagan made a joke of solar panels, Orange Foolius gutted the EPA.

The Mouth

(3,150 posts)
10. An interesting theory, but the Eastern Roman Empire used lead too.
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 07:16 PM
Aug 2021

And lasted nearly 1000 years longer.

ffr

(22,670 posts)
8. I'd like to see some blind studies on it.
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 06:50 PM
Aug 2021

Is lead a primary catalyst? It is a catalyst for cognitive decline and other brain disorders. And it can be passed on from generation to generation through a mother's bones during pregnancy.

mahatmakanejeeves

(57,446 posts)
7. It's hard to tell what year Cadillac that is in the picture. It could be a '76.
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 06:47 PM
Aug 2021

If this answer is any indication, at least by 1971, and possibly earlier, Cadillac engines were designed to run on unleaded gas.

I haven't seen leaded gas for sale in a good thirty years.

1971 Cadillac and Unleaded Gas

Daurb
Jun '12
The person who called in today questioning the use unleaded gasoline in his 1971 Cadillac has nothing to worry about. It should state in his owner’s manual that all 1971 General Motors cars are designed to operate on unleaded gasoline but the use of a higher octane than the regular grade unleaded used today should be used. I used the mid grade for years in, yes, a 1971 model year GM vehicle, and had no problems.

ffr

(22,670 posts)
9. It was more a representative example of anecdotal evidence connecting the two
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 06:54 PM
Aug 2021

Classic cars that appear to be owned almost exclusively by TFG supporters and their vehicles that use tetra-ethyl lead as a fuel.

But good catch!

EX500rider

(10,847 posts)
11. I don't think any classic cars are burning lead fuel anymore
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 07:19 PM
Aug 2021

Cuz you can't buy it.. and haven't been able to for decades
Some of them will burn higher octane feel but that's different

NullTuples

(6,017 posts)
12. Here in the USA, classic cars run on unleaded.
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 07:21 PM
Aug 2021

"Classic cars that run on LEADed fuel"

You can't buy leaded gas for them. Haven't been able to do so as long as I've been driving & I'm an older Gen-X who got their permit at 15 and a half. Classic cars here in the USA don't emit lead because there isn't any in the fuel & by now the small amounts on the valves, etc are long gone or glazed into place.

dsc

(52,161 posts)
13. I drove a 1969 chevy for a few years in college
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 07:34 PM
Aug 2021

and it was built to use leaded gas but if you used higher octane gas it worked just fine. By the time I had it, leaded gas was very hard to find and clearly on its way out. I literally can't recall the last time I saw leaded gas for sale.

gay texan

(2,443 posts)
14. You can still buy it in the form of race fuel
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 07:49 PM
Aug 2021

I have a 5 gallon can of it, 110 octane for racing purposes.

It's also stupid f-ing expensive and its purple.

Mopar151

(9,983 posts)
19. Also Av-Gas
Mon Aug 30, 2021, 11:49 PM
Aug 2021

100LL is about 96 " federal#". Cool thing is, the octane boosting properties of tetraethyl lead diminish at higher concentrations, so that you can make 100 octane gas with ~30% leaded race gas, and 70% pump premium.

Aristus

(66,351 posts)
20. The banning of leaded gas is cited as one of the reasons for the decline in violent crime
Tue Aug 31, 2021, 11:33 AM
Aug 2021

throughout the 90's and 2000's.

Now the crime rate is going back up. I'm guessing it's lead-exposed Trumpsters…

muriel_volestrangler

(101,316 posts)
21. Lead from gasoline is one of the markers being considered for the start of the Anthropocene Epoch
Tue Aug 31, 2021, 02:49 PM
Aug 2021
It has been estimated that lead (Pb), mercury (Hg) and tin (Sn) are three metals whose biogeochemical cycles show the global-scale change caused by anthropogenic pollution. Common constituents of airborne pollutants
are: chromium (Cr), copper (Cu), nickel (Ni) and zinc (Zn). Of these metals, lead shows all features of a good
Anthropocene signal. Its concentrations in dated sediments and ice-cores collected in Northern and Southern
Hemispheres show a global, near-synchronous distribution with a distinct peak level from 1960s to 1980s, mostly
related to the use of leaded gasoline. The signal of Pb in sedimentary records should be persistent since lead is a
non-essential element to living organisms and is relatively immobile. Additionally, Pb stable isotope ratios can be
used for tracking pollution sources.

https://meetingorganizer.copernicus.org/EGU2019/EGU2019-4228.pdf

muriel_volestrangler

(101,316 posts)
22. After putting lead into the atmosphere, Thomas Midgley went on to introduce CFCs for refrigeration
Tue Aug 31, 2021, 02:53 PM
Aug 2021
Midgley began working at General Motors in 1916. In December 1921, while working under the direction of Charles Kettering at Dayton Research Laboratories, a subsidiary of General Motors, Midgley discovered that the addition of tetraethyllead (TEL) to gasoline prevented "knocking" in internal combustion engines.[4] The company named the substance "Ethyl", avoiding all mention of lead in reports and advertising. Oil companies and automobile manufacturers, especially General Motors which owned the patent jointly filed by Kettering and Midgley, promoted the TEL additive as an inexpensive alternative superior to ethanol or ethanol-blended fuels, on which they could make very little profit.[5][6][7] In December 1922, the American Chemical Society awarded Midgley the 1923 Nichols Medal for the "Use of Anti-Knock Compounds in Motor Fuels".[8] This was the first of several major awards he earned during his career.[2]

In 1923, Midgley took a long vacation in Miami, Florida, to cure himself of lead poisoning. He found "that my lungs have been affected and that it is necessary to drop all work and get a large supply of fresh air".[9]
...
In the late 1920s, air conditioning and refrigeration systems employed compounds such as ammonia (NH3), chloromethane (CH3Cl), propane, and sulfur dioxide (SO2) as refrigerants. Though effective, these were toxic, flammable or explosive. The Frigidaire division of General Motors, at that time a leading manufacturer of such systems, sought a non-toxic, non-flammable alternative to these refrigerants.[12] Kettering, the vice president of General Motors Research Corporation at that time, assembled a team that included Midgley and Albert Leon Henne to develop such a compound.

The team soon narrowed their focus to alkyl halides (the combination of carbon chains and halogens), which were known to be highly volatile (a requirement for a refrigerant) and also chemically inert. They eventually settled on the concept of incorporating fluorine into a hydrocarbon. They rejected the assumption that such compounds would be toxic, believing that the stability of the carbon–fluorine bond would be sufficient to prevent the release of hydrogen fluoride or other potential breakdown products.[12] The team eventually synthesized dichlorodifluoromethane,[13] the first chlorofluorocarbon (CFC), which they named "Freon".[12][14] This compound is more commonly referred to today as "Freon 12", or "R12".[15]

Freon and other CFCs soon largely replaced other refrigerants, and later appeared in other applications, such as propellants in aerosol spray cans and asthma inhalers. The Society of Chemical Industry awarded Midgley the Perkin Medal in 1937 for this work.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Midgley_Jr.

FakeNoose

(32,639 posts)
23. The younger generation won't believe this
Tue Aug 31, 2021, 03:04 PM
Aug 2021

... but we used to pay MORE for leaded gasoline.

It cost extra to get that added "oomph" of lead in our gas. Then in the mid-70's pollution was out of control and we had to go to unleaded gasoline. The oil companies said, "OK but it's gonna cost more." That's right, they charged us MORE to take the lead out of the gasoline.

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